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View Full Version : Why the team was DOOMED from the start with Josh McDaniel's



Peerless
11-29-2010, 12:24 AM
First of all, let's get some facts cleared up.

The 2008 Denver Broncos finished the season with an offense that could fly up and down the field (who had troubles scoring), along with a powder puff defense coached by Bob Slowick.

The final rankings of the offense / defense:

Offense:

2008 offensive yards/game: 395.8

2008 offensive points/game: 23.1

2008 offensive ranking: #2 Overall


Defense:

2008 defense yards/game: 374.6

2008 points/game given up: 28.0

2008 final ranking of defense: #29 overall


Right from those specific statistics, which side of the ball needed more work? It's not calculus, or rocket science. It's not even a hard question. It's a simple answer: the defense.


The defense? It's CLEAR that the #29th ranked defense needed a MAJOR makeover.

Out goes Shanahan. A lot of people tend to forget that one of the MAIN reasons Shanahan was let go as our coach was because he didn't want to get rid of one of the weakest parts of the defense, the defensive coordinator of the #29th ranked defense: Bob Slowick.


Three league sources said Tuesday afternoon that in a short meeting, Bowlen had wanted Shanahan to make changes on the team's coaching staff, particularly with defensive coordinator Bob Slowik, and that Shanahan had refused. http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/dec/30/shanahan-broncos-agree-part-ways/

Bowlen wanted a new coordinator, Shanahan didn't want to make the change. In the end, with the epic ending failure of 2008 season along with this notion, Shanahan was fired.

In comes McDaniel's as the Broncos next head coach. Here is this young coach who helped coach the Patriots to the Super Bowl, with a history breaking offense.

Some people said, why not grab a defensive minded coach? There were guys like Steve Spagnuolo and Leslie Frazier out there who even came in for an interview.

But Bowlen didn't want them, he wanted McDaniel's because he was a young and intriguing coach to him. He hired him on the notion that he was coming from a team who he helped coordinate offensively to the Super Bowl, but he also hired him on the notion that he had a job to do; fix the defense. This is Pat Bowlen, one of the most classiest, trusted, and friendliest GMs to his players. Don't even believe for one second that he had any idea of what McDaniel's was going to do to the offense, and to #6 when he hired him...


"I looked at the possibility (of hiring a defensive-oriented coach), but the chance to get this young man was very intriguing to me. I think he's going to be a great head coach. I think he'll fix our defense." -- Bowlen, after announcing the hiring of 32-year-old New England Patriots offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels as Broncos head coach, Jan. 12, 2009.

So, McD is now the head coach of the #2 offense and the #29 ranked defense. Right from his very FIRST press conference, McD spoke highly of that offense (specifically Cutler) and what he wanted to accomplish with him:


I think Jay is going to enjoy playing in this system, this offense. It is very quarterback-friendly once you get to the point where you can use all the tools that it gives the quarterback. Obviously, he is a very important part of our success going forward and I can't wait to get started working with him." -- McDaniel's, addressing a question about Cuter in his introductory press conference, Jan. 12, 2009.

Cutler, was also on board with McDaniel's shortly after meeting him for the first time:


"It went really well," Cutler said. "We talked about a lot of stuff. He's very energetic. When I got off the phone, I was excited. I really was. . . . Just talked to him about the importance of our relationship."

Good work coach. I was STOKED at this stage of the game. New young head coach sought out his star 25 year old QB, and established a great relationship.

There was only ONE thing to do next, and that was FIX the #29th ranked defense.


Instead, we all know what happened. Josh McDaniel's decided to toy with his #2 offense, and put out Jay Cutler on the trading block when he heard Matt Cassel was available. The trade attempt failed, and McD lied and covered it up with the press/fan friendly response:
"He is our quarterback."

We all know what happens next, so let's talk about the present day.


Has Josh McDaniel's upgraded the team since 2008? No he hasn't.

Let's go back to the team offensive/defensive statistics:


2008 offensive yards/game: 395.8
2010 offensive yards/game: 359.5

2008 offensive points/game: 23.1
2010 offensive points/game: 21.7

2008 offensive ranking: #2 Overall
2010 current ranking: #11 Overall


2008 defense yards/game: 374.6
2010 defense yards/game: 375.6


2008 points/game given up: 28.0
2010 points/game given up: 28.7

2008 final ranking of defense: #29 overall
2010 current ranking of defense: #26 overall

As you can see, the #2 overall offense has slipped to the #11 overall offense. A downgrade. 2010 offense is averaging less yards/game along with fewer points. One will say there isn't a BIG difference, but there is a difference none the less.... It's a downgrade.

How about that defense? Take a look... Josh McDaniel's has upgraded the #29th ranked defense to #26!!! :clap: Woohoo! Oh wait, take a closer look.... The 2010 defense has given up more yards/game with more points/game than the 2008 defense. This could be either good or bad... There are some games left, but seeing how the Rams could put up 431 yards and 36 points... Those numbers could actually increase (while the overall ranking could fall).



So here we are. Sitting at 3-8; 5-16 since the first six weeks of 2009.

Josh McDaniel's had ONE job to do when he arrived, and that was to fix the 2008 #29th ranked defense.

But oh no... he had to start with the 25 year old QB and the #2 offense.


So here we are today. Judging by our current recorded we have gotten worse. Judging by our offense, it has been downgraded significantly. Judging our defense? Well... I guess you could say we are either equal/worse than 2008.

We were doomed from the start.

Tned
11-29-2010, 12:44 AM
Nice post.

I think a Top Gun quote is appropriate here:

"Son, your ego is writing checks your body can't cash."

When "The Head Coach", aka McDaniels, decided to get into a pissing match with "The Player", aka Cutler, it started a spiral that forced McDaniels to focus much of his first two drafts on offense.

Fact is, even now, many people defend the Cutler and Marshall trades in various ways -- they didn't want to be here, one mistake away from 8 game suspension, head case, pouts on sideline, etc. -- but, the fact is that EVERY other team in the league deals with their young, immature talent, they don't ship them off to other teams.

If he had recognized what he had in Hillis from the '08 game film, he might not have drafted Moreno, and we could have had Orakpo or someone else, but even without that recognition (which I understand), there was no reason he had to rebuild what was the number two offense. He should have worked that game plan magic to improve the red zone, that's all that he should have done.

He should have fixed the defense, which was what was, and still is, broken. Even Mr. Bowlen said he was surprised by the lack of defensive players drafted the first year (in the Woody Paige interview, where he referred to McD's rookie mistakes in the draft, and early months of his tenure).

sneakers
11-29-2010, 12:45 AM
I dunno, he looked like the right guy his first 6 games he coached.

I think he is trying to run a circus with housecats instead of tigers...maybe if he gets his guys in that he wants, things will improve...but will the broncos give him that long?

topscribe
11-29-2010, 12:46 AM
Can't argue with that much. Sickening and disgusting as it is . . .

-----

getlynched47
11-29-2010, 12:55 AM
Glad to see this posted over here, Peerless :salute:

Boo This Man!!! Boo Josh McDaniels!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76p_ncbffCE


76p_ncbffCE


http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd87/sugarfiend06/boo-man.gif

BroncoStud
11-29-2010, 01:04 AM
Great post OP. That really sums up the state of the Broncos. It's saddeningly ironic that the 2008 offense was better than the one we have today despite the high draft picks and time in the system... I miss Cutler more and more every day.

The defense is just a joke. Bob Slowik was better than this. The Rams moved the ball at will.

McDaniels may or may not have lost the players yet, but he's losing us fans rapidly.

cardoso
11-29-2010, 01:12 AM
I dunno, he looked like the right guy his first 6 games he coached.

I think he is trying to run a circus with housecats instead of tigers...maybe if he gets his guys in that he wants, things will improve...but will the broncos give him that long?

ummmmm everyone here are HIS GUYS! and it's a circus act :elefant:

cardoso
11-29-2010, 01:13 AM
Nice post dude!!!!!!

WARHORSE
11-29-2010, 01:13 AM
ZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzz.....................




Just what we needed.

TimBuff10
11-29-2010, 01:45 AM
I didn't realize offenses and defenses were measured by yards. Everyone likes to talk about how good Shanny's O was when he left. Yeah it was good between the 20s gaining lots of yards but avg when you look at the scoreboard. The scoreboard doesn't count yards, it counts points and in the end the only measuring stick there is is wins and losses.

Ravage!!!
11-29-2010, 01:58 AM
I didn't realize offenses and defenses were measured by yards. Everyone likes to talk about how good Shanny's O was when he left. Yeah it was good between the 20s gaining lots of yards but avg when you look at the scoreboard. The scoreboard doesn't count yards, it counts points and in the end the only measuring stick there is is wins and losses.

Yes.. but with young players that were only growing in the NFL. CLady was a rookie, Royal, and Hillis.. rookies. Marshall and Scheffler and Cutler were only in their third season.

So you had YOUNG guys, that were producing WELL in the NFL despite a lack of experience in the league. Having nearly 400 yrds offense in the NFL with that young of a corp, is pretty DAMNED good.

At least it showed promise with promising young players.

JDL
11-29-2010, 02:50 AM
Actually,

I'd say we were more doomed, because it is insulting to fans of a franchise that has bitchslapped the Patriots in good years and bad, to only have the 'Patriots Way' shoved down our throats. I am not saying that is right and I am not saying it is all that rational, but Denver owned NE for the better part of two decades and even BB struggled mightily to solve Denver and Shanahan. The fan base I don't really believe ever respected the Patriots way... the Steelers way (say bringing in that would be different), but ultimately McDaniels was never going to be fully loved... it was always an uncomfortable fit and it was even more so when Shanahan lost faith in his own ways.

See, Shanahan was ruined here actually by the bullet he missed. He knew very well that Denver had no answer for the monster that was Randy Moss in 1998, one very poorly timed FG helped Denver avoid a very very scary battle... the next year we sold our franchises soul by bringing in one of the very greatest enemies of Denver, a CB who ended the season of a true class act in Lionel Washington with what is still the worst cheap shot I've seen in a Broncos game. From that point forward, Shanahan instead of being cutting edge innovator became mr. I'm going to try and copy everyone else... he signed Dale Carter, then he proceeded to pour resources and money into becoming some stalwart D that we never had the proper coaches or talent evaluators for... as hard as it is to say... Greg Robinson was a big reason those teams were successful... his D's gave up a ton of big plays, but when you have an elite offense, the trick is to give your Offense more possessions than the opposition and you will win a VERY high percentage of the time... so we had an all-world offense teamed with a D that could score TDs themselves and did a great job getting turnovers and forcing other teams into mistakes. Until the Pats came along people seemed to understand that the league had become 1-dimensional... you need to be great on one side of the ball, and average in a complimentary way on the other side. The Pats were this very amorphous blob of a team with no clearly identifiable 'great', they didn't truly wow you or scare you on either side of the ball. They won that first Super Bowl by literally tackling Faulk out of the backfield in a game where the officials shelved their whistles and allowed it to occur. They became the San Antonio Spurs of the NFL... they had Brady their perfect caretaker accurate QB (the quintessential QB of the 2000s) and the best at it and built this team around him that cut every corner, used every dirty trick to fight their way to the top.

It was fairly offensive to have that Patriots Way brought to Denver, that arrogance (McD always thought Cutler was a punk and he may have been right, but doesn't mean he shouldn't have at least tried to make it work with him) and just blew up a team that was on the verge of something but needed someone to fix the red zone offense and D. So out went a bunch of beloved fan favorites and in came Patriots... and when you stack the deck against yourself that way... it never had a chance, not really. It's always been an uneasy marriage for most Broncos fans... and it has only been compounded by some of the worst aspects of the Patriots way... an often ineffective uninspiring rushing attack and embarrassment for cheating coupled with an unprecedented losing streak in the Bowlen era. It was ultimately a horrible decision from the start and bad bad choice.

Bosco
11-29-2010, 04:33 AM
Actually,

I'd say we were more doomed, because it is insulting to fans of a franchise that has bitchslapped the Patriots in good years and bad, to only have the 'Patriots Way' shoved down our throats. I am not saying that is right and I am not saying it is all that rational, but Denver owned NE for the better part of two decades and even BB struggled mightily to solve Denver and Shanahan. The fan base I don't really believe ever respected the Patriots way... the Steelers way (say bringing in that would be different), but ultimately McDaniels was never going to be fully loved... it was always an uncomfortable fit and it was even more so when Shanahan lost faith in his own ways.

See, Shanahan was ruined here actually by the bullet he missed. He knew very well that Denver had no answer for the monster that was Randy Moss in 1998, one very poorly timed FG helped Denver avoid a very very scary battle... the next year we sold our franchises soul by bringing in one of the very greatest enemies of Denver, a CB who ended the season of a true class act in Lionel Washington with what is still the worst cheap shot I've seen in a Broncos game. From that point forward, Shanahan instead of being cutting edge innovator became mr. I'm going to try and copy everyone else... he signed Dale Carter, then he proceeded to pour resources and money into becoming some stalwart D that we never had the proper coaches or talent evaluators for... as hard as it is to say... Greg Robinson was a big reason those teams were successful... his D's gave up a ton of big plays, but when you have an elite offense, the trick is to give your Offense more possessions than the opposition and you will win a VERY high percentage of the time... so we had an all-world offense teamed with a D that could score TDs themselves and did a great job getting turnovers and forcing other teams into mistakes. Until the Pats came along people seemed to understand that the league had become 1-dimensional... you need to be great on one side of the ball, and average in a complimentary way on the other side. The Pats were this very amorphous blob of a team with no clearly identifiable 'great', they didn't truly wow you or scare you on either side of the ball. They won that first Super Bowl by literally tackling Faulk out of the backfield in a game where the officials shelved their whistles and allowed it to occur. They became the San Antonio Spurs of the NFL... they had Brady their perfect caretaker accurate QB (the quintessential QB of the 2000s) and the best at it and built this team around him that cut every corner, used every dirty trick to fight their way to the top.

It was fairly offensive to have that Patriots Way brought to Denver, that arrogance (McD always thought Cutler was a punk and he may have been right, but doesn't mean he shouldn't have at least tried to make it work with him) and just blew up a team that was on the verge of something but needed someone to fix the red zone offense and D. So out went a bunch of beloved fan favorites and in came Patriots... and when you stack the deck against yourself that way... it never had a chance, not really. It's always been an uneasy marriage for most Broncos fans... and it has only been compounded by some of the worst aspects of the Patriots way... an often ineffective uninspiring rushing attack and embarrassment for cheating coupled with an unprecedented losing streak in the Bowlen era. It was ultimately a horrible decision from the start and bad bad choice.

This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.

spikerman
11-29-2010, 06:43 AM
This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.

wow.... just, wow. :tsk:

eessydo
11-29-2010, 06:43 AM
I didn't realize offenses and defenses were measured by yards. Everyone likes to talk about how good Shanny's O was when he left. Yeah it was good between the 20s gaining lots of yards but avg when you look at the scoreboard. The scoreboard doesn't count yards, it counts points and in the end the only measuring stick there is is wins and losses.

Ok Tim,

Let's measure it in wins and losses and to be fair we will take shanahan's last two seasons where we missed the playoffs (no need to count the two superbowls and conference championships, they mean nothing).

Shanahan

2007 W 7 L 9
2008 W 9 L 7

McDaniels

2009 W 8 L 8
2010 W 3 L 7

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that the W column is definitely not going to exceed the L column this year. We are clearly going backwards.

Is that a good enough measurement for you?

eessydo
11-29-2010, 06:51 AM
This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.

Cool, so now we have a bunch of guys that think of the team first and lose, instead of having a talent rich group of players that produced and won ball games. I really enjoy watching "solid" professionals. Nothing makes it more "worth it" than watching a completely unprepared group of "professionals" allowing our opponents to light us up for ridiculous scores.

Also nothing gives me more pride than watching a coach who has won a game blitz incessantly in the 4th quarter to run up a score to save his job because he is so "professional" and team oriented.

I am also filled with pleasure when a coach tosses a guy under a bus because his reputation would get hurt because he is so "team oriented" and "team first" in his approach to the game. Obviously he had nothing to do with it, no instruction to film the other team. Ignorance is bliss.

This all makes so much sense to me now. I clearly see how Josh McDaniels is all about the "team" and shows it in his actions on and off the football field. Clearly he is a good role model and we should believe in him no matter what, right??

Dean
11-29-2010, 07:39 AM
This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.

Can you say denial?

dunk7
11-29-2010, 11:04 AM
I think any of us would agree that if we see a glimmer of improvement, we'd be willing to give McD more time but it just isn't happening. Yesterdays game was embarrassing. The Rams 4th quarter ultra prevent defense looked like our typical defense. In terms of preparation, its easy to see why the Broncos aren't successful on defense. Every time we face a top tier RB (with the exception of McFadden), we've prepped all week saying "we need to stop "insert name". We usually do a decent job of that but the focus is so dedicated to stopping that one player that as soon as the other team changes their gameplan, its just pure chaos. I swear, all the LB's yesterday must have been focused on stopping Jackson so much so that they didn't even assign one to cover the TE's.

turftoad
11-29-2010, 11:56 AM
This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.

I'm sure the Pats could use one more fan. :shocked:

broncofaninfla
11-29-2010, 12:04 PM
This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.

You do realize we suck now right?

arapaho2
11-29-2010, 12:30 PM
This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.


go support the patriot way then...this is our bronco team...not the patriots

and we are forced into the patriot way...spygate II shows that:lol:

topscribe
11-29-2010, 02:23 PM
In retrospect, I'm not all that sure the Broncos' woes can be attributed to
lack of talent. Yes, the team's two best pass rushers - Ayers and Dumervil -
have been missing from the lineup for most of the season, and that has had a
devastating effect on pass defense. But beyond them, what position really
has "bad" players?

This post might seem off-topic, but I'm getting to the point.

I believe there is a desperate lack of morale on the team. I believe the players -
most of them - are lying when they stand up for McDaniels they way they do.
The older players know to keep issues internally, and the younger ones would
be placing their jobs on the line to come out with the truth.

But McDaniels' taking the coaches in front of the owner and launching a
scathing diatribe against them in the owner's presence has provided a
monstrous red flag to me. That has been reinforced by an insider's averring
that McDaniels treats people like a "piece of ____," according to Michael
Silver of Yahoo Sports, who claims to have talked personally with the bird.

This revives the incidents involving Cutler, Marshall, and Scheffler, in my
mind. Cutler actually showed up in McDaniels' office to try to smooth a
relationship, according to my understanding of reports, only to leave in a
huff so severe that he would not respond even to Mr. Bowlen after that.

I saw Marshall apparently trying hard to straighten out his relationships
with McDaniels and the team, only to express after the trade, in effect,
how glad he was to be gone.

And what about Scheffler? Was he a spoiled child with a 'tude? Well, if my
impressions are accurate (I'm not certain, but those are my impressions),
Cutler and Marshall were Scheffler's best friends on the team. He and
Marshall were roommates, IIRC. If they were both treated "like a piece of
____," why would he not develop a negative attitude toward it?

I always thought Nolan's departure was very curious. Why would he
suddenly book to make a lateral move to another team before he had
completed his rebuilding here?

I may be entirely wrong, but I believe the Head Coach has a problem in
personal relations, and that is the first prerequisite to coaching, even
before the X's and O's.

It will be very unsettling to the franchise to bring in a new regime and start
all over again with an entirely new infrastructure, let alone a scheme. But
I fear that if the present one remains one more year, the destruction will
be so complete that it will take another decade to repair the damage. I
have somewhat of a background in this, in that I went through that kind
of construction in the 1960s. Believe me, one does not want to go into
another decade before one's team can achieve a winning record.

I have been on the fence about this front office for some time, trying hard
to take a position of support toward it. But now I'm off the fence. It's time
for a change.

IMHO.

-----

GEM
11-29-2010, 02:27 PM
In retrospect, I'm not all that sure the Broncos' woes can be attributed to
lack of talent. Yes, the team's two best pass rushers - Ayers and Dumervil -
have been missing from the lineup for most of the season, and that has had a
devastating effect on pass defense. But beyond them, what position really
has "bad" players?

This post might seem off-topic, but I'm getting to the point.

I believe there is a desperate lack of morale on the team. I believe the players -
most of them - are lying when they stand up for McDaniels they way they do.
The older players know to keep issues internally, and the younger ones would
be placing their jobs on the line to come out with the truth.

But McDaniels' taking the coaches in front of the owner and launching a
scathing diatribe against them in the owner's presence has provided a
monstrous red flag to me. That has been reinforced by an insider's averring
that McDaniels treats people like a "piece of ____," according to Michael
Silver of Yahoo Sports, who claims to have talked personally with the bird.

This revives the incidents involving Cutler, Marshall, and Scheffler, in my
mind. Cutler actually showed up in McDaniels' office to try to smooth a
relationship, according to my understanding of reports, only to leave in a
huff so severe that he would not respond even to Mr. Bowlen after that.

I saw Marshall apparently trying hard to straighten out his relationships
with McDaniels and the team, only to express after the trade, in effect,
how glad he was to be gone.

And what about Scheffler? Was he a spoiled child with a 'tude? Well, if my
impressions are accurate (I'm not certain, but those are my impressions),
Cutler and Marshall were Scheffler's best friends on the team. He and
Marshall were roommates, IIRC. If they were both treated "like a piece of
____," why would he not develop a negative attitude toward it?

I always thought Nolan's departure was very curious. Why would he
suddenly book to make a lateral move to another team before he had
completed his rebuilding here?

I may be entirely wrong, but I believe the Head Coach has a problem in
personal relations, and that is the first prerequisite to coaching, even
before the X's and O's.

It will be very unsettling to the franchise to bring in a new regime and start
all over again with an entirely new infrastructure, let alone a scheme. But
I fear that if the present one remains one more year, the destruction will
be so complete that it will take another decade to repair the damage. I
have somewhat of a background in this, in that I went through that kind
of construction in the 1960s. Believe me, one does not want to go into
another decade before one's team can achieve a winning record.

I have been on the fence about this front office for some time, trying hard
to take a position of support toward it. But now I'm off the fence. It's time
for a change.

IMHO.

-----

We fought the good fight, Top. We tried as hard as we could.

topscribe
11-29-2010, 02:27 PM
We fought the good fight, Top. We tried as hard as we could.

It hurts, GEM. It really hurts . . .

-----

GEM
11-29-2010, 02:28 PM
It hurts, GEM. It really hurts . . .

-----

I know doll, I'm right there with ya. :(

Ravage!!!
11-29-2010, 02:46 PM
This post perfectly outlines why McDaniels was the right man for the job. This team and it's fanbase was too infatuated with streaky playmakers and gunslingers rather than solid, professional football players. We needed some massive culture shock here, regardless of whether it "offended" our ever fragile fan base. No matter what happens with the rest of McDaniels' tenure here, installing the team first "Patriot Way" made it worth it.

I've seen posters have blinders on. I've seen posts that are purely looking through the orange-colored lenses. But this, I don't know wha this is. This isn't looking through orange-colored lenses, this is looking through black, light-blocking lenses that are given to the blind, or those trying to watch the lunar eclipse. This is based on nothing other, than complete blind defense of a guy that has given nothing to this team.

I've seen fans follow players from team to team, but I've never seen such blind devotion to an over-hyped OC before. I knew you were a patriots fan, but even patriots fans don't have such denial drippping from their homerism.

Ravage!!!
11-29-2010, 02:49 PM
In retrospect, I'm not all that sure the Broncos' woes can be attributed to
lack of talent. Yes, the team's two best pass rushers - Ayers and Dumervil -
have been missing from the lineup for most of the season, and that has had a
devastating effect on pass defense. But beyond them, what position really
has "bad" players?

This post might seem off-topic, but I'm getting to the point.

I believe there is a desperate lack of morale on the team. I believe the players -
most of them - are lying when they stand up for McDaniels they way they do.
The older players know to keep issues internally, and the younger ones would
be placing their jobs on the line to come out with the truth.

But McDaniels' taking the coaches in front of the owner and launching a
scathing diatribe against them in the owner's presence has provided a
monstrous red flag to me. That has been reinforced by an insider's averring
that McDaniels treats people like a "piece of ____," according to Michael
Silver of Yahoo Sports, who claims to have talked personally with the bird.

This revives the incidents involving Cutler, Marshall, and Scheffler, in my
mind. Cutler actually showed up in McDaniels' office to try to smooth a
relationship, according to my understanding of reports, only to leave in a
huff so severe that he would not respond even to Mr. Bowlen after that.

I saw Marshall apparently trying hard to straighten out his relationships
with McDaniels and the team, only to express after the trade, in effect,
how glad he was to be gone.

And what about Scheffler? Was he a spoiled child with a 'tude? Well, if my
impressions are accurate (I'm not certain, but those are my impressions),
Cutler and Marshall were Scheffler's best friends on the team. He and
Marshall were roommates, IIRC. If they were both treated "like a piece of
____," why would he not develop a negative attitude toward it?

I always thought Nolan's departure was very curious. Why would he
suddenly book to make a lateral move to another team before he had
completed his rebuilding here?

I may be entirely wrong, but I believe the Head Coach has a problem in
personal relations, and that is the first prerequisite to coaching, even
before the X's and O's.

It will be very unsettling to the franchise to bring in a new regime and start
all over again with an entirely new infrastructure, let alone a scheme. But
I fear that if the present one remains one more year, the destruction will
be so complete that it will take another decade to repair the damage. I
have somewhat of a background in this, in that I went through that kind
of construction in the 1960s. Believe me, one does not want to go into
another decade before one's team can achieve a winning record.

I have been on the fence about this front office for some time, trying hard
to take a position of support toward it. But now I'm off the fence. It's time
for a change.

IMHO.

-----

Top.. I think this is my all - time favorite post of yours

topscribe
11-29-2010, 03:03 PM
Top.. I think this is my all - time favorite post of yours

Awww shucks, Rav . . . :kicksthedirt:

That means a lot coming from . . . oh wait . . .


:D

-----

TXBRONC
11-29-2010, 03:29 PM
In retrospect, I'm not all that sure the Broncos' woes can be attributed to
lack of talent. Yes, the team's two best pass rushers - Ayers and Dumervil -
have been missing from the lineup for most of the season, and that has had a
devastating effect on pass defense. But beyond them, what position really
has "bad" players?

This post might seem off-topic, but I'm getting to the point.

I believe there is a desperate lack of morale on the team. I believe the players -
most of them - are lying when they stand up for McDaniels they way they do.
The older players know to keep issues internally, and the younger ones would
be placing their jobs on the line to come out with the truth.

But McDaniels' taking the coaches in front of the owner and launching a
scathing diatribe against them in the owner's presence has provided a
monstrous red flag to me. That has been reinforced by an insider's averring
that McDaniels treats people like a "piece of ____," according to Michael
Silver of Yahoo Sports, who claims to have talked personally with the bird.

This revives the incidents involving Cutler, Marshall, and Scheffler, in my
mind. Cutler actually showed up in McDaniels' office to try to smooth a
relationship, according to my understanding of reports, only to leave in a
huff so severe that he would not respond even to Mr. Bowlen after that.

I saw Marshall apparently trying hard to straighten out his relationships
with McDaniels and the team, only to express after the trade, in effect,
how glad he was to be gone.

And what about Scheffler? Was he a spoiled child with a 'tude? Well, if my
impressions are accurate (I'm not certain, but those are my impressions),
Cutler and Marshall were Scheffler's best friends on the team. He and
Marshall were roommates, IIRC. If they were both treated "like a piece of
____," why would he not develop a negative attitude toward it?

I always thought Nolan's departure was very curious. Why would he
suddenly book to make a lateral move to another team before he had
completed his rebuilding here?

I may be entirely wrong, but I believe the Head Coach has a problem in
personal relations, and that is the first prerequisite to coaching, even
before the X's and O's.

It will be very unsettling to the franchise to bring in a new regime and start
all over again with an entirely new infrastructure, let alone a scheme. But
I fear that if the present one remains one more year, the destruction will
be so complete that it will take another decade to repair the damage. I
have somewhat of a background in this, in that I went through that kind
of construction in the 1960s. Believe me, one does not want to go into
another decade before one's team can achieve a winning record.

I have been on the fence about this front office for some time, trying hard
to take a position of support toward it. But now I'm off the fence. It's time
for a change.

IMHO.

-----

Top you and I have been on the outs with one an other but I do agree with others this is a great post. :beer:

Lancane
11-29-2010, 03:35 PM
In retrospect, I'm not all that sure the Broncos' woes can be attributed to
lack of talent. Yes, the team's two best pass rushers - Ayers and Dumervil -
have been missing from the lineup for most of the season, and that has had a
devastating effect on pass defense. But beyond them, what position really
has "bad" players?

This post might seem off-topic, but I'm getting to the point.

I believe there is a desperate lack of morale on the team. I believe the players -
most of them - are lying when they stand up for McDaniels they way they do.
The older players know to keep issues internally, and the younger ones would
be placing their jobs on the line to come out with the truth.

But McDaniels' taking the coaches in front of the owner and launching a
scathing diatribe against them in the owner's presence has provided a
monstrous red flag to me. That has been reinforced by an insider's averring
that McDaniels treats people like a "piece of ____," according to Michael
Silver of Yahoo Sports, who claims to have talked personally with the bird.

This revives the incidents involving Cutler, Marshall, and Scheffler, in my
mind. Cutler actually showed up in McDaniels' office to try to smooth a
relationship, according to my understanding of reports, only to leave in a
huff so severe that he would not respond even to Mr. Bowlen after that.

I saw Marshall apparently trying hard to straighten out his relationships
with McDaniels and the team, only to express after the trade, in effect,
how glad he was to be gone.

And what about Scheffler? Was he a spoiled child with a 'tude? Well, if my
impressions are accurate (I'm not certain, but those are my impressions),
Cutler and Marshall were Scheffler's best friends on the team. He and
Marshall were roommates, IIRC. If they were both treated "like a piece of
____," why would he not develop a negative attitude toward it?

I always thought Nolan's departure was very curious. Why would he
suddenly book to make a lateral move to another team before he had
completed his rebuilding here?

I may be entirely wrong, but I believe the Head Coach has a problem in
personal relations, and that is the first prerequisite to coaching, even
before the X's and O's.

It will be very unsettling to the franchise to bring in a new regime and start
all over again with an entirely new infrastructure, let alone a scheme. But
I fear that if the present one remains one more year, the destruction will
be so complete that it will take another decade to repair the damage. I
have somewhat of a background in this, in that I went through that kind
of construction in the 1960s. Believe me, one does not want to go into
another decade before one's team can achieve a winning record.

I have been on the fence about this front office for some time, trying hard
to take a position of support toward it. But now I'm off the fence. It's time
for a change.

IMHO.

-----

In my honest opinion...this is without a doubt the best post of the year by anyone on the forums.

:beer:

TXBRONC
11-29-2010, 03:35 PM
You do realize we suck now right?

It's rather hard to defend the Patriot way when you're 3-8 on the current season and what 5-20 since the midway point of last season?

HORSEPOWER 56
11-29-2010, 03:53 PM
I'm sure the Pats could use one more fan. :shocked:

McDaniels sure could! :laugh:

Seriously though, Bosco will be gone as soon as McDaniels is. Much like how Jagsbch was as soon as he realized that Tebow wouldn't start this year no matter how bad the season turned out...

Broncolingus
11-29-2010, 04:16 PM
Wins and Losses - particularly in January - are all that matters...

(...although, I do appreciate how it's unlikely a bottom ranked offensive and defensive team is going to be successful in Jan...)

Not sure how much else is relevant here...

Hardwired
11-29-2010, 05:02 PM
I have been on the fence about this front office for some time, trying hard
to take a position of support toward it. But now I'm off the fence. It's time
for a change.

IMHO.

-----

Yeah. There are just too many mistakes and bad feelings piling one on top of another to ever dig out from under. Making mistakes is one thing, but ruining my team with unethical incompetence is another. I was giving him 3 years before judging what he's done, but I'm not sure what will be left if Pat waits that long. Josh needs to go. :screwy:

Cugel
11-30-2010, 12:16 PM
Peerless's original post pretty much sums it up. This is exactly what threw me off the McDaniels bandwagon starting off.

I mean what the hell was he doing getting rid of all the best offensive players and changing the ZBS scheme that was working just fine?

But, what really lost me was the oblivious arrogant way of his. He's always right, even when he's wrong. He just can't really accept criticism. You know he mouths the words in press conferences after a loss. But, privately, every inside tidbit that comes out from Dove Valley just reinforces the image of a petty tyrant with a runt complex who can't treat people with respect.

And you're seeing the unmistakable evidence of that when his own coaches start ratting him out to the media. They have no loyalty because HE has no loyalty to them and is constantly ready to throw anybody under the bus at any time.

People say Cutler was "a crybaby." But, who's supposed to be the adult in that relationship? The Coach or the player? Why couldn't McDaniels simply be the bigger person and mend fences with his star QB? Was it really so important who was "right". Did he really need to say "I don't regret anything and I wouldn't do anything different."

That's a slap in the face, not mending fences.

So, right from the start it was clear that McDaniels just has a serious personality defect. He just can't treat people with respect. It's either "my way or the highway."

And if you've ever worked for a boss who's angry and always right, you know that doesn't work out for very long. The best workers find ways to change jobs. The ones who are left are the ones who are willing to surrender their self-respect and just do what they're told. And that doesn't usually work out for very long because people become expert at covering their rear-ends and not angering the tyrant and concentrate on that rather than producing success.

It creates an atmosphere of fear. And McDaniels seems to revel in that. He wants to strut around and have everybody afraid. He thinks that way they'll work extra hard and he'll have everything under his control.

Only, when you've failed again and again the infant tyrant act wears thin. People find petty ways of getting back at you (like ratting you out to the media).

Ex: Nolan did a brilliant job turning the defense around -- for at least the first 1/2 of the season. Perhaps it might have been a good idea to keep him around and see what he could do with a few more defensive draft picks?

But, McEgo couldn't stand having a guy who had been a former head coach and demanded respect. Nolan had to go.

Since then the defense has been crap. That's really the problem with this team. The offense has declined from what it was to mediocre, but the defense is just as horrible as it was in 2008. No improvement.

But the WORST malefactor was Bowlen. Despite his rhetoric to the contrary, he really loves having one guy control both drafting and coaching, just like Shanahan. Only that failed under Shanahan and is a total disaster under McDaniels.

Peter King is right. McDaniels the coach is being undone by McDaniels the draft and trade ignoramus. :coffee:

UrbanBounca
11-30-2010, 12:25 PM
McD has never understood that offense makes you look good, but defense wins games. Why do you think the Ravens end up with a winning record every year, even with Flacco?
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

arapaho2
11-30-2010, 01:55 PM
mcd reminds me of that ******* Matt from that show " Rehab, party at the hard rock"
kinda looks like him too

I Eat Staples
11-30-2010, 02:03 PM
Excellent post, Peerless.

I have no idea how some people came to support McDaniels so vigorously. Even now, people make excuses for him and don't want him to be fired. He's the worst coach in the NFL and it will always perplex me as to how people couldn't see this sooner.

Ever since he was hired, he showed me all the signs of a failure of a HC.

Ravage!!!
11-30-2010, 02:08 PM
Excellent post, Peerless.

I have no idea how some people came to support McDaniels so vigorously. Even now, people make excuses for him and don't want him to be fired. He's the worst coach in the NFL and it will always perplex me as to how people couldn't see this sooner.

Ever since he was hired, he showed me all the signs of a failure of a HC.

you know.. I actually woke up Monday morning, and was expecting to read the headlines in the the sports column that there was a 3rd HC fired before season's end. I was a bit surprised there wasn't....but it occured to me just how much of a spring in my step I had when going to go look for that bit of news. :beer: