Orton needs better protection from Oline

[topscribe]

By Jeff Legwold
The Denver Post
POSTED: 09/14/2010 01:00:00 AM MDT
UPDATED: 09/14/2010 02:51:49 AM MDT


Kyle Orton directs traffic against the Jaguars, whose defense pressured the Broncos QB on almost every pass attempt. ( Joe Amon, The Denver Post )
A work in progress is just that: in progress.

And a season opener is just that: the opener. It isn't a trend or the way things are going to be the rest of the way.

Not yet, anyway.

But that doesn't change the fact that quarterback Kyle Orton won't start all of the games the Broncos would like him to this season if they don't protect him better than they did Sunday at Jacksonville.

Perhaps that means the Broncos need to run the ball more, just to slow down opposing defensive fronts. Or that Orton needs to get rid of the ball a little more quickly, even throw it away from time to time, out of a defense's reach.

Or that the Broncos run fewer three-wide-receiver looks and more of their two-tight-end packages. They used a tight end and a running back in the backfield to bracket Orton in protection from time to time Sunday.

But Orton still was sacked three times by a team that finished last in the NFL, by a long stretch, in sacks last season with just 14, or three fewer than Elvis Dumervil had alone for the Broncos.

Aaron Kampman, with 1-1/2 sacks Sunday, and rookie defensive tackle Tyson Alualu — known in Jacksonville as the guy the team took instead of Tim Tebow in the draft — were nice additions to the Jacksonville defensive front in the offseason, but the Jaguars still aren't as accomplished in the defensive line as several teams still to come on the Broncos' schedule.

When Orton is healthy, he has shown he can move the offense and make the throws the Broncos want him to make. When things have taken a downturn in his career, it is usually when he has dealt with some kind of leg or ankle injury.

He's not the kind of scrambler who looks to bolt the pocket at his first chance to run, but he certainly may have to be more judicious in how long he stands in there as the Broncos work through things up front.

Sunday they had three offensive linemen — center J.D. Walton, guard

ALL THINGS BRONCOS BLOG

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Stanley Daniels and tackle Zane Beadles — making their first NFL regular-season starts. That's a lot of game-day inexperience at a position that covets working together over the long haul.
And with right tackle Ryan Harris having been left home from Jacksonville because of an ankle injury that required him to wear a walking boot for much of last week, those three may have to make several starts together.

That's a lot to learn on the job, and the NFL is a cruel business at times. Defensive coaches aren't going to look at all that video and then decide to back off and give the Broncos a break.

They're looking for weaknesses, and they'll pound away at those weaknesses until you fix them.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_16065850


I am really worried about Orton. There's been a lot of talk about how effective
he was in the Jax game, and so he was. But he was beaten half to death back
there in the process. This cannot go on for 16 games. No QB can take that. I
hope they get something done to protect him.

We need you, Ryan Harris!!

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[claymore]

Lets all pray for his ankles.

[slim]

Nice work, top. I think next time you should just paste the entire story into the thread title.

[BigDaddyBronco]

Beadles didn't look ready out there.

[topscribe]

Nice work, top. I think next time you should just paste the entire story into the thread title.

lol - I didn't realize at the time I was pasting so much. I'm trying to get a mod to
shorten it for me, but I can't get anybody's attention. Maybe I ought to flame
somebody real good - that ought to do it . . . :D

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[slim]

lol - I didn't realize at the time I was pasting so much. I'm trying to get a mod to
shorten it for me, but I can't get anybody's attention. Maybe I ought to flame
somebody real good - that ought to do it . . . :D

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Yes, that sounds like a good idea.

I hope Beadles is a better guard than he is a tackle.

[topscribe]

Yes, that sounds like a good idea.

I hope Beadles is a better guard than he is a tackle.

He's a rookie and more of a natural guard. Yes, he played some tackle in college,
but that was in college. I think he'll be fine, just not at tackle . . .

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[BigDaddyBronco]

Yes, that sounds like a good idea.

I hope Beadles is a better guard than he is a tackle.

I don't remember then getting too much pressure up the middle. Maybe a couple of times. Most of the time it was edge rushing with Kampman looking the best.

If Clady and Harris can get healthy we might be in decent shape.

[Nomad]

Beadles didn't look ready out there.

Hopefully first game gitters! It's a good way to get seasoned in your NFL career against a hardnosed defense like Jax! He'll get better as time goes on!

[silkamilkamonico]

Really disappointed in the way the oline and dline have shaped up under McDaniels at this point. I know we're young, inexperienced and trying to get healthy, but if this is going to be a 2+ year process I am really disappointed.

As far as the dline goes, how do we get players that played well on dominant defenses in other organizations and they come here and we still struggle?

I must say I expected more in terms of positive results at this point.

[slim]

I don't remember then getting too much pressure up the middle. Maybe a couple of times. Most of the time it was edge rushing with Kampman looking the best.

If Clady and Harris can get healthy we might be in decent shape.

Yeah, I just hope Harris can play this week (I have read that he probably won't).

Also, there were a couple of crucial runs in the game that went over the right side (I would have to watch it again to be more specific). I was kinda surprised by that.

[slim]

He's a rookie and more of a natural guard. Yes, he played some tackle in college,
but that was in college. I think he'll be fine, just not at tackle . . .

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I hope you are right. I am certainly not going to write him off after one game, but I want to see improvment every week.

[topscribe]

I hope you are right. I am certainly not going to write him off after one game, but I want to see improvment every week.

Clady and Harris are effective because of superior footwork. That is what a
tackle needs more than anything else. Beadles is big and strong - more of a
road grader, it seems. But I didn't notice particularly good footwork at tackle
from him . . .

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[BigDaddyBronco]

Really disappointed in the way the oline and dline have shaped up under McDaniels at this point. I know we're young, inexperienced and trying to get healthy, but if this is going to be a 2+ year process I am really disappointed.

As far as the dline goes, how do we get players that played well on dominant defenses in other organizations and they come here and we still struggle?

I must say I expected more in terms of positive results at this point.
I think with the DLine we have Bannan who was a back-up in Baltimore and played with much better players such as Ngata, Pryce, Kelly Gregg, etc. he looked better by osmosis. Williams is at the end of his career and missed last year. he also played with a bunch of good defensive players in SD. McBean and the rest of our guys are former practice squad, 2nd teamers, or low round draft picks. Until we restock our DLine with 1st and 2nd rounders or with high priced free agents (Jarvis Green didn't pan out), we are going to be in this boat.

On the OLine we replaced 2 out of 5 and are on the second year of a new style, with last year being a transition where we did some zone blocking. Add to that the injuries to Clady and Harris and we are where we are. If Clady and Harris get healthy and we still look like this, then we are in trouble.

[Nomad]

I hope you are right. I am certainly not going to write him off after one game, but I want to see improvment every week.

I agree! I'm a "give McDaniels time" type of guy but if there isn't improvement as the year goes on, it'll be hard not to question him!

[Northman]

Really disappointed in the way the oline and dline have shaped up under McDaniels at this point. I know we're young, inexperienced and trying to get healthy, but if this is going to be a 2+ year process I am really disappointed.

As far as the dline goes, how do we get players that played well on dominant defenses in other organizations and they come here and we still struggle?

I must say I expected more in terms of positive results at this point.

Same.

[claymore]

I agree! I'm a "give McDaniels time" type of guy but if there isn't improvement as the year goes on, it'll be hard not to question him!

Im really trying to keep my mouth shut.

[slim]

Im really trying to keep my mouth shut.

Try harder.

[Nomad]

Im really trying to keep my mouth shut.

Speak your mind clay, it's not healthy to keep your worries held in!

[turftoad]

I agree! I'm a "give McDaniels time" type of guy but if there isn't improvement as the year goes on, it'll be hard not to question him!

Yep. Everyone was so excited about how McD "fixed" the O and D lines.

You can't expect to start two rookies on the O line and expect them to be good right away. Unless thier names are Pouncy. They will get better in time but, defenitly not fixed right away.

We brought in some back up D linemen and an old Williams. Most fans were excited. There is a reason they did not start for thier former teams and let go by thier former teams.

We need to address this in the draft or spend some real money on some real talent in FA.
The D line problems are the same problems and have been addressed the same way Shanahan used to address them. Thats one of the main reasons he got fired. Hope McD learns in a hurry or he may be next out the door sooner than later.

[claymore]

Speak your mind clay, it's not healthy to keep your worries held in!

Ive said it all before. I just need everyone to see it and then we can sit around in agreement.

[claymore]

Yep. Everyone was so excited about how McD "fixed" the O and D lines.

You can't expect to start two rookies on the O line and expect them to be good right away. Unless thier names are Pouncy. They will get better in time but, defenitly not fixed right away.

We brought in some back up D linemen and an old Williams. Most fans were excited. There is a reason they did not start for thier former teams and let go by thier former teams.

We need to address this in the draft or spend some real money on some real talent in FA.
The D line problems are the same problems and have been addressed the same way Shanahan used to address them. Thats one of the main reasons he got fired. Hope McD learns in a hurry or he may be next out the door sooner than later.

This is why I want to see Bailey at safety. 1. It does no good to have an all century CB and no DL. 2. Bailey is at the end of his career anyway. Why not lock up safety for 4-5 more years and spend that money on DL. Even if we have to overpay for it?

[BigDaddyBronco]

I we don't spend some 1st or 2nd round picks on the DLine next year I'm going to go nuts.

So far McD has rebuilt the OLine with high picks, the WR's with picks and FA's, the RB situation with Moreno, the QBs with Orton and Tebow, TEs in his style (not mine, but whatever) so the offense is more or less rebuilt, with maybe some more depth at RB and T and a better 2nd TE.

On defense he brought in FAs and drafted both S (last year) and CB (this year) to rebuild the secondary. Drafted a LB (last year) to go with the LB's we had and brought in FAs for depth, and brouhgt in FAs for the DLine. Looks like we need some talent on Dline and better back-ups at LB.

We are getting there. Now the only question is if his system is going to work or not.

[turftoad]

I we don't spend some 1st or 2nd round picks on the DLine next year I'm going to go nuts.

So far McD has rebuilt the OLine with high picks, the WR's with picks and FA's, the RB situation with Moreno, the QBs with Orton and Tebow, TEs in his style (not mine, but whatever) so the offense is more or less rebuilt, with maybe some more depth at RB and T and a better 2nd TE.

On defense he brought in FAs and drafted both S (last year) and CB (this year) to rebuild the secondary. Drafted a LB (last year) to go with the LB's we had and brought in FAs for depth, and brouhgt in FAs for the DLine. Looks like we need some talent on Dline and better back-ups at LB.

We are getting there. Now the only question is if his system is going to work or not.

We miss Doom more than expected. Not much pressure on Gerrard was evident and only 1 sack. We need him. Bad.

[Nomad]

Yep. Everyone was so excited about how McD "fixed" the O and D lines.

You can't expect to start two rookies on the O line and expect them to be good right away. Unless thier names are Pouncy. They will get better in time but, defenitly not fixed right away.

We brought in some back up D linemen and an old Williams. Most fans were excited. There is a reason they did not start for thier former teams and let go by thier former teams.

We need to address this in the draft or spend some real money on some real talent in FA.
The D line problems are the same problems and have been addressed the same way Shanahan used to address them. Thats one of the main reasons he got fired. Hope McD learns in a hurry or he may be next out the door sooner than later.

I was all about the oline/dline in the draft always have been! Spending....are Shanny and McDaniels both tightwads or is there a higher figure calling the shots in FA and resigning!:ponder: McDaniel's will either succeed or fail, there's no in between and this season is a defining season! Give it more than one game for the rookies to make an impact, it'll happen!!

[BigDaddyBronco]

We miss Doom more than expected. Not much pressure on Gerrard was evident and only 1 sack. We need him. Bad.
Man I wish they would have drafted Orakpo instead of Moreno. That is one thing Shanny always got right. Don't draft a RB in the 1st round.

[Northman]

We miss Doom more than expected. Not much pressure on Gerrard was evident and only 1 sack. We need him. Bad.

Yep. There was some talking that we didnt need a pass specialist because as a team we could get enough pressure to force turnovers. That didnt happen on one of the more average NFL QB's. Imagine what will happen with the likes of Brady or Manning? This isnt a good start and at the moment i dont see any real progress as a team.

[BigDaddyBronco]

I was all about the oline/dline in the draft always have been! Spending....are Shanny and McDaniels both tightwads or is there a higher figure calling the shots in FA and resigning!:ponder: McDaniel's will either succeed or fail, there's no in between and this season is a defining season! Give it more than one game for the rookies to make an impact, it'll happen!!
I think Bowlen has tightened the purse strings quite a bit. After Shanny wasted a bunch of his money on guys like Dale Carter and Gardener I think Bowlen wanted some say in how his money was being spent.

Further evidence is in how they treated the Marshall issue, he made the right call from a financial risk point of view. We'll see how they deal with Champ on a new deal.

[claymore]

Yep. There was some talking that we didnt need a pass specialist because as a team we could get enough pressure to force turnovers. That didnt happen on one of the more average NFL QB's. Imagine what will happen with the likes of Brady or Manning? This isnt a good start and at the moment i dont see any real progress as a team.

We lost with dignity though.

[turftoad]

Yep. There was some talking that we didnt need a pass specialist because as a team we could get enough pressure to force turnovers. That didnt happen on one of the more average NFL QB's. Imagine what will happen with the likes of Brady or Manning? This isnt a good start and at the moment i dont see any real progress as a team.

Exactly. Do you realize that there were only 5, count em, 5 teams that ran more than they passed last year. It's a pass happy league.

This day and age, you have to have a pass ruch specialist, just have to.

[BroncoNut]

Beadles didn't look ready out there.

what's your hangup on Beadles? this is like the 4th negative post on him I've seen from you? He had a bad game and I'm sure he knows it. Step off him already. Sure would rather have him than your fatass out there right now.

[turftoad]

We lost with dignity though.

We still lost though. :shocked:

[topscribe]

what's your hangup on Beadles? this is like the 4th negative post on him I've seen from you? He had a bad game and I'm sure he knows it. Step off him already. Sure would rather have him than your fatass out there right now.

You've got to stop mincing your words, Nut. Don't be so bashful. Just come out and say it.

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[BigDaddyBronco]

what's your hangup on Beadles? this is like the 4th negative post on him I've seen from you? He had a bad game and I'm sure he knows it. Step off him already. Sure would rather have him than your fatass out there right now.
Thats for sure. I would have looked like Barton the RT for the Cowboys out there.

Oh, I don't hate the guy. He just needs time to develop like most guys do on the OLine.

[slim]

Thats for sure. I would have looked like Barton the RT for the Cowboys out there.

Oh, I don't hate the guy. He just needs time to develop like most guys do on the OLine.

Way to take the high road, BDB.

:boring:

[BigDaddyBronco]

Way to take the high road, BDB.

:boring:

Yea I could have gone all clayemo and bashed McDaniels for the pick.

[claymore]

Yea I could have gone all clayemo and bashed McDaniels for the pick.

I dont blame people for the Draft. I blame people for stupid trades, bad playcalling, poor people skills, and terrible coaching (not being able to play to your players strengths).

[slim]

Clay, did you go to the game?

[topscribe]

I dont blame people for the Draft. I blame people for stupid trades, bad playcalling, poor people skills, and terrible coaching (not being able to play to your players strengths).

How about you stop apologizing for your Little League failures and focus on the Broncos?

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[claymore]

Clay, did you go to the game?

No, I missed the game entirely.

[BigDaddyBronco]

I dont blame people for the Draft. I blame people for stupid trades, bad playcalling, poor people skills, and terrible coaching (not being able to play to your players strengths).
I baited my hook with a nice big Hatch green chile. :laugh:

[slim]

No, I missed the game entirely.

I recorded it, if you're interested :welcome:

[claymore]

I baited my hook with a nice big Hatch green chile. :laugh:

Yeah you did. One of my coworkers did it earlier to! :laugh:

[claymore]

I recorded it, if you're interested :welcome:

Im going to shut up while Im behind. :D

[arapaho2]

i recall back in 08...we started a rookie LT...a 2nd yr RT with zero starts and a zero start 2nd year rg...and were the best oline in the game


so i will give no excuse for being inexpirienced this year

but i think they will get better...clady no doubt isnt 100%, maybe feeling the injury in lateral movements...harris is a much better RT than beadles...and beadles as a Lg with walton and kuper will be a force in years to come in the middle

what bugs me is depth...if beadles playing RT is the best option in case of ryan missing...then the depth is a issue

[BigDaddyBronco]

Well that OLine was great in pass blocking and zone blocking. Not so much on short yardage or in the red zone.

Maybe next year in Beadles and Waltons 2nd year and having Clady and Harris healthy they will be the best in all phases.

[LRtagger]

Where's Christopher Polumbus when you need him

[arapaho2]

Well that OLine was great in pass blocking and zone blocking. Not so much on short yardage or in the red zone.

Maybe next year in Beadles and Waltons 2nd year and having Clady and Harris healthy they will be the best in all phases.

they were better in red zone and short yardage than the broncos of last year:coffee:

i dont think it will take another year to see an improvment though...get harris back, clady healthy and with beadles or danials at LG i think they will meld together just fine by mid season..

they will never be as good in pass blocking with orton as they were with cutler...but thats a issue of qb mobility not blocking...but i think they still will become a top line

[Traveler]

they were better in red zone and short yardage than the broncos of last year:coffee:

i dont think it will take another year to see an improvment though...get harris back, clady healthy and with beadles or danials at LG i think they will meld together just fine by mid season..

they will never be as good in pass blocking with orton as they were with cutler...but thats a issue of qb mobility not blocking...but i think they still will become a top line

Nice take!

I'll be looking closely on how much better-or worse- we get in short yardage and pass protection this season.

[BigDaddyBronco]

Nice take!

I'll be looking closely on how much better-or worse- we get in short yardage and pass protection this season.
Guys, QB mobility had nothing to do with zone blocking not working when you try and run the ball in short yardage. Zone blocking stopped working in short yardage when the whole defensive line is 300+ or since about 2005. We disguised the demise well since we got so much yardage between the 20's and then had Plummer do his rollout thing for a couple of years when we were at 4th and 1.

[BigDaddyBronco]

Nice take!

I'll be looking closely on how much better-or worse- we get in short yardage and pass protection this season.
So far Moreno ran for a TD in short yardage and we converted a 4th and 1. Better than last year.

[topscribe]

So far Moreno ran for a TD in short yardage and we converted a 4th and 1. Better than last year.

That's a pretty small sample, as I'm sure you will agree.

But mildly encouraging, nonetheless . . .

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[BigDaddyBronco]

That's a pretty small sample, as I'm sure you will agree.

But mildly encouraging, nonetheless . . .

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Sure, but at least we didn't do some rollout thing we a sloooooooooow Kyle Orton.
:D

They at least have faith that they can run in short yardage. We'll see how it goes against the Jets and Ravens.

[dogfish]

Man I wish they would have drafted Orakpo instead of Moreno. That is one thing Shanny always got right. Don't draft a RB in the 1st round.

and i wish they'd taken clay matthews over either of 'em. . .

[BigDaddyBronco]

and i wish they'd taken clay matthews over either of 'em. . .

Good point. He is a stud as well.

I'm really trying not to hate on Moreno, it's not his fault he was drafted too high.