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TXBRONC
08-10-2010, 02:21 PM
Broncos O-line starts with a big Q
Denver has a lot of questions to answer upfront because of injuries, inexperience.
By Mike Klis
The Denver Post
Posted: 08/10/2010 01:00:00 AM MDT

Just before Kyle Orton gets the snap, a long line of question marks settles in before him.

From left to right, the Broncos' offensive front looks something like this:

?-?-?-?-?

Elvis Dumervil's chest that is to be surgically repaired today has been the root of so much "woe are the Broncos" circulating around Dove Valley team headquarters in recent days.

Dumervil is a one-man quarterback wrecking ball.

The offensive line is five men working together to protect their quarterback and open holes for the running back who will be healthy enough to play in the season opener Sept. 12 at Jacksonville.

And after right guard Chris Kuper wrenched his ankle last week, the Broncos now have a question mark of injury or youth at each of their five blocking positions.

"We just have to work harder than everybody else," right tackle Ryan Harris said. "We have to be willing to work harder than the defensive lines that are put together. We have to be able to work harder than anybody else on the offense. Because it all starts with us, run or pass."

Ryan Clady's false step on a basketball court created a large question mark at left tackle. Rookies will start at left guard and center. Question mark, question mark.

Harris is coming off toe surgery that forced him to miss the second half of last season. But he's been back a while, so only a small question mark there.

Kuper didn't take long to go from the offensive line's best young prospect to highest-paid mainstay, but there seemed to be no concern at right guard. None at all, until Kuper followed seemingly half the roster into the trainer's room.

One possible answer to all of these offensive line question marks was proposed to Orton, the Broncos' starting quarterback. How about if Orton becomes more mobile this year? He doesn't need to go Michael Vick or Tim Tebow, anything like that. But maybe Orton can slide in the pocket here, scoot for a couple of yards there.

"Their job's to block. My job's to throw," Orton said.

So much for that thought. The offensive line, it seems, will have to ease concern on its own. "They'll get it figured out," Orton said.

As a group, the offensive linemen understand why they are widely considered the Broncos' chief worry heading into the 2010 season. They don't share this fear, but they know there is nothing they can say — unless it's in the form of communication among themselves — that can lower the stress level among the masses.

Between injury and youth, there is mystery as to how well the offensive line will keep Orton clean, or create running room for Knowshon Moreno, Correll Buckhalter and LenDale White, not to raise more question marks.

If they were sensitive sorts, and not a rough, tough breed, Broncos blockers might deem it unfair for anyone outside Dove Valley to express so much angst. Nobody ever watches the offensive line anyway. Why pay attention now?

"It's early," Kuper said. "I haven't been in pads since January, and we're all just knocking the rust off. It's a battle, but we're working at it to get better every day. We've got a good defense we play against every day and that's going to help us."

Truth is, the people in Denver who really watch football — inside and out, up front to way back at safety, on film every day from inside the team's headquarters — are more excited than troubled about the Broncos' offensive line this year.

This franchise has moved on from its famed zone-blocking scheme. While great for the one-cut runner between the 20-yard lines, the smaller, nimbler linemen weren't much good near the goal line or in third-and-short in recent years.

The temporary replacements for the 325-pound Clady are Tyler Polumbus, an eight-game starter at right tackle last year who is up to 312 pounds this year, and D'Anthony Batiste, who took his 314 pounds to the first-team offense for the first time last week.

Zane Beadles, a rookie left guard, and rookie center J.D. Walton each weigh 305 pounds. Broncos coach Josh McDaniels decided he'd rather have big and strong kids than the grizzled likes of Casey Wiegmann and Ben Hamilton, neither of whom could crack 290 if they lived on a steady daily diet of spaghetti at midnight.

"They're young guys, so they're going to make their mistakes," Dumervil said of Beadles and Walton. "But they both have got that junkyard dog in them. That's a good thing. As long as you've got some dog in you, you can coach that other stuff."

Kuper, a four-year starter, is listed at 303 pounds but there's no telling how much he weighs now that he's carrying around a fresh $28 million contract.

Harris, at 300 pounds, is the lightest of the 15 offensive linemen on the camp roster. Let that crush the consciousness one more time — 300 pounds and the smallest of the bunch.

Missing from this training camp are the classic, all-pro confrontations between Clady and Dumervil.

"We all know what Ryan can do," Polumbus said. "But we've got five guys out there trying to work together. Who's lining up come Jacksonville, who knows?"

Clady should be there. The rehab on his surgically repaired left knee is coming along well.

Which leads to one last question regarding the offensive line: If Clady were here taking on Dumervil in camp, would there be so much concern? Yes, Beadles and Walton are rookies, but in 2005 the New England Patriots won the AFC East with McDaniels as their rookie offensive coordinator and Logan Mankins and Nick Kaczur as starting rookie offensive linemen.

"Think about Ryan coming back, and you have Kupe and Harris on the other side," McDaniels said. "Yeah, we may have youth at left guard and center, but the snaps they're going to get between now and the beginning of the season, they're going to be that much more ahead of the curve.

"And they've got good players around them now. On both sides of the line. Hopefully, by the time we line up in Jacksonville we're going to look the way we want to look."

Mike Klis: 303-954-1055 or mklis@denverpost.com

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_15725608

One thing I find troubling is Orton basically saying it's not his job to slide away from pressure when need be.

BroncoNut
08-10-2010, 02:28 PM
Yeah, sounds like he says it's not his job to avoid or evade pressure. ah.,, that's the response of a virtually immobile qb.

TXBRONC
08-10-2010, 02:30 PM
Yeah, sounds like he says it's not his job to avoid or evade pressure. ah.,, that's the response of a virtually immobile qb.

Marino wasn't mobile but he was very good at sliding away from pressure.

Tempus Fugit
08-10-2010, 02:33 PM
Another thread to bash the QB?

Nomad
08-10-2010, 02:33 PM
Yeah, sounds like he says it's not his job to avoid or evade pressure. ah.,, that's the response of a virtually immobile qb.

Blockers can keep pressure from coming through for so long and it's up to the QB to keep the play alive or make a play when a hole is there or receiver available, but it is the oline's main purpose to block for him. Supposedly he is 100% healthy so no excuses if he doesn't keep the brick shoes at home!!

TXBRONC
08-10-2010, 02:34 PM
Another thread to bash the QB?

No.

Also if you don't like the thread don't participate.

TXBRONC
08-10-2010, 02:38 PM
Blockers can keep pressure from coming through for so long and it's up to the QB to keep the play alive or make a play when a hole is there or receiver available, but it is the oline's main purpose to block for him. Supposedly he is 100% healthy so no excuses if he doesn't keep the brick shoes at home!!

Agreed their job is to keep him clean but there will be plenty of times he when he'll need slide away from the pressure.

BroncoNut
08-10-2010, 02:39 PM
Marino wasn't mobile but he was very good at sliding away from pressure.



exactly, You have to be pretty congnizant to slide effectively. You have to have that 6th sense, to "feel" the pressure and that automatic timer in your head.. Dan had all of that.

Tempus Fugit
08-10-2010, 02:40 PM
No.

Also if you don't like the thread don't participate.

Well, given the only thing you took from the article was a negative against Orton, I don't intend to. I just wanted to get some verification before using the iggy feature.

BroncoNut
08-10-2010, 02:41 PM
Well, given the only thing you took from the article was a negative against Orton, I don't intend to. I just wanted to get some verification before using the iggy feature.

I noticed it too Tempus, but only becaue I read TX's post before the article itself.

Nomad
08-10-2010, 02:43 PM
I noticed it too Tempus, but only becaue I read TX's post before the article itself.

I hardly ever read the full articles but skim through it! I answered your post!:D

Traveler
08-10-2010, 02:45 PM
OT (a little):

I just realized that all these years we were expecting #50 to become our starting center. Only it's not Hamilton. While he gave us some good years, I'm glad it'll be Walton.

We now resume the original topic of discussion....

TXBRONC
08-10-2010, 02:53 PM
OT (a little):

I just realized that all these years we were expecting #50 to become our starting center. Only it's not Hamilton. While he gave us some good years, but I'm glad it'll be Walton.

We now resume the original topic of discussion....

That occured to me as well.

HORSEPOWER 56
08-10-2010, 03:24 PM
This weekend at Cincy we're looking at a starting O-line of Polumbus, Beadles, Walton, ? (maybe Seth Olsen with Kuper nursing an ankle), and Harris. On top of that, Lance Ball is expected to start at RB (no Moreno, Buck, or White this weekend if they don't practice today). All I can say is, Orton may not make the regular season. McDaniels will probably have to pull him out during the first drive just to keep him alive. The Bengals will get after him and he will get hit a lot...

That means Quinn and Tebow are both going to see a lot of action this weekend. And they're going to be some sore dudes because they're both going to get hit a lot. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see one of our QBs joining the walking wounded after this weekend.

Traveler
08-10-2010, 03:31 PM
All I'm gearing up for is the multitude of negative threads forthcoming if Tebow plays badly.:eek:

claymore
08-10-2010, 03:34 PM
All I'm gearing up for is the multitude of negative threads forthcoming if Tebow plays badly.:eek:

Im more worried about him lighting it up. Every swinging richard south of Georgia will be on here.

Nomad
08-10-2010, 03:34 PM
All I'm gearing up for is the multitude of negative threads forthcoming if Tebow plays badly.:eek:

Why is that? He's a rookie!!

Nomad
08-10-2010, 03:36 PM
Im more worried about him lighting it up. Every swinging richard south of Georgia will be on here.

That's funny, but true! BF overload! Tned may need to start charging:D

claymore
08-10-2010, 03:39 PM
That's funny, but true! BF overload! Tned may need to start charging:D

Or advertising bbq sauce and skoal. He would make a fortune!

TXBRONC
08-10-2010, 05:09 PM
All I'm gearing up for is the multitude of negative threads forthcoming if Tebow plays badly.:eek:

Maybe theyll play well. One saving grace is they will be going up against a vanilla defense.

NightTrainLayne
08-10-2010, 05:10 PM
Can we dispense with the notion that McD has abandoned zone blocking (he hasn't), and replaced our line with a bunch of huge road-graders (he hasn't)?

Assuming Clady comes back, our line would weigh, 325, 305, 305, 304, 300.

Bigger no doubt, but still just barely over 300 lbs.

McD does however, still use a lot of zone blocking in his scheme. I think the pieces are in place for a very good line if everyone is healthy and having some experience we will be fine, but we didn't "abandon the ZBS" and trade it in for some "huge" power blocking line.

TXBRONC
08-10-2010, 05:14 PM
Can we dispense with the notion that McD has abandoned zone blocking (he hasn't), and replaced our line with a bunch of huge road-graders (he hasn't)?

Assuming Clady comes back, our line would weigh, 325, 305, 305, 304, 300.

Bigger no doubt, but still just barely over 300 lbs.

McD does however, still use a lot of zone blocking in his scheme. I think the pieces are in place for a very good line if everyone is healthy and having some experience we will be fine, but we didn't "abandon the ZBS" and trade it in for some "huge" power blocking line.

Maybe he is I'm pretty sure I remember reading that he was going to move us using a power blocking scheme.

NightTrainLayne
08-10-2010, 05:22 PM
Maybe he is I'm pretty sure I remember reading that he was going to move us using a power blocking scheme.

There will be more one-on-one "power" blocking than was used under Shanny, but there is still a lot of zone blocks as well.

McD was asked about this last week when the Sirius NFL radio guys were at camp. He told them that he wants to be able to run inside (with "power" one-on-one blocking) and also work the edges (with zone blocking). He said you have to do both, and you need guys that can do both. . .bigger, but still able to get out in space and move around well.

Traveler
08-10-2010, 07:34 PM
Im more worried about him lighting it up. Every swinging richard south of Georgia will be on here.

You make a good point!

Bosco
08-11-2010, 01:39 AM
There will be more one-on-one "power" blocking than was used under Shanny, but there is still a lot of zone blocks as well.

McD was asked about this last week when the Sirius NFL radio guys were at camp. He told them that he wants to be able to run inside (with "power" one-on-one blocking) and also work the edges (with zone blocking). He said you have to do both, and you need guys that can do both. . .bigger, but still able to get out in space and move around well.

Just about every team in the league uses zone blocking to some degree though.

Lonestar
08-11-2010, 08:03 AM
Can we dispense with the notion that McD has abandoned zone blocking (he hasn't), and replaced our line with a bunch of huge road-graders (he hasn't)?

Assuming Clady comes back, our line would weigh, 325, 305, 305, 304, 300.

Bigger no doubt, but still just barely over 300 lbs.

McD does however, still use a lot of zone blocking in his scheme. I think the pieces are in place for a very good line if everyone is healthy and having some experience we will be fine, but we didn't "abandon the ZBS" and trade it in for some "huge" power blocking line.

But 15-25 pounds of more muscle at the interior spots the new kids will have will make a huge difference. That is what we are starting at and no doubt next year will probably add a few more pounds per man.

That is not even counting the nasty factor this oline has lacked for years.

Time will tell how fast this group gels and if it all fits well we should have a great oline for maybe a decade or more.
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Lonestar
08-11-2010, 08:06 AM
Just about every team in the league uses zone blocking to some degree though.

Which is one reason it is less efective than it used to be when it was pretty much a DEN exclusive.

Now everyone has to be ready for it instead of just worrying about it F you played DEN.
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BigDaddyBronco
08-11-2010, 08:20 AM
But 15-25 pounds of more muscle at the interior spots the new kids will have will make a huge difference. That is what we are starting at and no doubt next year will probably add a few more pounds per man.

That is not even counting the nasty factor this oline has lacked for years.

Time will tell how fast this group gels and if it all fits well we should have a great oline for maybe a decade or more.
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It sure will help in short yardage and in pass protection against DT's.

Jagsbch
08-11-2010, 10:31 AM
Can we dispense with the notion that McD has abandoned zone blocking (he hasn't), and replaced our line with a bunch of huge road-graders (he hasn't)?

Assuming Clady comes back, our line would weigh, 325, 305, 305, 304, 300.

Bigger no doubt, but still just barely over 300 lbs.

McD does however, still use a lot of zone blocking in his scheme. I think the pieces are in place for a very good line if everyone is healthy and having some experience we will be fine, but we didn't "abandon the ZBS" and trade it in for some "huge" power blocking line.

Looking at the combine Numbers these bigger rookie lineman could very6 well indeed be much more mobile then the jettisoned vets where.

Lonestar
08-11-2010, 02:40 PM
It sure will help in short yardage and in pass protection against DT's.

Hamilton has been a weak link for along time in pass protect back as far as 06 when we started trying to pocket pass with Dingers "O". That is when I really saw it. The DT/NT were constantly pushing him back into the "pocket".

Trying to play at 285 on a good day simply was not enuff when playing someone 30-60 pounds bigger.

I do not understand how no one else saw this. Maybe it was having nalen/lepsis there to help out. Maybe they overlooked this fupaw because he was so good at ZBS.

But someone besides every DC in the league had to see what I was seeing in those games.
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