The 2010 Top Ten NFL WR Tandem's

[Jagsbch]

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/294/626/91981271_display_image.jpg?1278904031

What makes a great wide receiver passing tandem in the NFL?

Is it the Talent of the receiver’s?
Is it the Talent of the quarterback?
Is it the quality of the offensive scheme?
Is it what the offenses prospects are this season?
Is it the potential of a sleeper rookie receiver?
Is it the quality of depth at the receiver position?
Is it the quality of a balanced rushing attack?
Or is it all of the above?

I believe it may be all the above for the most part, and with that in mind I set out on the course to try and determine who this seasons top ten NFL WR tandems are going to be.

The NFL is not a mundane sport, watching the Cardinals disintegrate as the Super Bowl team got gutted through the free agency and retirement of their quarterback, well it reveals just one extreme of the equation that makes the suspense of the NFL, awesome theatre.

How this all actually plays out on the wave of reality remains to be seen, but from the view of my liquid crystal display, there appears to be a couple of shockers as well as surprises projecting on the canvas the 2010 NFL season.

So grab some popcorn sit back and relax and enjoy the slideshow....

Here is the 2010 NFL top 10 WR tandem projection.

No. 1 Saints: Marques Colston Robert Meachem

No. 2 Vikings: Sidney Rice Percy Harvin

No. 3 Packers: Greg Jennings Donald Driver

No. 4 Colts: Reggie Wayne Pierre Garcon

No. 5 Steelers: Hines Ward Mike Wallace

No. 6 Patriots: Randy Moss Taylor Price

No. 7 Ravens: Anquan Boldin Derrick Mason

No. 8 Broncos: Eddie Royal Demaryius Thomas

No. 9 Giants: Hakeem Nicks Steve Smith

No. 10 Cowboys: Miles Austin Dez Bryant




The breakdown in this link is more like a book than an article (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/418937-the-2010-top-ten-nfl-wr-tandems) :coffee:

[Slick]

I´m going to have to say that Brandon Marshall paired up with the Dolphin's ball boy should be ranked higher than Royal and Thomas. Our WR corps isn't really even in the top 20 if we're making lists.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

This list is projections for 2010, so obviously, we will not know if Royal/Thomas live up to this until the season is over. Hopefully they do.

[Jagsbch]

Can they do better than Ravens tandem did last year? 11 TD's?
2052 yards between the two of them? I say yes.

Heck I think Royal will have double digit TD break out figures this season.

Ravens
Anquan Boldin 12.2 Yard Average 1,024 Receptions Yards 4 Touchdowns

Derrick Mason 14.1 Yard Average 1,028 Receptions Yards 7

[broncophan]

Royal and Thomas at #8...........wow....Royal had 1 good year....and is coming off a terrible year........and Thomas has not played a down.....lol.......must be a projected down year for receivers.
Hope they are right though....

[Slick]

This list is projections for 2010, so obviously, we will not know if Royal/Thomas live up to this until the season is over. Hopefully they do.

I'm as optimistic as the next guy Carol, you know me, but if we're making projections, I have to use what they did last year as the measuring stick and neither of those guys are in a top 10 list.

I appreciate the effort from the OP, I just disagree.

[jhildebrand]

Royal had 34 (or so) catches last season. The other WR hasn't played a down in this league yet.

I think it is safe to say this pairing should be no where close to 8.

[TXBRONC]

I'm as optimistic as the next guy Carol, you know me, but if we're making projections, I have to use what they did last year as the measuring stick and neither of those guys are in a top 10 list.

I appreciate the effort from the OP, I just disagree.

Agreed. All the other tandems have something to work off from whether they were together last year as a tandem or they accumulated stats with other teams at the pro level that's more to work than what we have.

I would love for them to be in the top 10 but with Thomas being rookie it's probably not likely. If they are great but I'm not expected it.

[Northman]

I´m going to have to say that Brandon Marshall paired up with the Dolphin's ball boy should be ranked higher than Royal and Thomas. Our WR corps isn't really even in the top 20 if we're making lists.

:lol:

Yea, i had to shake my head at that too. It would be nice if it comes to fruitition but lets be honest, right now its not there.

[turftoad]

I think this one is more accurate. Denver at #24. Yahoo Sports. Here's the link.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AlH4n9tFM2lqxFKcYqPZ9XTsYNAF?slug=jc-directsnap050710

1. Indianapolis Colts: This group has both stars and depth with Reggie Wayne(notes), TE Dallas Clark(notes), Austin Collie(notes) and Pierre Garcon(notes).


2. New Orleans Saints: The champions go five deep with Marques Colston(notes), TE Jeremy Shockey(notes), Devery Henderson(notes), Robert Meachem(notes) and Lance Moore(notes). And they just added promising TE Jimmy Graham(notes).


3. San Diego Chargers: When you start with the best TE (Antonio Gates(notes)) and most consistent deep threat (Vincent Jackson(notes)) in the league, your foundation is really good. Depth has slipped, but only a little.


4. Minnesota Vikings: This group is so deep and so talented that Bernard Berrian(notes) is the fourth option behind Sidney Rice(notes), TE Visanthe Shiancoe(notes) and Percy Harvin(notes). Scary.


5. Green Bay Packers: Greg Jennings(notes) and Donald Driver(notes) lead a deep group of receivers. If TE Jermichael Finley(notes) continues to develop, watch out.


6. Arizona Cardinals: Losing Anquan Boldin(notes) hurts a lot and the TE spot is thin, but Larry Fitzgerald(notes) is a great anchor. Steve Breaston(notes) is better than people think and Early Doucet(notes) showed up big in the playoffs.


7. Houston Texans: Like Arizona, when you start with a great one (Andre Johnson(notes), in this case) it’s hard to go wrong. Kevin Walter(notes) helps, but TE Owen Daniels(notes) must return from knee injury.


8. Atlanta Falcons: Roddy White(notes) is a step below the likes of Fitzgerald and Andre Johnson and Tony Gonzalez(notes) is closer to the end, but they’re still really good. Depth is the biggest concern.


9. Philadelphia Eagles: Don’t be surprised if this group rockets into the top five by the end of this season. TE Brent Celek(notes), DeSean Jackson(notes) and Jeremy Maclin(notes) should make life easy for new starting QB Kevin Kolb(notes).


10. Dallas Cowboys: Miles Austin(notes) and TE Jason Witten(notes) are the strength of this group and Patrick Crayton(notes) is underrated. If Roy Williams can show something and Dez Bryant(notes) can just show up, the Cowboys could be nasty.


11. New England Patriots: If Wes Welker(notes) was healthy, this group would rank higher. Adding Torry Holt helps, although we’ll see how he gets along with Randy Moss(notes).


12. Detroit Lions: Like Philadelphia and Dallas, there’s potential for great improvement here if Calvin Johnson(notes) continues to develop and TE Brandon Pettigrew(notes) comes back healthy.


13. Cincinnati Bengals: With Bryant and Gresham around, Chad Ochocinco(notes) might be back to celebrating on a more regular basis.


14. Baltimore Ravens: No overwhelming stars, but great depth and balance. Anquan Boldin and Derrick Mason(notes) are as tough as they come at receiver.


15. San Francisco 49ers: TE Vernon Davis(notes) is finally developing into a serious star and Michael Crabtree(notes) isn’t far behind after a quietly impressive rookie season.


16. New York Jets: If Braylon Edwards(notes) returns to Pro Bowl form and Santonio Holmes(notes) can get his head straight, this group could be awesome by December. If so, the Jets will be a serious contender.


17. New York Giants: They were better than expected last season, but that doesn’t mean they’re great. A lot of nice players, but nobody a defense has to worry about.


18. Pittsburgh Steelers: The loss of the aforementioned Santonio Holmes is a brutal blow, although Mike Wallace(notes) showed promise last season. Hines Ward(notes) brings stability, but not much more at this point.


19. Miami Dolphins: The Dolphins finally landed a No. 1 receiver in Brandon Marshall(notes) after years of not having one. The question is whether Marshall will be enough.


20. Carolina Panthers: After Steve Smith, there’s not a lot of hope on this roster. Dwayne Jarrett(notes) has been a bust and the TE position is a wasteland.


21. Washington Redskins: If TE Chris Cooley(notes) is healthy, this group can be respectable. After Santana Moss(notes), who’s just average at this point, the receiver spot is weak.


22. Tennessee Titans: Kenny Britt(notes) gives the Titans hope of a potential No. 1 receiver for the first time in years, but the rest of the group is completely pedestrian.


23. Chicago Bears: There are a lot of guys here who are interesting, from Devin Hester(notes) to TE Greg Olsen(notes) to Johnny Knox(notes). Too bad none of them is truly accomplished or looks like they ever will be.


24. Denver Broncos: After gutting a position that once looked really good, at least the Broncos have rookie WR Demaryius Thomas(notes) to pin some hope on. After him, it’s a bunch of bit-part guys like Eddie Royal(notes) and Jabar Gaffney(notes).


25. Buffalo Bills: Much like good friend and former Wisconsin teammate Chris Chambers(notes), Lee Evans(notes) has spent a career teasing people with his talent. Sorry, but it’s hard to believe he’ll ever be truly great.


26. Seattle Seahawks: T.J. Houshmandzadeh(notes), Deion Branch(notes) and rookie Golden Tate(notes) are all interesting in one way or another, but none of them is dominating or really even has the potential.


27. Oakland Raiders: TE Zach Miller is terrific, but when Louis Murphy(notes), a fourth-round pick last year, becomes your best wide receiver as a rookie, that’s not good. Former first-rounder Darrius Heyward-Bey(notes) was garbage last year.


28. Jacksonville Jaguars: After Mike Sims-Walkers, the other starting receiver looks to be Mike Thomas(notes). The Jags have already figured out that Kassim Osgood(notes) can’t play wide receiver.


29. Tampa Bay Buccaneers: Mercurial TE Kellen Winslow(notes) returns, but getting rid of Bryant in favor of rookie Arrelious Benn(notes) might turn out bad for the Bucs.


30. Kansas City Chiefs: Chris Chambers was picked up off the scrap heap and became the Chiefs best receiver. That says volumes about Dwayne Bowe(notes).


31. St. Louis Rams: Donnie Avery(notes) is the best the Rams have right now and he’s barely a No. 2 receiver. Rams would be wise to sit Sam Bradford(notes) for at least a year.


32. Cleveland Browns: Mohamed Massaquoi(notes) led the Browns with 34 catches last season. That’s not a typo, that’s a testament to how far Cleveland’s receiving corps has fallen in two years since it had Braylon Edwards, Kellen Winslow and Joe Jurevicius(notes).

[Jagsbch]

I'm as optimistic as the next guy Carol, you know me, but if we're making projections, I have to use what they did last year as the measuring stick and neither of those guys are in a top 10 list.

I appreciate the effort from the OP, I just disagree.

Last year Royal fell into a sophomore slump, the year before he had 1,829 total yards 5 TD's During his Rookie season. Year three is usually when WR's break out~!!:beer:

You can't underestimate the potential of the rookie WR's this season. I mean check out what these 4 rookies did the past 2 seasons.

Percy Harvin and Mike Wallace killed it last season

2008

DeSean Jackson 1,460 total yards 4 TD's rookie season

Eddie Royal 1,829 total yards 5 TD's Rookie season

You can't just dismiss rookies anymore, teams are starting to break the code of unlocking their potential as each season passess. I think this season we will see more of Rookies establishing themselves now that the passing game is King in the NFL over the run.

[TXBRONC]

Last year Royal fell into a sophomore slump, the year before he had 1,829 total yards 5 TD's During his Rookie season. Year three is usually when WR's break out~!!:beer:

You can't underestimate the potential of the rookie WR's this season. I mean check out what these 4 rookies did the past 2 seasons.

Percy Harvin and Mike Wallace killed it last season

2008

DeSean Jackson 1,460 total yards 4 TD's rookie season

Eddie Royal 1,829 total yards 5 TD's Rookie season

You can't just dismiss rookies anymore, teams are starting to break the code of unlocking their potential as each season passess. I think this season we will see more of Rookies establishing themselves now that the passing game is King in the NFL over the run.

That's four rookie receivers out of how many drafted over the last couple of years? The law of averages still holds true. Wide Receiver is still a position that takes about three years for them to develop. It's possible but it's not anything that can be counted on with any degree of certainty.

[underrated29]

I would put us at 19...nothing higher. Def not top 10.



I think the cowboys are the best.

Miles austin, Dez, roy, crayton, witten---Is Nuts!!

[Jagsbch]

That's four rookie receivers out of how many drafted over the last couple of years? The law of averages still holds true. Wide Receiver is still a position that takes about three years for them to develop. It's possible but it's not anything that can be counted on with any degree of certainty.

The law of averages holds true to what? Declaring that rookie WR's have the potential to be part of a phenomenal WR tandem?

Yes.

It is not as if I placed every rookie WR drafted on the list.:rolleyes:

The average has been what, two rookie sensations the past 3 seasons?

2007
Steve Smith 11.5 Yards per reception 1,002 Reception Yards 7 TD's
Dwayne Bowe 14.2 Yards per reception 995 Reception Yards 5 TD's

2006
Santonio Holmes 16.8 Yards per reception 824 Reception Yards 2 TD's
Greg Jennings 14.0 Yards per reception 632 Reception Yards 3 TD's

Something happened last year however, 7 receivers jumped into the top 64, making them eligible bachlers for tandems considering there are 32 teams in the league~!!

Mike Wallace 19.4 Yards Per Reception 756 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Percy Harvin 13.2 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Jeremy Mclin 13.8 Yards Per Reception 773 Reception Yards 4 TD's
Hakeem Nicks 16.8 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Kenny Britt 16.7 Yards Per Reception 701 Reception Yards 3 TD's
Johnny Knox 11.7 Yards Per Reception 527 Reception Yards 5 TD's
Mohamed Massaquoi 18.4 Yards Per Reception 624 Reception Yards 3 TD's

[TXBRONC]

The law of averages holds true to what? Declaring that rookie WR's have the potential to be part of a phenomenal WR tandem?

Yes.

It is not as if I placed every rookie WR drafted on the list.:rolleyes:

The average has been what, two rookie sensations the past 3 seasons?

2007
Steve Smith 11.5 Yards per reception 1,002 Reception Yards 7 TD's
Dwayne Bowe 14.2 Yards per reception 995 Reception Yards 5 TD's

2006
Santonio Holmes 16.8 Yards per reception 824 Reception Yards 2 TD's
Greg Jennings 14.0 Yards per reception 632 Reception Yards 3 TD's

Something happened last year however, 7 receivers jumped into the top 64, making them eligible bachlers for tandems considering there are 32 teams in the league~!!

Mike Wallace 19.4 Yards Per Reception 756 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Percy Harvin 13.2 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Jeremy Mclin 13.8 Yards Per Reception 773 Reception Yards 4 TD's
Hakeem Nicks 16.8 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Kenny Britt 16.7 Yards Per Reception 701 Reception Yards 3 TD's
Johnny Knox 11.7 Yards Per Reception 527 Reception Yards 5 TD's
Mohamed Massaquoi 18.4 Yards Per Reception 624 Reception Yards 3 TD's


It still holds true that on average receivers take about two to three years to develop. I can help it that it cramps your style.

One freakin year where you have several rookies make little more of impact than normal doesn't make it a tread. :rolleyes:

Trying to put our receiving tandem in the top 10 without anymore than you being jazzed up isn't going to make it so. :coffee:

[jhildebrand]

Last year Royal fell into a sophomore slump

Is that what you call it? :lol:

Seriously!

Royal fell into the wrong position in the wrong system/scheme. Even McDaniels admitted using Royal wrong to the point of not getting his potential out of him.

[TXBRONC]

Is that what you call it? :lol:

Seriously!

Royal fell into the wrong position in the wrong system/scheme. Even McDaniels admitted using Royal wrong to the point of not getting his potential out of him.

All I know is that Royal's numbers were down but I can't it's because he slumped. It might be part of the answer it certainly was all of the answer. Also I do remember McDaniels saying that Royal was used correctly but imho there is still more to it than even that.

[Jagsbch]

The law of averages holds true to what? Declaring that rookie WR's have the potential to be part of a phenomenal WR tandem?

Yes.

It is not as if I placed every rookie WR drafted on the list.:rolleyes:

The average has been what, two rookie sensations the past 3 seasons?

2007
Steve Smith 11.5 Yards per reception 1,002 Reception Yards 7 TD's
Dwayne Bowe 14.2 Yards per reception 995 Reception Yards 5 TD's

2006
Santonio Holmes 16.8 Yards per reception 824 Reception Yards 2 TD's
Greg Jennings 14.0 Yards per reception 632 Reception Yards 3 TD's

Something happened last year however, 7 receivers jumped into the top 64, making them eligible bachlers for tandems considering there are 32 teams in the league~!!

Mike Wallace 19.4 Yards Per Reception 756 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Percy Harvin 13.2 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Jeremy Mclin 13.8 Yards Per Reception 773 Reception Yards 4 TD's
Hakeem Nicks 16.8 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Kenny Britt 16.7 Yards Per Reception 701 Reception Yards 3 TD's
Johnny Knox 11.7 Yards Per Reception 527 Reception Yards 5 TD's
Mohamed Massaquoi 18.4 Yards Per Reception 624 Reception Yards 3 TD's




It still holds true that on average receivers take about two to three years to develop. I can help it that it cramps your style.

One freakin year where you have several rookies make little more of impact than normal doesn't make it tread. :rolleyes:

Trying to put our receiving tandem in the top 10 without anymore than you being jazzed up isn't going to make it so. :coffee:

As if I don't believe that it takes some receivers 3 years to break out, but to state that this rule trumps the trend we are in is laughable.

Especially when you insist on ignoring the revelation of the trend that was just exposed to you, not to mention that when we are talking about top receiver tandems we are not talking about average group of WR's either.

I gave you a revelation of the trend we are in, yet you insist on writing it off while stubbornly assuming that the truth is only what you say it is; while trying to spin the notion that what you believe is the truth cramps my style, when fact of the matter is, the only ones style being cramped here is your stubborn one.

My point is simple 1-2 times is a coincidence, 3 times is a trend, especially when the 3rd time you find the trend going from 2-3 receivers to 7 rookie receivers.

Don't sit there and try to make it look like I am the one being stubborn here. I am the one who is open minded enough to embrace reality to the point of actually applying it to my projections, rather than stubbornly ignoring the trends to the point of writing Thomas off simply because he is a rookie.


"but with Thomas being rookie it's probably not likely"

Now who is being stubborn and who is open minded to reality and the current trends this pass happy league is in with its rookie upstarts?:beer:


There was actually 3 players in 2008 that where actually Tandem material.

Royal was actually 6th in receptions, then when you calculate all his ST and Rushing yards into the equation things get really stupid in regards to any attempt to write off a WR simply because he is a rookie. That goes for Desean Jackson as well.

Eddie Royal 10.8 Yards Per Reception 980 Reception Yards 5 TD's

DeSean Jackson 14.7 Yards Per Reception 912 Reception Yards 2 TD's

Donnie Avery 12.5 Yards Per Reception 589 Reception Yards 5 TD's

[Slick]

Last year Royal fell into a sophomore slump, the year before he had 1,829 total yards 5 TD's During his Rookie season. Year three is usually when WR's break out~!!:beer:

You can't underestimate the potential of the rookie WR's this season. I mean check out what these 4 rookies did the past 2 seasons.

Percy Harvin and Mike Wallace killed it last season

2008

DeSean Jackson 1,460 total yards 4 TD's rookie season

Eddie Royal 1,829 total yards 5 TD's Rookie season

You can't just dismiss rookies anymore, teams are starting to break the code of unlocking their potential as each season passess. I think this season we will see more of Rookies establishing themselves now that the passing game is King in the NFL over the run.

I hope you're right about Royal breaking out in year three. I really do.

Let's also not forget who we have throwing the pill.

Harvin has Favre, Jackson had McNabb, and we have Kyle Orton. Ouch.

[Jagsbch]

I hope you're right about Royal breaking out in year three. I really do.

Let's also not forget who we have throwing the pill.

Harvin has Favre, Jackson had McNabb, and we have Kyle Orton. Ouch.

I don't think it is an ouch factor at all. I would not compare Orton with the Legend Favre either; it is not a fair comparison.

I mean I laugh when Giant fans try that crap with Eli, Romo is no Favre either I could go on and on.

One of my assignment is to write an Orton article, I better get on it.

But first I have to get this out of my system.

I found another receiver from 2007 NFL draft to add to the 2009 tandem potential list, now there are three from 2008, and 2007 to go with the 7 in 2009.

Steve Smith 11.5 Yards per reception 1,002 Reception Yards 7 TD's
Dwayne Bowe 14.2 Yards per reception 995 Reception Yards 5 TD's
Anthony Gonzalez 15.6 Yards Per Reception 576 Reception Yards 3 TD's

[silkamilkamonico]

Royal has a lot of work to do to break out this year. He struggles at getting off the LOS jam, and he's absolutely terrible at coming back and helping the QB, which was evident last year.

I think he can be a good compliment in this offense, but he isn't a complete WR so he's very limited in what he can do in this offense.

[Lonestar]

I think this one is more accurate. Denver at #24. Yahoo Sports. Here's the link.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AlH4n9tFM2lqxFKcYqPZ9XTsYNAF?slug=jc-directsnap050710



24. Denver Broncos: After gutting a position that once looked really good, at least the Broncos have rookie WR Demaryius Thomas(notes) to pin some hope on. After him, it’s a bunch of bit-part guys like Eddie Royal(notes) and Jabar Gaffney(notes).

(notes).

Yes that is a much more accurate. List.

After gutting the WR position. WTF.

Eddie. A bit part. Forgot he was a ROY canidate.

No bias byu them or you huh?
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

[EMB6903]

Rice,Berrian,Harvin~~~~~~>the rest

[TXBRONC]

As if I don't believe that it takes some receivers 3 years to break out, but to state that this rule trumps the trend we are in is laughable.

Especially when you insist on ignoring the revelation of the trend that was just exposed to you, not to mention that when we are talking about top receiver tandems we are not talking about average group of WR's either.

I gave you a revelation of the trend we are in, yet you insist on writing it off while stubbornly assuming that the truth is only what you say it is; while trying to spin the notion that what you believe is the truth cramps my style, when fact of the matter is, the only ones style being cramped here is your stubborn one.

My point is simple 1-2 times is a coincidence, 3 times is a trend, especially when the 3rd time you find the trend going from 2-3 receivers to 7 rookie receivers.

Don't sit there and try to make it look like I am the one being stubborn here. I am the one who is open minded enough to embrace reality to the point of actually applying it to my projections, rather than stubbornly ignoring the trends to the point of writing Thomas off simply because he is a rookie.



Now who is being stubborn and who is open minded to reality and the current trends this pass happy league is in with its rookie upstarts?:beer:


There was actually 3 players in 2008 that where actually Tandem material.

Royal was actually 6th in receptions, then when you calculate all his ST and Rushing yards into the equation things get really stupid in regards to any attempt to write off a WR simply because he is a rookie. That goes for Desean Jackson as well.

Eddie Royal 10.8 Yards Per Reception 980 Reception Yards 5 TD's

DeSean Jackson 14.7 Yards Per Reception 912 Reception Yards 2 TD's

Donnie Avery 12.5 Yards Per Reception 589 Reception Yards 5 TD's

Where did I say that it wont absolutely happen? Nowhere.

You want count special teams? Your argument up until now was about receiving not special teams now all of the sudden you want to change it. That doesn't help your arguement at all.

Having a couple of receivers breakout every year isn't a trend sorry. If we start seeing 5 or 6 receivers do it over 3 year period then you have valid point. But until then...

So I'm not being stubborn just realistic.

From your opening post it seemed to me that you were saying that we have a top 10 receiving tandem without Thomas ever playing down. It's not realistic.

[silkamilkamonico]

LMAO at counting special teams with WR evaluation.

Next you'll argue Devin Hester is indeed a top 10 WR in the NFL.

[Jagsbch]

Royal has a lot of work to do to break out this year. He struggles at getting off the LOS jam, and he's absolutely terrible at coming back and helping the QB, which was evident last year.

I think he can be a good compliment in this offense, but he isn't a complete WR so he's very limited in what he can do in this offense.

so how do you explain him being ranked 6th his rookie season in receptions? That pretty much trumps every point you just attempted to make IMO.

[Jagsbch]

Hey Tex you are not being realistic what your being is pessimistic. Your just too stubborn to admit it. Its sad really:tsk:

[silkamilkamonico]

so how do you explain him being ranked 6th his rookie season in receptions? That pretty much trumps every point you just attempted to make IMO.

LMAO at the subtle Michael Clayton comparison.

[turftoad]

Yes that is a much more accurate. List.

After gutting the WR position. WTF.

Eddie. A bit part. Forgot he was a ROY canidate.

No bias byu them or you huh?
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

OMG, look at last year. Royal IMO is a stud. What did MCd do with him? He buried him, plain and simple.
After him we have two rookies. Big effing deal. They havent even played an NFL down, unless you think Gaffney the answer. Gimme a break.
I suppose you think we should be in the top ten. :tsk:

[Bosco]

How are Moss and Welker not at the top of these lists? That's easily the best tandem in the league.

[Bosco]

OMG, look at last year. Royal IMO is a stud. What did MCd do with him? He buried him, plain and simple. No, McD was forced to use Royal as the X (Randy Moss role) receiver, because he was the only one with the speed required of that position, when he should have been playing the Z (Wes Welker) receiver role.

This year McD went out and acquired a true X receiver and is moving Royal to the Z spot where he belongs. As a result, it's fairly likely that Royal has his best season to date.

[broncofaninfla]

No matter what the talent level is on this years team, the coaching staff has yet to prove they can put together a prolific passing attack. No excuses this year, it's Mcd's guys, running Mcd's schemes hopefully that equates to an offense that isn't as sickening to watch as last years pathetic effort.

[Jagsbch]

I feel like this point may have gotten obscured by all the static and clutter noise, and me dragging my research out, so if you don't mind I will elaborate it one more time regarding rookie WR's.

I want to share a revelation of the trend the NFL is currently in, the average NFL draft has produced at least three rookie sensations the past three seasons, last season however that number more than doubled.

My point is simple 2 times is a coincidence, 3 times is a trend, especially when the 3rd time you find the trend going from 3-3 to 7 rookie receivers.

The Era of ignoring the trends to the point of writing players such as Demaryius Thomas & Eric Decker off simply because they are rookies is over.

3 players in 2007 NFL draft that where actually Tandem material.

Steve Smith 11.5 Yards per reception 1,002 Reception Yards 7 TD's
Dwayne Bowe 14.2 Yards per reception 995 Reception Yards 5 TD's
Anthony Gonzalez 15.6 Yards Per Reception 576 Reception Yards 3 TD's

3 players in 2008 that where actually Tandem material.

Royal was actually 6th in receptions, and then when you calculate all his ST and rushing yards into the equation things get really stupid in regards to any attempt to write off a WR simply because he is a rookie. That goes for Desean Jackson as well.

Eddie Royal 10.8 Yards Per Reception 980 Reception Yards 5 TD's

DeSean Jackson 14.7 Yards Per Reception 912 Reception Yards 2 TD's

Donnie Avery 12.5 Yards Per Reception 589 Reception Yards 5 TD's

Something happened last year however, 7 receivers jumped into the top 64, making them eligible bachlers for tandems, considering there are 32 teams in the league~!!

Mike Wallace 19.4 Yards Per Reception 756 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Percy Harvin 13.2 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Jeremy Mclin 13.8 Yards Per Reception 773 Reception Yards 4 TD's
Hakeem Nicks 16.8 Yards Per Reception 790 Reception Yards 6 TD's
Kenny Britt 16.7 Yards Per Reception 701 Reception Yards 3 TD's
Johnny Knox 11.7 Yards Per Reception 527 Reception Yards 5 TD's
Mohamed Massaquoi 18.4 Yards Per Reception 624 Reception Yards 3 TD's


http://journeyacrossthesky.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/can-you-hear-me-now-lg1.gif

[CoachChaz]

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/294/626/91981271_display_image.jpg?1278904031

What makes a great wide receiver passing tandem in the NFL?

Is it the Talent of the receiver’s?
Is it the Talent of the quarterback?
Is it the quality of the offensive scheme?
Is it what the offenses prospects are this season?
Is it the potential of a sleeper rookie receiver?
Is it the quality of depth at the receiver position?
Is it the quality of a balanced rushing attack?
Or is it all of the above?

I believe it may be all the above for the most part, and with that in mind I set out on the course to try and determine who this seasons top ten NFL WR tandems are going to be.

The NFL is not a mundane sport, watching the Cardinals disintegrate as the Super Bowl team got gutted through the free agency and retirement of their quarterback, well it reveals just one extreme of the equation that makes the suspense of the NFL, awesome theatre.

How this all actually plays out on the wave of reality remains to be seen, but from the view of my liquid crystal display, there appears to be a couple of shockers as well as surprises projecting on the canvas the 2010 NFL season.

So grab some popcorn sit back and relax and enjoy the slideshow....

Here is the 2010 NFL top 10 WR tandem projection.

No. 1 Saints: Marques Colston Robert Meachem

No. 2 Vikings: Sidney Rice Percy Harvin

No. 3 Packers: Greg Jennings Donald Driver

No. 4 Colts: Reggie Wayne Pierre Garcon

No. 5 Steelers: Hines Ward Mike Wallace

No. 6 Patriots: Randy Moss Taylor Price

No. 7 Ravens: Anquan Boldin Derrick Mason

No. 8 Broncos: Eddie Royal Demaryius Thomas

No. 9 Giants: Hakeem Nicks Steve Smith

No. 10 Cowboys: Miles Austin Dez Bryant




The breakdown in this link is more like a book than an article (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/418937-the-2010-top-ten-nfl-wr-tandems) :coffee:




I'll agree with #6 and McD will rue the day he chose Eric "my entire lower body is an injury waiting to happen" Decker over Taylor Price.

Watch Price become the next great mid-round WR in the NFL.

[TXBRONC]

Hey Tex you are not being realistic what your being is pessimistic. Your just too stubborn to admit it. Its sad really:tsk:

What's sad is your inability hear the facts or criticism of your boisterous claims. You claim we have a top ten receiving tandem in Royal and an unproven rookie Thomas. How? You have NOTHING to support your position. So instead you side step the issue by claiming I'm be pessimistic. All I said is that they are not in top ten I never said they would never get there. If you're a claim like you've at least be able to back it up with something concrete. And I don't mean cherry picked stuff about players that don't play for Denver. Tell me what Thomas has done in the NFL to warrant that he and Royal are in the top ten? It's kind of hard to make a legitimate claim when one of the players doesn't have ANY meaningful stats in the NFL.

[Bosco]

No matter what the talent level is on this years team, the coaching staff has yet to prove they can put together a prolific passing attack.

They haven't? Josh McDaniels had the league's 2nd ranked passing attack in 2005 and the 1st ranked in 2007 and even his talent depleted 2006 squad, Matt Cassel led 2008 unit and our very own 2009 Broncos ranked in the top half of the NFL.

[Northman]

They haven't? Josh McDaniels had the league's 2nd ranked passing attack in 2005 and the 1st ranked in 2007 and even his talent depleted 2006 squad, Matt Cassel led 2008 unit and our very own 2009 Broncos ranked in the top half of the NFL.

What he did or may not have done (considering Belichek is the HC) in NE means nothing in Denver and that is what broncofaninla was getting at.

[broncofaninfla]

They haven't? Josh McDaniels had the league's 2nd ranked passing attack in 2005 and the 1st ranked in 2007 and even his talent depleted 2006 squad, Matt Cassel led 2008 unit and our very own 2009 Broncos ranked in the top half of the NFL.

Mcd as a head coach for the Denver Broncos is all that matters to me and he didn't show me he could coordinate a viable passing threat as a head coach. Just as nothing Tebow did in college matters anymore, neither does what Mcd did before he got to Denver. I am hopefull both can achieve that level of success for Denver however nothing I saw in 2009 gives me much optimism.

[Bosco]

Mcd as a head coach for the Denver Broncos is all that matters to me and he didn't show me he could coordinate a viable passing threat as a head coach. Just as nothing Tebow did in college matters anymore, neither does what Mcd did before he got to Denver. I am hopefull both can achieve that level of success for Denver however nothing I saw in 2009 gives me much optimism.

I'm sorry, but that's a logic fallacy. Your claim was that McD hasn't shown he can put together a prolific passing attack when he clearly has.

Now, had you said that his successes as an OC weren't a sure thing to translate into head coaching successes, I would agree. God knows there have been many great coordinators who failed as head coaches.

[TXBRONC]

I'm sorry, but that's a logic fallacy. Your claim was that McD hasn't shown he can put together a prolific passing attack when he clearly has.

Now, had you said that his successes as an OC weren't a sure thing to translate into head coaching successes, I would agree. God knows there have been many great coordinators who failed as head coaches.

There's no problem with broncofaninfla's logic, it was very clear what he meant.

[broncohead]

I'm sorry, but that's a logic fallacy. Your claim was that McD hasn't shown he can put together a prolific passing attack when he clearly has.

Now, had you said that his successes as an OC weren't a sure thing to translate into head coaching successes, I would agree. God knows there have been many great coordinators who failed as head coaches.

The passing attack was already put tougher in NE.

[TXBRONC]

The passing attack was already put tougher in NE.

McDaniels play calling was excellent in '07 but it sure doesn't hurt to have one of the best quarterbacks in the League who had been in that system for the seven previous seasons.

[Bosco]

The passing attack was already put tougher in NE.

No it wasn't. McDaniels made some very drastic changes when he took over the offense in 2005. In fact, I just posted an article the other day talking about how he went down to Florida to scout out Urban Meyer's spread option and took many of those elements to use in his own offense.

[Bosco]

McDaniels play calling excellent in '07 but sure doesn't hurt to have one of the best quarterbacks in the League who had been in that system for the seven previous seasons.

Even if you ignore the fact that McDaniels is the one credited with Brady's development, or the fact that he changed the scheme, how do you explain his 2008 offense being ranked in the top 10 (and vastly outproducing our supposedly high power offense) with a quarterback who hadn't had any significant playing time since he was in high school some 8 years earlier?

[TXBRONC]

Even if you ignore the fact that McDaniels is the one credited with Brady's development, or the fact that he changed the scheme, how do you explain his 2008 offense being ranked in the top 10 (and vastly outproducing our supposedly high power offense) with a quarterback who hadn't had any significant playing time since he was in high school some 8 years earlier?

I've always heard that Weis is credited with Brady's development. Second the scheme didn't change. It was Weis that develop the scheme for the Patriots that's plan and simple fact. McDaniels added to it but he didn't change it.

How do I explain Matt Cassel? Easy.

1. McDaniels had four years work with him. He had him well prepared.

2. In those four years he sat behind one of best quarterbacks in the League.

3. The Patriots ran the ball significantly more in '08 than they did in '07 (about 100 times more). They normally run the ball 430 times a year in '08 they ran it over 530 times.

4. Other than Brady going down the rest of the offense was still intact.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

They haven't? Josh McDaniels had the league's 2nd ranked passing attack in 2005 and the 1st ranked in 2007 and even his talent depleted 2006 squad, Matt Cassel led 2008 unit and our very own 2009 Broncos ranked in the top half of the NFL.

Fair is fair... did McDaniels "put that squad together" or just get to use the pieces provided to him by a saavy HC, GM, and owner?

Remember, McDaniels as a coach can only really be rated by what he's done as the HC of the Denver Broncos... not what he did as the D-backs coach/offensive coordinator of the best team of the last decade.

Nobody talks about Dick Lebeau's TERRIBLE track record as a HC when they discuss how great he is as the Steelers DC. Apples to apples. From what he said, he was spot on.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

I've always heard that Weis is credited with Brady's development. Second the scheme didn't change. It was Weis that develop the scheme for the Patriots that's plan and simple fact. McDaniels added to it but he didn't change it.

How do I explain Matt Cassel? Easy.

1. McDaniels had four years work with him. He had him well prepared.

2. In those four years he sat behind one of best quarterbacks in the League.

3. The Patriots ran the ball significantly more in '08 than they did in '07 (about 100 times more). They normally run the ball 430 times a year in '08 they ran it over 530 times.

4. Other than Brady going down the rest of the offense was still in tact.

Yep. Something about being behind a very good O-line and having RANDY FRICKIN' MOSS, WES FRICKIN' WELKER, and BEN FRICKIN' WATSON to throw to probably didn't hurt, either.

[Bosco]

I've always heard that Weis is credited with Brady's development. Tom Brady himself has sent much more credit McDaniels way than he ever did with Weis, and even objective outsiders noticed far better improvement with Brady after McD became QB coach.


Second the scheme didn't change. It was Weis that develop the scheme for the Patriots that's plan and simple fact. McDaniels added to it but he didn't change it. I'm sorry, but you don't have a goddamn clue what you're talking about.


After the New England Patriots 2004 season, coach Bill Belicheck and offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels went to Gainesville, Florida to meet with Urban Meyer, scout some of his offensive players and discuss the spread option with him. Over the next few years, they would form a great bond and change the New England Patriots offensive attack from an old, smashmouth, Earhardt-Perkins offense left over from the Charlie Weiss and Bill Parcells era, to a new spread attack. The rest is history!

The 2007 New England Patriots went on to break every offensive NFL record with this new spread attack. They grew tired of stumbling into super bowls and barely winning them by three points. They wanted the offense to be explosive and be able to dictate to the defense. If you watch their offense, they use multiple formations to run the same plays, similar to Meyer's spread. The exception is that the NFL quarterback can't run. At least, not yet.

It will be interesting to see how coach Josh McDaniels implements his offense in Denver. With all the new offensive weapons (great wide receivers, great tight ends, great full back and running back), the best pass-blocking offensive line in all of football, and Kyle Orton at the helm (played in Purdue's spread offense), Josh will have every opportunity to continue the spread offense he began in New England.

http://www.footballtimes.org/Article.asp?ID=217

If you really want to challenge me on this, feel free to keep pushing. Just be warned that I have copies of the Patriots 2002-2004 playbooks as well as copies of many of their games under Weis and almost every single game from when McDaniels was calling the plays and can easily disprove any of the uninformed bullshit you try to peddle.

Trust me, this isn't a debate you're equipped to handle.



How do I explain Matt Cassel? Easy.

1. McDaniels had four years work with him. He had him well prepared.

2. In those four years he sat behind one of best quarterbacks in the League.

3. The Patriots ran the ball significantly more in '08 than they did in '07 (about 100 times more). They normally run the ball 430 times a year in '08 they ran it over 530 times.

4. Other than Brady going down the rest of the offense was still in tact. So it wasn't all Brady? Thanks for agreeing with me.


Fair is fair... did McDaniels "put that squad together" or just get to use the pieces provided to him by a saavy HC, GM, and owner? By all accounts, Belichick allowed McD to have lots of input on any offensive decisions and by the middle of the 2007 season had basically turned over complete control (personnel included) over to him.


Remember, McDaniels as a coach can only really be rated by what he's done as the HC of the Denver Broncos... not what he did as the D-backs coach/offensive coordinator of the best team of the last decade.-

Nobody talks about Dick Lebeau's TERRIBLE track record as a HC when they discuss how great he is as the Steelers DC. Apples to apples. From what he said, he was spot on. Again, you're talking two different things. I do agree that McD's head coaching pedigree will be entirely separate from his time as OC in New England, but to claim that he has never put together an elite passing attack is a farce that is factually incorrect. To use your example of Dick LeBeau, even when he was unproven as a HC you and me both would have laughed in the faces of anyone who claimed he hadn't proven that he could build an elite defense.

[jhildebrand]

I have copies of the Patriots 2002-2004 playbooks

Well....LET'S SEE THEM!!!

[Bosco]

Yep. Something about being behind a very good O-line and having RANDY FRICKIN' MOSS, WES FRICKIN' WELKER, and BEN FRICKIN' WATSON to throw to probably didn't hurt, either.

See this is the problem I have with this. Nobody wants to give credit to McDaniels for his offenses because of the elite players, but yet fail to acknowledge the role McD had in making those same players elite.

Brady - Statisical performance climbed substantially when McD was made his quarterback coach and has been very vocal in praising Josh for helping him take the next step, peaking with a record breaking season in 2007.

Welker - Had 96 catches in 3 years before joining the Pats. He then comes to New England and exceeds that total (tied for league lead) in one season, voted two time All-Pro (2007 & 2008) Pro Bowler in 2008 and has three straight seasons of 100+ catches.

Moss - Two mediocre seasons in Oakland and many thought he was done for. Value was so low that the Pats only had to spend a 4th to acquire him. Comes to New England and has the best year of his career while setting an NFL record for touchdown receptions.

Secondly, how many great offensive coordinators have without talented players. I don't hear anyone docking Shanahan for his offensive prowness with San Fransisco or the John Elway led Broncos. Tom Moore? Sean Payton? Andy Reid?

Apparently Josh McDaniels is the only one who loses credit for having talented players.

[Bosco]

Well....LET'S SEE THEM!!!

PM me your email address.

[Ravage!!!]

How many years was Brady in the NFL by the time McDaniels became the QB coach or OC? So Weiss was working with nearly a rookie, McDaniels was working with a 3 time SUper Bowl champion, veteran QB. Seems that the 'improvments' in Brady's game could be attributed to learning from experience as much as anything else.

[TXBRONC]

If you really want to challenge me on this, feel free to keep pushing. Just be warned that I have copies of the Patriots 2002-2004 playbooks as well as copies of many of their games under Weis and almost every single game from when McDaniels was calling the plays and can easily disprove any of the uninformed bullshit you try to peddle.

Trust me, this isn't a debate you're equipped to handle.


So it wasn't all Brady? Thanks for agreeing with me.

By all accounts, Belichick allowed McD to have lots of input on any offensive decisions and by the middle of the 2007 season had basically turned over complete control (personnel included) over to him.

Again, you're talking two different things. I do agree that McD's head coaching pedigree will be entirely separate from his time as OC in New England, but to claim that he has never put together an elite passing attack is a farce that is factually incorrect. To use your example of Dick LeBeau, even when he was unproen as a HC you and me both would have laughed in the faces of anyone who claimed he hadn't proven that he could build an elite defense.




Well....LET'S SEE THEM!!!


PM me your email address.

I'm not worried about your acumen. In other words let's see the playbook. There is no reason to hide. Since you have all this inside information let everyone see it. And while you're at provide some tangible evidence that Belichick turned personnel decisions to to a 30 year offensive coordinator.

[Lonestar]

PM me your email address.

Just about wiped out my email storage last night. Have not had a chance to look at them, thanks.
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

[TXBRONC]

Yep. Something about being behind a very good O-line and having RANDY FRICKIN' MOSS, WES FRICKIN' WELKER, and BEN FRICKIN' WATSON to throw to probably didn't hurt, either.

That's what I meant when I said the rest of the offense was intact for the '08 season. I give McDaniels credit for having Cassel well prepared but it wasn't like they were dependent on Cassel to carry the team.

[broncohead]

How much more development did Brady need when McD came? He was already regarded as one of the best in the game if not the best

[TXBRONC]

How much more development did Brady need when McD came? He was already regarded as one of the best in the game if not the best

I guess he was still pretty raw eventhough the Patriots were well on there way to winning two more Super Bowls by the time McDaniels became the quarterbacks coach. :whoknows:

[broncohead]

I guess he was still pretty raw eventhough the Patriots were well on there way to winning two more Super Bowls by the time McDaniels became the quarterbacks coach. :whoknows:

Ya i guess he never carried the team on his back...

[Lonestar]

How much more development did Brady need when McD came? He was already regarded as one of the best in the game if not the best

Brady himslef praised Josh about taking him to a new level. I guessing much the same way that mikey did for John earlier in his career.

Y'all can say what you want about TB accomplishments prior to Josh taking them to record levels but when Brady says his level of play was raised might want to listen.
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

[TXBRONC]

As someone has repeatedly said about different player praising a coach: "What else was he suppose to say?" Unless Brady is complete jerk you wouldn't expect him to bad mouth a former coach would you? :confused:

[Bosco]

How many years was Brady in the NFL by the time McDaniels became the QB coach or OC? So Weiss was working with nearly a rookie, McDaniels was working with a 3 time SUper Bowl champion, veteran QB. Seems that the 'improvments' in Brady's game could be attributed to learning from experience as much as anything else.

Brady's 3rd ring came in 2004 when McD was the QB coach, which also marked a significant rise in his statistical performance.


I'm not worried about your acumen. In other words let's see the playbook. There is no reason to hide. Since you have all this inside information let everyone see it. I agree there is nothing to hide, which is why everyone that asked me for copies of the playbooks has received them. Unfortunately they are rather large PDF files so posting them here is not really an option. If you PM me your email address and I'll send them out to you as well.

Anyways, that is all secondary. My original point is that if you want to keep talking to us about McDaniels scheme, you damn well better be able to back it up and in this case you can't, as it's factually incorrect.


And while you're at provide some tangible evidence that Belichick turned personnel decisions to to a 30 year offensive coordinator. I already did that. It apparently wasn't good enough for you because it didn't contain a "direct quote".

[Bosco]

As someone has repeatedly said about different player praising a coach: "What else was he suppose to say?" Unless Brady is complete jerk you wouldn't expect him to bad mouth a former coach would you? :confused:

There is a pretty big difference between "taking the high road" and the very specific praise that both Brady and Cassel had for McD.

[Ravage!!!]

Brady's 3rd ring came in 2004 when McD was the QB coach, which also marked a significant rise in his statistical performance.

Wow.. so the QB got better in his fourth season after already winning two Super Bowls? Shocking.

[Ravage!!!]

There is a pretty big difference between "taking the high road" and the very specific praise that both Brady and Cassel had for McD.

Actually, their isn't.

[TXBRONC]

Brady's 3rd ring came in 2004 when McD was the QB coach, which also marked a significant rise in his statistical performance.

I agree there is nothing to hide, which is why everyone that asked me for copies of the playbooks has received them. Unfortunately they are rather large PDF files so posting them here is not really an option. If you PM me your email address and I'll send them out to you as well.

Anyways, that is all secondary. My original point is that if you want to keep talking to us about McDaniels scheme, you damn well better be able to back it up and in this case you can't, as it's factually incorrect.

I already did that. It apparently wasn't good enough for you because it didn't contain a "direct quote".

There's no need e-mail me entire alleged playbook. Post some of it here with some way legitimately verify that you're not just blowing smoke. Anyway it's rather strange that a Denver Bronco fan would have an authentic N.E. playbook. That might constitute stealing since I doubt like you work for the Patriots or ever have and if you do or did work for them that would be completely unprofessional of you to share it with fans.

What I've said is not factually incorrect it's all based on facts.

You have backed anything to this point. And you're damn right I want a verifiable direct quote. Until then....

[TXBRONC]

Actually, their isn't.

Spot on.

[Bosco]

Actually, their isn't.

You're joking, right?

Scenario A: When asked by a reporter how his coach helped him improve his game, player gives generic response about the coach's knowledge and dedication.

Scenario B: Same player gives a very detailed response stating that the coach directly helped him improve X, Y, Z and helped him to understand A, B, C.

And you think there is no difference between those?


There's no need e-mail me entire alleged playbook. Post some of it here with some way legitimately verify that you're not just blowing smoke. Jrwiz and JHildebrand both received the playbooks. If you don't want the copies to verify yourself, you can ask them if it's legit.


Anyway it's rather strange that a Denver Bronco fan would have an authentic N.E. playbook. That's just a couple of the 10+ playbooks I have with many more available if I had any use for them.


That might constitute stealing since I doubt like you work for the Patriots or ever have and if you do or did work for them that would be completely unprofessional of you to share it with fans. I see your understanding of the law is as poor as your understanding of X's and O's.

But no, none of the playbooks I have were acquired by any illegal means.


What I've said is not factually incorrect it's all based on facts. What facts are those?

[Ravage!!!]

You're joking, right?

Scenario A: When asked by a reporter how his coach helped him improve his game, player gives generic response about the coach's knowledge and dedication.

Scenario B: Same player gives a very detailed response stating that the coach directly helped him improve X, Y, Z and helped him to understand A, B, C.

And you think there is no difference between those?

Don't try to fit the scenario to fit your comment. There is no difference from what has been said/complimented about McD from those players than what we have heard a 1000 times from other players saying about their coaches. Hell, even Marshall had nice things to say about McD after the season when he knew he wanted out, woul be leaving, didn't want in Denver, and didn't want to be around McD.

Your scenario is no different than what we've seen in the NFL for the length of our lifetime. Don't try to sell us on how its any different.

[Bosco]

Don't try to fit the scenario to fit your comment. Don't need to. My comments fit the scenario.


Hell, even Marshall had nice things to say about McD after the season when he knew he wanted out, woul be leaving, didn't want in Denver, and didn't want to be around McD. Wrong again. Both McD and Marshall have openly talked about how they liked each other.

[broncohead]

Don't need to. My comments fit the scenario.

Wrong again. Both McD and Marshall have openly talked about how they liked each other.

So everything players and coaches say is the truth? I don't know why I ever thought otherwise.

[Bosco]

So everything players and coaches say is the truth? I don't know why I ever thought otherwise.

So what's the alternative? Believe that Josh and Brandon got together and concocted a plan to appear as buddies in the national media and make sure that all 3rd party reports fit this agenda.

Right. That's entirely plausible.

[broncohead]

So what's the alternative? Believe that Josh and Brandon got together and concocted a plan to appear as buddies in the national media and make sure that all 3rd party reports fit this agenda.

Right. That's entirely plausible.

It's as simple as trying to act professional. I'm sure a lot of players and coaches on the Broncos who don't like Marshall cause of his antics. McD isn't going to say he doesn't like a player to the media. Just isn't going to happen.

[Bosco]

It's as simple as trying to act professional. I'm sure a lot of players and coaches on the Broncos who don't like Marshall cause of his antics. McD isn't going to say he doesn't like a player to the media. Just isn't going to happen.

Yeah, this was definitely another case of "just taking the high road".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxV8IfKOir8

[broncohead]

Yeah, this was definitely another case of "just taking the high road".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxV8IfKOir8

Thats how i see it

[Bosco]

Thats how i see it

Well then the problem is clearly you. I've followed football for a long time and know it's very, very rare for a coach to heap that kind of praise onto a player, especially one they supposedly don't like.

[TXBRONC]

You're joking, right?

Scenario A: When asked by a reporter how his coach helped him improve his game, player gives generic response about the coach's knowledge and dedication.

Scenario B: Same player gives a very detailed response stating that the coach directly helped him improve X, Y, Z and helped him to understand A, B, C.

And you think there is no difference between those?

Jrwiz and JHildebrand both received the playbooks. If you don't want the copies to verify yourself, you can ask them if it's legit.

That's just a couple of the 10+ playbooks I have with many more available if I had any use for them.

I see your understanding of the law is as poor as your understanding of X's and O's.

But no, none of the playbooks I have were acquired by any illegal means.

What facts are those?

How can they verify it? Just because they something you sent doesn't verify shit. Any dumb ass if they want to waste the time could create some piece of shit and say it's authentic.

Your understanding of Xs and Os is awe inspring by an measure. I don't think you know jack from shit.

You're really not to swift are you?

I'll go through this one more time. Read it slow and read it left to right ok?

Is it true that Cassel was turtored for four years under McDaniels? Answers: Yes. So that is a fact isn't?

Did Cassel get to sit behind one of the best quartersbacks in the League. Answer Yes he did. That to is a fact. Or are you really going say that Tom Brady isn't one of the League's best?

Did they run the ball significantly more in '08? Yes they did. They generally run the ball about 450 times a year as team. In '08 they ran it over 500 times.

Other than Brady who else was hurt? Moss? No. Welker? No. Watson? No. Faulk? No. Oh wait Maroney was also hurt. But they still had four running backs with 70 plus carries or more.

I know it rains on your little parade but those are facts.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/teams/stats?team=nwe&year=2008

[broncohead]

Well then the problem is clearly you. I've followed football for a long time and know it's very, very rare for a coach to heap that kind of praise onto a player, especially one they supposedly don't like.

That's your opinion. You can't say for sure that McD liked Marshall. All his antics and McD benching him at the end of the season then trading him. Kinda tells the story to me...

[Poet]

Eddie Royal had one good year. Thomas hasn't played a snap. Your third WR is....


Your lineup of wideouts isn't lacking talent, just production, which is fine because they're young. But even if the Broncos do have a top ten year in WR production, that doesn't make this prediction any less absurd.

In that same vein, if I say "I project Cedric Benson to score 20 touchdowns this year," and I'm right I'm still being a homer/am a moron/got lucky.

[jhildebrand]

Your third WR is....


Eddie Mac er Eric Decker


:couch: Hiding from the posters who hate the Eddie Mac references :lol:

[Bosco]

How can they verify it? Just because they something you sent doesn't verify shit. Any dumb ass if they want to waste the time could create some piece of shit and say it's authentic.

Yeah, it's all some media conspiracy to make sure Josh McDaniels looks good to the Bronco fans who haven't accepted him.

Do you buy your tinfoil in bulk?


Your understanding of Xs and Os is awe inspring by an measure. I don't think you know jack from shit. So quit talking about it and show us what you got. You claim that McD is still running Charlie Weis' system, so bring out some X's and O's to support your point and we'll see just which one of us really has a better grasp on this.


You're really not to swift are you?

I'll go through this one more time. Read it slow and read it left to right ok?

Is it true that Cassel was turtored for four years under McDaniels? Answers: Yes. So that is a fact isn't?

Did Cassel get to sit behind one of the best quartersbacks in the League. Answer Yes he did. That to is a fact. Or are you really going say that Tom Brady isn't one of the League's best?

Did they run the ball significantly more in '08? Yes they did. They generally run the ball about 450 times a year as team. In '08 they ran it over 500 times.

Other than Brady who else was hurt? Moss? No. Welker? No. Watson? No. Faulk? No. Oh wait Maroney was also hurt. But they still had four running backs with 70 plus carries or more.

I know it rains on your little parade but those are facts.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/teams/stats?team=nwe&year=2008

So we could some up your arguments like this.

- Josh McDaniels developed Cassel so when he was pressed into action, he performed very well despite not starting a game since high school.

- Cassel also spent all his time in New England learning behind Tom Brady, who McDaniels also helped to develop.

- When Cassel was put into action, Josh scaled the offense back from a spread form, wide open passing attacking to more of a WCO, grind it out offense to fit Cassel's strengths and still outperformed the 2008 Broncos offense.

Pretty interesting, coming from a guy who has twist and bent like a novelty straw to avoid giving McDaniels the slightest bit of credit for New England's success. I guess that only works for so long before it falls apart.


That's your opinion. You can't say for sure that McD liked Marshall. All his antics and McD benching him at the end of the season then trading him. Kinda tells the story to me...

You're bordering on hilariously obtuse here. Let's review facts here.

1. Josh McDaniels has openly professed his fondness for Brandon Marshall on many occasions.

2. Brandon Marshall has openly professed his fondness for Josh McDaniels.

3. Multiple outside sources have gone on record verifying this.

4. We have video footage of the very emotional hug between Brandon and Josh after his touchdown in the Dallas game

4. There is a lack of any credible, verifiable evidence to refute the above facts.

Conclusion: Brandon and Josh really did like each other.

Simple shit man.

[Poet]

They liked each other at one point, and that point has passed. If things were so peachy he wouldn't have been traded. The Broncos had contract talks with Marshall, they weren't opposed to paying him. But to think that a coach liked a player who pulled what Marshall did at the end of the year is ridiculous.

[TXBRONC]

That's your opinion. You can't say for sure that McD liked Marshall. All his antics and McD benching him at the end of the season then trading him. Kinda tells the story to me...

I don't think they liked each other either. Reeves didn't particularly care for Elway but he praised to the media and stuck up for him when he was criticized.

[Bosco]

If things were so peachy he wouldn't have been traded. The Broncos had contract talks with Marshall, they weren't opposed to paying him. Doesn't the bolded part kinda contradict the un-bolded part?

[Lonestar]

You're joking, right?

Scenario A: When asked by a reporter how his coach helped him improve his game, player gives generic response about the coach's knowledge and dedication.

Scenario B: Same player gives a very detailed response stating that the coach directly helped him improve X, Y, Z and helped him to understand A, B, C.

And you think there is no difference between those?

Jrwiz and JHildebrand both received the playbooks. If you don't want the copies to verify yourself, you can ask them if it's legit.

That's just a couple of the 10+ playbooks I have with many more available if I had any use for them.

I see your understanding of the law is as poor as your understanding of X's and O's.

But no, none of the playbooks I have were acquired by any illegal means.

What facts are those?


SInce I was off :laugh::laugh::laugh: a few days had nothing to do but pour though the playbacks They are loaded with info. Not sure if it can be done but some of those plays could be useful in football 101 .

I'm not computer savy enough to place them there but maybe you could. :salute:

[Bosco]

SInce I was off :laugh::laugh::laugh: a few days had nothing to do but pour though the playbacks They are loaded with info. Not sure if it can be done but some of those plays could be useful in football 101 .

I'm not computer savy enough to place them there but maybe you could. :salute:

I don't really use Adobe that often, but I'm sure at the very least you could use Print Screen to make an image of a certain page and upload it to Photobucket or something.

[Dean]

There are football playbooks all over the internet. Some are free others you have to pay for. Google football coaching playbooks and there are pages to choose from. If you want the Patriots playbooks, google football coaching playbooks Patriots. However, without techniques, reads, and knowledge of check-offs and calls they are not as useful as one might believe.:coffee:

[TXBRONC]

There are football playbooks all over the internet. Some are free others you have to pay for. Google football coaching playbooks and there are pages to choose from. If you want the Patriots playbooks, google football coaching playbooks Patriots. However, without techniques, reads, and knowledge of check-offs and calls they are not as useful as one might believe.:coffee:

Interesting I never thought to look for NFL play books. Maybe those online playbooks are for guys who want to pretend they offensive coordinators. :whoknows:

[Bosco]

Maybe those online playbooks are for guys who want to pretend they offensive coordinators. :whoknows:

Nope, just those of us willing to spend the time to become informed on the matter.

[Poet]

Doesn't the bolded part kinda contradict the un-bolded part?

No, not at all. There are plenty of players who get paid that play for a team that puts up with them.

Putting up with and liking are two different things.

[TXBRONC]

No, not at all. There are plenty of players who get paid that play for a team that puts up with them.

Putting up with and liking are two different things.

:nod: Elway and Reeves tolerated each other until the last couple of years of Reeves tenure as head coach.