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Tned
05-27-2008, 07:22 AM
As the message board charter states we get feedback on major decisions and the only reason to ban people is to 'protect' other forum members, it only makes sense that we get feedback from ‘forum members’ before implementing definitive process for suspensions and bandings.

In the beginning, decisions to ban went before the advisory board. Since the board was disbanded, I have made all final decisions on whether to suspend, typically after a request by one or more moderators to do so. There have been a couple situations where mods have banned a member based on what they considered an emergency situation (they have the power to do that, with procedural limits, although it is a bit ambiguous).

We need to formalize a policy for when a member should be banned. I am going to throw out some ideas/possibilities, but we can and should add to the list of possibilities based on discussion (and ideas that are presented) in this thread.

For the purposes of full disclosure, I need to make the following point. First, I want to say that IMO, we have a great set of mods that are doing a great job of balancing a need to keep Broncosforums friendly and fun with the need to prevent people from running wild attacking other members. Having said that, if I was not currently a built in ‘slow down’ in terms of approving suspensions/bans, we would have had quite a few more bans to date. Meaning, that based on moderator discussion on problems that have arisen, it is clear that I am much more reticent to suspend/ban than the mods in general. This is probably do to the fact that they have to deal with the crap on a regular basis, which often includes people not complying with their directive to discontinue certain behavior. So, if I am simply removed from the picture and each mod can made the decision to ban/suspend on a case by case basis, I am confident that the number of suspensions will increase fairly rapidly. That might be a good thing, as I tend to give people 2nd, 3rd and even 4th chances before implementing a suspension.

I bring up the above, because most message boards either allow mods to make judgement calls on suspensions/bannings (often with limited to no appeal process) or use an Infractions Points system to attempt to eliminate “heat of the moment bannings” and to allow members to know when they are pushing the envelope and getting close to being suspended. I don’t want to continue being the person making the final call on suspensions/bannings for a number of reasons, including that with work I travel overseas several times a year and have limited time to check in. In addition, I just don’t particularly like being in that position, for the same reason I don’t want to moderate the message board.

Here are four initial options for us to consider, plus as I said we will update this list as ideas are presented in this discussion:


Individual mods have freedom to suspend/ban at their discretion (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending)
X number of mods (three for instance) must agree on a suspension/banning (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending)
A group of forum members (jury if you will) that have been pre-selected in some manner, will be presented with all non-emergency banning situations and 'based on the forum rules' determine whether and suspension/banning is in order and for how long (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending). For this to work, the group would have to be preselected and large enough to ensure that when they were presented with a situation, enough of them would respond with a vote of yes/no on the suspension within x hours (12 or 24), so that a reasonably quick resolution could be arrived at.
An infraction system like Broncos Country uses and Broncosfreak used to use, in which thresholds (when suspensions will occur) are clearly publicized, as well as the values for each and all infractions. This is built in to vBulletin, and thousands of message boards use. When implemented correctly, it is probably the closest manner of taking emotion out of the banning process and at the same time creating both a system of warning people when they are getting close, but also quickly taking action.


Of the options above, I know the last one will be met with immediate resistance by many that came from Mania. To that, let me say this. Many, many message boards (probably thousands) use an infractions points system without the problems that occurred on mania. A lot of that had to do with the way it was implemented. First, they refused to publicize the values for each infraction type as well as what the levels were for suspensions (or other loss of privileges). Second, one of the mods started giving out infractions before the IP system was publically announced. Third, borderline IPs were given, such as the famous “Frog” IPs.

Anyway, we need to discuss this and define how suspensions and bannings should be handed out. Unfortunately, it is a fact of life that not all members will be so well behaved that we don’t have to worry about suspending/banning people. Instead, a great many people tend to push and push until it is clear to them that if they push anymore, they will be banned/suspended. Then, they often chill out for a little while.

Right now our mods are in a tough position, because we do not have a defined policy for how and when members will be suspended/banned and therefore members push the envelope more than they should and take advantage of the non-defined suspension process.

Let’s try to keep this discussion on topic and not take shots at each other for their opinions. If for any reason anyone is uncomfortable posting their opinion openly, then PM me and I will repost it in this thread anonymously.

Thanks
T

MOtorboat
05-27-2008, 08:12 AM
Individual mods have freedom to suspend/ban at their discretion (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending)
X number of mods (three for instance) must agree on a suspension/banning (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending)

Preferably one of these. I would tend to lead towards option 1. They need to have this power, imo.


An infraction system like Broncos Country uses and Broncosfreak used to use, in which thresholds (when suspensions will occur) are clearly publicized, as well as the values for each and all infractions. This is built in to vBulletin, and thousands of message boards use. When implemented correctly, it is probably the closest manner of taking emotion out of the banning process and at the same time creating both a system of warning people when they are getting close, but also quickly taking action.


This would be OK too.

broncogirl7
05-27-2008, 08:23 AM
Tned, I don't have a problem with option 4...people don't have to worry if they follow the guidelines that were set up. Seems pretty simple to me. You and the mods are doing a great job.

Retired_Member_001
05-27-2008, 03:25 PM
The problem is that different Mods have different standards. If individual mods are going to ban people, they have to be consistent.

(I'm not implying that our mods are inconsistent, just saying that consistency is needed).

I think that all your ideas sound great though.

Escobar
05-27-2008, 03:27 PM
The problem is that different Mods have different standards. If individual mods are going to ban people, they have to be consistent.

(I'm not implying that our mods are inconsistent, just saying that consistency is needed).

I think that all your ideas sound great though.
They are ''inconsistent'' Better yet, unfair and biased.

Kapaibro
05-27-2008, 03:29 PM
Oh yay. IP's...again

Just one of the reasons people left Broncomania. Yeah, great idea, let's bring in the grossly unpopular move.

Kapaibro
05-27-2008, 03:30 PM
They are ''inconsistent'' Better yet, unfair and biased.

Amen. :tsk:

Retired_Member_001
05-27-2008, 03:30 PM
They are ''inconsistent'' Better yet, unfair and biased.

Shhhhhhhhhhhh

You are supposed to put it nicely.

;)

Ok ok. I'll agree that I've seen some inconsistency. Unfair and biased are not fair comments though. The Mods here DO try there best and do a supreme job of keeping order. Alot better than most messageboards and I'm not just saying that. Sometimes, a hint on inconsistency kicks in though. It's only natural considering that different mods can be completely different people. I just think a standard should be set.

Broncospsycho77
05-27-2008, 04:36 PM
Back on the Freak, there certainly were some inconsistencies with a few of the mods with different members, which caused a lot of tension within the forum, so more than one mod backing it would be the "safest" point of view.

Tned
05-27-2008, 05:07 PM
Oh yay. IP's...again

Just one of the reasons people left Broncomania. Yeah, great idea, let's bring in the grossly unpopular move.

That's why I suggested alternatives and opened it up for discussion. FWIW, the IP system works successfully on thousands of forums and typically is put in place to be more fair, not less.

I'm not tied to any method, but there needs to be 'some' method, because right now I am having to make the call on each banning, which puts the mods in a tough position (especially when I am traveling or otherwise out of touch) and if we allow mods the freedom to ban based on their discretion, then we will have inconsistancies, just do to human nature. Just like happened on BM before the IP system. Some mods were slow to ban, some were one strike and you are banned.

So, since this is a discussion, stating that one option is very bad is only part of the objective, the more important part is deciding how to move forward. What do you see as our best approach to handling suspensions and bannings?

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 05:21 PM
Tned, just make it easy and ban everyone.

tia.

GEM
05-27-2008, 05:23 PM
That's why I suggested alternatives and opened it up for discussion. FWIW, the IP system works successfully on thousands of forums and typically is put in place to be more fair, not less.

I'm not tied to any method, but there needs to be 'some' method, because right now I am having to make the call on each banning, which puts the mods in a tough position (especially when I am traveling or otherwise out of touch) and if we allow mods the freedom to ban based on their discretion, then we will have inconsistancies, just do to human nature. Just like happened on BM before the IP system. Some mods were slow to ban, some were one strike and you are banned.

So, since this is a discussion, stating that one option is very bad is only part of the objective, the more important part is deciding how to move forward. What do you see as our best approach to handling suspensions and bannings?


I would like to see Topscribe's opinion of the Infraction System.I think if it had been implemented correctly on Mania/Country it could have been a lot more successful. I also think at that point it isn't a mod's decision that comes into play, it's the poster themselves. If infractions are given out for rules that are set out and we know about, there really isn't an issue. I think our mods here are a lot more understanding of where our posters are coming from. I think the "frog" comment would have gone by here without a look.

Those are just my thoughts.

Jody
05-27-2008, 05:34 PM
That's why I suggested alternatives and opened it up for discussion. FWIW, the IP system works successfully on thousands of forums and typically is put in place to be more fair, not less.

I'm not tied to any method, but there needs to be 'some' method, because right now I am having to make the call on each banning, which puts the mods in a tough position (especially when I am traveling or otherwise out of touch) and if we allow mods the freedom to ban based on their discretion, then we will have inconsistancies, just do to human nature. Just like happened on BM before the IP system. Some mods were slow to ban, some were one strike and you are banned.

So, since this is a discussion, stating that one option is very bad is only part of the objective, the more important part is deciding how to move forward. What do you see as our best approach to handling suspensions and bannings?

A three-person advisory board, with majority vote as the decision.

Well...a three-person Banning/Suspension Committee, since the advisory board thing has a black cloud over it.

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 05:35 PM
Just let me decide. I'll be fair and impartial.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 05:38 PM
Shhhhhhhhhhhh

You are supposed to put it nicely.

;)

Ok ok. I'll agree that I've seen some inconsistency. Unfair and biased are not fair comments though. The Mods here DO try there best and do a supreme job of keeping order. Alot better than most messageboards and I'm not just saying that. Sometimes, a hint on inconsistency kicks in though. It's only natural considering that different mods can be completely different people. I just think a standard should be set.

You will never be able to put into motion enough rules and standards to
negate some differences among Mods. That is anywhere, not just here.

For instance, say you are caught speeding, going seven MPH over. One cop
might issue you a ticket, so you have to appear in court, pay a fine, incur
points on your license, and maybe get an increase in your insurance
premiums.

Another cop, however, may just issue a warning ticket (if they still exist),
while a third might just tell you to slow it down, then go on his way.

You're going to get that because you are dealing with different individuals.

That is why we have a process of appeal. When you feel you have been
dealt with unfairly or you think a Mod might have been a bit heavy-handed,
you send it on to Admin. And, believe me, the appealing poster gets the
first consideration with Admin (Tned) because he believes so deeply in the
community concept for this board.

We do try to limit that, however. When a circumstance arises where we're
not entirely sure, we submit it to the other Mods for discussion, and then it
is taken care of according to consensus among the Mods. This happens
often, in fact.

Regarding the banning issue, I will go on record as being against having the
individual power to ban.

Now, I personally make a distinction here in terminology. To me, a ban is
an action that results in a more long-term absence from the board . . . say,
30 days or more. To me, something short in duration or temporary is a
suspension.

Admin has retained the power over bans and suspensions, and any case is
submitted first to the Mods and then to Admin for the final decision. Admin,
then, bans or suspends the poster.

The exception is when Admin cannot be reached and the Mod in question
deems it urgent to stop the poster's access to the board, either from
uncontrollable spamming/trolling/flaming or unyielding defiance of a Mod's
directives, and Admin is not accessible because he is either in bed or away,
which he does go out of the country on business occasionally. The Mod is
then authorized to implement an emergency suspension of 24 to 72 hours,
usually, depending on when Admin is expected back onto the board. This is
the only circumstance under which a Mod can suspend or ban.

So I will repeat that I am absolutely against giving individual Mods the
authority to ban or suspend, except under the above circumstances. If
each Mod ends up with that authority, then we may have an inconsistent
situation where a poster might get banned by one Mod but not by another.
This would not be right.

Hope I made sense in all this rambling.

-----

topscribe
05-27-2008, 05:38 PM
Just let me decide. I'll be fair and impartial.

What, would you like for me to kick your ass out right now? :mad:

-----

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 05:41 PM
What, would you like for me to kick your ass out right now? :mad:

-----

:couch:

topscribe
05-27-2008, 05:48 PM
I would like to see Topscribe's opinion of the Infraction System.I think if it had been implemented correctly on Mania/Country it could have been a lot more successful. I also think at that point it isn't a mod's decision that comes into play, it's the poster themselves. If infractions are given out for rules that are set out and we know about, there really isn't an issue. I think our mods here are a lot more understanding of where our posters are coming from. I think the "frog" comment would have gone by here without a look.

Those are just my thoughts.

I don't like the IP system as it was set up on the previous board (not bashing
that board, just disagreeing with a policy). I believe, as Jody posted here,
with some sort of board that represents the community, which will decide,
in serious cases, whether action is to be taken and, if so, what action. In
the case of banning (not necessarily suspension . . . see my previous post),
however, I believe in a unanimous vote, not majority.

I do not believe a moderator should be saddled with that responsibility.

I also believe that, in the case of banning (again, not necessarily suspension),
the poster in question should be allowed to make a statement on his/her
own behalf before advisory board (or whatever we'll call it) makes the decision.

Regarding some sort of "IP" system, I do believe the moderators need a
method of record keeping, but one that does not take a whole lot of time
and effort since we are working and/or family people. The "IP" feature in
this software is ideal, and it can be implemented without accumulation of
actual points. But some sort of history is necessary to keep track of
especially problem posters.

I might come up with more later, but, as I implied, I'm working. :D

-----

RunYouOver
05-27-2008, 05:51 PM
I'd say the IP system could work pretty well if all the guidelines were laid out before hand...

Otherwise, the best bet would be a group decision by a few of the mods.

GEM
05-27-2008, 06:08 PM
I don't like the IP system as it was set up on the previous board (not bashing
that board, just disagreeing with a policy). I believe, as Jody posted here,
with some sort of board that represents the community, which will decide,
in serious cases, whether action is to be taken and, if so, what action. In
the case of banning (not necessarily suspension . . . see my previous post),
however, I believe in a unanimous vote, not majority.

I do not believe a moderator should be saddled with that responsibility.

I also believe that, in the case of banning (again, not necessarily suspension),
the poster in question should be allowed to make a statement on his/her
own behalf before advisory board (or whatever we'll call it) makes the decision.

Regarding some sort of "IP" system, I do believe the moderators need a
method of record keeping, but one that does not take a whole lot of time
and effort since we are working and/or family people. The "IP" feature in
this software is ideal, and it can be implemented without accumulation of
actual points. But some sort of history is necessary to keep track of
especially problem posters.

I might come up with more later, but, as I implied, I'm working. :D

-----


Thank you top, I was more interested in your opinion now that you have been on both sides of the "force" lol. If we don't go for that, i would agree with the vote of the moderators. I don't really like the trial by committee. A lot of personal opinions can come in there and no need to spread the power any more. That's just my opinion. I think our moderators here are pretty good at their job.

slim
05-27-2008, 09:00 PM
I would prefer some discussion between mods before a suspension is issued to anyone. I think that is the fairest way. So I guess option 2 would be my choice.

Nature Boy
05-27-2008, 09:01 PM
They are ''inconsistent'' Better yet, unfair and biased.

He is correct.

Jody
05-27-2008, 09:02 PM
He is correct.

Are you sure you are 9 years old like your profile states? :confused: :D

Tned
05-27-2008, 09:05 PM
He is correct.


They are ''inconsistent'' Better yet, unfair and biased.

This isn't a "bash the mods" thread, for then it could very easily turn into a "bash the posters bashing the mods" thread.

Please give constructive input on the subject at hand or resist the temptation to hit "Submit Reply".

Thanks

T

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 09:05 PM
He is correct.

Only to rogue posters.... Interesting viewing the posts in this thread from those that are (IMO) considered "instigators".

Anyway, I like what the Freak used. Get an infraction, and you get a certain amount of points against you. Exceed the limit, you get a time out. Repeat offenders get longer, which could eventually lead to an all out permanent ban.

Some posts (full nudity, etc.) would lead to an immediate ban. That system seems fair and balanced.

Again, JMO.

Nature Boy
05-27-2008, 09:07 PM
I suggest that the one who starts the mud slinging 1st, gets in more trouble then the guy who is simply defending himself. And the mods have to be fair and unbiased.

Spider
05-27-2008, 09:08 PM
you know your mods , their temperament ...... you know if they will treat members the way you want to be treated

Nature Boy
05-27-2008, 09:10 PM
Are you sure you are 9 years old like your profile states? :confused: :D

I turn 10 soon. :cool:

slim
05-27-2008, 09:10 PM
I suggest that the one who that starts the mud slinging 1st gets in more trouble then the guy who is simply defending himself. And the mods have to be fair and unbiased.

By and large, the mods here are fair and unbiased. They do a great job. Of course there will always be a few whiners and such, but you can't please everyone.

Tned
05-27-2008, 09:10 PM
you know your mods , their temperament ...... you know if they will treat members the way you want to be treated

I appreciate that sentiment, but I am a firm believer in this being a community and the community discussing how we should do things, and then I attempt to implement what the community "as a whole" wants. I am not a believer in one person making the decisions for a message board/online community.

MOtorboat
05-27-2008, 09:10 PM
I suggest that the one who that starts the mud slinging 1st gets in more trouble then the guy who is simply defending himself. And the mods have to be fair and unbiased.

Yes, I agree whole heartedly.

Someone who starts throwing shit should get less leniency.

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 09:12 PM
I appreciate that sentiment, but I am a firm believer in this being a community and the community discussing how we should do things, and then I attempt to implement what the community "as a whole" wants. I am not a believer in one person making the decisions for a message board/online community.

I agree, T, but you also can't let the inmates run the asylum.

Just a thought.

Jody
05-27-2008, 09:13 PM
you know your mods , their temperament ...... you know if they will treat members the way you want to be treated

This is true, Spider.

From my perspective (limited like everyone's)....

Mods range broadly in temperament and personality.

I would be more concerned if suspension/bannings are left in their hands, it will cause dissention between them as mods. Not so worried about the members on this as I am them. I guess that's why I personally lean towards "the jury". I'm not for the infraction system, but then I still have a bad taste in my mouth about that coming from the other board. If we used the infraction system here, how would it differ? That was a sore subject for many who came over to this site and some other issues surrounding it. I say this without ever receiving an infraction, just watching a board get torn a part due to 'policy' basically.

BeefStew25
05-27-2008, 09:13 PM
Any infraction, banning or warning I have ever recieved I deserved. I trust Tned, so whatever he thinks is what I think. I also think he is very handsome.

Beef

Rick
05-27-2008, 09:15 PM
No one Mod should ever have the power of banning all to themselves. If there is a poster getting out of hand then perhaps a temp suspension to simply pause the problem but the decision should be yours as the admin or the mod group as a whole whether it is a lengthy or perm ban.

Just my :2cents:

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:17 PM
A group of forum members (jury if you will) that have been pre-selected in some manner, will be presented with all non-emergency banning situations and 'based on the forum rules' determine whether and suspension/banning is in order and for how long (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending). For this to work, the group would have to be preselected and large enough to ensure that when they were presented with a situation, enough of them would respond with a vote of yes/no on the suspension within x hours (12 or 24), so that a reasonably quick resolution could be arrived at.

An infraction system like Broncos Country uses and Broncosfreak used to use, in which thresholds (when suspensions will occur) are clearly publicized, as well as the values for each and all infractions. This is built in to vBulletin, and thousands of message boards use. When implemented correctly, it is probably the closest manner of taking emotion out of the banning process and at the same time creating both a system of warning people when they are getting close, but also quickly taking action.




I never had the problem that others had with infraction system that others from Broncomania did however, I prefer the jury method over letting the mods be the police, judge and jury.

Spider
05-27-2008, 09:17 PM
I appreciate that sentiment, but I am a firm believer in this being a community and the community discussing how we should do things, and then I attempt to implement what the community "as a whole" wants. I am not a believer in one person making the decisions for a message board/online community.

well Tned , i think you know me well if enough to know if I felt something was unfair , I would come right out with it ..... I think I have pushed the envelope here more then anyone else , I havent had a single run in with a mod yet . though I am getting better with my "Personal attacks "I still have a ways to go :D

Jody
05-27-2008, 09:20 PM
I never had the problem that others had with infraction system that others from Broncomania did however, I prefer the jury method over letting the mods be the police, judge and jury.

There's another point that goes along with this that should be considered, TX....they are also avid posters and deeply involved in discussions that do not bring objectivity to the table...possibly.

Spider
05-27-2008, 09:20 PM
Actually Tned , I think you have a fair group of Mods here , even including the kool aid thing :D give them the benefit of doubt untill they give you a reason not to

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:25 PM
I agree, T, but you also can't let the inmates run the asylum.

Just a thought.

That's why support the idea of having jury of peers make the decision. I don't think its a good idea to have moderators make decisions like this with no way to appeal it.

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:27 PM
There's another point that goes along with this that should be considered, TX....they are also avid posters and deeply involved in discussions that do not bring objectivity to the table...possibly.

Absolutely.

Tned
05-27-2008, 09:28 PM
Actually Tned , I think you have a fair group of Mods here , even including the kool aid thing :D give them the benefit of doubt untill they give you a reason not to

I agree wholeheartedly about having a fair group of mods. This discussion is in no way meant to be a negative reflection on them, but instead the natural way we proceed here at Broncosforums.

It is an issue that has been on the table, both as a town hall item and as a mod group item for some time. We implemented some internal "temp banning guidelines" to buy us time until we could come up with permanent, but we have now been around (9 months or so) long enough that we need to establish some rules.

For instance, even with the temporary time out, among our mods, we would have a fairly wide disparity in 'when' the trigger would be pulled. That is simply human nature.

So, we have a few things we need to address.


Should a single mod be able to give a timeout or 24 hour suspension, and if so, should there be guidelines as to what warrants that, or should it be a pure judgement call (currently there are loose guidelines as to what constitutes an emergency and this was defined when the advisory board was in effect).

What procedure (points, multiple warnings, a vote of some kind) should be used to determine longer (past 24 hours/timeout) suspensions of 3 days, 7 days, 14 days, perm ban, etc.

Should there be a warning or x warnings before any suspension is given.

Etc.

Spider
05-27-2008, 09:31 PM
I agree wholeheartedly about having a fair group of mods. This discussion is in no way meant to be a negative reflection on them, but instead the natural way we proceed here at Broncosforums.

It is an issue that has been on the table, both as a town hall item and as a mod group item for some time. We implemented some internal "temp banning guidelines" to buy us time until we could come up with permanent, but we have now been around (9 months or so) long enough that we need to establish some rules.

For instance, even with the temporary time out, among our mods, we would have a fairly wide disparity in 'when' the trigger would be pulled. That is simply human nature.

So, we have a few things we need to address.


Should a single mod be able to give a timeout or 24 hour suspension, and if so, should there be guidelines as to what warrants that, or should it be a pure judgement call (currently there are loose guidelines as to what constitutes an emergency and this was defined when the advisory board was in effect).

What procedure (points, multiple warnings, a vote of some kind) should be used to determine longer (past 24 hours/timeout) suspensions of 3 days, 7 days, 14 days, perm ban, etc.

Should there be a warning or x warnings before any suspension is given.

Etc.


:D fair enough and thats why I am still here .... things are pretty fair ......
Maybe Verbal warning then a 24 hour ban , then a 72 hour ban , then a 30 day etc ......Although i dont think there should be stipulations on a 24 ban , if a poster feels he /She / It/ has been banned unjustly , they can come ot town hall and plead their case

Nature Boy
05-27-2008, 09:33 PM
I think that Tops had done a superb job. Can't say the same about the other mod who is pretty active here and actually gets involved in the drama.

Tned
05-27-2008, 09:34 PM
I think that Tops had done a superb job. Can't say the same about the other mod who is pretty active here and actually gets involved in the drama.

NB. Last warning. Provide input on the topic, which is about banning procedures and NOT your opinion of the mods.

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:34 PM
I suggest that the one who starts the mud slinging 1st, gets in more trouble then the guy who is simply defending himself. And the mods have to be fair and unbiased.

This makes no sense IMO....If "mud" is slung at you....don't respond
knowing that you could also be banned.

The mods are fair here...look at all the turds they put up with!

BeefStew25
05-27-2008, 09:34 PM
I think that Tops had done a superb job. Can't say the same about the other mod who is pretty active here and actually gets involved in the drama.

Well, that is a good way to never get the benefit of the doubt.

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:34 PM
I think that Tops had done a superb job. Can't say the same about the other mod who is pretty active here and actually gets involved in the drama.


NB this isn't the place for comments like one I've quoted.

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:35 PM
By and large, the mods here are fair and unbiased. They do a great job. Of course there will always be a few whiners and such, but you can't please everyone.

My thoughts exactly in my post before this one!

slim
05-27-2008, 09:36 PM
I think that Tops had done a superb job. Can't say the same about the other mod who is pretty active here and actually gets involved in the drama.

Time to move along.

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 09:37 PM
Look - a cop on the street can arrest someone if they think they're doing something that negatively affects the society/neighborhood. I think the same can be applied here. If someone is getting out of hand (in a MOD's opinion) a ban could be applied temporarily until a "council" or "jury" can be assembled for an opinion.

It's really not that complicated. Again, JMO.

BeefStew25
05-27-2008, 09:38 PM
Look - a cop on the street can arrest someone if they think they're doing something that negatively affects the society/neighborhood. I think the same can be applied here. If someone is getting out of hand (in a MOD's opinion) a ban could be applied temporarily until a "council" or "jury" can be assembled for an opinion.

It's really not that complicated. Again, JMO.

I'll donate a pair of my handcuffs. Good thought Joe. You should be on the council.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 09:38 PM
NB this isn't the place for comments like one I've quoted.

Well, maybe not in this thread, TX. But if a poster has a beef with the Mods
and wants to air it out, I'm not adverse to his/her starting a thread about it in
this Town Hall forum.

Better here than bashing us on another board. :nod:

-----

BeefStew25
05-27-2008, 09:39 PM
Well, maybe not in this thread, TX. But if a poster has a beef with the Mods
and wants to air it out, I'm not adverse to his/her starting a thread about it in
this Town Hall forum.

Better here than bashing us on another board. :nod:

-----

Beef never has a beef with you guys.

MOtorboat
05-27-2008, 09:39 PM
I'll donate a pair of my handcuffs. Good thought Joe. You should be on the council.

If there was a council, Joe would be an excellent member.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 09:40 PM
Time to move along.

HEY!! Let me savor that! http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Smilies/thannoyed.gif

-----

slim
05-27-2008, 09:40 PM
Look - a cop on the street can arrest someone if they think they're doing something that negatively affects the society/neighborhood. I think the same can be applied here. If someone is getting out of hand (in a MOD's opinion) a ban could be applied temporarily until a "council" or "jury" can be assembled for an opinion.

It's really not that complicated. Again, JMO.

But cops are evil and mods are biased. When are you going to wake up? Also, you should vote for Obama.

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:41 PM
But cops are evil and mods are biased. When are you going to wake up? Also, you should vote for Obama.

Behave slim

topscribe
05-27-2008, 09:41 PM
Beef never has a beef with you guys.

Can we touch tongues?

-----

MOtorboat
05-27-2008, 09:41 PM
But cops are evil and mods are biased. When are you going to wake up? Also, you should vote for Obama.

Hey, as long as the don't pull you over for DWB.

That's Driving While Blind...btw...

slim
05-27-2008, 09:42 PM
Behave slim

Yes ma'am...:elefant:

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:43 PM
Well, maybe not in this thread, TX. But if a poster has a beef with the Mods
and wants to air it out, I'm not adverse to his/her starting a thread about it in
this Town Hall forum.

Better here than bashing us on another board. :nod:

-----

Yes, but that's still for different thread and not this one.

Thnikkaman
05-27-2008, 09:43 PM
I agree with just about everything Topscribe has said.

I think there needs to be an IP system, however the IP system does not trigger a ban/suspension event. When a member reaches a certain level, it gets brought to the attention of the mods and the admin. At that point, they decide what course of action needs to be taken for the offending member.

I also agree that a mod should not have the power to ban/suspend people/I.P. addresses unless its an emergency.

There is no perfect way to do this. I appreciate that this forum exists and feels like a haven from the wild that is the intarwebs.

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:43 PM
Can we touch tongues?

-----

:eek::eek:

BeefStew25
05-27-2008, 09:43 PM
Can we touch tongues?

-----

I am a little shocked. Another mod told me you are 106 years old. But, yeah, we can kiss.

Tned
05-27-2008, 09:44 PM
Look - a cop on the street can arrest someone if they think they're doing something that negatively affects the society/neighborhood. I think the same can be applied here. If someone is getting out of hand (in a MOD's opinion) a ban could be applied temporarily until a "council" or "jury" can be assembled for an opinion.

It's really not that complicated. Again, JMO.

That is the way many forums do it (that don't use the IP system), and what BM did before they implemented the IP system.

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:45 PM
Maybe this is for a different thread but what will get a person
an IP?

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:45 PM
Maybe this is for a different thread but what will get a person
an IP?

Did this make sense?

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 09:46 PM
That is the way many forums do it (that don't use the IP system), and what BM did before they implemented the IP system.

I don't know what the IP system is....

I thought you were talking about someone's IP address...

slim
05-27-2008, 09:46 PM
Maybe this is for a different thread but what will get a person
an IP?

A Tony G avatard.

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:48 PM
Maybe this is for a different thread but what will get a person
an IP?

Bad jokes and hijacking threads are grounds for permanent bans. :D

Thnikkaman
05-27-2008, 09:48 PM
Maybe this is for a different thread but what will get a person
an IP?

usually, when you are logged into the internet, you are issued an IP address in the form of xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx where each of the numbers is in the range of 0-255. :P

As far as what they are talking about, its probably Infraction Points. Things like personal attacks against a member where they find the post offensive.

BeefStew25
05-27-2008, 09:49 PM
I like the idea of a Kangaroo Court. First warning your avatard has to be Eddie Kennison or something. Public shame works.

Tned
05-27-2008, 09:50 PM
Maybe this is for a different thread but what will get a person
an IP?

No, this is definately the thread, because if we go with an IP approach (points lead to suspensions), then we need to talk about it here.

I think we would have to define different types of infractions, assign point values and expirations. For instance, it might be:

Personal Attack 3 points - 7 days
Graphic language outside Lounge - 5 points - 14 days
Posting nudity 15 points - 30 days.

A person is suspended for 7 days when reacing 15 points.

I just arbitrarily made those up, but that is the type scale we would have to construct.

Something like circumventing the filter outside the lounge might only get say 1 point, and the mods would have the option to give 0 point warnings, but something like posting nudity might be equal to the point value that would given an immediate suspension.

It is completely up to us as a community to decide what we really don't want going on on our message board (more points, longer expirations) and what are minor issues (less points, shorter expirations).

If we use a points based system to determine suspensions/bans.

BeefStew25
05-27-2008, 09:51 PM
Tned, can I still hold my title as crisis counselor?

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:52 PM
I don't know what the IP system is....

I thought you were talking about someone's IP address...

Infraction points.

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 09:52 PM
No, this is definately the thread, because if we go with an IP approach (points lead to suspensions), then we need to talk about it here.

I think we would have to define different types of infractions, assign point values and expirations. For instance, it might be:

Personal Attack 3 points - 7 days
Graphic language outside Lounge - 5 points - 14 days
Posting nudity 15 points - 30 days.

A person is suspended for 7 days when reacing 15 points.

I just arbitrarily made those up, but that is the type scale we would have to construct.

Something like circumventing the filter outside the lounge might only get say 1 point, and the mods would have the option to give 0 point warnings, but something like posting nudity might be equal to the point value that would given an immediate suspension.

It is completely up to us as a community to decide what we really don't want going on on our message board (more points, longer expirations) and what are minor issues (less points, shorter expirations).

If we use a points based system to determine suspensions/bans.

I like it. It's like the three strike rule. Keep doing bad things, suffer the consequence.

Day1BroncoFan
05-27-2008, 09:52 PM
My opinion is that in some extreme circumstance a Mod should be able to suspend an account for 24 hours. Things like nudity, deliberately ignoring direct warnings from a Mod, spamming and these sorts of things. It may be possible to get another Mod to agree to a temporary suspension.

In other cases I think it would be better to have a three panel Mod group agree to suspend an account. As long as any three Mods agree it should be no problem.

In the case of a longer suspension or an all out ban a user should be able to appeal a decision to a predetermined board of members or Mods, that would be something to be determined by vote or whatever.

All in all I think the Mods are doing a great job here so far as I can tell. I’ve never had a warning yet. I have no desire for an IP system to be implemented but it would not matter to me if it were as long as it is clearly defined as to what points would be given for what offense.

I fully support immediate suspension by any Mod for 24 hours in emergency cases although as I said it would be better for at least two Mods to agree. This would save trouble for the Mods and enforce the decision of them to the user.

Tned
05-27-2008, 09:52 PM
Tned, can I still hold my title as crisis counselor?

I don't know, can you.... Baaa, daaa, bump, bump...

TXBRONC
05-27-2008, 09:54 PM
I don't know, can you.... Baaa, daaa, bump, bump...

You have received 10 infraction points for a lame joke. :laugh:

Thnikkaman
05-27-2008, 09:55 PM
My opinion is that in some extreme circumstance a Mod should be able to suspend an account for 24 hours. Things like nudity, deliberately ignoring direct warnings from a Mod, spamming and these sorts of things. It may be possible to get another Mod to agree to a temporary suspension.

In other cases I think it would be better to have a three panel Mod group agree to suspend an account. As long as any three Mods agree it should be no problem.

In the case of a longer suspension or an all out ban a user should be able to appeal a decision to a predetermined board of members or Mods, that would be something to be determined by vote or whatever.

All in all I think the Mods are doing a great job here so far as I can tell. I’ve never had a warning yet. I have no desire for an IP system to be implemented but it would not matter to me if it were as long as it is clearly defined as to what points would be given for what offense.

I fully support immediate suspension by any Mod for 24 hours in emergency cases although as I said it would be better for at least two Mods to agree. This would save trouble for the Mods and enforce the decision of them to the user.

I agree with this. The one issue I have had was handled quickly and elegantly considering I would not normally post the type of material that ended up being displayed on the forum.

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:57 PM
A Tony G avatard.

:mad::mad: :lol:

KCL
05-27-2008, 09:59 PM
No, this is definately the thread, because if we go with an IP approach (points lead to suspensions), then we need to talk about it here.

I think we would have to define different types of infractions, assign point values and expirations. For instance, it might be:

Personal Attack 3 points - 7 days
Graphic language outside Lounge - 5 points - 14 days
Posting nudity 15 points - 30 days.

A person is suspended for 7 days when reacing 15 points.

I just arbitrarily made those up, but that is the type scale we would have to construct.

Something like circumventing the filter outside the lounge might only get say 1 point, and the mods would have the option to give 0 point warnings, but something like posting nudity might be equal to the point value that would given an immediate suspension.

It is completely up to us as a community to decide what we really don't want going on on our message board (more points, longer expirations) and what are minor issues (less points, shorter expirations).

If we use a points based system to determine suspensions/bans.

:shocked: Tned....you might wanna stay out of Jodys and my thread...:lol:

Tned
05-27-2008, 10:02 PM
My opinion is that in some extreme circumstance a Mod should be able to suspend an account for 24 hours. Things like nudity, deliberately ignoring direct warnings from a Mod, spamming and these sorts of things. It may be possible to get another Mod to agree to a temporary suspension.
.

I think it will always be necessary, in some form, for a mod to take unilateral action on an out of control poster. We have probably all seen on one message board or another when a poster is told to do something by a mod, and their response is to start creating threads screaming about how bad the mod or board is and start essentiall spamming the board. In those cases, it is in the message boards best interest (and in many cases that poster's best interest) to put an end to it.

So, there will always be a need to address this type of situation, or someone that comes on the board and spams an advertisement. These are covered in our current emergency banning guidelines.

Beyond those situations are deciding what to do when a person disregards a mods instructions, but isn't disrupting the community by spamming the board. For instance:

A poster (we'll call him Tned) slams a poster (we'll call him Jose Reyes) like:



The Mets are the greatest team in baseball
Your an idiot

Then a mod warns Tned and tells him to cut out personal attacks and not to call other posters idiots. Later that night:



David Wright is the greatest third baseman to ever play the game
Your beyond an idiot, you make idiots look like geniuses...


In the above situation, the person (Tned) is disregarding the mod's commands, but isn't necessarily disrupting the message board by spamming about mod injustice and such, but is simply ignoring what the mod said.

Should a single mod be able to suspend him for 24 hours for disregarding an instruction (even if warned that continuing will result in suspension), should it require a vote of mods, etc.

So, as I indicate above, I think there will always be a need for dealing with the out of control poster disrupting the forum, but it's the less black and white situations that we need to define how to handle.

Nature Boy
05-27-2008, 10:02 PM
I think infraction points are a great idea.

Jody
05-27-2008, 10:03 PM
:shocked: Tned....you might wanna stay out of Jodys and my thread...:lol:

True. Infact, I just thought of a new board name for you KC...
The Slaminator. :D

I'm sure glad we've had so many constructive posts in this thread. :D
I see a whole slew of posters are not so unlike myself. It gives me 'hope'. :lol:


Tned...question....

Re the IP system. How do you as an Admin (not a wine drinker, but an Admin) and the Mods 'benefit' from this system? Please elaborate. It may help some of us (cough *me) understand a little more from a different perspective.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:04 PM
I don't know what the IP system is....

I thought you were talking about someone's IP address...

It's a point system implemented over on Mania. Instead of sending corrective
PMs, like we do, you are "awarded" a given number of points for a given
infraction (hence, IP, or infraction points). Accumulate enough of them, and
you're taking a vacation.

Kind of like points on a driver's license, I guess.

I think the system stinks, personally.

-----

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 10:05 PM
I think the system stinks, personally.

-----

How come?

KCL
05-27-2008, 10:05 PM
True. Infact, I just thought of a new board name for you KC...
The Slaminator. :D

I'm sure glad we've had so many constructive posts in this thread. :D
I see a whole slew of posters are not so unlike myself. It gives me 'hope'. :lol:


Tned...question....

Re the IP system. How do you as an Admin (not a wine drinker, but an Admin) and the Mods 'benefit' from this system? Please elaborate. It may help some of us (cough *me) understand a little more from a different perspective.

Stop with the highjacking....Tned in Jodys case...the IP system is needed.:D

Slaminator....WTH?

CoachChaz
05-27-2008, 10:07 PM
I guess I didn't realize there have been issues lately. I mean...even I haven't had a warning in quite some time.

IMO, I think a majority vote by Mods should be required on ALL issues. Bannings and infractions. No offense toward anyone, but what one mod finds offensive...another may not. I know on the Freak we saw this all the time. One of us would get an infraction for something that was no different than what was said by someone else earlier in the thread.

I have no problem with either system as long as they are policed properly.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:08 PM
I guess I didn't realize there have been issues lately. I mean...even I haven't had a warning in quite some time.

IMO, I think a majority vote by Mods should be required on ALL issues. Bannings and infractions. No offense toward anyone, but what one mod finds offensive...another may not. I know on the Freak we saw this all the time. One of us would get an infraction for something that was no different than what was said by someone else earlier in the thread.

I have no problem with either system as long as they are policed properly.

Hang on, Coach. In fact, I was just scanning the boards, trying to find something to warn you on . . .

-----

Spider
05-27-2008, 10:08 PM
I think it will always be necessary, in some form, for a mod to take unilateral action on an out of control poster. We have probably all seen on one message board or another when a poster is told to do something by a mod, and their response is to start creating threads screaming about how bad the mod or board is and start essentiall spamming the board. In those cases, it is in the message boards best interest (and in many cases that poster's best interest) to put an end to it.

So, there will always be a need to address this type of situation, or someone that comes on the board and spams an advertisement. These are covered in our current emergency banning guidelines.

Beyond those situations are deciding what to do when a person disregards a mods instructions, but isn't disrupting the community by spamming the board. For instance:

A poster (we'll call him Tned) slams a poster (we'll call him Jose Reyes) like:



Then a mod warns Tned and tells him to cut out personal attacks and not to call other posters idiots. Later that night:




In the above situation, the person (Tned) is disregarding the mod's commands, but isn't necessarily disrupting the message board by spamming about mod injustice and such, but is simply ignoring what the mod said.

Should a single mod be able to suspend him for 24 hours for disregarding an instruction (even if warned that continuing will result in suspension), should it require a vote of mods, etc.

So, as I indicate above, I think there will always be a need for dealing with the out of control poster disrupting the forum, but it's the less black and white situations that we need to define how to handle.

well in a case like Tned being a jerk :D banning from a forum ( like the baseball forum ) could be a consideration ..... then if the action continues on , the nproceed with total baning

pnbronco
05-27-2008, 10:10 PM
- X number of mods (three for instance) must agree on a suspension/banning (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending)

This would be my first choice. Then the mods have the chance to talk things out and make a decision based on different points of view. I also like that they have the ability to issue multiple warnings.

I don't have a problem with extreme circumstance 24 hr banning.

My second choice would by the IP.

Day1BroncoFan
05-27-2008, 10:10 PM
I think it will always be necessary, in some form, for a mod to take unilateral action on an out of control poster. We have probably all seen on one message board or another when a poster is told to do something by a mod, and their response is to start creating threads screaming about how bad the mod or board is and start essentiall spamming the board. In those cases, it is in the message boards best interest (and in many cases that poster's best interest) to put an end to it.

So, there will always be a need to address this type of situation, or someone that comes on the board and spams an advertisement. These are covered in our current emergency banning guidelines.

Beyond those situations are deciding what to do when a person disregards a mods instructions, but isn't disrupting the community by spamming the board. For instance:

A poster (we'll call him Tned) slams a poster (we'll call him Jose Reyes) like:



Then a mod warns Tned and tells him to cut out personal attacks and not to call other posters idiots. Later that night:




In the above situation, the person (Tned) is disregarding the mod's commands, but isn't necessarily disrupting the message board by spamming about mod injustice and such, but is simply ignoring what the mod said.

Should a single mod be able to suspend him for 24 hours for disregarding an instruction (even if warned that continuing will result in suspension), should it require a vote of mods, etc.

So, as I indicate above, I think there will always be a need for dealing with the out of control poster disrupting the forum, but it's the less black and white situations that we need to define how to handle.

I say in that situation the poster should be banned immediately. This in my opinion would only require one Mod to do so. It would always be better to have two Mods agree, but not required.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:11 PM
How come?

For the very reason you aren't necessarily any closer to banning here than
you were before. Over there, you would be. http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Smilies/thwink.gif

-----

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 10:12 PM
For the very reason you aren't necessarily any closer to banning here than
you were before. Over there, you would be. http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Smilies/thwink.gif

-----

Post reorted.

;)

CoachChaz
05-27-2008, 10:13 PM
Hang on, Coach. In fact, I was just scanning the boards, trying to find something to warn you on . . .

-----

Love ya, top!!!

Tned
05-27-2008, 10:13 PM
It's a point system implemented over on Mania. Instead of sending corrective
PMs, like we do, you are "awarded" a given number of points for a given
infraction (hence, IP, or infraction points). Accumulate enough of them, and
you're taking a vacation.

Kind of like points on a driver's license, I guess.

I think the system stinks, personally.

-----

And I think it is what they did on the Freak (and thousands of other sites), but I believe posted thresholds, such as when you were going to be suspended. Maybe they can chime in.

I personally think a system where an individual can use a one strike and your out (the way it was the six to twelve months prior to the IP system on mania) stinks even more. On BM, they got to the point where one personal attack (often an arbitrary concept) on another member could lead to a 3 or 7 day suspension.

However, it doesn't matter what I think or you think, because as a mod and admin, we need to take a back seat to what the other 300-400 active members think. If community as a whole thinks the IP concept stinks, then great. If the community as a whole thinks it should be a council or x number of mods, great. That's what this conversation is all about.

Day1BroncoFan
05-27-2008, 10:16 PM
I guess I didn't realize there have been issues lately. I mean...even I haven't had a warning in quite some time.

IMO, I think a majority vote by Mods should be required on ALL issues. Bannings and infractions. No offense toward anyone, but what one mod finds offensive...another may not. I know on the Freak we saw this all the time. One of us would get an infraction for something that was no different than what was said by someone else earlier in the thread.

I have no problem with either system as long as they are policed properly.

I think Coach has a point and would like to add to my "opinion" that it might be wise to have an appeal system in place for IP's just so they cannot be given out lightly. Not that they would be but still it would be a little insurance people could live with better.

Mike
05-27-2008, 10:16 PM
Tned...question....

Re the IP system. How do you as an Admin (not a wine drinker, but an Admin) and the Mods 'benefit' from this system? Please elaborate. It may help some of us (cough *me) understand a little more from a different perspective.

Instead of having to rely on memory (poor Tops ;)) or by a manual input system, the IP system would keep track of offenses for us.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:16 PM
And I think it is what they did on the Freak (and thousands of other sites), but I believe posted thresholds, such as when you were going to be suspended. Maybe they can chime in.

I personally think a system where an individual can use a one strike and your out (the way it was the six to twelve months prior to the IP system on mania) stinks even more. On BM, they got to the point where one personal attack (often an arbitrary concept) on another member could lead to a 3 or 7 day suspension.

However, it doesn't matter what I think or you think, because as a mod and admin, we need to take a back seat to what the other 300-400 active members think. If community as a whole thinks the IP concept stinks, then great. If the community as a whole thinks it should be a council or x number of mods, great. That's what this conversation is all about.

I agree. I was just explaining what the IP system is for those who don't know . . .

-----

cbs1177
05-27-2008, 10:16 PM
I myself make a 24 hour delay on any decision that is major. Takes all emotions out of the way and the analytical side takes over. Maybe some one proposes a ban to the other mods and give it a couple of days to germinate and if it still feels right then ban. Of course if the poster is still be a jack a double then immediately ban them. put the poster on notice and usually the character will come out either toned down or up the notch. And send the banning to committee and let cooler head prevail.

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 10:16 PM
And I think it is what they did on the Freak (and thousands of other sites), but I believe posted thresholds, such as when you were going to be suspended. Maybe they can chime in.

I personally think a system where an individual can use a one strike and your out (the way it was the six to twelve months prior to the IP system on mania) stinks even more. On BM, they got to the point where one personal attack (often an arbitrary concept) on another member could lead to a 3 or 7 day suspension.

However, it doesn't matter what I think or you think, because as a mod and admin, we need to take a back seat to what the other 300-400 active members think. If community as a whole thinks the IP concept stinks, then great. If the community as a whole thinks it should be a council or x number of mods, great. That's what this conversation is all about.

Now that I understand, I prefer the IP system. Get too many tickets, you spend some time thinking about what you've done.

Either way, I don't really care honestly. I got infractions at the freak, and behaved until they expired.

CoachChaz
05-27-2008, 10:16 PM
On the Freak, you'd just accumulate warnings and infractios and they'd expire after a month. Bannings were completely at the discretion of the mods. One in particular found a way to ban some one almost daily and that's why I think a majority vote amongst mods would be beneficial. I'm very outspoken and get my share of warnings, but I'll be the first to say the group of mods here on the forums is a pretty outstanding one. If they voted to infract me or ban me, I'd say it would be a fair assumption that I earned it.

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 10:19 PM
On the Freak, you'd just accumulate warnings and infractios and they'd expire after a month. Bannings were completely at the discretion of the mods. One in particular found a way to ban some one almost daily and that's why I think a majority vote amongst mods would be beneficial. I'm very outspoken and get my share of warnings, but I'll be the first to say the group of mods here on the forums is a pretty outstanding one. If they voted to infract me or ban me, I'd say it would be a fair assumption that I earned it.

What Coach said.

Tned
05-27-2008, 10:22 PM
Now that I understand, I prefer the IP system. Get too many tickets, you spend some time thinking about what you've done.

Either way, I don't really care honestly. I got infractions at the freak, and behaved until they expired.

The way the infraction system was implemented on mania was a complete debacle, so many of us that came from mania in the beginning left with very bad feelings regarding it.

The question, and I don't know the answer, is whether or not if it is implemented correctly and with openess (how many points lead to a suspension, how many points for each infraction, etc.) if we can overcome the animosity from on BM. As I have said, I know many, many forums use it and it is considered a major and important feature vBulletin.

Rick
05-27-2008, 10:23 PM
All in all I don't want to say anything bad about any of the Mods here. I have had my share of disagreements with them but that is not the reason so much of why I don't think one should have sole power.

Where I am coming from here is a poster will not always agree with what a Mod thinks and a Mod will not always agree with what a poster thinks. It is simply the nature of things...it is humanity. People are people, all of us have not just holes in the rear, we all also have opinions. Seldom will they be the same.

I don't personally believe that one person should ever be able to solely look at another's and be the judge and jury on it, what says the Mod's opinion is right? Just because it is their representation of the rules? Sometimes my thoughts of the rules differ from the Mods here, sometimes I see things more strictly and sometimes less. Is my way always right? Is my way always wrong? Should one Mod decide on that?

The only exception to this would be you Tned as you are the admin and it's your pocket thats holding the cash.

But there should be no other exceptions to this rule, one person should not be able to form their own opinion on another's and have it be the final word.

Tned
05-27-2008, 10:23 PM
On the Freak, you'd just accumulate warnings and infractios and they'd expire after a month. Bannings were completely at the discretion of the mods. One in particular found a way to ban some one almost daily and that's why I think a majority vote amongst mods would be beneficial. I'm very outspoken and get my share of warnings, but I'll be the first to say the group of mods here on the forums is a pretty outstanding one. If they voted to infract me or ban me, I'd say it would be a fair assumption that I earned it.

I think we have an outstanding set of mods, but three months from now, or six months from now that makeup could easily be different. I have been on other message boards where some mods were more likely to work with a poster and get him/her to calm down, where other mods would pull the trigger on a suspension/ban for almost no reason.

cbs1177
05-27-2008, 10:24 PM
what actually sets this site different from other forums is there is a drunken forum and a r rated place to rant and rave so on this board if a poster went psycho on the main threads and not on the lounge area then that should carry heavy weight. also I think the 24 hour should be established so cooler head prevail except in personal attacks on mods and family.

CoachChaz
05-27-2008, 10:26 PM
Well, just to throw an idea out there as a starting point, why don't you say that an infraction stays on the books for 30 days. After that it expires. However, if you have 3 active infractions at once, it results in a 3 day suspension from the site. A additional infraction after the banning will cost you a 10 day vacation and anything after that is just childish and we don't need people like that here and you just ban them forever.

However, there will be instances where some moron comes along and seriously threatens someone or intentionally does nothing but create problems. In those instances, the mods should be able to see it's intentional and they could just vote to immediately start with a ban without an infraction.

Just some thoughts

CoachChaz
05-27-2008, 10:27 PM
I think we have an outstanding set of mods, but three months from now, or six months from now that makeup could easily be different. I have been on other message boards where some mods were more likely to work with a poster and get him/her to calm down, where other mods would pull the trigger on a suspension/ban for almost no reason.

Which is why I would like to see the mods have a mojority vote on the matter and allow the member in question to defend themself.

frauschieze
05-27-2008, 10:27 PM
Question: If an IP system is implemented with no points attached (so the mods can keep track of violations), would the individual poster still be able to see the IP and what they received it for?

CoachChaz
05-27-2008, 10:29 PM
Is there even a list of who the mods are posted anywhere?

cbs1177
05-27-2008, 10:29 PM
All in all I don't want to say anything bad about any of the Mods here. I have had my share of disagreements with them but that is not the reason so much of why I don't think one should have sole power.

Where I am coming from here is a poster will not always agree with what a Mod thinks and a Mod will not always agree with what a poster thinks. It is simply the nature of things...it is humanity. People are people, all of us have not just holes in the rear, we all also have opinions. Seldom will they be the same.

I don't personally believe that one person should ever be able to solely look at another's and be the judge and jury on it, what says the Mod's opinion is right? Just because it is their representation of the rules? Sometimes my thoughts of the rules differ from the Mods here, sometimes I see things more strictly and sometimes less. Is my way always right? Is my way always wrong? Should one Mod decide on that?

The only exception to this would be you Tned as you are the admin and it's your pocket thats holding the cash.

But there should be no other exceptions to this rule, one person should not be able to form their own opinion on another's and have it be the final word.

thus the 24 hour committee rule gives the others mods time to look at post and gives time for the poster to come off the high horse or show their true colors. if the poster doesn't back down then ban or one drunken post spam then all is forgiven of course seniority on this part also. People have many variable going on so maybe personal life is spilling over on message board. instant ban is bad but at least 24 hours is long enough to shift thru stuff.

Tned
05-27-2008, 10:31 PM
Here is the emergency banning guidelines currently in place. What we are discussing are the situations that fall outside of this guideline.

As you can see from this, the mods are somewhat hamstrung in how to deal with a problem poster if I am not around to approve a suspension (not to mention I would rather not be in the role of approving suspensions/bans on a full time basis) or if the poster is disregarding the mod's instructions, but not rising to the level of disrupting the forum, as in the example I gave in the Tned/Jose Reyes argument earlier in this thread.



Section D – Emergency Banning Guidelines

It is impossible to fully define what an emergency ban is, so to some degree that decision will have to be left in the hands the mods. However, since banning members can often lead to a backlash against the mods and the message board, emergency bans should ONLY be issued if there is no other choice in how to proceed. Some general examples of situations that could require an emergency ban are:


A spammer or someone who has joined the message board with no purpose other than to post advertisements, pornography or any other "spam" that is not adding a contribution to the board.


A member who has become 'out of control' (generally in reaction to a moderator's action) and is spamming the board with complaints or flames to the degree that the moderation staff can't keep up with it and that spamming/complaining is becoming 'destructive' to the message board.


Some examples of situations where an emergency ban should not be used are:


A poster that questions or complains about a moderator's action, or creates a thread in Town Hall questioning a moderator's decision or action.


A poster that has a history of being a 'problem poster' who once again breaks one or more rules, such as launching a person attack against someone, getting into a flame war with one or more posters, in one thread verses multiple threads which would constitute spamming.

A poster that breaks one or more rules so badly, that even the single event would cause the advisory board to bypass some of the official warning steps that might exist in a future member ban/suspension policy.


In essence, if there is any doubt as to whether an emergency ban should be used, then in all likelihood, an emergency ban should not be issued. Emergency bans should only be issued for 'time sensitive' situations where leaving a poster unchecked would be considered destructive to the message board. The emergency ban should never be used as a form of punishment or be justified by a poster's history on BroncosFroums or other message boards.



IMO, we need to get me out of the picture, and give the mods (through a point system, votes or unilateral decisions) more leeway to deal with problem posters.

CoachChaz
05-27-2008, 10:32 PM
Plus I think the mods we have now have had enough time to get an idea of who we are. Jrwiz, top, Carol and turf have warned me countless times and sometimes I went head to head with them and other times I agreed. But I have confidence that they know I'm the resident pervert and that I'll slip up from time to time and usually a quick PM sets me straight.

Same can be said for others.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:34 PM
Is there even a list of who the mods are posted anywhere?

When you go back to the main page that lists all the forums and look down at
the bottom to the right, you should see the list.

-----

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:35 PM
When you go back to the main page that lists all the forums and look down at
the bottom to the right, you should see the list.

-----

Sorry, that is after you go into a forum (before you enter a thread), then you can see it.

-----

Denver Native (Carol)
05-27-2008, 10:36 PM
Is there even a list of who the mods are posted anywhere?

Moderators

Den21vsBal19
Denver Native (Carol)
Jrwiz
Mike
topscribe
turftoad

Rick
05-27-2008, 10:36 PM
I must admit it has been awhile since I have last Moded or admined a vb board. I just haven't had the time to do anything with my vb sites.

Is there an option to allow Mods to change the a posters user group?

So say have a specific forum set aside that only people in that user group and the mods and admin can see and if a user gets out of hand a mod can move him/her to that user group and when he logs in all he/she can see is that forum. He/she can then give his case to the Mods, perhaps it can all be worked out then the poster can be moved back to the members group.

Just a thought, I don't remember if this was possible for a normal Mod.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:37 PM
Moderators

Den21vsBal19
Denver Native (Carol)
Jrwiz
Mike
topscribe
turftoad

I don't like this alphabetical order business.

I'm not first . . . :D

-----

frauschieze
05-27-2008, 10:38 PM
I don't like this alphabetical order business.

I'm not first . . . :D

-----

Shall we put it in order of age? ;)

Denver Native (Carol)
05-27-2008, 10:39 PM
I don't like this alphabetical order business.

I'm not first . . . :D

-----

:eviltongue::eviltongue:

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:39 PM
Shall we put it in order of age? ;)

Starting with the oldest. :nod:

-----

slim
05-27-2008, 10:39 PM
Moderators

Den21vsBal19
Denver Native (Carol)
Jrwiz
Mike
slim
topscribe
turftoad

Edited for accuracy...watch yourself, cowboy.

cbs1177
05-27-2008, 10:40 PM
Here is the emergency banning guidelines currently in place. What we are discussing are the situations that fall outside of this guideline.

As you can see from this, the mods are somewhat hamstrung in how to deal with a problem poster if I am not around to approve a suspension (not to mention I would rather not be in the role of approving suspensions/bans on a full time basis) or if the poster is disregarding the mod's instructions, but not rising to the level of disrupting the forum, as in the example I gave in the Tned/Jose Reyes argument earlier in this thread.



IMO, we need to get me out of the picture, and give the mods (through a point system, votes or unilateral decisions) more leeway to deal with problem posters.

clearly most poster can see the porn people I get that all day on myspace. clearly a no brainer or thus selling something gets a ban.

on the crazy poster most of us has had a day that was cluster F*** and the board is a chance to vent of course this forum is different gives a r rated place to vent. seniority and variables should come into play. I still think the 24 hour ban unless stated above is best. give the poster a warning and if they go crazy then ban them but if they settle down and log off then deal with them. I work in food service most members are nice but some days they come in crazy and I talk them down to see what is really happening.

for instances one member came in and said I want that salad now.

I got to think maybe the golf game is not going well and second I gotta calm him down enough to get to the root of what he wants.

mods are camp counselors always the adult and thinking ahead.

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:40 PM
Edited for accuracy...watch yourself, cowboy.

Ass Mods don't count . . .

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frauschieze
05-27-2008, 10:42 PM
Ass Mods don't count . . .

-----

Oh man....if slim was an Ass Mod.....they'd be letting EVERYBODY in. :D

Tned
05-27-2008, 10:42 PM
I must admit it has been awhile since I have last Moded or admined a vb board. I just haven't had the time to do anything with my vb sites.

Is there an option to allow Mods to change the a posters user group?

So say have a specific forum set aside that only people in that user group and the mods and admin can see and if a user gets out of hand a mod can move him/her to that user group and when he logs in all he/she can see is that forum. He/she can then give his case to the Mods, perhaps it can all be worked out then the poster can be moved back to the members group.

Just a thought, I don't remember if this was possible for a normal Mod.

Yes. As part of the "User Banning" module, the mod can move a person into any usergroup that is marked as bannable (for lack of a better word). So, a person could be moved into a "limited" user group using that functionality.

Tned
05-27-2008, 10:44 PM
Ok, I am off to bed. Thanks for all the great feedback and input so far. Keep it coming. This is not a discussion we will conclude in a day or two, but need to spend time hashing things out. We don't have a crisis we are dealing with, but instead need to look to how "WE" want the board as we continue to grow and as time passes.

Northman
05-27-2008, 10:46 PM
I think all bannings should be left up to a third party. Me. :)

slim
05-27-2008, 10:47 PM
Ass Mods don't count . . .

-----

Well, it wouldn't matter...I'm not an assmod, either :tsk:

Spider
05-27-2008, 10:47 PM
Did I forget to add that the rules dont apply to me ? :D

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:48 PM
I think all bannings should be left up to a third party. Me. :)

Fine. When it all starts, you'll be the first to be banned . . . :nod:

-----

Northman
05-27-2008, 10:48 PM
Fine. When it all starts, you'll be the first to be banned . . . :nod:

-----

:lol::cool:

BroncoJoe
05-27-2008, 10:48 PM
I think all bannings should be left up to a third party. Me. :)

I offered my services as well.

And, was threatened with a ban....

:heh:

topscribe
05-27-2008, 10:49 PM
Well, it wouldn't matter...I'm not an assmod, either :tsk:

Looks like they got it right . . . http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Smilies/thwink.gif

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slim
05-27-2008, 10:49 PM
Looks like they got it right . . . http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Smilies/thwink.gif

-----

That would be the only thing they have right :D

KCL
05-27-2008, 11:28 PM
Well, it wouldn't matter...I'm not an assmod, either :tsk:

Nope...your just an ass....:lol:

dogfish
05-27-2008, 11:44 PM
T, i think you need to ban somebody as a test run-- just to try it out. . . i nominate HD. . .






However, it doesn't matter what I think or you think, because as a mod and admin, we need to take a back seat to what the other 300-400 active members think.

on the contrary, you folks are still members just like the rest of us-- your opinions should count just as much. . .



not sure how much i have to add that hasn't already been covered, but here are a few things just because i know you want as much feedback as possible. . . first off-- while i'm sure everyone appreciates your reticence to ban anybody unless absolutely necessary, i would remind you that there are instances where the community WANTS you to kick some ass and take some names. . . of course you want to protect the "rights" of individuals, and voicing an unpopular opinion shouldn't be grounds for banning, but if someone is consistently agitating/harrasing other members and instigating conflict with their aggressive posting style, as far as i'm concerned you should feel free to give 'em a vacation. . . i guarantee that almost all the maners will tell you that the board would have been a better place if they'd run bob off, and i challenge anyone to tell me why kmartin shouldn't have gotten the axe from mania years ago? and there were a few "broncos trolls" who were just as bad. . .

i'm against the IP system, as i think it is every bit as arbitrary as any other system-- i guess i just think that formal IPs feel more "heavy handed" than a PM from a mod for infrequent offenders. . . JMO, and it's not really a huge deal to me either way, but i've admittedly got some intrinsic resistance to it after the way things went down at mania. . .

i'll echo the prevailing sentiment that individual mods should not be able to ban beyond emergency, short-term suspensions. . .

overall, my opinion is that the mods have done a very solid job here, and anyone who's claiming bias needs to take a more honest look at their own posting style-- you're almost certainly bringing it on yourself through your own actions. . . . quit crying and put the victim card back in your pocket-- no one's impressed by self-proclaimed martyrs. . . :coffee:

ApaOps5
05-27-2008, 11:50 PM
Coming from the Omane where it takes A LOT to get banned I would say that I really like the infraction system. It gives the mods the opportunity to punish based on a case by case basis. Plus if I understand the system right you can set it up so it takes away certain privledges as you reach certain numbers.

The jury option would be good. You can set up a forum only accessible by the jury. Set up a poll and discuss the infraction.

Broncos Mtnman
05-27-2008, 11:51 PM
Individual mods have freedom to suspend/ban at their discretion (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending)

Emergencies only. Say, a mod is the only one online and can't discuss it with the other two mods.


X number of mods (three for instance) must agree on a suspension/banning (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending)

Yes, but requiring a certain number could tie their hands. Some offenses are worse than others. Some are bad enough to consider a banning with one offense, while others don't.


A group of forum members (jury if you will) that have been pre-selected in some manner, will be presented with all non-emergency banning situations and 'based on the forum rules' determine whether and suspension/banning is in order and for how long (possibly with guidelines for x number of warnings before suspending). For this to work, the group would have to be preselected and large enough to ensure that when they were presented with a situation, enough of them would respond with a vote of yes/no on the suspension within x hours (12 or 24), so that a reasonably quick resolution could be arrived at.

Not a bad idea.


An infraction system like Broncos Country uses and Broncosfreak used to use, in which thresholds (when suspensions will occur) are clearly publicized, as well as the values for each and all infractions. This is built in to vBulletin, and thousands of message boards use. When implemented correctly, it is probably the closest manner of taking emotion out of the banning process and at the same time creating both a system of warning people when they are getting close, but also quickly taking action.


The problem with the IP system over at the other place was the lack of communication and the arbitrary application. If communicated properly, I wouldn't have a problem with it.

Northman
05-27-2008, 11:53 PM
Coming from the Omane where it takes A LOT to get banned I would say that I really like the infraction system. It gives the mods the opportunity to punish based on a case by case basis. Plus if I understand the system right you can set it up so it takes away certain privledges as you reach certain numbers.

The jury option would be good. You can set up a forum only accessible by the jury. Set up a poll and discuss the infraction.


Rep or High Five or whatever the fun system is. Yea, thats it. :D:beer:

topscribe
05-27-2008, 11:53 PM
Nope...your just an ass....:lol:

You missed your opportunity. Here's the way it should go:

He says, "I'm not an ass mod."

You reply, "No, you're just an ass, Maude."



*sits down and looks at the floor*

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Grover
05-28-2008, 12:09 AM
I think that mods should have the authority to suspend a member - perhaps for three to five days. Kind of a cooling off period.

I think a suspension should be decided by a group of three moderators, or perhaps two moderators and a respected member appointed to the position.

Another board I frequent (Audio Asylum) has a system where moderators can delete individual posts that are against the rules, or they can shut down a whole thread from posts when it gets too contentious. Some members there cry of censorship, but the effect is a fairly orderly discourse when offensive posts are deleted. By "offensive" I mean posts that offend the rules.

frenchfan
05-28-2008, 01:11 AM
Tned,

I've no problem with suspension or other rules.
People just don't realize how hard it is to admin such kind of forums.
But it's like a society... Sometimes you don't fully agree with a rule or a law, but overall you have to adapt if the majority is ok.

I know people can heat (I'm not the last one to do that too :D)... But when you cross the border, I think you have to assume. Period.

I think that if people could just debate and argue rather than debate and bash, there would be no problem.

My rules :
- If you can't debate in a "civil" way, then don't debate.
- Don't try to convince people who don't think like you. Better try to explain your point.... The other poster won't be convinced, but may be he/she could just understand...
- Try to stay cool... (I try to apply this on me, I know sometimes that doesn't work though :D)... It's just a forum of discussion... People have the right to express an opinion, to explain it and to disagree with others... If you can't handle that, just stay away...
- Stop answering questions on issues by just saying "well this one or this other one did worse and so on"... If you can't defend your point, just shut up... Humm... OK, I think I have to apply this last advice on me... So I'm done... :laugh:
- Don't give "first blood".
- Love the girls :D
- Remember that nobody really has the Truth ;)

(of course, that's what you -other posters- have to do... My rules don't apply on me... LOL).

More seriously... Take it easy...

I have some good talking with many people here even if sometimes I really don't agree with them. I don't hate anybody even though sometimes I was really pissed off by some posts. BTW, I guess I pissed off some people too with some posts too sometimes... LOL
That's a thing that we french are doing well... Because here, we think that we can be friend even though we sometimes disagree and discuss.

So in conclusion (too much 'blabla' for this conclusion, I admit), I'll respect the choice of the majority. I've quit Mania for other reasons than IP...
I just hope the mods would make the difference between a good discuss and a bash.. That's all.

Take care.

atwater27
05-28-2008, 01:30 AM
You mods do a good job.
I do think you should ban my racist ass.

topscribe
05-28-2008, 01:32 AM
You mods do a good job.
I do think you should ban my racist ass.

If I could do that without banning the rest of you, I would. :D

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Escobar
05-28-2008, 01:33 AM
two week suspension is enough ;)

Escobar
05-28-2008, 01:38 AM
If I could do that without banning the rest of you, I would. :D

-----

That would be a start.

TXBRONC
05-28-2008, 05:48 AM
Did I forget to add that the rules dont apply to me ? :D

Well all I have to say to that is: :ban:

HolyDiver
05-28-2008, 06:49 AM
I think AMA ( assistant moderating association) should have the final say in who does and who does not get banned.

Joel
05-28-2008, 07:39 AM
A three-person advisory board, with majority vote as the decision.

Well...a three-person Banning/Suspension Committee, since the advisory board thing has a black cloud over it.
Yeah, that last is what would hold me back from an IP system; it doesn't matter how well and fairly it works if everyone hates it. Review by more than one person prevents it being (or being seen as) a Mods grudge against one or more members; "I didn't do anything wrong, really, but so-and-so ALWAYS hated me, so s/he banned me. " I'm not accusing anyone of anything, by any means, but you KNOW it would happen, if only because some always prefer to blame others for their own transgressions and the penalties incurred. Review by a small group of Mods allows it to be handled in a timely yet fair manner without something like that scene with the stolen collection plate money in The Simpsons:

"Everybody turn around and look at THIS!"

I'm happy so say it's never been an issue that directly affected me, anywhere. I get more upset when people cross the line with others than when they do it with me; when I'm the recipient my reaction is usually along the lines of "wow, that was rude and uncalled for; oh, well... " and while I ain't perfect, I do at least TRY to be civil even when I can't be cordial. MOST people will treat you as you treat them--good or bad.

Anyway, thanks for requesting our input, ya'll (for future reference, my vote on a garish white background with gratuitous video ads and pics is "please kill me now.... " :whistle: ) Here's hoping ya'll find a solution that satisfies everyone (yes, I said that with a straight face, but it wasn't easy.... )

Retired_Member_001
05-28-2008, 10:30 AM
You will never be able to put into motion enough rules and standards to
negate some differences among Mods. That is anywhere, not just here.

For instance, say you are caught speeding, going seven MPH over. One cop
might issue you a ticket, so you have to appear in court, pay a fine, incur
points on your license, and maybe get an increase in your insurance
premiums.

Another cop, however, may just issue a warning ticket (if they still exist),
while a third might just tell you to slow it down, then go on his way.

You're going to get that because you are dealing with different individuals.

That is why we have a process of appeal. When you feel you have been
dealt with unfairly or you think a Mod might have been a bit heavy-handed,
you send it on to Admin. And, believe me, the appealing poster gets the
first consideration with Admin (Tned) because he believes so deeply in the
community concept for this board.

We do try to limit that, however. When a circumstance arises where we're
not entirely sure, we submit it to the other Mods for discussion, and then it
is taken care of according to consensus among the Mods. This happens
often, in fact.

Regarding the banning issue, I will go on record as being against having the
individual power to ban.

Now, I personally make a distinction here in terminology. To me, a ban is
an action that results in a more long-term absence from the board . . . say,
30 days or more. To me, something short in duration or temporary is a
suspension.

Admin has retained the power over bans and suspensions, and any case is
submitted first to the Mods and then to Admin for the final decision. Admin,
then, bans or suspends the poster.

The exception is when Admin cannot be reached and the Mod in question
deems it urgent to stop the poster's access to the board, either from
uncontrollable spamming/trolling/flaming or unyielding defiance of a Mod's
directives, and Admin is not accessible because he is either in bed or away,
which he does go out of the country on business occasionally. The Mod is
then authorized to implement an emergency suspension of 24 to 72 hours,
usually, depending on when
Admin is expected back onto the board. This is
the only circumstance under which a Mod can suspend or ban.

So I will repeat that I am absolutely against giving individual Mods the
authority to ban or suspend, except under the above circumstances. If
each Mod ends up with that authority, then we may have an inconsistent
situation where a poster might get banned by one Mod but not by another.
This would not be right.

Hope I made sense in all this rambling.

-----


Thanks for clearing that up.

All I ask, is that when suspensions and especially bans are handed out, there are a set rules that all Mods go by so there isn't any inconsistency.

Tned
05-28-2008, 01:35 PM
Thanks for clearing that up.

All I ask, is that when suspensions and especially bans are handed out, there are a set rules that all Mods go by so there isn't any inconsistency.

That's what this discussion is for. However, keep in mind that what you just described is very hard, if not impossible. What I mean, is that rules lead to interpretation, hence inconsistancies between mods, just as there are inconsistancies between posters in how they read/interpret rules.

This is why we need to define procedures, which might be x number of mods needed to issue a suspension ban, or x number of points if we use a points system, or x number of warnings, or x number of members that form a 'jury pool' for lack of a better word.

Or, we go the route of having some rules and an individual mod can suspend/ban, with an appeal process to have the suspension/ban lifted after an appeal and review.

Lots of different options, but quite honestly none of them will likely be perfect. In a perfect world, or message board I should say, there would be no need to even talk about suspension processes.

CoachChaz
05-28-2008, 01:49 PM
That's why i say you leave it to a majority vote. if they split 3-3, it's a hung jury.

girler
05-28-2008, 02:26 PM
I have no problem with how things are handled now. Of course I'm pretty easy. Just ask Mr.B. :D

BroncoBJ
05-28-2008, 08:38 PM
Yea I agree with Escobar. The Mods on this site are pretty funny. If I did something I'd get in trouble. And then pretty much anyone else could say/do the same thing and nothing would happen to them.
Oh well.
It happens. :lol:

But I don't really care how things are handled.
All though being fair would be a nice start. :salute:

I also don't mind the IP system as well.
I kind of like it over at Mania. :elefant:

KCL
05-28-2008, 08:40 PM
Yea I agree with Escobar. The Mods on this site are pretty funny. If I did something I'd get in trouble. And then pretty much anyone else could say/do the same thing and nothing would happen to them.
Oh well.
It happens. :lol:

But I don't really care how things are handled.
All though being fair would be a nice start. :salute:

I also don't mind the IP system as well.
I kind of like it over at Mania. :elefant:

Ah....your just ticked cause your little "Neg Squad" didn't work out...:lol:
so your taking it out on Tned and his mods...:tsk:

BroncoBJ
05-28-2008, 08:42 PM
Ah....your just ticked cause your little "Neg Squad" didn't work out...:lol:
so your taking it out on Tned and his mods...:tsk:

:lol: Naw, I'm not ticked.
Just trying to say being fair would be nice.
They don't have to be fair.
They can continue to let some get away with murder and others not.


And our Neg Squad did work out. And once the CP System is back we will be back to our negging self. :salute:

KCL
05-28-2008, 08:50 PM
:lol: Naw, I'm not ticked.
Just trying to say being fair would be nice.
They don't have to be fair.
They can continue to let some get away with murder and others not.


And our Neg Squad did work out. And once the CP System is back we will be back to our negging self. :salute:

Well alot of times...its not what you say but how you say it.

BroncoBJ
05-28-2008, 08:53 PM
Well alot of times...its not what you say but how you say it.

:lol: How Do I say things?
I'm such a bad boy sometimes :elefant:

KCL
05-28-2008, 09:01 PM
:lol: How Do I say things?I'm such a bad boy sometimes :elefant:

Like an idiot? :confused:

:lol:

dogfish
05-28-2008, 09:04 PM
Yea I agree with Escobar. The Mods on this site are pretty funny. If I did something I'd get in trouble. And then pretty much anyone else could say/do the same thing and nothing would happen to them.



what a bunch of bullshit! :elefant::elefant::elefant:

Dreadnought
05-29-2008, 11:02 AM
T, i think you need to ban somebody as a test run-- just to try it out. . . i nominate HD. . .

on the contrary, you folks are still members just like the rest of us-- your opinions should count just as much. . .

not sure how much i have to add that hasn't already been covered, but here are a few things just because i know you want as much feedback as possible. . . first off-- while i'm sure everyone appreciates your reticence to ban anybody unless absolutely necessary, i would remind you that there are instances where the community WANTS you to kick some ass and take some names. . . of course you want to protect the "rights" of individuals, and voicing an unpopular opinion shouldn't be grounds for banning, but if someone is consistently agitating/harrasing other members and instigating conflict with their aggressive posting style, as far as i'm concerned you should feel free to give 'em a vacation. . . i guarantee that almost all the maners will tell you that the board would have been a better place if they'd run bob off, and i challenge anyone to tell me why kmartin shouldn't have gotten the axe from mania years ago? and there were a few "broncos trolls" who were just as bad. . .

i'm against the IP system, as i think it is every bit as arbitrary as any other system-- i guess i just think that formal IPs feel more "heavy handed" than a PM from a mod for infrequent offenders. . . JMO, and it's not really a huge deal to me either way, but i've admittedly got some intrinsic resistance to it after the way things went down at mania. . .

i'll echo the prevailing sentiment that individual mods should not be able to ban beyond emergency, short-term suspensions. . .

overall, my opinion is that the mods have done a very solid job here, and anyone who's claiming bias needs to take a more honest look at their own posting style-- you're almost certainly bringing it on yourself through your own actions. . . . quit crying and put the victim card back in your pocket-- no one's impressed by self-proclaimed martyrs. . . :coffee:


I've seen some good ideas for the most part, but Dogfish pretty much sums up my thinking as well as anyone. The mods are outstanding here, and I trust their judgement pretty thoroughly. If anything, they are a little slow on the trigger, but they almost always get it right. I've had a post deleted once, and the mod was 100% right to do so - and he gave me more of an explanation than I really needed as it happened. I would suggest a max 3 day suspension from an individual mod, up to a week or two from 3 mods, and a lifetime ban to be done only by Tned.

Not crazy about an Infraction Point system, but I could live with it. I'd rather the Mods had the authority right at hand - it will tend to make their instructions get followed.

Joel
05-29-2008, 11:12 AM
I have no problem with how things are handled now. Of course I'm pretty easy. Just ask Mr.B. :D
Um... in TX, we don't ask guys if their wives are easy... most of us have (several) guns.... ;-p

girler
05-29-2008, 11:18 AM
Um... in TX, we don't ask guys if their wives are easy... most of us have (several) guns.... ;-p

So does Mr.B. But he doesn't do fish hooks. :tsk:

CoachChaz
05-29-2008, 11:21 AM
Um... in TX, we don't ask guys if their wives are easy... most of us have (several) guns.... ;-p

Exactly...we just assume it.

Ricky
05-29-2008, 12:22 PM
Being a mod has ruined the forum experience for me. I will look in from time to time to this site, but there are a few who will never let the past go. Oh well, back to being a lurker and in the background. Do what you want tned, those few will still lead the bulk of membership with a pack/bully mentality.

tubby
05-29-2008, 12:32 PM
Being a mod has ruined the forum experience for me. I will look in from time to time to this site, but there are a few who will never let the past go. Oh well, back to being a lurker and in the background. Do what you want tned, those few will still lead the bulk of membership with a pack/bully mentality.

Hi Rick. What's up with your old grumpy ass lately?

BroncoNut
05-29-2008, 12:32 PM
Being a mod has ruined the forum experience for me. I will look in from time to time to this site, but there are a few who will never let the past go. Oh well, back to being a lurker and in the background. Do what you want tned, those few will still lead the bulk of membership with a pack/bully mentality.

Actuallly, Cswil, Tubby, Beef, BroncoJoe, and Mo have really toned it down since being here. and 9798 hardly posts at all anymore

topscribe
05-29-2008, 12:45 PM
Being a mod has ruined the forum experience for me. I will look in from time to time to this site, but there are a few who will never let the past go. Oh well, back to being a lurker and in the background. Do what you want tned, those few will still lead the bulk of membership with a pack/bully mentality.

If you feel like posting, Ricky, post. What can anyone do to you on a message
board? I post occasionally over on the Mane, and there is a handful who take
great pleasure in attacking me, despite the good friends I have there. So
what? I let them attack and make asses out of themselves because that is
how they appear to everyone else when they do. (Sometimes I will respond
only if I can own them with a one-liner, which happens.)

Don't let anyone discourage you from taking part, Ricky. You're just as
much a member here as anyone else. Besides, it appears that a lot of the
hangover animosity that naturally occurs on a board has dissipated over
time since all you guys and gals have joined.

-----

KCL
05-29-2008, 02:22 PM
If you feel like posting, Ricky, post. What can anyone do to you on a message
board? I post occasionally over on the Mane, and there is a handful who take
great pleasure in attacking me, despite the good friends I have there. So
what? I let them attack and make asses out of themselves because that is
how they appear to everyone else when they do. (Sometimes I will respond
only if I can own them with a one-liner, which happens.)

Don't let anyone discourage you from taking part, Ricky. You're just as
much a member here as anyone else. Besides, it appears that a lot of the
hangover animosity that naturally occurs on a board has dissipated over
time since all you guys and gals have joined.

-----

Hey if I (A Chiefs fan) can put up with these Bronco Fans for as long as I
have...then anyone can do it. :D

Of course I know...some of you are thinking that you put up with me.:D

Good Post Top!

topscribe
05-29-2008, 02:41 PM
Hey if I (A Chiefs fan) can put up with these Bronco Fans for as long as I
have...then anyone can do it. :D

Of course I know...some of you are thinking that you put up with me.:D

Good Post Top!

I'll put up with you anytime you want, classy lady. :hug:

-----

KCL
05-29-2008, 02:43 PM
I'll put up with you anytime you want, classy lady. :hug:

-----

I know.....:laugh:

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 02:43 PM
I'll put up with you anytime you want, classy lady. :hug:

-----

Why dont you ban yourself just to get a feeling how it is to a person:laugh:

topscribe
05-29-2008, 04:15 PM
Why dont you ban yourself just to get a feeling how it is to a person:laugh:

I'll just ban you and enjoy it vicariously through you.

How's that sound? http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Smilies/thwink.gif

-----

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 04:21 PM
I'll just ban you and enjoy it vicariously through you.

How's that sound? http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Smilies/thwink.gif

-----

sure.... can you ban me from saturday to midnight tuesday... I have to take an exam so it would probably be the best to not have the temptation anyway.

topscribe
05-29-2008, 04:25 PM
sure.... can you ban me from saturday to midnight tuesday... I have to take an exam so it would probably be the best to not have the temptation anyway.

Well, since you want me to do it, it's going to cost you. :D

-----

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 04:27 PM
Well, since you want me to do it, it's going to cost you. :D

-----

well seriously i want you to. NO LIE!
I have never been banned before, and I kinda need to get off the destractions since the exam I am taking is sooooooooooooooooooo boring.

Lonestar
05-29-2008, 04:28 PM
well seriously i want you to. NO LIE!
I have never been banned before, and I kinda need to get off the destractions since the exam I am taking is sooooooooooooooooooo boring.


just how much is this worth to you?

BeefStew25
05-29-2008, 04:34 PM
Being a mod has ruined the forum experience for me. I will look in from time to time to this site, but there are a few who will never let the past go. Oh well, back to being a lurker and in the background. Do what you want tned, those few will still lead the bulk of membership with a pack/bully mentality.

Ricky, you need to post more here man.

topscribe
05-29-2008, 04:34 PM
well seriously i want you to. NO LIE!
I have never been banned before, and I kinda need to get off the destractions since the exam I am taking is sooooooooooooooooooo boring.

That's like walking up to a cop and telling him you want him to put you in jail.

Would he do it just because you asked?

Go break a window or something! :coffee:

-----

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 04:36 PM
just how much is this worth to you?

A lot.......... I just spent several hours today surfing here instead of reading what I should. It doesnt help to have an attention span like a fly when you are reading things that are boring......

slim
05-29-2008, 04:36 PM
Actuallly, Cswil, Tubby, Beef, BroncoJoe, and Mo have really toned it down since being here. and 9798 hardly posts at all anymore

And nut has even given up dogs.

You have nothing to fear here :welcome:

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 04:37 PM
That's like walking up to a cop and telling him you want him to put you in jail.

Would he do it just because you asked?

Go break a window or something! :coffee:

-----

Well I could go on a verbal rampage..... **** **** ****ety **** **** **** hihi

Lonestar
05-29-2008, 04:45 PM
Well I could go on a verbal rampage..... **** **** ****ety **** **** **** hihi


not good enough

Rex
05-29-2008, 04:49 PM
Being a mod has ruined the forum experience for me. I will look in from time to time to this site, but there are a few who will never let the past go. Oh well, back to being a lurker and in the background. Do what you want tned, those few will still lead the bulk of membership with a pack/bully mentality.

Not as much fun when you cant rule along your own party lines, huh Rick?

BeefStew25
05-29-2008, 04:50 PM
*cough* *cough*

Um...man. Okay.

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 04:50 PM
not good enough

ok i give up..... perhaps, yes perhaps some day I will become a mod and rule from overseas!

Lonestar
05-29-2008, 05:49 PM
ok i give up..... perhaps, yes perhaps some day I will become a mod and rule from overseas!


OK now go study..

Ricky
05-29-2008, 06:03 PM
Not as much fun when you cant rule along your own party lines, huh Rick?


It wasn't fun then either. Matter fact it got old very quick and I really can't say that I miss it. I do miss talking Broncos though, but why would I want to post and get bashed?

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 06:12 PM
perhaps you should just ignore it until it goes away?

Eventually people will forget about the mod part at broncosfreak and if they dont, just put them on ignore. there are plenty of people who didnt have a problem with you at the freak, and even more who have no experience with you what so ever.

BeefStew25
05-29-2008, 06:14 PM
perhaps you should just ignore it until it goes away?

Eventually people will forget about the mod part at broncosfreak and if they dont, just put them on ignore. there are plenty of people who didnt have a problem with you at the freak, and even more who have no experience with you what so ever.

Exactly. Rick, ignore the comments and focus on hard hitting Denver Bronco football. You don't need those idiots anyway.

topscribe
05-29-2008, 06:24 PM
Not as much fun when you cant rule along your own party lines, huh Rick?

That's exactly what I am talking about. That was a different board, different time.

Everybody who first comes to this board is given a clean slate, no matter what
their past is on another. That has benefitted a few who came here with some
skeletons in their respective closets (and most of them haven't disappointed
us, at least not terribly). It would then behoove you to extend that courtesy
to each other.

This is what we expect of you. The past is gone. Let's leave it there.

-----

Dreadnought
05-29-2008, 06:49 PM
ok i give up..... perhaps, yes perhaps some day I will become a mod and rule from overseas!

I suggest posting some nudie pics. As a courtesy, and because we don't want Tned to have any actual troubles, PM a few of us, plus Top and Tned, just before you post them and set up a new Lounge thread where you plan to post them. We'll take a quick peek, then Top will shut down the thread, you will get banned for a few days, and virtually nobody is any the wiser. Just an idea. Maybe no a good one, but an idea.

KCL
05-29-2008, 06:58 PM
I suggest posting some nudie pics. As a courtesy, and because we don't want Tned to have any actual troubles, PM a few of us, plus Top and Tned, just before you post them and set up a new Lounge thread where you plan to post them. We'll take a quick peek, then Top will shut down the thread, you will get banned for a few days, and virtually nobody is any the wiser. Just an idea. Maybe no a good one, but an idea.

Sounds like you have it all figured out...;)

Dreadnought
05-29-2008, 07:00 PM
Sounds like you have it all figured out...;)

I get paid to think a few moves ahead :D

topscribe
05-29-2008, 07:01 PM
Sounds like you have it all figured out...;)

It's working for Dread, all right.

In fact, I'm about to ban him right now. :heh:

-----

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:06 PM
It's working for Dread, all right.

In fact, I'm about to ban him right now. :heh:

-----

Oh no not Dread....:eek:

He is my Knight in Shining Armor on this board...:D

Dreadnought
05-29-2008, 07:07 PM
OK - I need support here; if I get booted, will you walk w/ me KCL?

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:09 PM
OK - I need support here; if I get booted, will you walk w/ me KCL?

Oh YES....I will hold your hand or whatever else needs holding!:D

Dreadnought
05-29-2008, 07:14 PM
Oh YES....I will hold your hand or whatever else needs holding!:D

Thats a thrilling concept. It would be worth the banning. :elefant::elefant:

topscribe
05-29-2008, 07:15 PM
Oh YES....I will hold your hand or whatever else needs holding!:D


:shocked:

-----

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 07:17 PM
Oh YES....I will hold your hand or whatever else needs holding!:D

if you can get a hold of that but I get hicks like you have their own snakefarm.
:laugh:

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:22 PM
Thats a thrilling concept. It would be worth the banning. :elefant::elefant:

My thoughts exactly....:laugh:

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:24 PM
:shocked:

-----

Did I really type that outloud? :lol:

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:25 PM
if you can get a hold of that but I get hicks like you have their own snakefarm.
:laugh:

Are you trying to make some sense here or what?:rolleyes: :confused:

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 07:31 PM
Are you trying to make some sense here or what?:rolleyes: :confused:

lets just say there are some double entendre and innuendo in it.... two ones actually..... i found it amusing myself though-

frauschieze
05-29-2008, 07:34 PM
lets just say there are some double entendre and innuendo in it.... two ones actually..... i found it amusing myself though-

I got it. But then.....well....let's not go there.

Have you gotten banned yet? When you PM those pics, don't forget me. :D

Day1BroncoFan
05-29-2008, 07:37 PM
Hey if I (A Chiefs fan) can put up with these Bronco Fans for as long as I
have...then anyone can do it. :D

Of course I know...some of you are thinking that you put up with me.:D

Good Post Top!

We put up with a lot from you KCL. :D

MOtorboat
05-29-2008, 07:39 PM
I love the Broncos.

It's OK KCL...we know...

we know... :2thumbs:

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:41 PM
lets just say there are some double entendre and innuendo in it.... two ones actually..... i found it amusing myself though-


I got it. But then.....well....let's not go there.

Have you gotten banned yet? When you PM those pics, don't forget me. :D

I got it as well...sorry I forgot to laugh...

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:42 PM
We put up with a lot from you KCL. :D

And you are more than happy to do that!:D

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 07:42 PM
I got it. But then.....well....let's not go there.

Have you gotten banned yet? When you PM those pics, don't forget me. :D

well i wanna go there.... especially with you....
why cant any of you girls PM me some pics of yourself naked though.........
see, I just start up slow... then faster and faster..............no thats something completely different.
Begin with a little double entendre... then BOOOM the worst(or best) pictures are coming.... or cumming(sp)?

Slowly, Harold is just loosing his mind until the Ban is complete!

frauschieze
05-29-2008, 07:43 PM
I got it as well...sorry I forgot to laugh...

I'll laugh for you. :laugh:

Do we all feel better now? ;)

Day1BroncoFan
05-29-2008, 07:43 PM
And you are more than happy to do that!:D

You bet we are as long as you can take it we can dish it out. :elefant:

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:44 PM
It's OK KCL...we know you really don't love the Broncos and I don't either...



I know you how you feel MO!:D

MOtorboat
05-29-2008, 07:44 PM
I know you how you feel MO!:D

:confused:

haroldthebarrel
05-29-2008, 07:45 PM
I got it as well...sorry I forgot to laugh...

hihihi.... and I who was so satisfied with the sentence..... well the best laughs are the one you create yourself.

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:46 PM
I'll laugh for you. :laugh:

Do we all feel better now? ;)

Your too kind....thanks but no thanks!;)

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:49 PM
You bet we are as long as you can take it we can dish it out. :elefant:

Well now Day1....I have been a member of the Broncos boards now for
about 5 yrs....I think I am doing okay!:D

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:50 PM
:confused:

well one of the guys here told me....:D

KCL
05-29-2008, 07:51 PM
hihihi.... and I who was so satisfied with the sentence..... well the best laughs are the one you create yourself.

okay htb...whatever you say! :D

Day1BroncoFan
05-29-2008, 07:51 PM
Well now Day1....I have been a member of the Broncos boards now for
about 5 yrs....I think I am doing okay!:D

You're doing better than I am and I'm a Bronco fan. :coffee:

Tned
05-29-2008, 11:16 PM
It's good to see the lighthearted banter around a serious topic, but don't forget to keep discussing the main point of this thread.

KCL
05-29-2008, 11:18 PM
It's good to see the lighthearted banter around a serious topic, but don't forget to keep discussing the main point of this thread.

Party Pooper....:lol:

Oh its you Tned...sorry!:shocked:

Tned....you and I can talk about CPs...;)

EDIT-sorry Tned....I thought this was the other thread I was posting
in earlier...

Tned
05-29-2008, 11:50 PM
Party Pooper....:lol:

Oh its you Tned...sorry!:shocked:

Tned....you and I can talk about CPs...;)

EDIT-sorry Tned....I thought this was the other thread I was posting
in earlier...

Yea, I was debating about whether or not to start back up our CP debates. :D Ahhh, the good ole days ;)

topscribe
05-30-2008, 12:40 AM
Yea, I was debating about whether or not to start back up our CP debates. :D Ahhh, the good ole days ;)

:faint:

-----

frenchfan
05-30-2008, 12:54 AM
Humm... well, I missed a good part of this thread and I think I've to hijacked it too...

KCie... It seems to me that I shouldn't have told you about "bisous"... You're so... humm... "french" now... see what I mean ;)

:laugh:

Timmy!
06-02-2008, 06:38 AM
I'd be in favor of some sort of infraction system. I do feel that mods should be able to ban somebody without the infractions if it was a situation that warranted such action.

Tned
06-02-2008, 06:44 AM
I'll give this another couple days, assuming input continues, then summarize the comments to date and then prepare a proposal based on the input to be presented to the community.

Arkansas Bronco
06-02-2008, 09:23 AM
I havnt gone through all 11 pages but responding off the first post. A Mod should ban or suspend (as scribe brought up) when its necessary (such as porn bots and spammers) and may be a good idea to talk with other mods with issues of members that are out of line, unless it was very clear that they were way over the boundary's. I know my opinion isnt worth much because I am mostly a maner but i felt like I wanted too toss it in anyway.

BeefStew25
06-02-2008, 09:38 AM
I'll give this another couple days, assuming input continues, then summarize the comments to date and then prepare a proposal based on the input to be presented to the community.

You are our leader. We trust your decison oh vaulted one.

claymore
06-02-2008, 09:53 AM
I'll give this another couple days, assuming input continues, then summarize the comments to date and then prepare a proposal based on the input to be presented to the community.
I say that if you snuck in before Jan 08....... Then you are immune to being banned. :D

Tned
06-02-2008, 06:55 PM
I say that if you snuck in before Jan 08....... Then you are immune to being banned. :D

Or if you username starts with C, ends with E and has at least one Y in the middle...

MOtorboat
06-02-2008, 07:01 PM
Or if you username starts with C, ends with E and has at least one Y in the middle...

Well, I'm not going to sugar coat it.

On the list to be banned:
Claymore.


I expect immediate and thorough reaction by you, Tned.

:coffee:

Tned
06-02-2008, 07:04 PM
Well, I'm not going to sugar coat it.

On the list to be banned:
Claymore.


I expect immediate and thorough reaction by you, Tned.

:coffee:

Shove my ass in a beaker with a catalyst and I am sure you will get a reaction....

MOtorboat
06-02-2008, 07:09 PM
Shove my ass in a beaker with a catalyst and I am sure you will get a reaction....

Um, yeah...crap.

:vroam:

Day1BroncoFan
06-02-2008, 07:29 PM
Or if you username starts with C, ends with E and has at least one Y in the middle...

Or if your user name is dent spelled backwards. :D

Tned
06-02-2008, 08:07 PM
Or if your user name is dent spelled backwards. :D

Yep ;)

NightTrainLayne
06-08-2008, 11:01 PM
I feel that the infraction system is the most efficient way to handle the situation, but if not that, then my next choice would be for a quorum of mods (three or more depending on what the rest of the board feels) should be in agreement for banning an individual in a "non-emergency" situation.

Obviously, there will still be need for "emergency" bannings, and those should have some appeal or review process involved.

BroncoWave
06-08-2008, 11:11 PM
I like the infraction system if the admins put out guidelines for what we can be IP'd for and things of the like.

Ziggy
06-08-2008, 11:16 PM
I'd lean toward the infraction system also. Try it for 6 months, and then go back and review it.

Skinny
06-08-2008, 11:18 PM
Looks good to me. Where do i sign??

And yeah, the mods do a great job! Whatever that job is. :rolleyes:

















I kid because i care! :D

DenBronx
06-09-2008, 03:05 AM
i'm opposed to the infraction system tned. i don't really care for it plus i feel it isnt always correct. i prefer that 3 mods together would make a final call if someone were to get banned or not. i understand emergency bannings and all that but a regular member that has been warned a few times and still doesnt change then that should be brought before 3 mods to make the call. i like this much better....thats just me though.

i tend to stay out of all the political mumbo jumbo but in this case i hope we dont start playing passion police around here like the guys on mania ....ooopss country did. i love this board because a.) great posters/fans/community ect. b.) great mods c.) best overall forums/layout/color d.) we are a little loose around here.

so....my opinion is just let it ride, clyde!

Colorado4Life
06-09-2008, 10:43 AM
In my personal, but unimportant opinion, I believe that we should have a very detailed, specific, clear, and concise, BroncosForums Constitution and Bill of Rights. For example, many posters have on this site and others gotten warnings, received infractions for sarcasm, taking jokes too far, or just being immature. I believe that if this site is opposed to that type of childish behavior it should be clearly stated in some type of document along with specific rules. Once these rules are put into Constitution form, then each member would then be required to somehow signoff in order to continue to post that they will abide by these rules. As a "community" based board it might take a while until the entire text of this hypothetical document is compiled but once it is and people have agreed to abide by it as they do the rules then there is less of a problem with amibiguity. I was watching a British comedian, who was talking about an experience he had with a police officer and the officer said, and I quote, "one man's shit is another man's crap, which is another man's poop" Everyone here is different and unique and that is part of what makes Forums sites so much fun, but once we run into the gray area where the decision is left to the moderators rather than the Constitution then people start getting upset. Moderators are people too, and I think they do their best, and I honestly believe that this aforementioned document will cut back on the problems as they can simply point out that each member agreed to the terms found therein. For example, there needs to be a concise, and clear definition of what constitutes spam and what does not. Some people have felt singled out as a result of ambigous definitions that again are not just here but on many online communities. So again my ideas are simply a Bill of Rights, Constitution and framework of governance, and some type of agreement online acceptance/signature that recognizes people are agreeing to post within the SPECIFIC framework set up.

Then if people violate these rules, then BAN them without a trace of sympathy! If the community decided to ban sarcasm, and then I no longer could be sarcastic or annoying and I signed a statement agreeing that I would not and I continued to be my regular self, then I would deserve to be banned. That is why the rules should be explicit, specific, and cover the gray areas thus eliminating disgruntled posters with chip on their shoulders towards the Mods and more support amongst the posters for Mod actions.

tubby
06-09-2008, 10:48 AM
In my personal, but unimportant opinion, I believe that we should have a very detailed, specific, clear, and concise, BroncosForums Constitution and Bill of Rights. For example, many posters have on this site and others gotten warnings, received infractions for sarcasm, taking jokes too far, or just being immature. I believe that if this site is opposed to that type of childish behavior it should be clearly stated in some type of document along with specific rules. Once these rules are put into Constitution form, then each member would then be required to somehow signoff in order to continue to post that they will abide by these rules. As a "community" based board it might take a while until the entire text of this hypothetical document is compiled but once it is and people have agreed to abide by it as they do the rules then there is less of a problem with amibiguity. I was watching a British comedian, who was talking about an experience he had with a police officer and the officer said, and I quote, "one man's shit is another man's crap, which is another man's poop" Everyone here is different and unique and that is part of what makes Forums sites so much fun, but once we run into the gray area where the decision is left to the moderators rather than the Constitution then people start getting upset. Moderators are people too, and I think they do their best, and I honestly believe that this aforementioned document will cut back on the problems as they can simply point out that each member agreed to the terms found therein. For example, there needs to be a concise, and clear definition of what constitutes spam and what does not. Some people have felt singled out as a result of ambigous definitions that again are not just here but on many online communities. So again my ideas are simply a Bill of Rights, Constitution and framework of governance, and some type of agreement online acceptance/signature that recognizes people are agreeing to post within the SPECIFIC framework set up.

Then if people violate these rules, then BAN them without a trace of sympathy! If the community decided to ban sarcasm, and then I no longer could be sarcastic or annoying and I signed a statement agreeing that I would not and I continued to be my regular self, then I would deserve to be banned. That is why the rules should be explicit, specific, and cover the gray areas thus eliminating disgruntled posters with chip on their shoulders towards the Mods and more support amongst the posters for Mod actions.

I want to poop on your shit.

ps. freak/forum gathering OCT 12 in Denver.

HighPlainsBronc
06-09-2008, 04:01 PM
I haven't posted here much since I just switched over from that other board but I'll put in my two bits;




So, we have a few things we need to address.


Should a single mod be able to give a timeout or 24 hour suspension,
Yes

and if so, should there be guidelines as to what warrants that, or should it be a pure judgement call (currently there are loose guidelines as to what constitutes an emergency and this was defined when the advisory board was in effect).
Keep the loose guidlines and allow a (one mod) the power to give up to a 24 hour emegency time-out suspension and a group of maybe 4 mods to suspend for up to a week. A longer suspension would require all the mods to agree.


What procedure (points, multiple warnings, a vote of some kind) should be used to determine longer (past 24 hours/timeout) suspensions of 3 days, 7 days, 14 days, perm ban, etc.

Maybe after 3 week long suspensions the standards get a bit tighter for that poster.

Should there be a warning or x warnings before any suspension is given.

Three week long bans should be ample warning LOL Any out right bans should be yours Tned.


Etc.

Lonestar
06-09-2008, 06:11 PM
I haven't posted here much since I just switched over from that other board but I'll put in my two bits;

a man of few words. Something like speak softly but carry a Magnum 44.

Is that you Harry?