Anyone else concerned about the interior OL situation in Denver?

[lex]

I said this in another thread but Hamilton is now a victim of concussions. Unfortunately, it becomes increasingly easier to get them as one moves forward. Nalen is getting up there and is coming off of an injury. I know Kuper is on the roster but it seems like he might be the best choice at one of the tackle positions. We drafted Lichtensteiger but it wouldnt seem he is NFL ready exactly in addition to physical limitations. Does anyone else worry that we're in dire straits where our interior OL is concerned? Plus, honestly, we had been getting pushed around for a while now. Is anyone else regretting that we didnt take another OL who might be able to play OG?

[Tned]

At this time, I have a much greater concern at the tackle position, since that is where most of the pressure has been coming from. There is no doubt that at times our interior has given up a sack or a QB pressure, but more times than not it is our ends getting thrown around or blown by that has led to QB pressure, so that is my first concern.

Once the tackle positions are addressed, then we may find we need to upgrade the interior, but Nalen might be good for more than just '08, and if Hamilton doesn't have on going problems, he is likely to move to center once Nalen does retire, at which point Lichtensteiger is ready to take over LG. At RG, I will be curious to see how he plays with a healthy line around him, but Holland is only 27 or so, so he could be around for a while.

[lex]

At this time, I have a much greater concern at the tackle position, since that is where most of the pressure has been coming from. There is no doubt that at times our interior has given up a sack or a QB pressure, but more times than not it is our ends getting thrown around or blown by that has led to QB pressure, so that is my first concern.

Once the tackle positions are addressed, then we may find we need to upgrade the interior, but Nalen might be good for more than just '08, and if Hamilton doesn't have on going problems, he is likely to move to center once Nalen does retire, at which point Lichtensteiger is ready to take over LG. At RG, I will be curious to see how he plays with a healthy line around him, but Holland is only 27 or so, so he could be around for a while.

I think the interior OL is in bad shape too...as bad as the OT. The sacks come from the outside because thats where the better pass rushers are. Im actually worried about the interior OL where our running game is concerned. Like Ive said, weve actually been getting rag dolled for awhile and now we're getting old on top of that save Holland, who, hopefully, can be consistent.

[Fan in Exile]

I know that it's fashionable to talk about Hamilton as being one shot away from not playing ever again. But when he was cleared one of the statements by I think it was the university of Pittsburgh medical college was that he wasn't at anymore of a risk than anyone else. So I would say they know more about head injuries and his specific condition than any of us. Injury of course is a concern for every player but he isn't at any more of a risk than anyone else.

Nalen certainly is getting older but I'm not going to worry about him getting worse until I see it on the field. If he can still beat out Weigmann and Lichtensteiger than his play on the field shouldn't be a problem.

I also know that Kuper is penciled in at RT but that doesn't mean that he can't slide inside and be replaced by Harris if it gets to be that bad. Of course that would probably mean that Hamilton/Nalen, Weigmann, and Lichtensteiger already went down. Would that be a bad situation sure, but with the limits of a 53 man roster we are as prepared as we can be. There isn't any kind of realistic reason to be too worried about the interior of our o-line right now.

[Ziggy]

I think the interior OL is in bad shape too...as bad as the OT. The sacks come from the outside because thats where the better pass rushers are. Im actually worried about the interior OL where our running game is concerned. Like Ive said, weve actually been getting rag dolled for awhile and now we're getting old on top of that save Holland, who, hopefully, can be consistent.

You pose a good and fair question Lex. I'm concerned about C and LG. Holland is solid, and consistent. This will be his second year in the ZBS and I anticipate he will be even better. As far as Nails and Hamilton go, I'm very concerned. It's yet another reason why the Lichtensteiger pick was one of my favorites. He can play both guard and tackle, brings more beef, and the same nasty disposition that Nails does.

I'm wondering if Shanny isn't planning on moving the loser of the RT competition to G, to give us more depth there. If Harris ends up in 2nd place at the RT spot, he can back up both tackle positions. The same can be said of Pears. If Kuper finishes 2nd or even 3rd, I see him going back to G. We just have too much riding on a C that is in the twighlight of his career, and coming off of a serious injury, and a G that is one good knock in the head away from retirement. Not to mention the fact that I always thought of Hamilton as overrated. I wouldn't be surprised to see him replaced if Kuper loses out on the RT position.

[dogfish]

if clady pans out, i think we're a RT away from having a very solid young line in place. . . clady, kuper, lichtensteiger and holland should be fine. . . you don't absolutely need five studs on the OL-- two or three is plenty, and if you have them it makes it a whole lot easier to plug in a few serviceable guys and get very good overall line play. . . kuper and clady could give us a beastly left side for years to come. . .

[PatricktheDookie]

If Hamilton is healthy, he'll do great.
Holland is fine.
Nalen is the only question mark.

We're fine on the interior at the moment. Kuper is a reliable backup, assuming Pears or Harris starts at RT.

[Medford Bronco]

I am more concerned with our defense.

I just dont see how we improve that much with
Boss Bailey and McCree and IMO no impact players taken in the draft
on the side of the ball we royally sucked last season.

Also I have a friend who is a Jets fan and he was so
happy they got rid of Robertson. He says he is a dog
and very overrated. God I hope he is wrong or it was a waste
picking up scraps for the d Line as usual in FA

[underrated29]

I would like harris to beat out pears- shouldnt be too hard anyhow. But then we got harris and clady at T, kupes and holland and hammy and nails.

I am not sure if it would work, but I am entrigued by the idea of pears moving into one of the G positions. He is a big boy, and seems to be strong enough, i just think his lateral mobility is what gets him in trouble.

If we can stick him up in the middle he might perfom better and with his size seems kinda like he could be a mauler in the run game.

anyone else think that might work?

[Skinny]

Not right now. With Nalen and Hamilton coming back it's as good as it's going to get.

[dogfish]

I am more concerned with our defense.

I just dont see how we improve that much with
Boss Bailey and McCree and IMO no impact players taken in the draft
on the side of the ball we royally sucked last season.

Also I have a friend who is a Jets fan and he was so
happy they got rid of Robertson. He says he is a dog
and very overrated. God I hope he is wrong or it was a waste
picking up scraps for the d Line as usual in FA



robertson was badly misused in NY the past two years-- he's a 310-315 pound one-gap tackle who relies on his first step quickness to get penetration-- when they traded up to get him he was supposed to be the next warren sapp, not the next ted washington. . . "mangenius" is a stubborn idiot for insisting on running the 3-4 with pure cover-2 personnel-- it's no wonder their defense sucked. . . i give robertson credit for playing yard and being productive even though his physical skill set really isn't suited to playing nosetackle. . . i think he'll be much better back in the proper scheme. . .


other than that i agree with you about the defense, though-- stopping the run is still a big concern. . .


sorry to get off-topic, guys. . . .

[G_Money]

I think we addressed the middle of the line fairly well.

If Kuper moves out to tackle, then that weakens it, but if he stays inside then I feel pretty good with Nalen at center for one more year, likely to be followed by Hamilton or Lichtensteiger if he's ready, and Kuper/Holland at the G position. We also have the KC center as a backup option at G/C if Kuper or Hamilton do have issues during the pre-season.

You can't always account for injury. We did have trouble opening holes up the middle in short yardage with Myers at the point, but he was our 3rd option at center (after Nalen and Hamilton). We've done about as well as we can at those positions without overloading on players who may never see time.

I'm more concerned about tackle. If Clady goes down (*knocks on wood frantically*) we're severely boned, with just Pears and Harris around as "natural" tackles who understand our scheme. If Nalen goes down, I have better backup options.

This is all dependent on what Kuper does, though.

~G

[silkamilkamonico]

I believe our entire oline across the board is much deeper, and in better shape than in years past.

If Clady isn't ready, we have the same bookends that we had last year, which was very good for the first few games, plus Harris.

We have a couple interchangeable players that did a great job filling in last year, that if they don't win the job at T they could play inside, which is easier to play than the T position in the Denver scheme.

Lictensteiger(sp?) won't contribute this year, IMHO. He's still not 100% from his injury, and if Harris couldn't get any PT last year even with all the injuries, I can't see another rookie with the exception of Clady contributing this year.

[Nature Boy]

Clady, Hamilton, Nalen, Holland and 1 of 3 guys playing RT. We should be just fine.

[haroldthebarrel]

We are better than we were last year. That is a start.
How much better we will get is totally up to the progress of Liechtenstieger, Clady and Kuper. If all pans out, watch out.

I love the Liechtenstieger pick(though i hate to write the name) just for the sake that he is a mauler. I totally overlooked him. He could be a really great pick in two years time.

We did a lot to at least try to become better in the RZ/SY areas and for that I commend the draft. Whether they pan out is another story, but at least they did try to help our woeful RZ pounding.

[LoyalSoldier]

I think the question should be "Is there anyone who isn't concerned"

Until our young players prove they can do it then I will be concerned.

[Tned]

I think the question should be "Is there anyone who isn't concerned"

Until our young players prove they can do it then I will be concerned.

Except the interior isn't made up of young players. While Holland is youngish, the rest of the interior is Hamilton and Nalen, who the team says are good to go.

Lex's contention is that Hamilton and Nalen are a bigger liability than the young guys at tackle.

[Buff]

Interior OL, along with defensive back, are probably the areas I have most confidence in going into 2008. Nalen's had plenty of time to rehab and will play himself into shape just fine. Getting Hamilton back is huge, as he was probably the most consistent O-Lineman not named Tom Nalen before his injury. Between Wiegman, Holland and Kuper, we'll be fine in terms of competition and depth.

IMO, we should be much more concerned with the interior D-Line-- an area that was absolutely atrocious a year ago... As Med mentioned, the only thing we did was bring in a guy with a degenerative knee condition... If I were Shanny, I'd be losing alot more sleep over the lack of ability to stop the run.

[dogfish]

am i the only one who wasn't aware that lichtensteiger played guard his first two college seasons before moving to center? just noticed that. . .

[Lonestar]

Yes I have concerns here also..

I'll stay on the Hamilton bandwagon of one good head slap away from retirement..

Nalen is a year maybe two from retirement period and might even be beat out of a job sometime this year..

Seigman IMO is a waste whom I would doubt would make the teams if Licthensteiger shows any promise at all.. He was someone they had to get in case the could not fill out the OLINE in the draft..

But as a general rule you do not waste a first rounders on OLINE unless it is an elite OLT. IMO we should have taken one of the better guards in the second round. Barring injury we would have been set for the next decade...

[cmhargrove]

am i the only one who wasn't aware that lichtensteiger played guard his first two college seasons before moving to center? just noticed that. . .

And..... I know he played for Bowling Green, but I believe he had the highest O-line blocking percentages in the NCAA last year.

And..... I haven't seen him play because who watches Bowling Green? However, he is said to have quite a mean streak. I like watching the tapes of Clady in this respect also. When he gets the chance, he likes to pile drive and pancake. If he could do that once or twice to Merriman or Olshartsky this season, I will probably throw a beer through my TV (in happiness of course)...

[TheDave]

Because of the injury situation last year, i have plenty of confidence in our interior line. Assuming that we remain relatively healthy we have solid starters and good depth... can't ask for much more than that.

[turftoad]

Except the interior isn't made up of young players. While Holland is youngish, the rest of the interior is Hamilton and Nalen, who the team says are good to go.

Lex's contention is that Hamilton and Nalen are a bigger liability than the young guys at tackle.

I agree. But I'm not concerned. Kuper could beat out Hamilton and we drafted Licht to compete and eventually take over for Nalen. Hamilton and Nalen could be backups this year. I mean, we have to face it. We're not going to win the SB this year. Why not get these young guys experience so we can make the run in 09".

Broncos OL of the future:
LT Clady
LG Kuper
C Licht
RG Holland
RT Harris

[HolyDiver]

I wasn't concerned about our O-line even before the draft. The starting lineup of clady, Kuper, Nalen, Holland and Harris sound really good to me. ............But, I guess in early May, we have nothing better to talk about.

[Retired_Member_001]

Kuper will lock down either LG or RG. He's the safest bet of a lineman we have at the moment. We've seen how talented he is, we know he doesn't have injury problems, he's safe.

The rest of the offensive line however, is one big IF. I think the IF that will have the biggest affect on the team is whether Ryan Clady can pick up the system quick enough and if he is talented in the first place. If Ryan Clady turns out to be good, as well as grasping the playbook fairly quickly, things start to fall into place.

The second biggest if is Ryan Harris. If Ryan Harris can move to RT and do at least an ok job, then the offensive line will start to look decent. The question will be, does he have the strength for RT?

The real issue in terms of losing guys, comes with Hamilton and Nalen. Both players will not make it past training camps in my opinion. Hamilton may do but he'll retire during the season. He's one concussion away from a career ending and life changing injury. He's made his money, so for his and his families life, I'd retire now. As for Nalen, he's old and worn at the moment, he will probably want to call it quits.

This will leave Weigmann, Lichtensteiger and Holland to compete for C and RG (assuming Kuper moves to LG).

It will be interesting, it is certainly unpredictable.

If all else fails, we can sign Emmanuel Akah!

[Fan in Exile]

The real issue in terms of losing guys, comes with Hamilton and Nalen. Both players will not make it past training camps in my opinion. Hamilton may do but he'll retire during the season. He's one concussion away from a career ending and life changing injury. He's made his money, so for his and his families life, I'd retire now.

Can people please stop saying this, it's just not true:

Hamilton knows there are skeptics who believe he's one blow to the helmet from another potential problem.

Such thoughts aren't part of his current mind-set, though.

"I know that's the perception around me, but I know that's not the case talking to the doctors," Hamilton said. "I don't have any hesitation or reservations playing this year. And I know that I'll gain people's trust as I go through practices and games. I can't wait to prove myself."

[Retired_Member_001]

Can people please stop saying this, it's just not true:

Hamilton knows there are skeptics who believe he's one blow to the helmet from another potential problem.

Such thoughts aren't part of his current mind-set, though.

"I know that's the perception around me, but I know that's not the case talking to the doctors," Hamilton said. "I don't have any hesitation or reservations playing this year. And I know that I'll gain people's trust as I go through practices and games. I can't wait to prove myself."

The head is a funny thing, even doctors can't 100% predict everything. All I'm saying is don't count him in for sure.

[Fan in Exile]

The head is a funny thing, even doctors can't 100% predict everything. All I'm saying is don't count him in for sure.

I'm still far more willing to trust the doctors who said that he can play then I am to trust anyone on this board who gets so worked up about him being one injury away from never playing again.

Also if all you're saying is don't count him in for sure, then you aren't really saying anything. That's true of everybody on the field. The interior of our O-line is fine, because we've got quality players penciled in to start and quality guys who can back them up. Anything else is just chicken little crying out that the sky is falling.

[TXBRONC]

I think the question should be "Is there anyone who isn't concerned"

Until our young players prove they can do it then I will be concerned.


Our interior line? No I'm not worried about it.

[TXBRONC]

The head is a funny thing, even doctors can't 100% predict everything. All I'm saying is don't count him in for sure.

Until I hear it from Hamilton or neurologist I going to count on him being there. There is no reason not too.

[slim]

The interior line play is the least of my worries. Tackle is by far a bigger question mark.

[TXBRONC]

The interior line play is the least of my worries. Tackle is by far a bigger question mark.

Agreed. For me it more so the left tackle than the right.

[slim]

Agreed. For me it more so the left tackle than the right.

I would say both. We really don't have a proven player at either position (or much depth, for that matter). If Clady works out at LT and Harris can manage RT, then MAYBE we will be OK. But that is a lot of ifs and hoping.

[TXBRONC]

I would say both. We really don't have a proven player at either position (or much depth, for that matter). If Clady works out at LT and Harris can manage RT, then MAYBE we will be OK. But that is a lot of ifs and hoping.

Honestly I think Kuper is our best option. He has the size, I hear that has good footwork, and he already has a full year's experience starting on our line.

[dogfish]

Honestly I think Kuper is our best option. He has the size, I hear that has good footwork, and he already has a full year's experience starting on our line.

agreed-- kupes also has a nastier disposition than pears or harris. . . assuming that everyone really is healthy and ready to go, as of right now my ideal O-line would be clady, hamilton, nails, holland and kupes. . .

[Lonestar]

I would say both. We really don't have a proven player at either position (or much depth, for that matter). If Clady works out at LT and Harris can manage RT, then MAYBE we will be OK. But that is a lot of ifs and hoping.

I have concerns about a little change now and then a little change when the injuries happen and again next year..


If Licthensteiger is what he appears to be the next center in DEN and Harris can handle RT then make the change now and get this OLINE working together this year so they can be cohesive before 2011.. Bite the bullet today and stop the bleeding that will happen over the next 3 years..

[broncohead]

The only thing I'm concerned about is that Hamilton and Nalen will handle the injury like Lepsis. When Lepsis came back you could tell that he wasn't in football shape anymore. Thats the only thing I'm concerned when it comes to these two. I'd really like to see Harris work out at RT only because I would rather have Kuper in the middle. I think the OL will be decent this year.