Kiper gives us a C +

[DenBronx]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft08/columns/story?columnist=kiper_jr_mel&id=3357479

AFC West
Denver Broncos: GRADE: C+
Ryan Clady is the left tackle the Broncos needed to help Jay Cutler, and Clady should start right away. Eddie Royal is a decent slot receiver who has some return skills, Kory Lichtensteiger was one of the top centers in the draft and Arizona State's Ryan Torain is an interesting pick at running back because he has the potential to prosper in Denver. Torain's ASU teammate, safety Joshua Barrett, has great physical abilities, but does not always play up to his potential. I want to see how they use FB Peyton Hillis because he has great hands out of the backfield, and would be an ideal H-back if he were a couple of inches taller.

[DenBronx]

He only gave the Titans, Texans and Jaguars a lower grade than us.

Kiper is a complete moron.

Mayock > Kiper

[shank]

i pretty much agree, but once i realize that all these guys are high-character, and have almost no chance of busting due to off-field stuff, i bump it up to a B. it will all come down to what they can do while wearing cleats, not that other crap.

[Lonestar]

sounds like kiper gave us a better grade than I did..

KIper has been in the past a pretty good evaluator although I do have to say Mayock is damned good..

90 out of his top 100 were gone by round 4..

[TXBRONC]

I wonder what kind of grade Mayock will give us.

[r8rh8r]

Saying Denver had the 5th worst draft in the NFL is severe. A C+ is more like a D if you look at his distribution. On my scale, we get a B. On Kiper's scale, we should have a B+ or A-.

[TXBRONC]

Saying Denver had the 5th worst draft in the NFL is severe. A C+ is more like a D if you look at his distribution. On my scale, we get a B. On Kiper's scale, we should have a B+ or A-.


He gave Denver a B+ for the drafting of Clady I guess everything after Clady he was lukewarm too.

[Scarface]

I wonder what kind of grade Mayock will give us.

I haven't seen grades from him but during the draft he sounded like he really liked the way Denver's draft was going.

[lex]

I gave us a C+ too. USA Today gave us a D. As negative as Ive been, I dont see how you can even begin to justify a D. Even if you didnt like some of the picks, the last two picks alone make it worth more than a D.

And I like how Mel pokes holes in Barrett when we drafted him in the 7th round.

[Flatinum]

Good for Mel. Jackass.

[eessydo]

I think we were lucky to get that, our round 2 pick was VERY questionable and I think the only reason we didn't fail was due to our OL pick ups and the FB in the final round.

Luke warm is being nice, I think most of our other picks were WTF awards winners? I think our scouts visited Arizona and Virginia this year and forgot that there are 48 other states in the Union with College Football programs.

[WARHORSE]

I expected as much. We dont have the sexy picks.

His hair is too stiff.

[lex]

I think we were lucky to get that, our round 2 pick was VERY questionable and I think the only reason we didn't fail was due to our OL pick ups and the FB in the final round.

Luke warm is being nice, I think most of our other picks were WTF awards winners? I think our scouts visited Arizona and Virginia this year and forgot that there are 48 other states in the Union with College Football programs.

Yeah, our scouts like taking bi-annual trips to the Grand Canyon State to look at marginal running backs.

[LRtagger]

Well at least we got two kick returners :rolleyes:

Maybe we are going to deal Fox or Bly.

Bly and next years 3rd for Chad Johnson...oh wait we already have 5465458413356 WRs on the roster now.

Unless Jack William projects well to Mike as a S, that pick had me :confused:

[tomjonesrocks]

I wondered when all the C grades for the Broncos draft would start coming out.

[shank]

the only reason our picks gave me WTF moments is because my ego said we were going to take the guy from my mock draft with every pick lol.

i have nothing wrong with royal, WR was the obvious choice there and shanny got a guy he thinks can be a WR and a great returner. he must feel that we already have our #2 in colbert or jackson, and has at the very least gotten us a good returner to end the carousel and also gotten stokely's eventual replacement.

i have no problem with jack williams. we all know that shanny likes corners, and it's nice to see him address a problem before it's a huge need (he knows what it's like to have a huge need at corner, and is doing what it takes to avoid a cb saturation draft again in 2010). foxy or paymah or both will be gone next year unless we deal bly. having williams now opens up our options to trade one of them also. not a bad thing.

and torain i have no problem with either. again, i only wtfed because i wanted xavier omon with that pick, but i don't think i have the right to criticize the broncos on a running back pick. torain seems to have some very good upside, and i think he will impress.

our 7th round kicked ass. both of those guys were at some point in people's 3rd and 4th round and we got them both to finish out the day.

when you look at all these guys' character, you have to see that none of them will fail because of a lack of effort or off the field crap! all are hard workers without character issues, or even with high character praise who will give everything they've got to make the team better, and we've been in need of players like that for the last couple years.


i was very critical of shanny up to the draft, and was sure he would mess it up, but a day later, i can see the reasons he picked the guys he picked. obviously we won't know how well the draft went for a while, but jarvis moss was a bigger wtf than anything from this draft. let's see how drafting solid performers with high character over raw guys with high potential and off field issues goes.

[honz]

Who cares what that chump Kiper thinks?

[topscribe]

We have to remember that these are guys on the outside looking in. They are
not privy to the day-to-day operations of the team, nor do they see the
personnel every day. The coaches and FO know what is going on with their
team.

Shanny set out to fill holes, and fill holes he did. That is how one improves a
football team, not by selecting "sexy" picks. There are very few "sexy" players
on New England's defense. All they do is knock you down and step on your
chest on their way to whoever has the ball.

Whatever the Broncos have done out of their front office, they have set the
entire team on its ear with an extreme makeover. And the draft is no
exception. Frankly, I'm tickled with this draft. I'm giving it a solid B+.

-----

[G_Money]

It's gonna be a "potential" draft.

In 5 years we could look back and go "Man! All those guys busted out! Clady really IS Foster the Deuce, Royal can't play wide at the pro level, Lichtensteiger didn't work, Williams is barely hanging on to a roster spot and Torain busted, Barrett and Larsen never turned into anybody, and Hillis is the new Kyle Johnson." It could be a really terrible draft. There aren't any "Sure things."

OTOH, in 5 years it could be this:

"HA! Best draft EVAH!! Clady's in the Pro Bowl.

"Royal's a GREAT #2 and vying with Hester for special teams honors."

"Lichtensteiger is the Man in the middle.

"Williams replaced Bly without breaking a sweat and let us use that money on X.

"And can you believe Torain is a 1500 yard back, Larsen is a rock on D, we have our new Atwater at safety, and our FB is a monster?"

I mean seriously, it's a very talented draft class. We don't know if it will turn into a skilled draft class, or a competent draft class, but the talent really is there, unlike several other years I can name - and we knew it at draft time too, not just 5 years down the road.

But it's definitely gonna need a little bit of patience.

~G

[sacmar]

I think we did just a well as anyone else in this bland draft.

[BroncoWave]

Mel Kiper can take his draft grades and shove em up his ass. :coffee:

[LRtagger]

I think we did just a well as anyone else in this bland draft.

I wouldnt go that far. Not only are there a number of teams that had better drafts, but this was one of the better all-around draft classes in a long time. There was tons of second day talent.

We came nowhere close to the talent that KC picked up. If these guys pan out as they are projected to, KC could be a very good team in a couple of years.

Glenn Dorsey (stud DT)
Brandon Albert (stud OT/G)
Brandon Flowers (stud CB)
Jamaal Charles (great second option back...maybe a premier back)
Brad Cottam (Tony Gonzalez replacement)
DaJuan Morgan (endless potential at S)
Will Franklin (6'1" WR with 4.3 40 speed)
Brandon Carr (dont know much about him...all-american DII CB)
Barry Richardson (huge OT, should be a solid backup...maybe start in a couple years)
Kevin Robinson (labelled "best return man in the country" - wish we would have grabbed him in the 6th rather than Royal in the 2nd)
Brian Johnson (small school DE prospect...dont know much about him but he looks pretty solid for a 7th rounder)
Mike Merritt (270lb blocking TE...similar to what we have in Graham)

I am just surprised they stuck to their guns by not drafting a QB

[topscribe]

It's gonna be a "potential" draft.

In 5 years we could look back and go "Man! All those guys busted out! Clady really IS Foster the Deuce, Royal can't play wide at the pro level, Lichtensteiger didn't work, Williams is barely hanging on to a roster spot and Torain busted, Barrett and Larsen never turned into anybody, and Hillis is the new Kyle Johnson." It could be a really terrible draft. There aren't any "Sure things."

OTOH, in 5 years it could be this:

"HA! Best draft EVAH!! Clady's in the Pro Bowl.

"Royal's a GREAT #2 and vying with Hester for special teams honors."

"Lichtensteiger is the Man in the middle.

"Williams replaced Bly without breaking a sweat and let us use that money on X.

"And can you believe Torain is a 1500 yard back, Larsen is a rock on D, we have our new Atwater at safety, and our FB is a monster?"

I mean seriously, it's a very talented draft class. We don't know if it will turn into a skilled draft class, or a competent draft class, but the talent really is there, unlike several other years I can name - and we knew it at draft time too, not just 5 years down the road.

But it's definitely gonna need a little bit of patience.

~G

All I want to think five years from now is that those were a great couple
Super Bowls we have won in the last five years. :coffee:

-----

[broncophan]

Kiper and all the experts can say whatever they want to say.....

I felt last season that the broncos had fallen a big step behind almost all the other nfl teams................now that the draft has come and gone.....I don't see where we are making up any ground......and I know better than to think that anyone we drafted this year will make any sort of immediate impact.

[Nick]

I really do not care for his grades nor care about his evaluation for many years now.

I just want to see Mayok's report on us... :rolleyes:

[LRtagger]

Or you can look at our picks vs our needs and come to your own conclusion.

If you take the time to evaluate the players, you dont need to rely on the so called experts.

[Retired_Member_001]

http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=222216#post222216

[TXBRONC]

It really doesn't matter what kind of grade we get from Kiper or anyone else that is going to offer their two cents. What is important is that the guys that have been brought in bring positive results with them.

[LoyalSoldier]

C+? Good that usually means we will do well this year. ;)

[TXBRONC]

sounds like kiper gave us a better grade than I did..

KIper has been in the past a pretty good evaluator although I do have to say Mayock is damned good..

90 out of his top 100 were gone by round 4..

That's not a surprise. He actually knows how to evaluate talent.

[fcspikeit]

It's gonna be a "potential" draft.

In 5 years we could look back and go "Man! All those guys busted out! Clady really IS Foster the Deuce, Royal can't play wide at the pro level, Lichtensteiger didn't work, Williams is barely hanging on to a roster spot and Torain busted, Barrett and Larsen never turned into anybody, and Hillis is the new Kyle Johnson." It could be a really terrible draft. There aren't any "Sure things."

OTOH, in 5 years it could be this:

"HA! Best draft EVAH!! Clady's in the Pro Bowl.

"Royal's a GREAT #2 and vying with Hester for special teams honors."

"Lichtensteiger is the Man in the middle.

"Williams replaced Bly without breaking a sweat and let us use that money on X.

"And can you believe Torain is a 1500 yard back, Larsen is a rock on D, we have our new Atwater at safety, and our FB is a monster?"

I mean seriously, it's a very talented draft class. We don't know if it will turn into a skilled draft class, or a competent draft class, but the talent really is there, unlike several other years I can name - and we knew it at draft time too, not just 5 years down the road.

But it's definitely gonna need a little bit of patience.

~G


I don't believe there ever is a "sure thing" when it comes to the draft. But I believe when you look over the guys we got they are all at least good players. It seems more time then not you have to chose between could be great but vary raw now or, is good now and could get better.

Clady is a little of the raw player who looks like he could be great. IMO, every other pick falls in the good now catigory...

I really like Royal. When I watched the combine I thought he was one of the best pure receivers in the draft. I thought he was a little small and not a prototypical wide out.. I didn't even know he was as fast and as good a kick returner as he is.

I remember watching him at the senior bowl too. He ran great routs and had outstanding hands, second only to Nelson. They kept saying these things and backing it up with tape. Watching him and Nelson consistently beat the best corners in the draft was great. As I said, I didn't know he was as good a kick returner as he is. If I had known that I might have even had him ahead of Nelson on my board.

I truly believe Clady, Royal, Lichtensteiger and Hillis will help us out and even start at one point this year for us. I like this draft more every day..

[pipes]

He only gave the Titans, Texans and Jaguars a lower grade than us.

Kiper is a complete moron.

Mayock > Kiper

WRONG!

You are just flat out WRONG!







Mayock > Kiper

not to mention...... NFL Network > ESPN

[TXBRONC]

WRONG!

You are just flat out WRONG!







Mayock > Kiper

not to mention...... NFL Network > ESPN

I haven't heard or read anything on what Mayock thought about our draft have you?

[Tned]

I haven't heard or read anything on what Mayock thought about our draft have you?

He spoke about a couple of the individual picks, like the Royal one, that he liked, but i never saw him address our entire draft.

[TXBRONC]

He spoke about a couple of the individual picks, like the Royal one, that he liked, but i never saw him address our entire draft.

That reminds me, I was watching NFL Access and over the next several days (I thinks it eight to be exact) they will be reviewing each teams entire draft division by division. Tonight it was the AFC East and I think tomorrow is AFC South.

[Ricky]

You cannot grade a draft for at least three years. we need to be looking at the 2005 draft right now for grades. This draft is all speculation at this point.

[studerp]

I wouldnt go that far. Not only are there a number of teams that had better drafts, but this was one of the better all-around draft classes in a long time. There was tons of second day talent.

We came nowhere close to the talent that KC picked up. If these guys pan out as they are projected to, KC could be a very good team in a couple of years.

Glenn Dorsey (stud DT)
Brandon Albert (stud OT/G)
Brandon Flowers (stud CB)
Jamaal Charles (great second option back...maybe a premier back)
Brad Cottam (Tony Gonzalez replacement)
DaJuan Morgan (endless potential at S)
Will Franklin (6'1" WR with 4.3 40 speed)
Brandon Carr (dont know much about him...all-american DII CB)
Barry Richardson (huge OT, should be a solid backup...maybe start in a couple years)
Kevin Robinson (labelled "best return man in the country" - wish we would have grabbed him in the 6th rather than Royal in the 2nd)
Brian Johnson (small school DE prospect...dont know much about him but he looks pretty solid for a 7th rounder)
Mike Merritt (270lb blocking TE...similar to what we have in Graham)

I am just surprised they stuck to their guns by not drafting a QB

I think the Chiefs made out really well in this draft, living in the KC area that is all I ever get to hear about. That being said, it's not real fair to compare our draft with that of KC's, they had 6 picks to our 2 in the first 3 rounds, 2 of which were in the first round.

[LRtagger]

I think the Chiefs made out really well in this draft, living in the KC area that is all I ever get to hear about. That being said, it's not real fair to compare our draft with that of KC's, they had 6 picks to our 2 in the first 3 rounds, 2 of which were in the first round.

I wasnt comparing the two...I was just replying to the comment that we had as good of a draft as anyone and that the draft class was mediocre. I disagree, I think this was one of the better draft classes in recent memory. I just referenced KC because I think they had the best draft of anyone.

There are teams that definitely made out better than we did. Thats not to say our draft was bad, but for comparison's sake, we didnt make out like bandits or anything.

[studerp]

I wasnt comparing the two...I was just replying to the comment that we had as good of a draft as anyone and that the draft class was mediocre. I disagree, I think this was one of the better draft classes in recent memory. I just referenced KC because I think they had the best draft of anyone.

There are teams that definitely made out better than we did. Thats not to say our draft was bad, but for comparison's sake, we didnt make out like bandits or anything.

True enough, I don't think this draft class was all that bad, it just didn't have as many "flashy" prostpects as some, but overall the talent pool was pretty solid. I think we did fairly well in this draft, but like everything else only time will tell.

[TXBRONC]

True enough, I don't think this draft class was all that bad, it just didn't have as many "flashy" prostpects as some, but overall the talent pool was pretty solid. I think we did fairly well in this draft, but like everything else only time will tell.

Yeah overall it was strong draft, but the safety position was weak this year.

[LRtagger]

Yeah overall it was strong draft, but the safety position was weak this year.

S, QB, and LB were pretty weak...if not for Dorsey and Ellis DT would have been super weak too

But OL, RB, FB, CB, DE were all solid with lots of depth. There was still lots and lots of talent on day 2.

I would say that makes for a pretty talented draft.

[mclark]

Through Carlton Powell, I think it was a D grade. I liked our last three picks, the only real values we got in the draft. I like Clady, Lichtensteigner, Larsen, Barrett, and Hills. I expect Eddie Royal to help us at least in the punt return game. I'm hoping Williams, Torian or Powell surprise me. It better be Powell, considering where we needed help.