What does this signal to Orton?

[D1g1tal j1m]

After a day to mull it over, I still don't know how to take it.

What does this say about Orton? He is signed to a one year tender and this pick doesn't really help to satisfy his hopes for a long term contract. So he is playing for a job with another team in 2011. No matter how good of a season he has, there is almost no chance for him to be the starter past 2011. Tebow is gonna be groomed this year to learn and fix his mechanics, with the thought that he will be the Starter by year 2.

The only way Orton is the starter beyond next season is if we win the SB. And I like to be optimistic, but I truly doubt we are that much improved to make that prediction.

[Northman]

Well, at the end of last year McD stated that Orton was going to be better this year. He said Kyle did very well last year and rewarded him by trading a 4th round pick for a former #1 QB in Quinn. He further rewarded Orton by drafting a QB in the first round this year. Kyle is probably like "why did you waste my time coming here? ". lol

[Ravage!!!]

After a day to mull it over, I still don't know how to take it.

What does this say about Orton? He is signed to a one year tender and this pick doesn't really help to satisfy his hopes for a long term contract. So he is playing for a job with another team in 2011. No matter how good of a season he has, there is almost no chance for him to be the starter past 2011. Tebow is gonna be groomed this year to learn and fix his mechanics, with the thought that he will be the Starter by year 2.

The only way Orton is the starter beyond next season is if we win the SB. And I like to be optimistic, but I truly doubt we are that much improved to make that prediction.

I think you said it right. I think he is playing for another team in 2011. I think Orton will consider this season to be an audition for another team.

Honestly, although I REALLY don't expect it to happen, I wouldn't be shocked to see Orton traded during the draft today. I mean, we could 'settle' for Quinn this season, and we know the idea is to have Tebow QB next year.

Orton would be better off being traded now, where he could go to his new city, learn the new team, get a new contract and be settled.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

I think you said it right. I think he is playing for another team in 2011. I think Orton will consider this season to be an audition for another team.

Honestly, although I REALLY don't expect it to happen, I wouldn't be shocked to see Orton traded during the draft today. I mean, we could 'settle' for Quinn this season, and we know the idea is to have Tebow QB next year.

Orton would be better off being traded now, where he could go to his new city, learn the new team, get a new contract and be settled.

All of this might be true, but all in all, nobody might want Orton right now or in the future for anything more than a backup. It would be great to be able to keep him on after this year as the backup to QUinn or Tebow or whoever. Kyle probably won't want to, but if the only offers he gets after this year are to be a backup somewhere else, he might just stay - especially if McDaniels decides he doesn't want to invest the time in Brady Quinn now that Tebow is here.

Honestly, short of Buffalo (today), Oakland, and maybe AZ (if Leinart still hasn't learned how to play QB), where is Orton really going to get an opportunity to start? I think his starting days in this league are numbered. He might just want to resign himself to this and stay where he likes it and help develop the future of the franchise. Just a thought.

[jrelway]

i hope we can trade orton for at least a 3rd or 4th. he's a stand up guy that didnt whine and moan when we got Quinn..hopefully he'll do the same when questioned about the Tebow pick.

[Ravage!!!]

All of this might be true, but all in all, nobody might want Orton right now or in the future for anything more than a backup. It would be great to be able to keep him on after this year as the backup to QUinn or Tebow or whoever. Kyle probably won't want to, but if the only offers he gets after this year are to be a backup somewhere else, he might just stay - especially if McDaniels decides he doesn't want to invest the time in Brady Quinn now that Tebow is here.

Honestly, short of Buffalo (today), Oakland, and maybe AZ (if Leinart still hasn't learned how to play QB), where is Orton really going to get an opportunity to start? I think his starting days in this league are numbered. He might just want to resign himself to this and stay where he likes it and help develop the future of the franchise. Just a thought.

Cleveland.. Buffalo...

But how many starting QBs stay on the team and remain a back-up to the guy that just came in? Rarely, if ever. Just doesn't happen.

Orton will move on to another team if he isn't traded, and I think you are right.... probably as a back-up to someone. He should go to Tennessee, where he would have a legitimate shot at taking over for Vince Young.

[D1g1tal j1m]

I think you said it right. I think he is playing for another team in 2011. I think Orton will consider this season to be an audition for another team.

Honestly, although I REALLY don't expect it to happen, I wouldn't be shocked to see Orton traded during the draft today. I mean, we could 'settle' for Quinn this season, and we know the idea is to have Tebow QB next year.

Orton would be better off being traded now, where he could go to his new city, learn the new team, get a new contract and be settled.

Well, I would have to say that the Broncos will keep Orton through this year. He will give it his best and not make any waves and just go through the season with the thought of improving his overall play. He will become a FA and sign a nice contract with any team that needs a veteran Starter who is a leader in the locker-room. He is a professional on all levels.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

Cleveland.. Buffalo...

But how many starting QBs stay on the team and remain a back-up to the guy that just came in? Rarely, if ever. Just doesn't happen.

Orton will move on to another team if he isn't traded, and I think you are right.... probably as a back-up to someone. He should go to Tennessee, where he would have a legitimate shot at taking over for Vince Young.

Orton couldn't beat out Delhomme. Orton can't run the WCO, Delhome can that's why I didn't put Cleveland on that list. Hell, I don't know if Orton could beat out Seneca Wallace...:confused:

[topscribe]

After a day to mull it over, I still don't know how to take it.

What does this say about Orton? He is signed to a one year tender and this pick doesn't really help to satisfy his hopes for a long term contract. So he is playing for a job with another team in 2011. No matter how good of a season he has, there is almost no chance for him to be the starter past 2011. Tebow is gonna be groomed this year to learn and fix his mechanics, with the thought that he will be the Starter by year 2.

The only way Orton is the starter beyond next season is if we win the SB. And I like to be optimistic, but I truly doubt we are that much improved to make that prediction.

I don't know. What did it signal to Elway when the Broncos drafted Maddox #1?

What's important are the signals Orton delivers to himself. He could fold his tent,
like Plummer did, or he could say, "Yeah, we'll see about that."

That is the only thing that is going to make any difference in Orton's case . . .

-----

[silkamilkamonico]

Orton couldn't beat out Delhomme. Orton can't run the WCO, Delhome can that's why I didn't put Cleveland on that list. Hell, I don't know if Orton could beat out Seneca Wallace...:confused:

I don't like Orton, but let's not be absurd about him. He could play for 10-12 NFL teams this year, at least.

[Ravage!!!]

Orton couldn't beat out Delhomme. Orton can't run the WCO, Delhome can that's why I didn't put Cleveland on that list. Hell, I don't know if Orton could beat out Seneca Wallace...:confused:

I'm thinking of guys that could get injured. Delhomme isn't a sturdy dude anymore...

Pitt might be an option... :lol:

San Fran always has QB problems. Cincinatti has a QB that gets hurt.


I still think Tennessee would be the optimum place to be, if you are a back-up QB that wants to have a chance to start for a good team.

[D1g1tal j1m]

I don't know. What did it signal to Elway when the Broncos drafted Maddox #1?

What's important are the signals Orton delivers to himself. I could fold his tent,
like Plummer did, or he could say, "Yeah, we'll see about that."

That is the only thing that is going to make any difference in Orton's case . . .

-----

Good points. We will see.

Onto round two of the draft...

[Ravage!!!]

I can think of Buffalo, Cleveland, Jags, Oakland, Tampa (?), AZ....

[Dean]

I don't know. What did it signal to Elway when the Broncos drafted Maddox #1?

What's important are the signals Orton delivers to himself. I could fold his tent,
like Plummer did, or he could say, "Yeah, we'll see about that."

That is the only thing that is going to make any difference in Orton's case . . .

-----


It signaled that the coach was on his way out the door if I remember correctly. ;)

[Ravage!!!]

Well, I would have to say that the Broncos will keep Orton through this year. He will give it his best and not make any waves and just go through the season with the thought of improving his overall play. He will become a FA and sign a nice contract with any team that needs a veteran Starter who is a leader in the locker-room. He is a professional on all levels.

Yeah.. like I said.. I don't really see it happening, but Iwouldn't be shocked if it happened considering our roster as it is right now, with the contracts as they are right now.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

I don't like Orton, but let's not be absurd about him. He could play for 10-12 NFL teams this year, at least.

Okay, name them please...

Who is he really better than?

Sure the Rams look terrible right now, but they've got their new man.

I see Buffalo (unless they draft McCoy or Clausen), Oakland, maybe Arizona, maybe the Vikings if Favre doesn't come back although I don't think he's a big trade up from Sage Rosenfels.

That's four (other than us) I can come up with. So, who am I missing?

Look, I LOVE Orton as a person and as a teammate, but the guy really is limited in what he brings to the offense. EVERYONE knows this. Most importantly MCDANIELS believes this or he wouldn't have brought in 2 "starting caliber" QBs in Orton's contract year to compete to replace him next year. Not even the might Bellicheat (who swears by competition) brings in "competition" for Brady. The writing is on the wall.

[Tempus Fugit]

What did it signal to Tom Brady when the Patriots drafted O'Connell in round 3?

[Northman]

What did it signal to Tom Brady when the Patriots drafted O'Connell in round 3?

Are you saying that O'Connell is worthy of a 1st round draft choice? Generally, when you draft a first round Qb that is a signal that you are planning on him starting SOON. You draft backup QB's later in the draft.

[Lancane]

What did it signal to Tom Brady when the Patriots drafted O'Connell in round 3?

Orton's not a Tom Brady...

What it signals is that if he wants a job after this year he should play lights out or he will be a backup for the rest of his career elsewhere!

:coffee:

[Lonestar]

with out reading all of the comments on this I will say.

Ortin was and still is in his CONTRACT year.

HE has always known that their will be competion brought in to make him as well as EVERY position work harder to get better.

What does it say IF you want to be our starter in 2011, you are going to have to show us why Tebow should be on the bench as your backup.

IF he plays lights out that means we win, he gets a big contract from someone if not us.

If he does not then well he gets a backup contract with someone, perhaps DEN.

[topscribe]

Okay, name them please...

Who is he really better than?

Sure the Rams look terrible right now, but they've got their new man.

I see Buffalo (unless they draft McCoy or Clausen), Oakland, maybe Arizona, maybe the Vikings if Favre doesn't come back although I don't think he's a big trade up from Sage Rosenfels.

That's four (other than us) I can come up with. So, who am I missing?

Look, I LOVE Orton as a person and as a teammate, but the guy really is limited in what he brings to the offense. EVERYONE knows this. Most importantly MCDANIELS believes this or he wouldn't have brought in 2 "starting caliber" QBs in Orton's contract year to compete to replace him next year. Not even the might Bellicheat (who swears by competition) brings in "competition" for Brady. The writing is on the wall.

You know, when a team brings in a QB from somewhere else, the coaches put
him through a preseason program against the present QBs to see who is
better. Which makes it ludicrous to me that fans can sit in front of a computer
and post in a message board who is better than whom. :lol:

-----

[broncophan]

with out reading all of the comments on this I will say.

Ortin was and still is in his CONTRACT year.

HE has always known that their will be competion brought in to make him as well as EVERY position work harder to get better.

What does it say IF you want to be our starter in 2011, you are going to have to show us why Tebow should be on the bench as your backup.

IF he plays lights out that means we win, he gets a big contract from someone if not us.

If he does not then well he gets a backup contract with someone, perhaps DEN.

Could you imagine what Cutler would have to say IF he was a bronco right now??

[Northman]

Yea, Elway was saying WTF too when Reeves drafted Maddox. lmao

[Lancane]

Yea, Elway was saying WTF too when Reeves drafted Maddox. lmao

That's cause Bowlen was telling Elway "that bitch Reeve's is a goner...".

:lol:

[broncophan]

Yea, Elway was saying WTF too when Reeves drafted Maddox. lmao

Yep.....Elway knew when to shut up and play football though......:salute:

[HORSEPOWER 56]

You know, when a team brings in a QB from somewhere else, the coaches put
him through a preseason program against the present QBs to see who is
better. Which makes it ludicrous to me that fans can sit in front of a computer
and post in a message board who is better than whom. :lol:

-----

Exactly, but I've NEVER seen a coach who was HAPPY with his current QB bring in not just one, but two FIRST ROUND PICK CALIBER QBs to compete with him IN HIS CONTRACT YEAR.

Topper, I know you love you some Orton, but unless some unforseen event magically removes both Tebow and Quinn (who still has what, 3 years left on his deal?) from Denver, Orton won't be our starter past this year. Even if he plays great. Even if we win the Superbowl and he's the MVP of the probowl. At that point, we'll be have a Brees/Rivers conundrum and the new guy will stay while Orton looks for a job elsewhere. It's just football.

[Northman]

That's cause Bowlen was telling Elway "that bitch Reeve's is a goner...".

:lol:

Well of course, he went and spoke to the boss and cleared it up. But, from a QB standpoint it had to rub him the wrong way. Orton has got to be like "wtf". :lol:

[Northman]

It's just football.

Well shit dude, ive been saying that about Cutler, Sheff, and Marshall. :D

[Tempus Fugit]

Are you saying that O'Connell is worthy of a 1st round draft choice? Generally, when you draft a first round Qb that is a signal that you are planning on him starting SOON. You draft backup QB's later in the draft.

1.) No, I'm not saying O'Connell is worthy of a 1st round pick. I thought that was an idiotic choice by the Patriots.

2.) It's acknowledged that Tebow is considered a project player. How much of a project is a question that only McDaniels can answer, so this question being asked in this thread is really going to be nothing more than guesswork as a result.


Orton had better play well if he wants to keep his job. However, for all we know, it could be Quinn who takes the job away from him if he struggles, and not Tebow. I'm sure Orton knew that already.

[topscribe]

Exactly, but I've NEVER seen a coach who was HAPPY with his current QB bring in not just one, but two FIRST ROUND PICK CALIBER QBs to compete with him IN HIS CONTRACT YEAR.

Topper, I know you love you some Orton, but unless some unforseen event magically removes both Tebow and Quinn (who still has what, 3 years left on his deal?) from Denver, Orton won't be our starter past this year. Even if he plays great. Even if we win the Superbowl and he's the MVP of the probowl. At that point, we'll be have a Brees/Rivers conundrum and the new guy will stay while Orton looks for a job elsewhere. It's just football.

You don't know anything in that effect. All I have done is to correct some lies and
misconceptions about Orton because I had studied him deeply, and I knew
different. That is all I did. I never made any predictions. I only presented facts on
what he has already done and tried to enter some logic as to why things are the
way they are.

Now, regarding your question about bringing in two "first round caliber" QBs:
What gives you the idea Quinn is a first-round caliber QB? Was it that he was
drafted in the 1st round, or was it his three (3) wins? Was it a surprise to you
that Quinn was brought in and Simms was released? I expected another QB to
be brought in because of Simms. How is it you see differently?

Regarding Tebow, I remember when Reeves drafted Maddox. What you said
about the Brees/Rivers deal, I've already said twice today. Do you ever read
my posts, or do you just respond without reading them?

-----

[SoCalImport]

I, for one, have never seen Orton as more than a really good back up anyway. I like him as a Bronco and as a stopgap between "franchise" QBs.
Best QB at camp gets it. That's all.

[WARHORSE]

This signals nothing other than Work Hard.

[Ravage!!!]

It tells you that you aren't in the teams plans for the future.

Anytime, you have your best season as a pro, and the owner says to the media "I expect that we go out and get a QB"... then on Draft day... your coach uses a 2nd 3rd and 4th to move into the first and uses that 1st round pick on a high-profile QB................. it says something.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

You don't know anything in that effect. All I have done is to correct some lies and
misconceptions about Orton because I had studied him deeply, and I knew
different. That is all I did. I never made any predictions. I only presented facts on
what he has already done and tried to enter some logic as to why things are the
way they are.

Now, regarding your question about bringing in two "first round caliber" QBs:
What gives you the idea Quinn is a first-round caliber QB? Was it that he was
drafted in the 1st round, or was it his three (3) wins? Was it a surprise to you
that Quinn was brought in and Simms was released? I expected another QB to
be brought in because of Simms. How is it you see differently?

Regarding Tebow, I remember when Reeves drafted Maddox. What you said
about the Brees/Rivers deal, I've already said twice today. Do you ever read
my posts, or do you just respond without reading them?

-----

I dubbed Quinn "1st round caliber" because he was drafted in the 1st round and had a 1st round grade. That's why. I can sort of buy the whole "Quinn was brought to replace Simms, not Orton" defense. It's a stretch seeing as how Quinn played for a McDaniels' mentor using essentially the same system, but I'll buy it. We didn't spend the 1st rounder on Quinn so there's no real rush to get him on the field.

But now Tebow? With Brandstater still here, too? What is the reasoning? We obviously feel Tebow is first round caliber because we drafted him there. We'll be shelling out that 1st round contract. There will be some expectation within the next couple of years that Tebow will be our starter.

Sure I read your posts, top. I just don't read all of them in every different thread. I've only responded to the ones in this thread.

[Northman]

This signals nothing other than Work Hard.

Tell Dan Reeves that. :lol:

[Lancane]

When will Denver's first round quarterback pick, Tim Tebow, be able to start in the NFL?

Shanahan: Oh, I can't answer that, but I can say is I would never bet against the kid. He's one of the most enjoyable people I've ever been around. You're talking about a class guy, and almost too good to be true, and then when you meet him, he's the real deal. What you see is what you get, and I'm a really big fan of his. I think Josh [McDaniels, the Broncos coach] will do, and I don't want to speak for Josh, but he can run the offense he's been running very, very well.

It will take him time to adjust to an NFL system, but along the way he can really keep a defense off balance by implementing some of the things he did in college and obviously him learning the system as time goes on.



Shanahan: Don't bet against Tebow

Gailey, Shanahan, Mayock, McDaniels, Belichick...???

[Northman]

Gailey, Shanahan, Mayock, McDaniels, Belichick...???

Think he will be better than Jay?

[G_Money]

You forgot Chucky.

For all his detractors, he has a lot of supporters too.

~G

[Lancane]

Think he will be better than Jay?

Whoops, forgot Gruden...

No all of em' have been high on the kid, or say don't bet against him succeeding in the NFL. Gailey tried to draft him, we know Del Rio and company were thinking of taking him in the second as well as Belichick.

He seems to be picking up momentum now that he's drafted rather then more negative.

[G_Money]

Orton has never had a secure future and isn't likely to. He's gonna be dogfighting for starting time his whole career. If it happened to Warner for much of his, it can happen to Orton who is a far less capable QB.

Some guys crack under that, and to his credit Orton doesn't seem to. He just keeps putting in his audition for next year's starting lineup, no matter whose lineup that might wind up being.

I may not like him as the QB who's going to carry our franchise to the next level, but I can respect that about him.

Orton will be fine. He's not Plummer in that regard. All he has to do this year is beat out Quinn and impress his next suitor. He should be able to stay focused on that and let the Tebow whirlwind swirl behind him.

~G

[GEM]

I'm thinking of guys that could get injured. Delhomme isn't a sturdy dude anymore...

Pitt might be an option... :lol:

San Fran always has QB problems. Cincinatti has a QB that gets hurt.


I still think Tennessee would be the optimum place to be, if you are a back-up QB that wants to have a chance to start for a good team.

Pittsburgh has a QB that finds bathrooms more interesting than football fields. :shocked:

[Lancane]

Pittsburgh has a QB that finds bathrooms more interesting than football fields. :shocked:

So I take it GEM that if you ever pass through Pittsburgh your not stopping to use a public restroom?

:laugh:

[broncophan]

I think Orton is on his way out.....sooner....rather than later......but we need a vet imo....to show Tebow the ropes........so hopefully that happens this year.

I hope ,in Tebow, the broncos have their qb for the next 10-12 years.....although that is a stretch.....but it would be nice....we have had issues at qb since you know who retired.

[Dreadnought]

Pittsburgh has a QB that finds bathrooms more interesting than football fields. :shocked:

Poor Ben - so misunderstood. And after bouncing his head off that windshield so hard, too. I bet he was just lonely.

Seriously, and one of my major complaints with McDaniels, is that his public pronouncements of confidence haven't worked out so well. Almost like he wasn't telling the truth or something. Ask any number of guys he ran out of here - some traded for the equivalent of half a stale ham sandwich - and it was pretty apparent he had predetermined to rid himself of them sight unseen, or close enough. If McD starts in again about all the things KO brings to the table I'd suggest KO start talking to realtors.

[GEM]

So I take it GEM that if you ever pass through Pittsburgh your not stopping to use a public restroom?

:laugh:

I'm not big on public restrooms in any cities, but Pittsburgh especially! :laugh:

[Dreadnought]

I'm not big on public restrooms in any cities, but Pittsburgh especially! :laugh:

I think Idaho could be dodgy too, at least if you run into an older guy with a "wide stance"

[LoyalSoldier]

I don't know. What did it signal to Elway when the Broncos drafted Maddox #1?

What's important are the signals Orton delivers to himself. I could fold his tent,
like Plummer did, or he could say, "Yeah, we'll see about that."

That is the only thing that is going to make any difference in Orton's case . . .

-----

Either "You aren't going to be here in the future" or "We don't know what the hell we are doing"

Either of which could be true in this case

[Dreadnought]

Either "You aren't going to be here in the future" or "We don't know what the hell we are doing"

Either of which could be true in this case

Both I think. Dan Reeves infatuation with that total stiff is one of the mysteries of the ages. Almost ghey or something.

[ursamajor]

I don't know. What did it signal to Elway when the Broncos drafted Maddox #1?

What's important are the signals Orton delivers to himself. I could fold his tent,
like Plummer did, or he could say, "Yeah, we'll see about that."

That is the only thing that is going to make any difference in Orton's case . . .

-----

Kyle is used to competition. He will lace his boots up.

[Lancane]

Kyle is used to competition. He will lace his boots up.

He needs them laced, it's a long walk to Buffalo...:lol:

[KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128]

Hopefully this challenges orton to be better than he's ever been before. If not, we've got three other qb's dying for some knowledge and playing time and money. Competition is exactly what mcd wanted and it's exactly what mcd will have.

[KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128]

He needs them laced, it's a long walk to Buffalo...:lol:

tebow is not taking any nfl qb's place for at least a few years. get used to crying for the qb to be benched.

[Ravage!!!]

tebow is not taking any nfl qb's place for at least a few years. get used to crying for the qb to be benched.

I heard people say the same thing about Cutler when he was drafted.

I'll just say the same thing, even though I don't think Tebow will be 'that' Qb.....

You don't draft a QB in the first round, to sit for 2-3 years. We see rookies start all the time... we even saw Vince Young start his rookie year. We'll see Tebow starting by the end of this season, and he'll be the starting QB next year. McD has hitched to this wagon, and he's not going to have him sit the bench.