Marshall signs tender

[broncobryce]

just heard it on ESPN from Schefter

[Mike]

So I guess we should expect to hear about a trade soon.

[T.K.O.]

uh oh....sounds like the trade winds are a blowin'

[Lancane]

just heard it on ESPN from Schefter

If it's true then a trade is likely to be announced in the next day or two.

[Slick]

We are fools for doing this.

[Northman]

Sweet. Time to get this nightmare over with.

[Lancane]

We are fools for doing this.

Very true...

[Northman]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5082365





By Adam Schefter
ESPN
Archive

Wide receiver Brandon Marshall signed his $2.5 million tender Tuesday, according to a league source, which will facilitate trade talks between the Denver Broncos and other teams until and through the draft.

The Broncos now have the ability to shop Marshall and see if they can find a satisfactory trade proposal for their Pro Bowl wide receiver.

The only team that Marshall visited during free agency was Seattle. But the Seahawks opted not to sign Marshall to an offer sheet that might have cost them the sixth overall pick.

The Seahawks remain interested, as do other teams.

Adam Schefter is ESPN's NFL Insider.

[Tempus Fugit]

We are fools for doing this.

When you consider what the Steelers did with Holmes, I'm not sure why your automatic reaction is to call the Broncos fools for doing essentially the same thing, especially if they get more value out of the deal.

[Italianmobstr7]

When you consider what the Steelers did with Holmes, I'm not sure why your automatic reaction is to call the Broncos fools for doing essentially the same thing, especially if they get more value out of the deal.

Because Marshall is twice the WR Holmes is.

[Northman]

Because Marshall is twice the WR Holmes is.

And twice the headache.

[Bosco]

Sweet. Time to get this nightmare over with.

Amen brother.

And Brandon...

http://insom.info/waprod/images/Reactions/tshirt-m-****-Green-art-280.gif

[broncofaninfla]

I can't say it enough.......we are a better team with Marshall than without him. Without Marshall last year we lose 2-3 more games. In this dink and dunk anemic offense we need a guy who can break the big one after the five yard reception, Marshall is that guy for us. His size and athletic ability is a HUGE issues for the DB's trying to bring him down. I can't say it enough, I truly feel trading Marshall is a HUGE mistake if all we get out of it is a draft pick. A proven vet would be acceptable but would leave a glaring hole at WR (assuming that vet isn't a WR).

[broncofaninfla]

If the Broncos brass had people skills, Marshall wouldn't have had a lot of the issues he had last year.....

[Northman]

I can't say it enough.......we are a better team with Marshall than without him. Without Marshall last year we lose 2-3 more games. In this dink and dunk anemic offense we need a guy who can break the big one after the five yard reception, Marshall is that guy for us. His size and athletic ability is a HUGE issues for the DB's trying to bring him down. I can't say it enough, I truly feel trading Marshall is a HUGE mistake if all we get out of it is a draft pick. A proven vet would be acceptable but would leave a glaring hole at WR (assuming that vet isn't a WR).

A lot of people said that last year after letting Cutler walk and we still did better than the team that took him in. Marshall isnt the be all end all to receivers so im not worried one bit. Ive been a Bronco fan for a long time and will continue to be one no matter what players come and go. This team will be fine.

[Northman]

If the Broncos brass had people skills, Marshall wouldn't have had a lot of the issues he had last year.....

:lol:

Wow, clueless.

[rationalfan]

If the Broncos brass had people skills, Marshall wouldn't have had a lot of the issues he had last year.....

of course, the inverse is also very plausible.

[Mike]

If the Broncos brass had people skills, Marshall wouldn't have had a lot of the issues he had last year.....

If Marshall wasn't a headcase he would have his contract and the Broncos wouldn't be in this situation.

[Northman]

of course, the inverse is also very plausible.

I thought it was funny that Bowlen punted his contract.....wait.....

[Northman]

If Marshall wasn't a headcase he would have his contract and the Broncos wouldn't be in this situation.


Talking to people who cant see the bigger picture man. Sorry to say.

[broncofaninfla]

From PFT-
"The reality is that plenty of high-end receivers can present challenges. It's still not clear whether the position attracts divas or creates them. Either way, the better the player, the more likely he'll be a potential pain in the posterior."

[broncofaninfla]

Because Orton to Gaffeny scares the hell out of opposing defenses.....:tsk:

[Northman]

From PFT-
"The reality is that plenty of high-end receivers can present challenges. It's still not clear whether the position attracts divas or creates them. Either way, the better the player, the more likely he'll be a potential pain in the posterior."


PFT :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::

Yea, Fitz, Wayne, they all are behaving like babies and slapping women around. :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::

[Bosco]

I can't say it enough.......we are a better team with Marshall than without him. Without Marshall last year we lose 2-3 more games. The Patroits game is the only one we were likely to lose without Marshall.


In this dink and dunk anemic offense we need a guy who can break the big one after the five yard reception Not really how McD's offense works.


If the Broncos brass had people skills, Marshall wouldn't have had a lot of the issues he had last year..... Say what?

[broncofaninfla]

PFT :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::

Yea, Fitz, Wayne, they all are behaving like babies and slapping women around. :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::

Ignorant.....and you called me clueless......

[broncofaninfla]

The Patroits game is the only one we were likely to lose without Marshall.

Not really how McD's offense works.

Say what?

Add the Cowboys game in there as well......


Please explain to me how Mcd's offense works. 1,2,3 punt?

[Mike]

Because Orton to Gaffeny scares the hell out of opposing defenses.....:tsk:

Because Orton to anyone scares the hell out of opposing defenses. :noidea:

I like Marshall and think he is a top 5 WR. But, to me, it all boils down to one thing...you don't want to be a Bronco, then I don't want you to be a Bronco.

[Northman]

My god, i cannot wait for him to be gone at this point so the bandwagon fans can get the **** off this board. Good lord their tripe is so tiring at this point.

[broncobryce]

If the Broncos brass had people skills, Marshall wouldn't have had a lot of the issues he had last year.....

And if the woman hadn't made Brandon mad, he wouldn't have hit her. And if Bowlen would give Brandon the contract he wanted.......and if the cops hadn't pulled Brandon over........Come on man, he needs to take responsibility for his actions. That's what ADULTS do.

[Lancane]

My god, i cannot wait for him to be gone at this point so the bandwagon fans can get the **** off this board. Good lord their tripe is so tiring at this point.

Bandwagon fans? Why is it that you believe you’re a real fan and others are not just because they don’t agree with you? Now that is ignorant…

[broncobryce]

And if that Mcdonald's bag hadn't been there......

[Italianmobstr7]

Very frustrated that it looks like Marshall is as good as gone. I wish we wouldve re-signed him to a long term deal. Kind of shocking that our 2 best players from Shamnys best draft are out the door. I'll always support the Broncos but this move stings.

[slim]

And the meltdown begins.

[Northman]

And if that Mcdonald's bag hadn't been there......


Its no wonder why Brandon could punt the ball so well after kicking his fiance all the time. And he's used to getting cut by glass after punching the windows to his last girlfriends car. I mean, thats completely rational right? :lol::lol::lol:

[underrated29]

Good lord.


he cleaned up his act. He wants to get paid to match his production, but he is now out of town.....


Why no talk of doom, of Orton? because we dont have offers on the tables for them. We do for brandon and as much as I hate hate hate to see him go. he is gone.....I just want us to get better then fair value....

[broncobryce]

Hasn't happened yet. The tenders have to be signed by Thursday anyway. But it does appear the offers are heating up....

[Nomad]

:pop2:Another Marshall thread:lol:!

I'm glad to see the Marshall matter moving along and not lingering without answers any longer!

So he signs a tender and I assume that means a team will match or go higher??

[Lancane]

And the meltdown begins.

There shouldn’t be a meltdown from either those for or against this move, but we should be able to openly disagree with it, and without people acting like total asses over it. It’s not that big of a shock if he is traded since it’s been out there for so long.

[CoachChaz]

It doesnt hurt us if he doesnt sign it, so that tells me there must be a few good offers being discussed.


Or maybe they made out.

[arapaho2]

And if the woman hadn't made Brandon mad, he wouldn't have hit her. And if Bowlen would give Brandon the contract he wanted.......and if the cops hadn't pulled Brandon over........Come on man, he needs to take responsibility for his actions. That's what ADULTS do.


adults also shouldnt slander...so your gonna have to show me one conviction for hitting a woman of marshall...otherwise your just blowing wind

[Italianmobstr7]

I really can't get over the fact that were trading away a superstar, pro bowl player and for what looks to be less than a 1st round pick. Makes me sick. The fact that he's my favorite player makes it worse, but now it looks as if were getting shitty compensation too. Just freaking ridiculous.

[Tempus Fugit]

Because Marshall is twice the WR Holmes is.

Both are top flight receivers with major problems off the field. Both have been locker room problems. Both have had 1,200 yard seasons. Some other notes:

Holmes has been a Super Bowl MVP.
Marshall has seen his Y/C fall every year he's been in the league.
Marshall's receiving yardage has fallen for 2 straight seasons.


You may be of the opinion that Marshall is the better receiver, and that's certainly a defensible claim, but he's pretty clearly not "twice" the WR Holmes is.

[Northman]

adults also shouldnt slander...so your gonna have to show me one conviction for hitting a woman of marshall...otherwise your just blowing wind

Let me call OJ.

[CoachChaz]

There shouldn’t be a meltdown from either those for or against this move, but we should be able to openly disagree with it, and without people acting like total asses over it. It’s not that big of a shock if he is traded since it’s been out there for so long.

You been here before?

[Northman]

At this point i will just be glad to have that POS off this team and move on to greener pastures.

[Lancane]

It doesnt hurt us if he doesnt sign it, so that tells me there must be a few good offers being discussed.


Or maybe they made out.

I’m pretty sure that a trade is in the works already and the final details are probably being worked out. Too many sources have mentioned that talks were in fact heating up, McDaniels has probably heard or countered an offer they are somewhat interested in and decided to get him signed so it would be less of a headache.

[weazel]

well that would mean no one wanted to give up a1st rounder for him...

[slim]

There shouldn’t be a meltdown from either those for or against this move, but we should be able to openly disagree with it, and without people acting like total asses over it. It’s not that big of a shock if he is traded since it’s been out there for so long.

I agree, there shouldn't be...but we all know there will be.

[underrated29]

At this point i will just be glad to have that POS off this team and move on to greener pastures.




come on man. He is not a POS.

he may have been dumb or more than a few occasions, but he never tore apart the locker room like TO did, or create a division, or call out his QB or coach. Marshall was just immature- possibly still, but so far it looks like he is over that.



A headcase, cancer, pos--I disagree with anyone who calls him this.....




HOWEVER- I will be happy as you are that this is finally over and done with. As it has been annoying. And I would like to have an offseason where we add probowl talent instead of it trying to leave.

[Northman]

I agree, there shouldn't be...but we all know there will be.


The crying has already started.

[Nomad]

He'll be a Buccaneer, that's my guess!!!

[underrated29]

The crying has already started.



Just wait until we get a 2nd and ted ginn for marshall and our 4th.... Then they crying will be an uproar..


people will find everything to bytch about. Including JMFMD benching brandon the last game of the season.

[slim]

The crying has already started.

I know.

I am thinking about joining a Rockies forum for the rest of the summer. I figure a few months should be enough time for this to blow over.

[weazel]

you sure he signed a tender and not a restraining order?

[topscribe]

I really can't get over the fact that were trading away a superstar, pro bowl player and for what looks to be less than a 1st round pick. Makes me sick. The fact that he's my favorite player makes it worse, but now it looks as if were getting shitty compensation too. Just freaking ridiculous.

I don't believe anything definitive has been said about a trade, has it? Yes, I'm
sure negotiations are going on, but two different results are still possible: (1) a
trade or (2) no trade.

We'll have to see . . .

:ducksForIncoming:

-----

[Northman]

come on man. He is not a POS.

he may have been dumb or more than a few occasions, but he never tore apart the locker room like TO did, or create a division, or call out his QB or coach. Marshall was just immature- possibly still, but so far it looks like he is over that.



A headcase, cancer, pos--I disagree with anyone who calls him this.....




HOWEVER- I will be happy as you are that this is finally over and done with. As it has been annoying. And I would like to have an offseason where we add probowl talent instead of it trying to leave.


Actually, i probably would be a little more forgiving if he was a lockerroom cancer. But lets face it, off the field he has some serious issues with women and i just cant get down with that. One incident? Ok, forgiveable. But many with different women? Nah, thats inexcusable. People with their heads in the sand will say that he wasnt convicted (yea, a lot of athletes and celebs dont get convicted) gives him a pass but im not one of those. There's a trend there with him and he has a very low character to me. Talented as he is i just dont really want that kind of garbage here.

[Lancane]

He'll be a Buccaneer, that's my guess!!!

That’s the consensus in Florida, but don’t discount Seattle just quite yet.

[Nomad]

That’s the consensus in Florida, but don’t discount Seattle just quite yet.

Either way, if he's not going to be a BRONCO at least he'll be on an NFC team and their 2nds are really high or does Seattle have a 2nd:confused:!!!

[Bosco]

Add the Cowboys game in there as well... We likely win that game anyway. We were driving and already 2 yards away from Cowboys territory with a tie game. Even if Brandon doesn't take that 10 yard catch and turn it into a 51 yard touchdown, we're still just outside field goal range with another first down.


Please explain to me how Mcd's offense works. 1,2,3 punt? McD's offense is predicated on a tall, physical and fast receiver (the "X" receiver) and a smaller, quicker slot guy who gets lots of YAC (the "Z" receiver). Moss and Welker play these roles, respectively, in New England. Marshall is a poor fit for both as he's too slow to play the X spot and too big and not quick enough for the Z spot. He fits in at the "Y" receiver role which features alot of intermediate routes. Gaffney played this role in New England and in Denver as well when Marshall wasn't on the field.

What that left us with in Denver was having to refocus the offense on the Y receiver and trying to stick Royal in as the X receiver since he was the only one with the deep speed to play there, and that created problems all season for us.

[JDL]

well that would mean no one wanted to give up a1st rounder for him...

So, we AREN'T getting the 6th overall pick for Marshall? :eek: jeez... who woulda thunk .... hmmmm lol.



At least, the absurdity about those types of things or deals can end.

Also, I wouldn't say at all things have changed one bit. McDaniels called Marshall today to say that nobody is willing to give up a 1st rd pick for him and that he might as well sign the tender and they'll see if between now and the draft the Broncos can find a suitable trade partner. Marshall probably just said fine, but don't expect me to come in and play on a 1 year deal, just so we're clear. McD probably fully understands that (or he should.)

Honestly, the move is much ado about jacksquat... it doesn't necessarily mean a trade is imminent it more than likely means an offer sheet was not imminent or likely from any team. We now enter stage 2 and as most reasonable Broncos fans have known, something creativity will have to be done, which requires Brandon signing the tender. I quite frankly doubt this resolves itself before wee hours of Thursday/Friday next week between Rounds 1 and 2. We probably would take the Rams 2nd rd pick, but the Rams could very well be intent on just waiting to see who is there, if there is genuinely no serious interest in Marshall before the draft and there really hasn't been. Just teams keeping an eye on the situation. Personally, as I've always stated, I'd give him a reasonable contract offer, hopefully sign him and go forward this year, but ultimately and QUIETLY make him available. Yeah we eat the guaranteed money paid out this year (which won't be much due to his past - plenty of incentives and all, but maybe 10-12mil up front), but we are really just buying more trade value which will help the team long-term. There are plenty of teams trying desperately to win now before the strike season since their window of opportunity is so small due to their key aging vets. At the very least, it should ease the constant drama around Denver... it'd be nice to go a couple months with hearing about Denver dealing with this situation or that.

[Northman]

So, we AREN'T getting the 6th overall pick for Marshall? :eek: jeez... who woulda thunk .... hmmmm lol.



At least, the absurdity about those types of things or deals can end.

Also, I wouldn't say at all things have changed one bit. McDaniels called Marshall today to say that nobody is willing to give up a 1st rd pick for him and that he might as well sign the tender and they'll see if between now and the draft the Broncos can find a suitable trade partner. Marshall probably just said fine, but don't expect me to come in and play on a 1 year deal, just so we're clear. McD probably fully understands that (or he should.)

Honestly, the move is much ado about jacksquat... it doesn't necessarily mean a trade is imminent it more than likely means an offer sheet was not imminent or likely from any team. We now enter stage 2 and as most reasonable Broncos fans have known, something creativity will have to be done, which requires Brandon signing the tender. I quite frankly doubt this resolves itself before wee hours of Thursday/Friday next week between Rounds 1 and 2. We probably would take the Rams 2nd rd pick, but the Rams could very well be intent on just waiting to see who is there, if there is genuinely no serious interest in Marshall before the draft and there really hasn't been. Just teams keeping an eye on the situation. Personally, as I've always stated, I'd give him a reasonable contract offer, hopefully sign him and go forward this year, but ultimately and QUIETLY make him available. Yeah we eat the guaranteed money paid out this year (which won't be much due to his past - plenty of incentives and all, but maybe 10-12mil up front), but we are really just buying more trade value which will help the team long-term. There are plenty of teams trying desperately to win now before the strike season since their window of opportunity is so small due to their key aging vets. At the very least, it should ease the constant drama around Denver... it'd be nice to go a couple months with hearing about Denver dealing with this situation or that.


JDL, go away. Your a total buzzkill here. :lol:

[Tempus Fugit]

We likely win that game anyway. We were driving and already 2 yards away from Cowboys territory with a tie game. Even if Brandon doesn't take that 10 yard catch and turn it into a 51 yard touchdown, we're still just outside field goal range with another first down.

McD's offense is predicated on a tall, physical and fast receiver (the "X" receiver) and a smaller, quicker slot guy who gets lots of YAC (the "Z" receiver). Moss and Welker play these roles, respectively, in New England. Marshall is a poor fit for both as he's too slow to play the X spot and too big and not quick enough for the Z spot. He fits in at the "Y" receiver role which features alot of intermediate routes. Gaffney played this role in New England and in Denver as well when Marshall wasn't on the field.

What that left us with in Denver was having to refocus the offense on the Y receiver and trying to stick Royal in as the X receiver since he was the only one with the deep speed to play there, and that created problems all season for us.

Well said. New England went from a "whoever's open" offense from 2001-2006 to a "Randy first, Wes second, everyone else if there's time" approach after the 2007 draft. McDaniel's seen both styles, and he's had success with both, but I'm sure he prefers the latter, and I'm sure he'd much rather find another WR1 type than try tweaking the offense to work with two players who would ideally be WR3 types in his preferred offense.

[JDL]

We likely win that game anyway. We were driving and already 2 yards away from Cowboys territory with a tie game. Even if Brandon doesn't take that 10 yard catch and turn it into a 51 yard touchdown, we're still just outside field goal range with another first down.

McD's offense is predicated on a tall, physical and fast receiver (the "X" receiver) and a smaller, quicker slot guy who gets lots of YAC (the "Z" receiver). Moss and Welker play these roles, respectively, in New England. Marshall is a poor fit for both as he's too slow to play the X spot and too big and not quick enough for the Z spot. He fits in at the "Y" receiver role which features alot of intermediate routes. Gaffney played this role in New England and in Denver as well when Marshall wasn't on the field.

What that left us with in Denver was having to refocus the offense on the Y receiver and trying to stick Royal in as the X receiver since he was the only one with the deep speed to play there, and that created problems all season for us.

Actually, Royal ran plenty of slot routes (Welker routes), but Orton didn't have the accuracy to hit him and constantly focused on the bigger Marshall. The reason Royal's numbers went down was not the types of routes he was running but the types of routes that Orton can hit... Royal and Gaffney were routinely hit on more stop routes, curls, WR screens and some very short outs, where it is still basically a straightline pass through the WR. Royal is absolutely too fast in the slot for Orton to hit and too small a target... Orton routinely missed back behind Marshall on slant routes as EVERYONE recalls those wonderful one-handed stabs back behind him that he made, one in particular against Oakland.

Royal will continue to be ineffective or limited I should say, so long as Orton is the QB... and the team will continue to need targets that are not particularly fast, but can still find a soft spot in a zone (Gaffney) or targets that are so big (Marshall) that Orton's inaccuracy is downplayed.

It is just something we have to live with, Royal can still be used on some WR screens and things, but last year's production was very minimally his fault.

[topscribe]

Actually, Royal ran plenty of slot routes (Welker routes), but Orton didn't have the accuracy to hit him and constantly focused on the bigger Marshall. The reason Royal's numbers went down was not the types of routes he was running but the types of routes that Orton can hit... Royal and Gaffney were routinely hit on more stop routes, curls, WR screens and some very short outs, where it is still basically a straightline pass through the WR. Royal is absolutely too fast in the slot for Orton to hit and too small a target... Orton routinely missed back behind Marshall on slant routes as EVERYONE recalls those wonderful one-handed stabs back behind him that he made, one in particular against Oakland.

Royal will continue to be ineffective or limited I should say, so long as Orton is the QB... and the team will continue to need targets that are not particularly fast, but can still find a soft spot in a zone (Gaffney) or targets that are so big (Marshall) that Orton's inaccuracy is downplayed.

It is just something we have to live with, Royal can still be used on some WR screens and things, but last year's production was very minimally his fault.

I'm trying to figure out who is better at analyzing Orton: you or Woody . . .

-----

[MasterShake]

I'm trying to figure out who is better at analyzing Orton: you or Woody . . .

-----

Huh huh... you said "analyzing" and "woody"...heh heh!

[broncobryce]

Actually, Royal ran plenty of slot routes (Welker routes), but Orton didn't have the accuracy to hit him and constantly focused on the bigger Marshall. The reason Royal's numbers went down was not the types of routes he was running but the types of routes that Orton can hit... Royal and Gaffney were routinely hit on more stop routes, curls, WR screens and some very short outs, where it is still basically a straightline pass through the WR. Royal is absolutely too fast in the slot for Orton to hit and too small a target... Orton routinely missed back behind Marshall on slant routes as EVERYONE recalls those wonderful one-handed stabs back behind him that he made, one in particular against Oakland.

Royal will continue to be ineffective or limited I should say, so long as Orton is the QB... and the team will continue to need targets that are not particularly fast, but can still find a soft spot in a zone (Gaffney) or targets that are so big (Marshall) that Orton's inaccuracy is downplayed.

It is just something we have to live with, Royal can still be used on some WR screens and things, but last year's production was very minimally his fault.

Maybe. But how do you explain him hitting Royal 10 times in the game against NE?

[underrated29]

Maybe. But how do you explain him hitting Royal 10 times in the game against NE?



If I remember correctly, since i just watched the NFLReplay yesterday, it seems eddies routes were all posts, comebacks. Only 1 was a quick slant, which was on 3rd down and Eddie made an amazing grab because the pass was high....

[slim]

Maybe. But how do you explain him hitting Royal 10 times in the game against NE?

Obviously, Eddie wasn't running full speed in that game. :welcome:

[topscribe]

Obviously, Eddie wasn't running full speed in that game. :welcome:

Nah, you're confusing Royal with Orton.

See, you think you saw Royal running not at full speed. They were in the "Wild
Horses" play, and what you saw was Orton who was running at full speed . . . :D

-----

[broncobryce]

If I remember correctly, since i just watched the NFLReplay yesterday, it seems eddies routes were all posts, comebacks. Only 1 was a quick slant, which was on 3rd down and Eddie made an amazing grab because the pass was high....

I watched it too, which is why it was on my mind. But I thought he couldn't hit Royal because he was too fast? I know you didn't say that, but that's what I responded to. I thought it was thrown where only Royal could get it on that play. The commentators kept saying he hit kept hitting Royal on the backside because he was getting favorable coverage.

[claymore]

Nah, you're confusing Royal with Orton.

See, you think you saw Royal running not at full speed. They were in the "Wild
Horses" play, and what you saw was Orton who was running at full speed . . . :D

-----

I think you are Ortons Grandpa sometimes. Ol" Top Orton.

[slim]

Nah, you're confusing Royal with Orton.

See, you think you saw Royal running not at full speed. They were in the "Wild
Horses" play, and what you saw was Orton who was running at full speed . . . :D

-----

Given his sissy-mary right arm...if he was a little faster, I bet he could catch his own passes :welcome:

[HORSEPOWER 56]

If I remember correctly, since i just watched the NFLReplay yesterday, it seems eddies routes were all posts, comebacks. Only 1 was a quick slant, which was on 3rd down and Eddie made an amazing grab because the pass was high....

Yep. Pretty much EVERY reception that Royal made in that game was some sort of curl/comeback route. As they were for Gaffney. Marshall got comeback routes and the occasional "jump ball" that Orton loves just to throw up there as a prayer. Both times he did were terrible passes to the inside while Marshall was outside. The first one, Marshall corrected for and came inside to take it away for the TD. The other was nearly picked had Marshall not smothered Shawn Springs coming over his back to break it up (the last pass in OT before we kicked the GW FG).

[topscribe]

Given his sissy-mary right arm...if he was a little faster, I bet he could catch his own passes :welcome:
That was cold, Slim . . . :tsk:

-----

[claymore]

Given his sissy-mary right arm...if he was a little faster, I bet he could catch his own passes :welcome:

You are pure money today Slim.

[topscribe]

Yep. Pretty much EVERY reception that Royal made in that game was some sort of curl/comeback route. As they were for Gaffney. Marshall got comeback routes and the occasional "jump ball" that Orton loves just to throw up there as a prayer. Both times he did were terrible passes to the inside while Marshall was outside. The first one, Marshall corrected for and came inside to take it away for the TD. The other was nearly picked had Marshall not smothered Shawn Springs coming over his back to break it up (the last pass in OT before we kicked the GW FG).

Wow, you guys should write for the DP.

-----

[roomemp]

If the Broncos brass had people skills, Marshall wouldn't have had a lot of the issues he had last year.....

Interesting ......Please elaborate....Seems to me, once the season started, everything went great between Marshall and the Broncos brass. It wasn't till the last and most critical game of the season till there was an issue. The last game being where Marshall bailed on his teammates.

[slim]

You are pure money today Slim.

I'll be here all week :yo:

[topscribe]

I'll be here all week :yo:

Well then, it's about time you're money . . .

-----

[slim]

Well then, it's about time you're money . . .

-----

Top, I think you and clay should get in an argument about Orton's arm strength.

[broncobryce]

Yep. Pretty much EVERY reception that Royal made in that game was some sort of curl/comeback route. As they were for Gaffney. Marshall got comeback routes and the occasional "jump ball" that Orton loves just to throw up there as a prayer. Both times he did were terrible passes to the inside while Marshall was outside. The first one, Marshall corrected for and came inside to take it away for the TD. The other was nearly picked had Marshall not smothered Shawn Springs coming over his back to break it up (the last pass in OT before we kicked the GW FG).

The first one was supposed to be thrown that way. Marshall stated "Kyle threw a beautiful ball" and said Rod Smith taught him that move where you battle the corner and go inside on him while he is standing there. Did you watch the game on NFL replay? It had Brandon talking about it the same time the play happened. The second one, I agree was a bad throw. I'm done defending Orton though, I'll leave that to Top. :D

[TXBRONC]

[QUOTE=Bosco;946235]We likely win that game anyway. We were driving and already 2 yards away from Cowboys territory with a tie game. Even if Brandon doesn't take that 10 yard catch and turn it into a 51 yard touchdown, we're still just outside field goal range with another first down. [QUOTE]

So you're saying we would more won that game anyway even if we had only scored field goal rather than the touchdown? I don't know how anyone could realistically come to that conclusion knowing how that game ended. A field goal only put Denver up three. Which means Dallas doesn't have to go for a touchdown to just to tie the game.

If the games goes to overtime it might have ended differently. Thankfully we'll never have to find out.

[roomemp]

From PFT-
"The reality is that plenty of high-end receivers can present challenges. It's still not clear whether the position attracts divas or creates them. Either way, the better the player, the more likely he'll be a potential pain in the posterior."

This is a great quote actually.......T.O. and Randy Moss are a great example of this.....Oh wait...............

[topscribe]

Top, I think you and clay should get in an arguement about Orton's arm strength.

Talking with Clay about Orton is about like the "Who's On Second" skit . . .

-----

[Bosco]

Actually, Royal ran plenty of slot routes (Welker routes) Some, but not many. Hell, we had to shuffle guys all over the place in 2009.


but Orton didn't have the accuracy to hit him and constantly focused on the bigger Marshall. The reason Royal's numbers went down was not the types of routes he was running but the types of routes that Orton can hit... Royal and Gaffney were routinely hit on more stop routes, curls, WR screens and some very short outs, where it is still basically a straightline pass through the WR. Royal is absolutely too fast in the slot for Orton to hit and too small a target... Orton routinely missed back behind Marshall on slant routes as EVERYONE recalls those wonderful one-handed stabs back behind him that he made, one in particular against Oakland.

Royal will continue to be ineffective or limited I should say, so long as Orton is the QB... and the team will continue to need targets that are not particularly fast, but can still find a soft spot in a zone (Gaffney) or targets that are so big (Marshall) that Orton's inaccuracy is downplayed. Sorry, I don't buy that at all. Orton had the accuracy to throw a frozen rope across his body to Gaffney who was 35-40 yards down field and put the ball right in his hands. If he can do that, he can (and did) hit Royal on the shorter routes.

At this point, any questions about Orton's short range accuracy have been answered. What you are seeing is almost certainly timing issues.


It is just something we have to live with, Royal can still be used on some WR screens and things, but last year's production was very minimally his fault. I agree that it wasn't Royal's fault. It's not easy trying to play two different positions in your 1st year in the system when you're only a 2nd year player to begin with. I'm sure he'll bounce back in 2010.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

Wow, you guys should write for the DP.

-----

Why? Because I can write about what I saw on TV? Nah, I'm no good at making stuff up and embellishing like the media does. I'm just calling it like I saw it ON THE REPLAY which I DVR'd and got to replay every pass play as many times as I wanted.

Seeing how it was one of the games last year that I was deployed for and missed the first time, I'll be recording any of the 1st six games they replay for us so I can see them. Orton played well in the game in that he did a decent job taking what the defense gave him, but he never really challenged them downfield. I don't think he completed a pass over 15 yds the whole game. Oh well. It's really hard to see the "laser/rocket arm" that you swear he has, top, when he never seems to use it.

[Overtime]

When you consider what the Steelers did with Holmes, I'm not sure why your automatic reaction is to call the Broncos fools for doing essentially the same thing, especially if they get more value out of the deal.

because Marshall is hands down the best receiver in the league. you don't just let a guy with his skill and talent level demand a trade, and push people around.

we need this guy. he might be a headache, but his play on the field speaks for itself.

[Buff]

come on man. He is not a POS.

he may have been dumb or more than a few occasions, but he never tore apart the locker room like TO did, or create a division, or call out his QB or coach. Marshall was just immature- possibly still, but so far it looks like he is over that.



A headcase, cancer, pos--I disagree with anyone who calls him this.....




HOWEVER- I will be happy as you are that this is finally over and done with. As it has been annoying. And I would like to have an offseason where we add probowl talent instead of it trying to leave.

Maybe he's not a POS, but he actually did all of those things.

[claymore]

I like a QB that converts third downs.

[Northman]

because Marshall is hands down the best receiver in the league.

Not true. I can think of many who are better and who i would take over him in a heartbeat.

[topscribe]

The first one was supposed to be thrown that way. Marshall stated "Kyle threw a beautiful ball" and said Rod Smith taught him that move where you battle the corner and go inside on him while he is standing there. Did you watch the game on NFL replay? It had Brandon talking about it the same time the play happened. The second one, I agree was a bad throw. I'm done defending Orton though, I'll leave that to Top. :D

Okay, I'll bite . . .

On the second one, Orton admitted that maybe he got away with one. Can't deny
that: it's on tape. However, the reason it was not picked is because (1) a DE was
covering, (2) it was thrown very hard, and (3) it was thrown with pinpoint accuracy.

That's on tape, too. Go back and review the play . . . .

-----

[roomemp]

because Marshall is hands down the best receiver in the league. you don't just let a guy with his skill and talent level demand a trade, and push people around.

we need this guy. he might be a headache, but his play on the field speaks for itself.

His play off the field does also hense the problem

[TXBRONC]

If signing his tender means that a trade is emanate then I hope we get a first round pick for him.

[Bosco]

So you're saying we would more won that game anyway even if we had only scored field goal rather than the touchdown? It's highly probable.


I don't how anyone could realistically come to that conclusion knowing how that game ended. A field goal only put Denver up three. Which means Dallas doesn't have to go for a touchdown to just to tie the game. You're forgetting the time that would have been burned up. If we kick a FG it's likely as time is expiring or with very little time left for Dallas to do anything. With Brandon's quick score the Cowboys had time to get back down the field (helped by a very big gain on a pass play) before we made a goal line stand.

[MileHighCrew]

Son of a Bi*#^
So who is clearly the best Broncos on Offence after this so I know who McD will trade next off season in advance....

[HORSEPOWER 56]

Okay, I'll bite . . .

On the second one, Orton admitted that maybe he got away with one. Can't deny
that: it's on tape. However, the reason it was not picked is because (1) a DE was
covering, (2) it was thrown very hard, and (3) it was thrown with pinpoint accuracy.

Go back and review the play . . . .

-----

Actually it was Shawn Springs not a DE... it was thrown right into his hands and should've been a pick... and Marshall went over his back (and probably should've been flagged for PI) to break it up and ended up landing on top of Springs in the end zone. Also, there was no pinpoint accuracy (unless he was throwing it to Springs). It should've been an outside fade over Marshall's outside shoulder not an under-thrown pass inside when Marshall had outside leverage. Orton just threw it up for grabs.

[Lancane]

If signing his tender means that a trade is emanate then I hope we get a first round pick for him.

While most of us agree, a team could have easily signed him to a contract if they were willing to give up as much, the only teams that could not would be those not willing to give up their original first round pick or teams which did not have their original any longer, besides ourselves that would leave only Seattle and San Francisco…all other teams could have simply signed him to a contract.

[topscribe]

Actually it was Shawn Springs not a DE... it was thrown right into his hands and should've been a pick... and Marshall went over his back (and probably should've been flagged for PI) to break it up and ended up landing on top of Springs in the end zone. Also, there was no pinpoint accuracy (unless he was throwing it to Springs). It should've been an outside fade over Marshall's outside shoulder not an under-thrown pass inside when Marshall had outside leverage. Orton just threw it up for grabs.

Okay, you're talking about a different pass. In case you missed, Orton and
Marshall both discussed Orton's "up for grabs" passes, which were on purpose
because they both said they expected Marshall to win those. I'm not overly
concerned about its being off a little . . . every QB throws some passes off a little.

I thought they were discussing the pass to Moreno. That was a DE, thrown hard,
and pinpoint accuracy . . . but, by Orton's admission, still lucky . . .

-----

[underrated29]

Maybe he's not a POS, but he actually did all of those things.


when did he divide the LR, Call out the Qb, or call out the coach?

[T.K.O.]

YIKES....ITS DA'BEARS......thats why we have to trade him they dont have a 1st.....they're probably offering all their picks this year and next years #1:beer:

[HORSEPOWER 56]

Okay, you're talking about a different pass. In case you missed, Orton and
Marshall both discussed Orton's "up for grabs" passes, which were on purpose
because they both said they expected Marshall to win those. I'm not overly
concerned about its being off a little . . . every QB throws some passes off a little.

I thought they were discussing the pass to Moreno. That was a DE, thrown hard,
and pinpoint accuracy . . . but, by Orton's admission, still lucky . . .

-----

Ahh. No, I was referring to the last pass of the game where we went for six in FG range right before we kicked it.

[topscribe]

Ahh. No, I was referring to the last pass of the game where we went for six in FG range right before we kicked it.

Well, that is where I believe common sense says keep Marshall.

How many receivers can do what he can do?

-----

[TXBRONC]

It's highly probable.

You're forgetting the time that would have been burned up. If we kick a FG it's likely as time is expiring or with very little time left for Dallas to do anything. With Brandon's quick score the Cowboys had time to get back down the field (helped by a very big gain on a pass play) before we made a goal line stand.

Highly probable? No more like 50-50.

And maybe you've forgotten they still had one or two timeouts. If they still get a 53 yard play their still in field goal range. Again the point is you don't know that for, you'll never for sure, and thankfully things turned out the way they did.

[Ziggy]

Son of a Bi*#^
So who is clearly the best Broncos on Offence after this so I know who McD will trade next off season in advance....

Clady is the best player on this offense, whether Marhsall is traded or not.

[Lancane]

Well, that is where I believe common sense says keep Marshall.

How many receivers can do what he can do?

-----

Not many, but it does not matter to the moral committee…they want him gone even if it’s seriously detrimental to the team itself.

[Lancane]

Clady is the best player on this offense, whether Marhsall is traded or not.

Best lineman, not the best playmaker…there is a difference.

[topscribe]

Best lineman, not the best playmaker…there is a difference.

Not the best playmaker. Best player. There is a difference.

-----

[Buff]

From Peter King on Twitter:


GM with WR need (but not interested in Marshall) just told me he now feels Den will get top-35 pick for him in trade. Higher that I thought.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

Not many, but it does not matter to the moral committee…they want him gone even if it’s seriously detrimental to the team itself.

Marshall isn't irreplaceable. The problem is, there's nobody on the roster right now who can duplicate his production or the matchup nightmares he presents for other teams.

Gaffney and Royal will have a lot harder time in the future getting open without Marshall to draw the rolled coverage all the time. I don't know what the right answer is with Marshall but if we lose him, it will be highly interesting to see what McDaniels can pull out of his magic 17 PPG offensive scheme for next year. Prolly not going to be too pretty. Regardless of what guys think of Orton or Quinn or whoever, losing Marshall won't help their progress. Hopefully J-Wall, Bannan, and Green can help us be the next '85 Bears-esque defense. I've got a feeling our offense is only going to get worse this year.

[Bosco]

Highly probable? No more like 50-50. Either way, removing Marshall from the game doesn't give us a loss. Like I said, the only game we almost certainly lose without Marshall is the Pats game.

[Ziggy]

From Peter King on Twitter:

Hmmm, doesn't Tampa have the 35th pick in the draft and a need for a WR?

[slim]

From Peter King on Twitter:

Basically a first, I could live with that

[TXBRONC]

Basically a first, I could live with that

I hope so if signing his tender is a precursor to him being traded.

[Ravage!!!]

you can only remove so much talent from this team. We didn't have much to begin with. Keep chipping away, and try to keep telling me "we'll be fine"

[roomemp]

Best lineman, not the best playmaker…there is a difference.

I believe the question was best Offensive player......Playmaker or lineman......Clady is that guy

And your right there is a difference......It all starts up front.

[Northman]

you can only remove so much talent from this team. We didn't have much to begin with. Keep chipping away, and try to keep telling me "we'll be fine"

We'll be fine

[underrated29]

From Peter King on Twitter:


id say:

stl
tampa
miami


(without looking at where they hold picks).

[roomemp]

you can only remove so much talent from this team. We didn't have much to begin with. Keep chipping away, and try to keep telling me "we'll be fine"

We'll be fine

[Ravage!!!]

We'll be fine


We'll be fine

Thanks guys.. now I feel better :beer:

[Lancane]

I believe the question was best Offensive player......Playmaker or lineman......Clady is that guy

That’s opinionated and not a fact, in three years Brandon Marshall has been voted to the Pro-Bowl twice. No one else on the offensive side of the ball can say as much, Clady may turn out to be the best…but at this time that is not so.

[roomemp]

That’s opinionated and not a fact, in three years Brandon Marshall has been voted to the Pro-Bowl twice. No one else on the offensive side of the ball can say as much, Clady may turn out to be the best…but at this time that is not so.

Clady was the best in 2008 and got snubbed in the Pro Bowl ans Pro Bowler in 2009. His first two years in the league....All starts

Ask any coach, player, or football expert and they will say it all starts up front.......You can have Montana, Rice, Marshall, and TD in the backfield but without a line, no one gets the ball in their hands to make a play.

[BroncoBJ]

you can only remove so much talent from this team. We didn't have much to begin with. Keep chipping away, and try to keep telling me "we'll be fine"

We'll be fine. :salute:


Although damn, this team looks so much different then Shannys last season here. And in another year, we won't even recognize anyone. :lol:

If McDaniels takes us to the playoffs or further, theres no way we can say he won with Shannys players. :lol:

Hes making sure that this is his team. Theres no doubt about that. I really hope we keep Marsh but its not looking good.

[Ravage!!!]

Clady was the best in 2008 and got snubbed in the Pro Bowl ans Pro Bowler in 2009. His first two years in the league....All starts

Ask any coach, player, or football expert and they will say it all starts up front.......You can have Montana, Rice, Marshall, and TD in the backfield but without a line, no one gets the ball in their hands to make a play.

Hmmm... who's considered to be the best 'FOOTBALL' players of all time?

1)Rice
2)sweetness
3)Elway

I can go on.... but I know none of the top ten will be an OLman.

I'm not knocking Clady in the least, but don't make it out to sound as though your OPINION is fact on this. Marshall can very easily be considered the best offensive player we have on the team.

[Broncolingus]

Marshall = gone

(...I guess we already knew that though, huh?...)

[Timmy!]

:imminent board pissing match:

This should be good.

:pop2:

[Northman]

:imminent board pissing match:

This should be good.

:pop2:


Who do you like? :laugh:

[LordTrychon]

:imminent board pissing match:

This should be good.

:pop2:


Who do you like? :laugh:

If it's to be a pissing match, I'll take McD.

[dogfish]

:imminent board pissing match:

This should be good.

:pop2:

i love unwinnable arguments, don't you?

[gobroncsnv]

Clady was the best in 2008 and got snubbed in the Pro Bowl ans Pro Bowler in 2009. His first two years in the league....All starts

Ask any coach, player, or football expert and they will say it all starts up front.......You can have Montana, Rice, Marshall, and TD in the backfield but without a line, no one gets the ball in their hands to make a play.

I bet you simply SUCK at fantasy football or Madden... you think linemen are important.
;)

[BroncoJoe]

BFD. The Broncos were here before him, and will be here after him.

Stay or go, I could really care less.

[dogfish]

BFD. The Broncos were here before him, and will be here after him.

Stay or go, I could really care less.

hey handsome. . .

:welcome:


next time, tell us how you really feel. . .

[Zweems56]

BFD. The Broncos were here before him, and will be here after him.

Stay or go, I could really care less.

Holy shit, it's joe!

[Ziggy]

BFD. The Broncos were here before him, and will be here after him.

Stay or go, I could really care less.

What are you, a Bronco fan?

[Nomad]

He'll be a Buccaneer, that's my guess!!!

I was wrong, that's what I get for guessing! :lol: