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Traveler
04-08-2010, 02:36 PM
For Pete's sake...

Posted April 08, 2010 @ 11:01 a.m. ET
By Dan Arkush

For obvious reasons, there's still a whole lot of head-shaking going on in NFL circles in the wake of Mike Shanahan's shocking heist of six-time Pro Bowl QB Donovan McNabb from the Eagles.

With dramatic suddenness, a delightfully mellow Easter Sunday turned into a frenzied nightmare for pro football Web sites far and wide, obligated to deliver the inside scoop without hesitation.

Suffice it to say, it comes with the territory.

More and more each season, it has become a given in the line of work to which I have devoted practically my entire adult life that there is absolutely no rest for the weary in the good ol' NFL.

We should have known, after all, that Shanahan, the former Broncos kingpin who had been keeping a surprisingly nondescript profile since returning to the pro football wars as the head coach of the Redskins, had something earthshaking up his sleeve.

The trade of McNabb within the NFC East certainly qualifies as an earthshaking maneuver.

Three days removed from the McNabb shocker, as I peck away at this column on another relatively slow day in the world of pro football, something tells me that the earth could begin shaking big-time in the not-too-distant future, thanks to another old/new head coach whose offseason moves up to now have been more odd than anything else.

Don't look now, but Pete Carroll, who was paid a king's ransom to leave USC and renovate a Seahawks team that, for my money, was the absolute worst in the league at the end of last season, just might be ready to drop another big-time bomb on the NFL landscape.

Can you say "Brandon Marshall"?

Please understand that I am not privy to any inside information whatsoever on the prospect of Carroll and the Seahawks taking a deep breath and cutting a deal for Marshall — via either a trade with the Broncos or, a lot less likely, a restricted free-agent offer that would require them to relinquish the sixth overall pick in the upcoming draft.

But while the price both in compensation and money is expected to be very hefty whatever route they would take — Marshall is said to be looking for at least $10 million a year — I can feel something really big about to happen out in Seattle in these raggedy old bones of mine.

Make no mistake: Despite his well-documented "rap" sheet, Marshall, who has managed three straight 100-catch seasons, is going to be doing his thing for some team come September, for better or worse.

We're talking high risk/high reward of the highest order with this particular cat, my friends. But the way I see it, if ever there was a team that needed a really dramatic lift, it's the Seahawks, who certainly have the money to gamble, thanks to their zillionaire owner, Paul Allen.

As it is, the Hawks have already done their share of high-stakes gambling this offseason, dropping down 20 spots in the second round and giving up a third-round draft pick in 2011 to the Chargers in exchange for QB Charlie Whitehurst, whom they apparently envision as their QB of the future despite the fact he has yet to throw a regular-season pass in four years at the pro level.

In addition, Marshall and his fiancée, Michi Nogami-Campbell, were flown in on Allen's seaplane for a visit to the Seahawks' headquarters March 6-7. A few weeks later, Carroll said at the league meetings in Orlando that the Seahawks have the advantage of some "unique insights" on Marshall, courtesy of the three coaches on his staff who worked with the receiver in Denver — offensive coordinator Jeremy Bates, QB coach Jedd Fisch and TE coach Pat McPherson.

On the field, Marshall would quickly fill one of the team's numerous major needs. A split end with speed, size and separation ability, he could be the perfect complement to T.J. Houshmandzadeh, one of the league's premier possession receivers.

But off the field?

We're talking about a player who has clearly been more trouble than he's worth in the Mile High City.

Just last March, he and his fiancée were arrested after a public skirmish in which several witnesses, including an off-duty policeman, reported seeing them kick and punch each other. The case was later dismissed, but the bad taste from the incident lingers.

Marshall was also on hand for the New Year's Day 2007 altercation that led to the fatal shooting of Broncos teammate Darrent Williams.

Those are just two of the red flags he has waved repeatedly during his four-year career.

Could Carroll, who has been known for his willingness to give troubled players a second chance, help get Marshall's act together in a neat, new environment?

I wouldn't blame him at all if he decided to steer clear of the Samsonite that Marshall carries. But as I've already indicated, I just have this feeling he is going to take a chance on Marshall.

And I would hardly be surprised if he followed in Shanahan's footsteps, catching everybody off guard on another quiet Sunday.

Memo to my fellow football-writing brethren: Be forewarned.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/04/08/for-petes-sake

Ziggy
04-08-2010, 02:49 PM
This guy doesn't understand that Marshall is a possession receiver. He makes it sound like he's the deep threat that will compliment Housh, when in reality, they're less than one yard apart in average YPC over thier careers. Seattle would be paying 2 wide receivers top money and not have a deep threat with either.

Lancane
04-08-2010, 02:53 PM
This guy doesn't understand that Marshall is a possession receiver. He makes it sound like he's the deep threat that will compliment Housh, when in reality, they're less than one yard apart in average YPC over thier careers. Seattle would be paying 2 wide receivers top money and not have a deep threat with either.

He might not be a blazer, but Marshall is more then a simple possession receiver. Ask any cornerback who's faced him...

Northman
04-08-2010, 03:57 PM
1st round pick this year or next year and he's yours.

Ziggy
04-08-2010, 04:03 PM
He might not be a blazer, but Marshall is more then a simple possession receiver. Ask any cornerback who's faced him...

He's also not a deep threat. You can ask any defensive coordinator who game plans for him. His bread and butter is using his body to shield off the defender, and gaining yards after the catch. He's one of the few receivers in the NFL that can make a defense have to account for him in the game plan without stretching the field. Don't assume that because I state facts about him not being a deep threat, that I'm calling him a simple possession receiver.

Nomad
04-08-2010, 04:27 PM
Same old song and dance.....man I can't wait for the draft to get here and then TC! You know life goes by pretty damn quick following the NFL because you're always looking forward to timelines!!

Lonestar
04-08-2010, 04:47 PM
Please let this end with us getting a #1 or numerous 2's and 3's let him be gone regardless of what the writers think he is or is not.

The key to that whole story was "Seahawks have the advantage of some "unique insights" on Marshall, courtesy of the three coaches on his staff who worked with the receiver in Denver — offensive coordinator Jeremy Bates, QB coach Jedd Fisch and TE coach Pat Mc Pherson."

That is why they want him. They know what he can do on the field. Nothing more nothing less.

elsid13
04-08-2010, 05:05 PM
This guy doesn't understand that Marshall is a possession receiver. He makes it sound like he's the deep threat that will compliment Housh, when in reality, they're less than one yard apart in average YPC over thier careers. Seattle would be paying 2 wide receivers top money and not have a deep threat with either.

They have a deep threat in Deon Butler , the kid from PSU.

Ravage!!!
04-08-2010, 05:33 PM
Marshall is MORE than a possession receiver. He may not have blazing speed, but neither did TD, and he was a threat to go all the way every time he touched the ball. You don't catch that many passes, have have that much yards per catch, and that many TDs in y our first 4 years and only be a possession receiver.

Either way.. I'm still sticking to the prediction that we don't get first round pick, but first round 'value'..... either way, some of you guys will get your wish, he'll be gone, and we'll be with less talent.

dogfish
04-08-2010, 05:33 PM
i still maintain my belief that marshall could be an effective deep threat if a team really focused on using him that way. . . it's hard for a guy to prove himself in that capacity when he's constantly running slants, button hooks and bubble screens. . .

granted, he doesn't have that blazer speed, but neither did TO. . .

tracking the ball over his shoulder doesn't appear to be one of brandon's strengths, but with his frame and athletic ability the guy should be a serious weapon on jump balls, and i've never understood why we don't give him more opportunities in that capacity. . . the play at the end of the dallas game is a perfect example of what he's capable of. . .


in any case, the guy is a true number one receiver with the numbers to back it up. . .

Ziggy
04-08-2010, 05:36 PM
They have a deep threat in Deon Butler , the kid from PSU.

He'd be thier 3rd receiver at best if they pick up Marshall. Like I said, Seattle would be paying 2 wide receivers top money and not have a deep threat with either.

dogfish
04-08-2010, 05:41 PM
He'd be thier 3rd receiver at best if they pick up Marshall. Like I said, Seattle would be paying 2 wide receivers top money and not have a deep threat with either.

how many deep balls are they going to throw with that line anyway? obviously in a perfect world you'd love to have 22 complete players, but it doesn't happen in the real world. . .

besides which, doushmandzadeh is done. . . there are plenty of decent reasons to pass on marshall, but having broken-down old-ass TJ isn't one of them. . .

T.K.O.
04-08-2010, 05:52 PM
Please let this end with us getting a #1 or numerous 2's and 3's let him be gone regardless of what the writers think he is or is not.

The key to that whole story was "Seahawks have the advantage of some "unique insights" on Marshall, courtesy of the three coaches on his staff who worked with the receiver in Denver — offensive coordinator Jeremy Bates, QB coach Jedd Fisch and TE coach Pat Mc Pherson."

That is why they want him. They know what he can do on the field. Nothing more nothing less.

and those "unique insights" might also be something totally different.
which would also explain why seattle has'nt made an offer.
it could be that the coaches from denver don't want to put up with any of his b.s.
OR
it could very well be that they know something the rest of us don't,like maybe they heard rumblings from mcD (or elsewhere ) that there is no way brandon comes back to denver next year.that would give them the leverage to take a "wait and see" attitude about the whole situation.:confused:hmmmmmm

Ravage!!!
04-08-2010, 05:52 PM
He'd be thier 3rd receiver at best if they pick up Marshall. Like I said, Seattle would be paying 2 wide receivers top money and not have a deep threat with either.

Honestly.. I wouldn't care. We didn't have a deep threat last year, and Marshall caught 100 passes. Housh isn't done (dog, whats wrong with you?)... and that will help Marshall that much more. But who cares if Marshall isn't a deep threat. He has MORE catches, nearly the same ypc, and more TDs than Andre Johnson, whom everyone considers to be such a deeep threat. How many deep balls are you going to throw?

Marshall doesn't have to be the deep threat. Neither does Housh. I'd rather have two guys like Housh and Marshall and no deep threat, than to have someone that can run fast and not be the guy that goes across the middle or can't beat the defender in traffic.

elsid13
04-08-2010, 06:12 PM
He'd be thier 3rd receiver at best if they pick up Marshall. Like I said, Seattle would be paying 2 wide receivers top money and not have a deep threat with either.

Teams go deep maybe three to four times a game. And most of that time it to keep the safeties honest and in cover-2. A deep threat is one of the most overrated words used for any offense. Marshall has the ability to dominate in the short to immediate routes and take any of them to the house. That far more important then guy that runs fly patterns.

dogfish
04-08-2010, 06:43 PM
Housh isn't done (dog, whats wrong with you?)...

he's not?

he's 32 years old, wasn't that fast or athletic to begin with, and hasn't done shit in two seasons. . .

blame the QB if you want-- i think he's in bigtime decline, and i thought so before he left cincy. . .

maybe i should qualify "done," though. . . i'm not saying i think he's completely incompetent and likely to retire this year. . . but in terms of being a top receiver, or even a second tier receiver, i think he's done. . . maybe he has another year or two of decent #2 production in him-- i wouldn't count on it. . . he's nowhere near close to the type of impact player marshall is, and i highly doubt he'll even be their #2 two years from now. . .

broncofaninfla
04-08-2010, 06:46 PM
Marshall is too good after the catch to be labeled a possession receiver. In our dink and dunk offense, Marshall gives us our best chance to score after a catch. I'm hoping we keep him.

HORSEPOWER 56
04-08-2010, 06:52 PM
He might not be a blazer, but Marshall is more then a simple possession receiver. Ask any cornerback who's faced him...

Exactly, anyone who thinks he can't go deep hasn't been paying attention. It's just that his forte is "possession" and YAC (what he's used for), it's not the only thing he does well.

Ziggy
04-08-2010, 08:11 PM
Teams go deep maybe three to four times a game. And most of that time it to keep the safeties honest and in cover-2. A deep threat is one of the most overrated words used for any offense. Marshall has the ability to dominate in the short to immediate routes and take any of them to the house. That far more important then guy that runs fly patterns.

I disagree. Having a deep threat affects more plays than the ones that are called for the deep pass. It affects every facet of the offense. When you have a true deep threat, the corner will nearly always keep a bigger cushion, as will the safety playing that area of the field. It helps to open up the running game and the short passing game.

I have no problem with Marshall being the highest paid receiver on a team. It makes no sense to pay a good chunk of your salary cap to 2 receivers that aren't deep threats. If Seattle does trade for Marhsall, I wouldn't be surprised to see them cut ties with Housh, and eat the salary excess now. The Hawk's owner is filthy rich and is one of the few owners in the NFL that might be willing to do it.

BigBroncLove
04-08-2010, 08:17 PM
I disagree. Having a deep threat affects more plays than the ones that are called for the deep pass. It affects every facet of the offense. When you have a true deep threat, the corner will nearly always keep a bigger cushion, as will the safety playing that area of the field. It helps to open up the running game and the short passing game.

I have no problem with Marshall being the highest paid receiver on a team. It makes no sense to pay a good chunk of your salary cap to 2 receivers that aren't deep threats. If Seattle does trade for Marhsall, I wouldn't be surprised to see them cut ties with Housh, and eat the salary excess now. The Hawk's owner is filthy rich and is one of the few owners in the NFL that might be willing to do it.

Nice post. The deep threat, much like a very aggressive rush offense, opens up other parts of the game. The consistent threat of opening the game through one deep pass keeps safeties honest, keeps CB's from playing against the run, and consistantly makes sure the defense protects the big play rather than allowing shorter more efficient passes that every offense relies on. In effect it keeps Defenses honest. When you add that dimension to any offense you will open other parts of essential offensive production and make things easier for both the OL and QB.

By preference you want to have a scary run game and an effective deep pass, which by itself opens the middle of the field (where you want the majority of your production), keeping the defense continually off guard. Easier said than done obviously...

Shazam!
04-08-2010, 08:53 PM
Please understand that I am not privy to any inside information whatsoever...

So, then this article is no better than it being written by one of our own football-savvy members here. Thanks for the heads up.

dogfish
04-08-2010, 09:29 PM
So, then this article is no better than it being written by one of our own football-savvy members here. Thanks for the heads up.

other than the fact that his family has been publishing one of the most respected rags in the business for about thirty years now, which would make him an industry professional as opposed to a hobbyist. . . he's an old-school, honest-to-goodness journalist, not a glorified blogger like florio or a mindless "camera-friendly" talking head like most of the bums at BSPN. . .


then again, most people on this board despise ALL media without bothering to make distinctions between political and non, old media or new, or anything else. . .

Lonestar
04-08-2010, 09:59 PM
he's not?

he's 32 years old, wasn't that fast or athletic to begin with, and hasn't done shit in two seasons. . .

blame the QB if you want-- i think he's in bigtime decline, and i thought so before he left cincy. . .

maybe i should qualify "done," though. . . i'm not saying i think he's completely incompetent and likely to retire this year. . . but in terms of being a top receiver, or even a second tier receiver, i think he's done. . . maybe he has another year or two of decent #2 production in him-- i wouldn't count on it. . . he's nowhere near close to the type of impact player marshall is, and i highly doubt he'll even be their #2 two years from now. . .

Even More reason for SEA to sign a big time WR.:laugh:

Ravage!!!
04-08-2010, 10:01 PM
he's not?

he's 32 years old, wasn't that fast or athletic to begin with, and hasn't done shit in two seasons. . .

blame the QB if you want-- i think he's in bigtime decline, and i thought so before he left cincy. . .

maybe i should qualify "done," though. . . i'm not saying i think he's completely incompetent and likely to retire this year. . . but in terms of being a top receiver, or even a second tier receiver, i think he's done. . . maybe he has another year or two of decent #2 production in him-- i wouldn't count on it. . . he's nowhere near close to the type of impact player marshall is, and i highly doubt he'll even be their #2 two years from now. . .

I did take what you meant a bit too far, however...

I think with Marshall opposite of him, that will open up what he excells in. He wasn't meant to be a #1, but a great #2. Marshall is absolutely a #1, and thus will put Housh right back into the role he is best at..... complimentary hands that will take pressure off the #1, as well as able to beat most coverages when the #1 is taking most the shades.

To me, these two make great compliments of one another. That doesn't mean i expect Housh to be around for another 10 years.

Ravage!!!
04-08-2010, 10:08 PM
I disagree. Having a deep threat affects more plays than the ones that are called for the deep pass. It affects every facet of the offense. When you have a true deep threat, the corner will nearly always keep a bigger cushion, as will the safety playing that area of the field. It helps to open up the running game and the short passing game.

I have no problem with Marshall being the highest paid receiver on a team. It makes no sense to pay a good chunk of your salary cap to 2 receivers that aren't deep threats. If Seattle does trade for Marhsall, I wouldn't be surprised to see them cut ties with Housh, and eat the salary excess now. The Hawk's owner is filthy rich and is one of the few owners in the NFL that might be willing to do it.

That would make no sense. What would they gain by cutting Housh??? :confused:

Housh is still a very viable receiver... you can have a3rd be your 'fast guy' if you need to have that deep threat.

Although I agree that the deep threat can be very important, its not a route that needs to be run on every play. Housh and Marshall both can get past a corner at any given moment, and both are threats when given the 1-on-1 coverage. Given the fact that Carlson can threaten the deep middle, this CAN very be a very strong two-some.

Given that I expect Seattle to get both Clausen and Spiller in the first round.... this offense could be the making of a stud offensive that can always add in some fast WR. Fast guys are the easy ones to find.

Elevation inc
04-09-2010, 03:15 AM
1st round pick this year or next year and he's yours.

i dont agree fully with this the 2011 first rd pick for marshall is just wrong...2011 is probally a lockout year first of all, and i do not belive MCd would make that trade when he needs weapons and a good team now....

i belive we either trade him in the next 2 weeks or he plays in denver next year, but i do not belive a 2011 1st rd pick will be in the deal....i see a first rd pick this year, or a early 2nd rd pick and 4-5th rd pikc this year...but no 2011 1st rd pick....

i would actually be pretty mad if we traded marshall for a 2011 1st rd pick, when this WR class is so deep in the back of rd 1-early 2nd rd....

if we trade him we need to replace him now, with the pick we trade him for....just my 2 cents....

TimTebow15MVP
04-09-2010, 03:32 AM
Seattle will eventually give up that sixth pick for marshall is my gut feeling also, I dont see why not? There gonna pay top doller for whatever rookie they pick there thats not proven so why not take a guy whose gonna sell you some tickets and get the fan base buzzin over there in seattle? Then they still have the 14th where clausen and some top tackle will be there also.

Broncos get fair compensation and seattle gets a top wide out. Broncos draft Spiller and Dez Bryant

TimTebow15MVP
04-09-2010, 03:34 AM
The way the league is designed now days its easy for WRs to have success. Thats why every year a new flock of wide outs break onto the scene. every team doesnt have good wide outs but many of them do. The Broncos would not stop because we lost marshall. he is replacable.....Just make sure you replace him though. Dez Bryant would definitly replace marshall AND he can actually stretch the field and get seperation. Then he goes and gets the ball at its highest point.

TXBRONC
04-09-2010, 08:26 AM
Seattle will eventually give up that sixth pick for marshall is my gut feeling also, I dont see why not? There gonna pay top doller for whatever rookie they pick there thats not proven so why not take a guy whose gonna sell you some tickets and get the fan base buzzin over there in seattle? Then they still have the 14th where clausen and some top tackle will be there also.

Broncos get fair compensation and seattle gets a top wide out. Broncos draft Spiller and Dez Bryant

I would be so certain that it will be the 6th overall pick if a deal actually goes through. I think it's way more likely that we end up with the 14th overall pick.

Traveler
04-09-2010, 08:44 AM
Seattle will eventually give up that sixth pick for marshall is my gut feeling also, I dont see why not? There gonna pay top doller for whatever rookie they pick there thats not proven so why not take a guy whose gonna sell you some tickets and get the fan base buzzin over there in seattle? Then they still have the 14th where clausen and some top tackle will be there also.

Broncos get fair compensation and seattle gets a top wide out. Broncos draft Spiller and Dez Bryant

I still stand by my comment that BM will be a Bronco for the 2010 season. While this draft is loaded with talent, I can't see any of the top 15 teams parting with a first rounder.

Having said that, if SEA were to acquire BM, they are more likely to send us the 14th pick. Their needs on the OL are too great to part with the 6th overall pick.

Most big trades involving 1st rounders usually happen the night prior to or the day of the draft. "IF" BM is going to be traded, I'm betting that's when we'll see something happen.

Broncolingus
04-09-2010, 08:52 AM
1st round pick this year or next year and he's yours.

Amen, brother...

broncofaninfla
04-09-2010, 08:53 AM
I'd rather have a proven vet over a first round pick.

Traveler
04-09-2010, 08:58 AM
I'd rather have a proven vet over a first round pick.

I'd take BM for David Harris without blinking an eye.

claymore
04-09-2010, 09:32 AM
Im just happy with Jabbar Gaffney. We can release Marshall for all I care.

TXBRONC
04-09-2010, 09:45 AM
Im just happy with Jabbar Gaffney. We can release Marshall for all I care.

Why am I not surprised? :D

Traveler
04-09-2010, 10:09 AM
Im just happy with Jabbar Gaffney. We can release Marshall for all I care.

This is the sarcasm police, "You are under arrest!"

TXBRONC
04-09-2010, 10:43 AM
This is the sarcasm police, "You are under arrest!"

Just don't ask him to spread'em. :eek:

T.K.O.
04-09-2010, 10:46 AM
Just don't ask him to spread'em. :eek:

or "assume the position"

WARHORSE
04-09-2010, 12:52 PM
BM is a talent.


Deep threat?

Yes, hes a deep threat. But a deep threat more like Rod Smith and Eddie Mac than Andre Johnson or Calvin Johnson.




The WARHORSE view into the future:



The Seattle Seahawks want Brandon.


The reason they talked to him is because they wanted to see his contract parameters.


But they knew from the start it wouldnt be about signing him right away.

Guarantee the Seahawks, at least in preliminary discussions, were offering the highest contract to BM.

Think other teams made their prices known to BMs agent?

You bet they did.

Seattles was highest and thats why he went there.



Now its about giving up as little draft pick compensation as possible for Seattle.

Denver should sit back and let it all play out, but not accept anything less than good first round comp.


Seattle is waiting for the April 15 deadline for signing RFAs to offer sheets to come, then is going to offer the Broncos the 14th pick imo because they want to hold onto the 6th.


The Broncos will accept.


This will allow Denver to trade down with Philly for the 24th and the 37th.


So we will end up with 14, 24, 37, and 42 I believe.


14-Spiller-We will need a playmaker and he is a great pass catcher...can go long or short out of the backfield.

24-Clausen if he falls.....Demaryous Thomas

37-Jerry Hughes or Dan Williams

45-Asomoah

Ziggy
04-09-2010, 01:24 PM
If Dan Williams drops to 37, you're going to be rudely awoken by your alarm clock Warhorse.

Traveler
04-09-2010, 02:01 PM
BM is a talent.


Deep threat?

Yes, hes a deep threat. But a deep threat more like Rod Smith and Eddie Mac than Andre Johnson or Calvin Johnson.




The WARHORSE view into the future:



The Seattle Seahawks want Brandon.


The reason they talked to him is because they wanted to see his contract parameters.


But they knew from the start it wouldnt be about signing him right away.

Guarantee the Seahawks, at least in preliminary discussions, were offering the highest contract to BM.

Think other teams made their prices known to BMs agent?

You bet they did.

Seattles was highest and thats why he went there.



Now its about giving up as little draft pick compensation as possible for Seattle.

Denver should sit back and let it all play out, but not accept anything less than good first round comp.


Seattle is waiting for the April 15 deadline for signing RFAs to offer sheets to come, then is going to offer the Broncos the 14th pick imo because they want to hold onto the 6th.


The Broncos will accept.


This will allow Denver to trade down with Philly for the 24th and the 37th.


So we will end up with 14, 24, 37, and 42 I believe.


14-Spiller-We will need a playmaker and he is a great pass catcher...can go long or short out of the backfield.

24-Clausen if he falls.....Demaryous Thomas

37-Jerry Hughes or Dan Williams

45-Asomoah


Let's see here, now what you suggest is plausible until this:


1. You think we'll trade our #11 to PHI?

2. You think Spiller will be available @ 14 and that we take another RB with our 1st in back to back years?

3. Dan Williams lasts till 37?


Puff, puff, pass, dude!

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii273/Papi728/PotFiend.jpg