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View Full Version : More wins in 2010, McDaniels or Shanahan?



broncobryce
03-26-2010, 07:00 PM
Just saw this asked on NFL network. What do you think?

broncobryce
03-26-2010, 07:01 PM
I think McD wins with 10-11 wins.

turftoad
03-26-2010, 07:02 PM
Doesn't Shanny get a year to his put team together?

Northman
03-26-2010, 07:03 PM
I think even in his first year Shanny will fair better.

Bosco
03-26-2010, 07:09 PM
McDaniels, although I think the gap will be very small.

LordTrychon
03-26-2010, 07:24 PM
I think Shanahan still has an edge in experience over McDaniels...

But McDaniels is picking up after Shanahan and Bowlen...

Shanahan is picking up after Zorn and Snyder! :eek:

Ziggy
03-26-2010, 07:32 PM
McD has had a 1 year head start to begin to gather his own players and install is system. He also plays in a much easier division. It's apples to oranges. A more fair comparison would be McD's record this year vs. Shanahan's record next year.

Lancane
03-26-2010, 07:38 PM
McDaniels has a fairly easier schedule then Shanahan will have, and Shanahan also has not been with his new team for a year. I do believe he will do better then McDaniels did last year, I will say 9-5 at least. Josh will likely have about the same amount of wins with the easier schedule...so both should be around 9-7 give or take a win or loss.

- Edited and fixed...lol. -

Nomad
03-26-2010, 07:41 PM
Haslett may make Shanny look good!!

Ziggy
03-26-2010, 08:26 PM
You can dog Shanahan all you want about his GM abilities, but he was always one of the best coaches in the NFL when it came to getting the most out of his players. He can game plan with the best of them, and fit the system around the players. McDaniels admitted that he did a poor job last season of utilizing Eddie Royal. It wasn't an issue with Shanny.

Unfortunately, he is playing in the NFC east. Philly, Dallas, and NY all have a ton of talent and proven pro bowl QB's. Washington is the least talented of those 4 teams, but Shanny will find a way not to finish in the cellar. He has a GM in place to check his draft moves, even though he will have the final say. The Redskins will be in the playoff hunt by next season at the latest, IMO.

orangenblueinohio
03-26-2010, 08:34 PM
As much as I am not in Mcd's corner, the skins suck, so I'd have to vote Mcd. Best of luck to ya Shanny, just not when your playin us.

broncobryce
03-26-2010, 09:00 PM
Shanahan is a great coach. And I think him getting fired caused him to take a look in the mirror. I also think he studied his ass off and learned a lot while he was gone. He visited a bunch of places and picked up stuff along the way. He will come back with a vengeance, but McD will have more wins I think.

WARHORSE
03-26-2010, 09:09 PM
Shanahan is a great coach. And I think him getting fired caused him to take a look in the mirror. I also think he studied his ass off and learned a lot while he was gone. He visited a bunch of places and picked up stuff along the way. He will come back with a vengeance, but McD will have more wins I think.


I have to agree 100%.


Hes still driven, and now he's even more driven.



I wouldnt doubt he gets a superbowl in Washington.


Shanahan took a look in the mirror. Did some evaluating, and is going to be stronger, and a better coach for it.

I think he wishes he could have known two years ago what he knows today.

Cause he would still be coach of the B R O N C O S.:salute:

Timmy!
03-26-2010, 09:12 PM
McDaniels has a fairly easier schedule then Shanahan will have, and Shanahan also has not been with his new team for a year. I do believe he will do better then McDaniels did last year, I will say 9-5 at least. Josh will likely have about the same amount of wins with the easier schedule...so both should be around 9-5 give or take a win or loss.

I assume you meant 9-7?

I think McD gets more wins this season, but a win/loss or two could very well depend on what happens on draft day for both teams.

silkamilkamonico
03-26-2010, 09:15 PM
I'm curious to see how Shanahan's finesse offense will fit in the division. It's a black and blue power division similiar to the AFC North, and Shanahan hasn't not had a good record since 2000 against the power teams that control the LOS, like Baltimore and Pittsburgh.

I'm also not sure why he is messing with Washington's defense. Haynesworth is already up in arms about possibly being moved to DE. The defense was set there, and all Shanahan had to do was come in and fix the offense, which there's no doubt in my mind he will.

Medford Bronco
03-26-2010, 09:17 PM
Haslett may make Shanny look good!!

Not having Slowbrain makes him look better:laugh:

BroncoBJ
03-26-2010, 09:24 PM
McDaniels has a fairly easier schedule then Shanahan will have, and Shanahan also has not been with his new team for a year. I do believe he will do better then McDaniels did last year, I will say 9-5 at least. Josh will likely have about the same amount of wins with the easier schedule...so both should be around 9-5 give or take a win or loss.

The Schedule went back to 14 games? Must have missed the latest rule changes/schedule changes. So many new rules and stuff that I get confused. :fight: :p

But I think McDaniels will win 10 or 11 games and I think Shanny will win 7 or 8. :salute:

Lancane
03-26-2010, 09:30 PM
I assume you meant 9-7?

I think McD gets more wins this season, but a win/loss or two could very well depend on what happens on draft day for both teams.

Why yes I did...thanks for the correction Timmy! :D

TXBRONC
03-26-2010, 09:30 PM
McDaniels has a fairly easier schedule then Shanahan will have, and Shanahan also has not been with his new team for a year. I do believe he will do better then McDaniels did last year, I will say 9-5 at least. Josh will likely have about the same amount of wins with the easier schedule...so both should be around 9-5 give or take a win or loss.

Did we go back to a 14 game schedule Lancane? :D

Lancane
03-26-2010, 09:31 PM
Did we go back to a 14 game schedule Lancane? :D

Shushhhhhh...damn typo errors...lol. I fixed it...:D

Buff
03-26-2010, 09:42 PM
McDaniels for sure. Shanny is installing new schemes on offense and defense. Plus I'd argue they are the worst team in that division.

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
03-26-2010, 10:38 PM
That's like asking which retard is going to master quantum mechanics first.

Lonestar
03-26-2010, 10:44 PM
I guess I'm not overly surprised at the love for mike here.

But HE seemed to suck playing east coast games, and that is pretty much all he will play now.

Seriously he had a great D last year with this team and the offense stunk it up. IF he remotely tries to install a finesse game or screw with the defense at all, he is going to get his ass handed to him in that division.

I think Lancanes 9-5 is probably correct but should be reversed as I suspect it will be a short season for him at 5-9. Then he be gone, after losing at least 6 division games.

Sorry the devil made me do it.:D

Bosco
03-27-2010, 04:48 AM
I think Shanahan still has an edge in experience over McDaniels...

But McDaniels is picking up after Shanahan and Bowlen...

Shanahan is picking up after Zorn and Snyder! :eek:

McDaniels (courtesy of Shanahan) got...

- An overrated, whiny bitch of a quarterback who demanded a trade because McD fired his boyfriend and wouldn't treat him like the super star he thought he was.

- A bunch of locker room problems, like a WR who couldn't stay out of jail and disrupted practices and a TE who openly wished for the season to be over while his teammates were fighting for their playoff lives.

- Basically zero functional running backs.

- Complete trash on defense, save for a couple players.

- An absolutely laughable defensive line. (They were so bad they get their own mention)





Compare that to Shanahan, who inherits...

- A talented and steady (if unspectacular) starting quarterback with a talented and promising youngster for a backup.

- A running back who despite being a little aged, excelled when he played for Denver.

- Chris Cooley, a tight end with multiple Pro Bowls on his resume.

- Arguably one of the best defensive lines in the league.

- A talented defensive backfield.

- A roster with good depth.


Personally, I could see Shanahan having better immediate success than McD, but fast forward a few years when that talent is older or moved on in free agency and I think Shanny will be lagging behind McD again.

Dean
03-27-2010, 06:27 AM
Last year during the first six games the defense carried us to 6 and 0. Now, with real ability on the defenive line, we should win some games.

I am not sure whether I think this or I hope this but the Broncos by two games. Shanahan with a defense is a force to be reconned with.

TXBRONC
03-27-2010, 08:55 AM
Last year during the first six games the defense carried us to 6 and 0. Now, with real ability on the defenive line, we should win some games.

I am not sure weather I think this or I hope this but the Broncos by two games. Shanahan with a defense is a force to be reconned with.

Agreed.

We'll see how everything works out on defense. Bringing in Williams to play nose tackle could work out well for us if his health holds up. Nevertheless, at 34 years of age Jamal is no long term solution.

Kaylore
03-27-2010, 09:13 AM
It's too early to get into predictions, but considering we know who each time will play, why not break it down? Here's Denver's opponents:

HOME
Kansas City - W
Oakland - W
San Diego - W
Houston - W
Indianapolis - L
St. Louis - W
Seattle - W
N.Y. Jets - W

AWAY
Kansas City - L
Oakland - W
San Diego - L
Jacksonville - L
Tennessee - W
Arizona - W
San Franscisco - L
Baltimore - L

Obviously none of these are "locks" one way or another. But that's not an off-the wall prediction. You figure at least 9 wins. I'm thinking we do ten.

Now let's look at the Redskins Schedule. They actually have a pretty brutal schedule with a few cupcakes thrown in their.

Home:
Dallas - L
New York - W
Philadelphia Eagles - W
Green Bay Packers - L
Minnesota Vikings - L
Tampa Bay Buccaneers - W
Houston Texans - L
Indianapolis Colts - L

Away:
Dallas - L
New York - L
Philadelphia - L
Chicago - W
Detroit - W
St. Louis - W
Jacksonville Jaguars - W
Tennessee Titans - L

So I've got them at 7-9. Give or take. I don't see them getting more than eight wins - especially with the QB's they have right now.

tomjonesrocks
03-27-2010, 12:58 PM
Shanahan--and I don't think it will be close.

It appears he's putting that team together the right way--by actually keeping the top talent he has and adding more. Imagine the concept.

Without Slowik dragging him down the sky's the limit--wish he hadn't insisted on going down with that ship while he was here.

Bosco
03-27-2010, 03:40 PM
It appears he's putting that team together the right way--by actually keeping the top talent he has and adding more. Imagine the concept.

Well it kinda helps when the previous staff had at least implemented some discipline in the locker room.

Bozo Jr.
03-27-2010, 03:56 PM
JFMD - 10-6 + 2

'La Rat - 8-8 - 2

Ravage!!!
03-27-2010, 04:28 PM
Well it kinda helps when the previous staff had at least implemented some discipline in the locker room.

you are joking... right? :eek:

Northman
03-27-2010, 04:34 PM
It's too early to get into predictions, but considering we know who each time will play, why not break it down? Here's Denver's opponents:

HOME
Kansas City - W
Oakland - W
San Diego - W
Houston - W
Indianapolis - L
St. Louis - W
Seattle - W
N.Y. Jets - W

AWAY
Kansas City - L
Oakland - W
San Diego - L
Jacksonville - L
Tennessee - W
Arizona - W
San Franscisco - L
Baltimore - L

Obviously none of these are "locks" one way or another. But that's not an off-the wall prediction. You figure at least 9 wins. I'm thinking we do ten.

Now let's look at the Redskins Schedule. They actually have a pretty brutal schedule with a few cupcakes thrown in their.

Home:
Dallas - L
New York - W
Philadelphia Eagles - W
Green Bay Packers - L
Minnesota Vikings - L
Tampa Bay Buccaneers - W
Houston Texans - L
Indianapolis Colts - L

Away:
Dallas - L
New York - L
Philadelphia - L
Chicago - W
Detroit - W
St. Louis - W
Jacksonville Jaguars - W
Tennessee Titans - L

So I've got them at 7-9. Give or take. I don't see them getting more than eight wins - especially with the QB's they have right now.

Based off last season and the lack of progress down the stretch.

Denver:

HOME
Kansas City - L
Oakland - W
San Diego - L
Houston - L
Indianapolis - L
St. Louis - W
Seattle - W
N.Y. Jets - L

AWAY
Kansas City - L
Oakland - W
San Diego - L
Jacksonville - L
Tennessee - L
Arizona - L
San Franscisco - W
Baltimore - L

5-11 at best right now. Might change after the draft and FA period is over.

Washington:

Home:
Dallas - W
New York - W
Philadelphia Eagles - W
Green Bay Packers - L
Minnesota Vikings - L
Tampa Bay Buccaneers - W
Houston Texans - W
Indianapolis Colts - L

Away:
Dallas - L
New York - L
Philadelphia - L
Chicago - W
Detroit - W
St. Louis - W
Jacksonville Jaguars - W
Tennessee Titans - L

9-7 right now.

spikerman
03-27-2010, 04:48 PM
I'm also not sure why he is messing with Washington's defense. Haynesworth is already up in arms about possibly being moved to DE. The defense was set there, and all Shanahan had to do was come in and fix the offense, which there's no doubt in my mind he will.



Seriously he had a great D last year with this team and the offense stunk it up. IF he remotely tries to install a finesse game or screw with the defense at all, he is going to get his ass handed to him in that division.

I can't put my finger on it, but something about these statements sounds familiar. :confused:

Bosco
03-27-2010, 09:15 PM
you are joking... right? :eek:

Not in the slightest.

LRtagger
03-27-2010, 10:22 PM
Based off last season and the lack of progress down the stretch.

Denver:

HOME
Kansas City - L
Oakland - W
San Diego - L
Houston - L
Indianapolis - L
St. Louis - W
Seattle - W
N.Y. Jets - L

AWAY
Kansas City - L
Oakland - W
San Diego - L
Jacksonville - L
Tennessee - L
Arizona - L
San Franscisco - W
Baltimore - L

5-11 at best right now. Might change after the draft and FA period is over.

Washington:

Home:
Dallas - W
New York - W
Philadelphia Eagles - W
Green Bay Packers - L
Minnesota Vikings - L
Tampa Bay Buccaneers - W
Houston Texans - W
Indianapolis Colts - L

Away:
Dallas - L
New York - L
Philadelphia - L
Chicago - W
Detroit - W
St. Louis - W
Jacksonville Jaguars - W
Tennessee Titans - L

9-7 right now.

You think we get swept by KC, but you think Washington beats Dallas, NYG, AND Philly at home :confused:

hamrob
03-27-2010, 10:37 PM
McDaniels (courtesy of Shanahan) got...

- An overrated, whiny bitch of a quarterback who demanded a trade because McD fired his boyfriend and wouldn't treat him like the super star he thought he was.

- A bunch of locker room problems, like a WR who couldn't stay out of jail and disrupted practices and a TE who openly wished for the season to be over while his teammates were fighting for their playoff lives.

- Basically zero functional running backs.

- Complete trash on defense, save for a couple players.

- An absolutely laughable defensive line. (They were so bad they get their own mention)





Compare that to Shanahan, who inherits...

- A talented and steady (if unspectacular) starting quarterback with a talented and promising youngster for a backup.

- A running back who despite being a little aged, excelled when he played for Denver.

- Chris Cooley, a tight end with multiple Pro Bowls on his resume.

- Arguably one of the best defensive lines in the league.

- A talented defensive backfield.

- A roster with good depth.


Personally, I could see Shanahan having better immediate success than McD, but fast forward a few years when that talent is older or moved on in free agency and I think Shanny will be lagging behind McD again.This is one of the most ignorant posts I've read in quite some time.

Cutler was and is twice the QB as Cambell. Denver's Offense was the best young offense in Football when McDaniels came on the scene. They needed a revamped defense to be a playoff caliber team. The Skins aren't even close.

hamrob
03-27-2010, 10:45 PM
Well it kinda helps when the previous staff had at least implemented some discipline in the locker room.Are you referring to Zorn? :huh:

hamrob
03-27-2010, 10:48 PM
I think we will have the better record. We have the easier schedule. But, I think the Skins will be competetive and that they'll win some games they're not expected to.

I think we'll make the playoffs. For McDaniels sake we better.

I don't think that the Skins will be in the playoffs...their division is too strong.

Northman
03-27-2010, 10:50 PM
You think we get swept by KC, but you think Washington beats Dallas, NYG, AND Philly at home :confused:

I think Washington at this point has a better defense in place. They have a coach with a LOT more experience at winning and who knows how to put together an offense and a offensive plan. Add in the fact that the Giants are really struggling defensively and Dallas is unpredictable. McNabb may not even be a Eagle next year so that division really isnt that horrible when you break it all down. Problem for Denver is we just havent seen any real improvement and considering the collapse last year i think its safe to say we may have a rough year next depending on what moves we make.

Bosco
03-28-2010, 04:35 AM
This is one of the most ignorant posts I've read in quite some time. Cutler was and is twice the QB as Cambell. Based on what? His stats are not as flashy but he also hasn't had the turnover problem that Cutler has had.


Denver's Offense was the best young offense in Football when McDaniels came on the scene. Absolute bullshit. We were the 16th ranked offense in the NFL.


They needed a revamped defense to be a playoff caliber team. And that was never going to happen with Shanny and Slowick on staff.


The Skins aren't even close. Not quite. They have a very talented defense and some pieces on offense.

Ravage!!!
03-28-2010, 09:58 AM
Not in the slightest.

2 things.

1)The locker room never seemed to b undisciplined when Shanahan was here.
2)The locker room in Washington was absolutely NOT considered to be a disciplined locker room under Zorn. Your statement is absolutely, one hundred percent, ridiculous.

Ravage!!!
03-28-2010, 10:11 AM
Based on what? His stats are not as flashy but he also hasn't had the turnover problem that Cutler has had.
Campbell sucks. He doesn't win games, he doesn't make plays, he doesn't play well. Campbell is worse than Orton, hence why we (McD and the Broncos) decided to trade with the Bears instead of getting the BETTER draft pick with the Redskins, because McD considered Orton to be better than Campbell. Thats not a good thing.


Absolute bullshit. We were the 16th ranked offense in the NFL.
yes, with a 3rd year QB that just had one of the most prolific seasons for a young QB, a 3rd year WR that had over 100 catches (again), a rookie WR that had 90 catches, an OL that gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL, a rookie LT that gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL and led the league in rushing yrds behing him, and a 2nd year Right Tackle. A young TE that was considered on of the up-in-coming field stretchers in the NFL, and a running back corp that averaged 4.8 yards a carry with a STUD of a FB that was proving to be an gem of a draft pick.

Coming to Denver, the Broncos were considered the top for any new/rookie coach because our offense was considered to be one of the VERY TOP young offenses in the NFL with Dynamic players at QB, WR, OL, and a running scheme that succeeded DESPITE having 6 RBs go on IR.

Your assessment of the team is blind and absurd.


And that was never going to happen with Shanny and Slowick on staff.
Conjecture. Nothing more than a guess. Although I agree that Slowick was bad bad, you are using nothing but guesses and attempting to use it as fact.


Not quite. They have a very talented defense and some pieces on offense.

pieces? what? The ONE piece, is the TE. Thats all they have on the offense.

The RB is aged and injury prone. The OL is horrid that just had their best OL retire. Their WRs are bad, and the QB is terrible.

You must be watching a different league than the rest of us.

Slick
03-28-2010, 11:55 AM
Good points Rav. The only bone I can pick is with the running game. We couldn't punch it in if we had 8 downs.



...and I say Shanahan beats McD in wins unfortunately.

atwater27
03-28-2010, 12:32 PM
I'm curious to see how Shanahan's finesse offense will fit in the division. It's a black and blue power division similiar to the AFC North, and Shanahan hasn't not had a good record since 2000 against the power teams that control the LOS, like Baltimore and Pittsburgh.

.

Very few coaches have a good record against those teams since 2000. And what's this finesse offense crap? We've had good, powerful backs like Mike Anderson, Olandis Gary,Reuben Droughns, Portis was smaller but a tough nosed runner when he had to score or get a 1st down, strong, tough receivers like Rod Smith and Brandon marshall, tough tight ends like Carswell, Putz. Once again, Shanahan is being misrepresented and bashed by 'Broncos fans".

Bosco
03-28-2010, 06:26 PM
2 things.

1)The locker room never seemed to b undisciplined when Shanahan was here. I've already provided the proof to this.

A) Lynch coming out and saying that Cutler was basically allowed to do what he pleased.

B) Foxworth openly questioning Shanny's "open competition" claims.

C) D.J saying the defense felt like "second class citizens".

And that's just the short list. God knows what happens behind closed doors. Regardless, you have 3 absolute consummate professionals who've given us a look at the problems in the Broncos locker room.


2)The locker room in Washington was absolutely NOT considered to be a disciplined locker room under Zorn. Your statement is absolutely, one hundred percent, ridiculous. Where's your examples?


Campbell sucks. He doesn't win games, he doesn't make plays, he doesn't play well. Campbell is worse than Orton, hence why we (McD and the Broncos) decided to trade with the Bears instead of getting the BETTER draft pick with the Redskins, because McD considered Orton to be better than Campbell. Thats not a good thing. Of course Orton is better than Campbell, but then again Orton is better than most quarterbacks. That said, Shanny knows QB's and can help Campbell take the next step. It's not like Shanny is dealing with garbage at QB.


yes, with a 3rd year QB that just had one of the most prolific seasons for a young QB Thanks to an offense that passed the ball like it was ******* Madden. Too bad the touchdown numbers weren't inflated like the rest of the passing stats including interceptions.


a 3rd year WR that had over 100 catches (again) And a known headcase who was caught on tape disrupting practice and before McD came along, had never had a double digit touchdown season.


an OL that gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL, a rookie LT that gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL and led the league in rushing yrds behing him, and a 2nd year Right Tackle. Harris missed most of the season. Ben Hamilton was so crappy that he got benched. Wiegmann also played poorly.


A young TE that was considered on of the up-in-coming field stretchers in the NFL Who is a world class douche, evidenced by his benching in the final game.


and a running back corp that averaged 4.8 yards a carry And what members of that RB corp were available to McDaniels?


with a STUD of a FB that was proving to be an gem of a draft pick. The same "stud" of a FB who was benched by Shanahan in 2008 and not let back on the field until our RB corp was seriously depleted and then was one **** up after another in 2009?


Coming to Denver, the Broncos were considered the top for any new/rookie coach because our offense was considered to be one of the VERY TOP young offenses in the NFL with Dynamic players at QB, WR, OL, and a running scheme that succeeded DESPITE having 6 RBs go on IR. Yeah, we were basically the most attractive job for a young coach, but do you think those coaches were as enamored with that offense as the fans were? We were the 16th best offense in the league, and one of McDaniels first orders of business was making sure the team understood that and that it was unacceptable.


Your assessment of the team is blind and absurd. Quite the opposite. I don't get wrapped up in the flashy yardage stats and go "ZOMG!!1! OUR OFFENSE WAS THE L33T WIN UNTIL MCDOUCHE SHOWED UP!1!!"


Conjecture. Nothing more than a guess. Although I agree that Slowick was bad bad, you are using nothing but guesses and attempting to use it as fact. Sorry, but it's about as close to fact as you can get. Shanny was going to keep Slowik despite a year and a half of suck. How long did he give Jim Bates, who has actually had success as a DC? Answer: 6 months.

Slowik was Shanny's buddy and it typical Shanny nepotism, Slowik's job was pretty much safe.

atwater27
03-28-2010, 06:41 PM
Jason Campbell effing SUCKS at QB. Shanahan won't win crap with him, and I would be absolutely shocked if he started the season with Jason at the helm.

silkamilkamonico
03-28-2010, 07:22 PM
2 things.

1)The locker room never seemed to b undisciplined when Shanahan was here.
2)The locker room in Washington was absolutely NOT considered to be a disciplined locker room under Zorn. Your statement is absolutely, one hundred percent, ridiculous.

The locker room, arguably was, especially considering Shanahan's star QB was throwing the defense under the bus while contributing a 4 TD 7 INT ratio and QB rating in the 60's in the 3 playoff determining regular season games. How about he focuses on his garbage play, instead of throwing another unit under the bus?

And forget the lockerroom. Shanahan's teams his last 3 years in Denver were terribly undisciplined on the field, where it actually matters.

OrangeHoof
03-28-2010, 09:58 PM
Name for me two teams in the NFC East weaker than the Chiefs and the Raiders. It's not a fair comparison. You're essentially giving McD a four-win handicap.

I'll predict the Redskins will be within four wins of the Broncos.

Lonestar
03-28-2010, 10:21 PM
Name for me two teams in the NFC East weaker than the Chiefs and the Raiders. It's not a fair comparison. You're essentially giving McD a four-win handicap.

I'll predict the Redskins will be within four wins of the Broncos. considering that means he could be anywhere from 4-12 to 12-4 that is a hell of a spread. that is if we are 8-8 if we are 13-3 (unlikely) mike could be 9-7 and still be in the hunt.

Nice try.

broncofaninfla
03-29-2010, 08:38 AM
I think Shanny is building something special in Washington and wouldn't be surprised at all if Washington finishes with a better record. I think the firing will make Shanny a better coach and Hasselts 3/4 will be a great compliment to Shanny's kick ass offensive schemes. As for Denver I look for the defense to be better than last year but based on 2009, see no reason for optimism for the offense at all.

claymore
03-29-2010, 08:45 AM
McDaniels (courtesy of Shanahan) got...

- An overrated, whiny bitch of a quarterback who demanded a trade because McD fired his boyfriend and wouldn't treat him like the super star he thought he was.

- A bunch of locker room problems, like a WR who couldn't stay out of jail and disrupted practices and a TE who openly wished for the season to be over while his teammates were fighting for their playoff lives.

- Basically zero functional running backs.

- Complete trash on defense, save for a couple players.

- An absolutely laughable defensive line. (They were so bad they get their own mention)





Compare that to Shanahan, who inherits...

- A talented and steady (if unspectacular) starting quarterback with a talented and promising youngster for a backup.

- A running back who despite being a little aged, excelled when he played for Denver.

- Chris Cooley, a tight end with multiple Pro Bowls on his resume.

- Arguably one of the best defensive lines in the league.

- A talented defensive backfield.

- A roster with good depth.


Personally, I could see Shanahan having better immediate success than McD, but fast forward a few years when that talent is older or moved on in free agency and I think Shanny will be lagging behind McD again.
LMAO. :laugh:

Elevation inc
03-29-2010, 09:25 AM
meh without reading all the wack back and forth....i belive both will be 9-7 or better....shanny is good with qb's and i belive when he gets a OL in town campbell will have a good season.....they have some good weapons there and a good defense, they just had a wack coach and no OL last year....

we have a very good defense as well....and i belive our o will improve even with the loss of marshall, i belive a big reason for that will be the new PBS scheme....also not having to play 8 times agaisnt the most physical teams in the nfl will help...

this draft is key for both coaches.....thats for sure....but both teams have players in place to do damage....they key will be which one is the better offensive genius, and which one has the ability to adapt when otehr teams know how to stop us....both MCd and shanny dont really have a good grasp of how to adapt once they get figured out....

mcd is still learning, and shanny should know better, so for me....i belive both teams will do better than expected....and i wouldnt be suprised to see both in the playoffs as wildcards....

Elevation inc
03-29-2010, 09:31 AM
2 things.

1)The locker room never seemed to b undisciplined when Shanahan was here.
2)The locker room in Washington was absolutely NOT considered to be a disciplined locker room under Zorn. Your statement is absolutely, one hundred percent, ridiculous.

WHAT????????????????????

DARYL GARDNER
Ashley Lelie
George foster
tatum bell
clinton portis
Sam Adams
travis henry
Montrae Holland
BRANDON MARSHALL
MAURICE CLARETT
MIKE BELL

just to name a few while he was here...i could keep going if you want.....

claymore
03-29-2010, 09:36 AM
Jason Campbell effing SUCKS at QB. Shanahan won't win crap with him, and I would be absolutely shocked if he started the season with Jason at the helm.

Campbell is better than Plummer. I wouldnt be shocked if their was a sudden market for Campbell next year.

broncobryce
03-29-2010, 09:45 AM
Campbell is better than Plummer. I wouldnt be shocked if their was a sudden market for Campbell next year.

The jury is still out. But I wouldn't be shocked either. He's another guy who had a different offense almost every year to learn. Shanahan should be able to get his arrow pointing up. I really like Colt Brennan too.

turftoad
03-29-2010, 09:59 AM
Campbell is better than Plummer. I wouldnt be shocked if their was a sudden market for Campbell next year.

Campbell may not even be starting this year. Kyle Shanahan (Houston OC last year) brought Grossman with him to DC. He must like him.

Time will tell.

claymore
03-29-2010, 10:05 AM
Campbell may not even be starting this year. Kyle Shanahan (Houston OC last year) brought Grossman with him to DC. He must like him.

Time will tell.

I think he would have to have an amazing camp for that to happen. Regardless of who starts, I think they will have a better year than last. Unless its Bradford or Clausen!

Ravage!!!
03-29-2010, 10:16 AM
WHAT????????????????????

DARYL GARDNER
Ashley Lelie
George foster
tatum bell
clinton portis
Sam Adams
travis henry
Montrae Holland
BRANDON MARSHALL
MAURICE CLARETT
MIKE BELL

just to name a few while he was here...i could keep going if you want.....

Thats fine. every team has those players..... but where is this "undisciplined locker room?" Foster? Tatum Bell? Holland? are you just naming players that weren't good? Mike Bell? what are you naming here?

This doesn't make your point for an undisciplined locker room, Inc

Mike
03-29-2010, 10:18 AM
Campbell isn't that bad considering the coaches and WRs he has had to play with. I am interested to see what Shanahan can do with him.

I will go with the Broncos to win maybe 1-2 games more this year. They have the benefit of playing in the system for a year, whereas Washington will be learning their's. But Washington's stout defense will help them transition easier, IMO. I wish Shanahan well and hope he takes them to the playoffs...which is entirely possible in the NFC. It won't change my opinion that change was needed here in Denver though.

Ravage!!!
03-29-2010, 10:20 AM
The locker room, arguably was, especially considering Shanahan's star QB was throwing the defense under the bus while contributing a 4 TD 7 INT ratio and QB rating in the 60's in the 3 playoff determining regular season games. How about he focuses on his garbage play, instead of throwing another unit under the bus?

And forget the lockerroom. Shanahan's teams his last 3 years in Denver were terribly undisciplined on the field, where it actually matters.

All of this, is complete BS if you re talking about undisciplined Locker room, and most of this is yoru biased crap.

As far as on the field... undisciplined how? did we lead the league in penalties? DId we have a collapse like in '09?? So who has the "undisciplined" team on the field if thats the crap you are going to spew. This is probably the most ridiculous post I've ever seen you make. Doesn't make an ouce of sense other than for you to ATTEMPT to gripe and complain about Shanahan and Cutler. Lame. :coffee:

claymore
03-29-2010, 10:20 AM
Campbell isn't that bad considering the coaches and WRs he has had to play with. I am interested to see what Shanahan can do with him.

I will go with the Broncos to win maybe 1-2 games more this year. They have the benefit of playing in the system for a year, whereas Washington will be learning their's. But Washington's stout defense will help them transition easier, IMO. I wish Shanahan well and hope he takes them to the playoffs...which is entirely possible in the NFC. It won't change my opinion that change was needed here in Denver though.

Change was needed for both the Broncos and Shanahan. Leadership grows stale after awhile.

Ravage!!!
03-29-2010, 10:21 AM
Campbell is better than Plummer. I wouldnt be shocked if their was a sudden market for Campbell next year.

Dude.. I have to completely disagree with you here. We know I thought Plummer was nothing more than an average QB with above average feet. But Campbell... ugh.... is just bad.

T.K.O.
03-29-2010, 10:23 AM
Dude.. I have to completely disagree with you here. We know I thought Plummer was nothing more than an average QB with above average feet. But Campbell... ugh.... is just bad.

he looked like a superstar compared to simms though.....;)

Elevation inc
03-29-2010, 10:29 AM
Thats fine. every team has those players..... but where is this "undisciplined locker room?" Foster? Tatum Bell? Holland? are you just naming players that weren't good? Mike Bell? what are you naming here?

This doesn't make your point for an undisciplined locker room, Inc

forster and holland couldnt keep there weight down, thats undisciplined, tatum bell and mike bell both had huge attitude issues regarding playing time...the rest had huge discipline issues as well....

personally i belive club shanny was to soft and he didnt know how to discipline players and the rookies felt unfairly treated when the vets got free reign even if they werent performing well...the new changes are refreshing....but its my opinion just like you belive MCD is a ego maniac....

Elevation inc
03-29-2010, 10:33 AM
All of this, is complete BS if you re talking about undisciplined Locker room, and most of this is yoru biased crap.

As far as on the field... undisciplined how? did we lead the league in penalties? DId we have a collapse like in '09?? So who has the "undisciplined" team on the field if thats the crap you are going to spew. This is probably the most ridiculous post I've ever seen you make. Doesn't make an ouce of sense other than for you to ATTEMPT to gripe and complain about Shanahan and Cutler. Lame. :coffee:

Run defense is the epitomy of discipline on the field, playing your gap, making a tackle, wrapping up, being physical....just saying.....

claymore
03-29-2010, 10:36 AM
Dude.. I have to completely disagree with you here. We know I thought Plummer was nothing more than an average QB with above average feet. But Campbell... ugh.... is just bad.

I disagree. Campbell is a decent QB. Plummers Pre Shanahan QB rating was in the 60's. Campbell's Pre Shanahan rating is in the 80's. They both suffered terrible teams. Add some bootlegs and a better running game to Campbell and he will be a monster.

T.K.O.
03-29-2010, 11:08 AM
we had the most brutal 8 game schedule stretch in football last year and combined with injuries,the broncos took a beating and could'nt recover.
i think the strides the FO is making to make the broncos a bigger ,tougher team will pay off.
that and the fact that the offensive and defensive scheme will be the same .we should be more competetive this coming season.
i see a real shot at the division:salute:
to answer the question.....
washington 6-10
denver 10-6

silkamilkamonico
03-29-2010, 03:32 PM
All of this, is complete BS if you re talking about undisciplined Locker room, and most of this is yoru biased crap.

As far as on the field... undisciplined how? did we lead the league in penalties? DId we have a collapse like in '09?? So who has the "undisciplined" team on the field if thats the crap you are going to spew. This is probably the most ridiculous post I've ever seen you make. Doesn't make an ouce of sense other than for you to ATTEMPT to gripe and complain about Shanahan and Cutler. Lame. :coffee:

Yea, biased crap. How dare anyone criticize the QB with the golden arm for throwing the defense under the bus when he bombed in all 3 of the playoff determining games for Denver. Great argument there.

Being disciplined isn't throwing your teammates under the bus, especially when you can't even take care of your own responsibilities.

Being disciplined on the field is not turning the ball over, you don't have to look past the Miami game when Cutler single handidly lost that game by saying "**** it", and throwing it to the other team. A little NFL 101 knowledge for ya.

But hey, he's Jay Cutler, right? "Who cares about actually winning games when your QB has a stronger arm than John Elway."

Buff
03-29-2010, 03:53 PM
Change was needed for both the Broncos and Shanahan. Leadership grows stale after awhile.

That's why I've nominated you to take NTL's place as a BF mod.

claymore
03-29-2010, 03:59 PM
That's why I've nominated you to take NTL's place as a BF mod.

I would get liquoured up and Ban Rcsodak.

claymore
03-29-2010, 04:00 PM
Yea, biased crap. How dare anyone criticize the QB with the golden arm for throwing the defense under the bus when he bombed in all 3 of the playoff determining games for Denver. Great argument there.

Being disciplined isn't throwing your teammates under the bus, especially when you can't even take care of your own responsibilities.

Being disciplined on the field is not turning the ball over, you don't have to look past the Miami game when Cutler single handidly lost that game by saying "**** it", and throwing it to the other team. A little NFL 101 knowledge for ya.

But hey, he's Jay Cutler, right? "Who cares about actually winning games when your QB has a stronger arm than John Elway."

He was a 3 year QB. Jeebus.

T.K.O.
03-29-2010, 04:08 PM
He was a 3 year QB. Jeebus.

and year #4 was'nt so hot.....;)
but he does'nt play for mcD or shanny.....yet

claymore
03-29-2010, 04:14 PM
and year #4 was'nt so hot.....;)
but he does'nt play for mcD or shanny.....yet

Yeah we've been over that. Compare his worst year to Elway's or Montana's or Manning's etc...

Ravage!!!
03-29-2010, 05:18 PM
Run defense is the epitomy of discipline on the field, playing your gap, making a tackle, wrapping up, being physical....just saying.....

Wait.. I'm confused.... are you talking about Shanahan's tenure here, or McD's??? For I saw a hug collapse. Whats the definition of setting an NFL record for not making the playoffs after 6-0 start? Undisciplined? What about players throwing fits, not making it on time to the rehab? TE's that complain about not being used?

I guess you are going to say that these are just from a couple players, or, they are "shanahan's" players. But werent' they in McD's locker room last year? Couldn't he control his locker room? Or.. you could say that these players are individuals and can't have the coach control their mouths..... much like the Mike Bell (uhmm, still think you are exaggerating this to the MILLIONTH degree, but either way) did?

If our defense was so disciplined (compared to Shanahan's years) this last season, how did we get run over by the Chiefs who has one of the worst OLs in the NFL? IF our team was so disciplined (compared to Shanahan's years), how did our OL go from being one of the very best, to one of the very worst in a single season? I can go on and on if you want to, but the point is the things you tried to point out against Shanahan, are the VERY things that happened VERY MUCH so on this team in '09.

Please don't try to tell me last years team was Shanahan's fault. You can't give credit to the 6-0 start to McD and try to blame the bad on the previous regime.

Elevation inc
03-29-2010, 05:34 PM
Wait.. I'm confused.... are you talking about Shanahan's tenure here, or McD's??? For I saw a hug collapse. Whats the definition of setting an NFL record for not making the playoffs after 6-0 start? Undisciplined? What about players throwing fits, not making it on time to the rehab? TE's that complain about not being used?

lol im talking about shann'ys ten year reign where you think he would have gotten a clue, not a coach who had to deal with a few bad apple leftovers as a new coach in denver for what 1 year now....lol...and yes 2 players marshall/sheffler still indenver when shanny left and the season started last year, and guess what both wont be after they acted like clowns because MCD dont let that crap fly...

I guess you are going to say that these are just from a couple players, or, they are "shanahan's" players. But werent' they in McD's locker room last year? Couldn't he control his locker room? Or.. you could say that these players are individuals and can't have the coach control their mouths..... much like the Mike Bell (uhmm, still think you are exaggerating this to the MILLIONTH degree, but either way) did?

um mike bell in his own words in a interview stated how bad his attitude was after his rookie year..it was in the DP before the superbowl....and all the other players i mentioned are not close to exaggerrated....if you think they are you havent been paying attention the last ten years

If our defense was so disciplined (compared to Shanahan's years) this last season, how did we get run over by the Chiefs who has one of the worst OLs in the NFL? IF our team was so disciplined (compared to Shanahan's years), how did our OL go from being one of the very best, to one of the very worst in a single season? I can go on and on if you want to, but the point is the things you tried to point out against Shanahan, are the VERY things that happened VERY MUCH so on this team in '09.

New D system was figured out, nolan(aka god to many of you:coffee:) didnt know how to adjust to new offense packages, just like had had problems with in san fran....he did good work here, but he was never aggressive enough as he should be and he really wasnt a great adapter when figured out....we had journey men back-ups playiong starter roles who had never done it before....there are many enviormental factors that went into last years collapse...which MCD himself admited needed review as a whole, because him and the org can do better and will do better...

Please don't try to tell me last years team was Shanahan's fault. You can't give credit to the 6-0 start to McD and try to blame the bad on the previous regime.

i didnt do that your just trying to say i did....*shrugs*


ten characters...

Ravage!!!
03-29-2010, 05:37 PM
Hmmm... I see. So McD doesn't have any of these problems, it was purely Shanahan. I guess McD truly is incapable of making a mistake and doing everything right. I mean, the proof is right there, everything had an explanation pointing to someone else

Elevation inc
03-29-2010, 05:43 PM
Hmmm... I see. So McD doesn't have any of these problems, it was purely Shanahan. I guess McD truly is incapable of making a mistake and doing everything right. I mean, the proof is right there, everything had an explanation pointing to someone else

i dont have enough proof...shanny gave me ten plus years of proof bro...mcd has given what 1 year with some questions here and there...but all 3 questioned players had glaring issues.....sheff,cutler and marshall had attitudes and werent very disciplined far before MCD got ahold of them, thats fact....now could MCd be more diplomatic at times and handle thinsg better yes, but for a young thats part of a learning as a new HC....whats shanny excuse in year 14 in denver????

whats funny is i enjoyed, shanny immensely, and liked watching marshall, cutler, and sheff.....but i knew when they were drafted the charcter concerns each one had...and i havent seen anything from any of them to make me think its MCD....when all 3 had history with attidue dating back to collge, when they were green prospects looking for a nfl job....

T.K.O.
03-29-2010, 06:16 PM
shanny and mcD had very different philosophies when it comes to players.shanny did'nt care so much about off field issues and attitude (see m.clarrett and travis henry) where mcd is trying to build a team with high character guys who want to "buy into the team 1st mentallity"
we dont yet know which will be better but we have had a decade of mediocrity so i will give a new approach a chance.
i think shanny was a great coach for a while and likely will be after recharging his batteries.
but i also think mcD is on the right track .
given that the broncos had one of the easiest schedules in the nfl in 08' and finished 8-8
and one of the toughest in 09' and finished with the same record....i just hope we see some improvement soon regardless of who we fans think should be coach !

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
03-29-2010, 07:02 PM
http://i430.photobucket.com/albums/qq28/adam98svt/oriellythisthreadsucks.gif

DenBronx
03-29-2010, 08:21 PM
McDaniels (courtesy of Shanahan) got...

- An overrated, whiny bitch of a quarterback who demanded a trade because McD fired his boyfriend and wouldn't treat him like the super star he thought he was.

- A bunch of locker room problems, like a WR who couldn't stay out of jail and disrupted practices and a TE who openly wished for the season to be over while his teammates were fighting for their playoff lives.

- Basically zero functional running backs.

- Complete trash on defense, save for a couple players.

- An absolutely laughable defensive line. (They were so bad they get their own mention)





Compare that to Shanahan, who inherits...

- A talented and steady (if unspectacular) starting quarterback with a talented and promising youngster for a backup.

- A running back who despite being a little aged, excelled when he played for Denver.

- Chris Cooley, a tight end with multiple Pro Bowls on his resume.

- Arguably one of the best defensive lines in the league.

- A talented defensive backfield.

- A roster with good depth.


Personally, I could see Shanahan having better immediate success than McD, but fast forward a few years when that talent is older or moved on in free agency and I think Shanny will be lagging behind McD again.



Not arguing on your whole post but are you refering to Bates being fired? Although Cutler was openly concerned that Bates would stay never did he say that he wanted out because Bates was canned. The reason McD let Bates go was because their play calling styles just wouldn't mesh. I disagreed with the move but can see why.

Shannys inheriting two talented promising QB's? Campbell hasn't proved jack! McD inherited a pro bowl QB in his 3rd year and shit cans him too. You never see this in the NFL. Although I think Shanny will turn Campbell into a better QB who else are you talkin about bud? The draft? Claussen? Unproven...even if he takes Bradford I'll just go on record now as saying neither will have a better career than Cutler. BTW, there are no gaurantees that WAS will even draft a QB.

Portis will be a backup the rest of his career. Even LT and Jones who are much better RB's at this stage in their careers will do better than injury prone Portis.

horsepig
03-29-2010, 09:25 PM
Shanahan--and I don't think it will be close.

It appears he's putting that team together the right way--by actually keeping the top talent he has and adding more. Imagine the concept.

Without Slowik dragging him down the sky's the limit--wish he hadn't insisted on going down with that ship while he was here.

?

Defense?

Shanny?

Bosco
03-29-2010, 11:02 PM
Not arguing on your whole post but are you refering to Bates being fired? Although Cutler was openly concerned that Bates would stay never did he say that he wanted out because Bates was canned. No, he never went public with it but Peter King and Adam Schefter both reported it.

http://www.mouthpiecesports.com/blog/2010/01/06/will-bears-cede-to-jay-cutler-and-hire-jeremy-bates/

http://www.scoresreport.com/2009/03/02/king-cutler-had-already-asked-to-be-traded/


The reason McD let Bates go was because their play calling styles just wouldn't mesh. I disagreed with the move but can see why. Actually their styles probably would have meshed fine, but McDaniels was going to call the plays and it's unlikely Bates would been OK with going back to being a glorified position coach.

Bates and Shanahan actually admitted that their 2008 offense copied alot of elements from the 2007 Patriots, so keeping Bates wouldn't have meant much anyways. Besides, Bates wasn't a very good play caller. I'm sure he'll get better in time but in 2008 he just didn't impress me much.