You're Gonna Love This News About Brady Quinn

[WARHORSE]

Hope you all appreciate the work ole WARHORSE puts in for ya.

I got to thinkin about Quinn and his unimpressive welcome to the NFL.

I went to watching game tape-whatever I could find online-of him playing for Notre Dame and I came away really impressed. I mean, I didnt see anything that told me, "No, this guy is not going to cut it in the NFL."

In his sophomore and junior seasons at Notre Dame, he did as follows:

2005- 32 TDs vs 7 INTs

2006- 37 TDs vs 7 INTs

Over 60% completion rate, and his QB ratings were almost always over 120.

This happened with an offensive line that if you remember was lacking with the exception of Harris. a

He also used his legs to good gain.

So anyway, Im thinking.....why hasnt this guy paid off?

That got me thinking about who has coached him up to this point in the pros.

Heres the fun part.


2007

Rob Chudinski was named offensive coordinator for the Browns for the 2007 season by Crennel and Savage because his "presentation was impressive."

They never looked to the fact that Chud had only had a couple of years experience in the NFL, and then a few in college.....ALL at the TE position. He has never coached a quarterback in his life. Neither had headcoach Romeo Crennel.

So, they draft Quinn in the first round, and Quinn comes in 10 days late to camp due to contract negotiations, and Anderson gets the start over Frye.
Quinn falls behind, and never gets much attention cause Anderson is the starter.

Anderson does an impressive job, and moves to a 10-6 record on the year. Anderson is also named the starter for the following year.

2008

Anderson named starter, he plays the first 8 games going 3-5. Quinn is named the starter against the Denver Broncos. He plays well, but loses when Cutler throws 3 late TDs to win it.
Next game he engineers a win against the Bills, but breaks his finger on a helmet during the game. At Quinns insistence, he gets Crennel to let him try and play through it against the Texans, but cant overcome. He has season ending surgery.

2009
Coach Eric Mangini is named HC, and he brings in quarterback guru Brian Daboll to be OC. His QB coach is Carl Smith.......WHO?

Daboll never coached QBs until Mangini brought him on board with the Jets. He was a defensive backs coach. He coached Pennington and Favre......um, like they needed coaching. BTW, they both had terrible years. After Mangini was fired by NY and hired by the Browns, Mangina brought Daboll to Cleveland last year to be OC of the Browns.
Carl Smith, QB coach for the Browns last year, has been in the league many years. He has coached everything from RBs, Oline, Dline, special teams, WRs and ....you get the picture. But as a quarterback coach or offensive coordinator, he has never done anything of note.
Never done anything of note with an offense or quarterback. Long list of accolades:

Coaching Background:
1971 Cal Poly State University, graduate assistant
1972 University of Colorado, graduate assistant
1973 University of Colorado, linebackers coach
1974 University of Louisiana-Lafayette, defensive line coach
1975-76 University of Louisiana-Lafayette, defensive backs coach
1977-78 University of Louisiana-Lafayette, offensive coordinator/running backs coach
1979-80 Lamar University, offensive coordinator/quarterbacks coach
1981 Lamar University, offensive coordinator/offensive line coach
1982 North Carolina State University, offensive coordinator/quarterbacks coach
1983 Philadelphia Stars (USFL), special teams coach/tight ends coach
1984-85 Philadelphia/Baltimore Stars (USFL), quarterbacks/wide receivers coach
1986-96 New Orleans Saints, offensive coordinator/quarterbacks coach
1997 New England Patriots, assistant head coach/quarterbacks coach
1998-99 New England Patriots, tight ends coach
2001-03 Cleveland Browns, quarterbacks coach
2004 University of Southern California, quarterbacks coach
2005-06 Jacksonville Jaguars, offensive coordinator

I list this out for you, because as you can see, he was so good, he could never hold the job for long. He knows nothing. Especially of modern quarterbacking. Look at the last 10 years in the league......fired from Jacksonville.......fired from USC.....Fired from Cleveland after guru-ing Tim Couch to a seat on your couch next to you.......demoted to TEs after being given a year with Bledsoe.

SOOOOOO................

Whats the point?


The point is, Brady has never had anyone with any real quarterback experience around him. No one.


Dont know about you, but that gives me a little hitch in my giddyup.:beer:

B R O N C O S BABY!

[Italianmobstr7]

Brady Quinn for president!

[NightTrainLayne]

Good thing our QB coach is so experienced

[Carl]

And I thought I was a diehard fan....... Fantastic work War!!!!

[Lancane]

Hahaha...now that's funny and yet sad at the same time...


Between Josh and Ben McDaniels as well as Mike McCoy we have enough experience at quarterback and coaching the position to help Quinn develop his talent into a better quarterback himself. Josh worked with Brady and Cassell, Ben has experience and has coached the position at the high school level and McCoy has just as much experience as Josh at working with quarterbacks.

[tomjonesrocks]

I am not a McDaniels supporter. I'm am STILL not over Cutler and this guy has shown me nothing that makes me think by 2011 the team won't be looking for a new HC.

Nevertheless, unless there's a gentlemens-draft-day-deal worked out that evens things up--I don't know how there can be outrage with this trade. Look at what the Chargers got for their 3rd string QB. Whitehurst is worth what Seattle paid for him but the Broncos got Quinn for a FB that they were never going to play and 2 bottom-of-the-draft picks? I'm pretty impressed whether Quinn winds up stinking up Invesco or not.

[WARHORSE]

Hahaha...now that's funny and yet sad at the same time...


Between Josh and Ben McDaniels as well as Mike McCoy we have enough experience at quarterback and coaching the position to help Quinn develop his talent into a better quarterback himself. Josh worked with Brady and Cassell, Ben has experience and has coached the position at the high school level and McCoy has just as much experience as Josh at working with quarterbacks.

True.

Difference is the results though.

McDaniels is a driven man, no one in the nation can deny that.

The man is obsessed with the position, and he has played it.

Coaches like Josh live, eat and breathe quarterbacking.

I have very little doubt that just like last year, Josh will be right behind Kyle and Bradys ear the entire practice.

McCoy and Ben are there to learn. You know it. I know. The team knows it.

If Ben is HALF as impressive a coach as his brother is, Im fine with it.:coffee:

[Lancane]

True.

Difference is the results though.

McDaniels is a driven man, no one in the nation can deny that.

The man is obsessed with the position, and he has played it.

Coaches like Josh live, eat and breathe quarterbacking.

I have very little doubt that just like last year, Josh will be right behind Kyle and Bradys ear the entire practice.

McCoy and Ben are there to learn. You know it. I know. The team knows it.

If Ben is HALF as impressive a coach as his brother is, Im fine with it.:coffee:

Don't discount McCoy War, we have to remember that he was the quarterback coach for Jake Delhomme during his best season in the league, the one that netted him that sick contract that raped the Panthers.

[TXBRONC]

True.

Difference is the results though.

McDaniels is a driven man, no one in the nation can deny that.

The man is obsessed with the position, and he has played it.

Coaches like Josh live, eat and breathe quarterbacking.

I have very little doubt that just like last year, Josh will be right behind Kyle and Bradys ear the entire practice.

McCoy and Ben are there to learn. You know it. I know. The team knows it.

If Ben is HALF as impressive a coach as his brother is, Im fine with it.:coffee:

I'll give you Ben is there to learn but McCoy not on a bet. McCoy like McDaniels has played the position and he's been a quarterback's coach for several years prior to McDaniels hiring him.

[Shazam!]

The kid has tremendous talent, we're all aware. If McD can shine him up, Denver could possibly have a future Starter. If not, a better backup than Chris Simms.

[WARHORSE]

I'll give you Ben is there to learn but McCoy not on a bet. McCoy like McDaniels has played the position and he's been a quarterback's coach for several years prior to McDaniels hiring him.

True. Not knocking McCoy.

But McCoy doesnt know this system like McD, and McD calls the plays on gameday.

So, Josh coaches the QBs, calls the plays on sundays.............

Thats all Im sayin.

McCoy isnt an OC in the true sense of the words......:beer:

[SOCALORADO.]

QWinn will start week 1.

[claymore]

Josh McDaniels cant be the QB Coach, OC, and HC all at once. THere isnt enough time in the day.

[GEM]

Josh McDaniels cant be the QB Coach, OC, and HC all at once. THere isnt enough time in the day.

Why not, Shanny was HC, GM, Head honcho of all operations. :laugh:

[Dreadnought]

Why not, Shanny was HC, GM, Head honcho of all operations. :laugh:

True, and it eventually cost him his job IMO. He was possibly the most brillant head coach I have watched anywhere in my lifetime, and he still couldn't do it all. I blame his hiring Jim Bates and Bob Slowick on exhaustion brought on by overwork brought on by excessive self esteem. Ditto his defensive drafting :D

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Why not, Shanny was HC, GM, Head honcho of all operations. :laugh:

Also, correct me if I am wrong, but did he not also put the offensive game plan together, and call the plays?

[GEM]

True, and it eventually cost him his job IMO. He was possibly the most brillant head coach I have watched anywhere in my lifetime, and he still couldn't do it all. I blame his hiring Jim Bates and Bob Slowick on exhaustion brought on by overwork brought on by excessive self esteem. Ditto his defensive drafting :D

I wish he would have just dropped some of those responsibilities and went strictly with coaching. We wouldn't have the mess we have now and he could have focused on some success. Water under the bridge now.

[GEM]

Also, correct me if I am wrong, but did he not also put the offensive game plan together, and call the plays?

Didn't he set up the first 15 plays and then his OC took over unless he overrode the play called?

[broncofaninfla]

It is my understanding he scripts the first 10-15 plays, then the game plan is adjusted based on what the opposing defense is doing.

[TXBRONC]

Also, correct me if I am wrong, but did he not also put the offensive game plan together, and call the plays?

If you mean unilaterally no not by a long shot. Like EVERY headcoach his staff was involved in the game planning. And no he did always call the plays. His offensive co-ordinators did much of playing calling. However, he always reserved the right to override a play that his o.c. would call.

[TXBRONC]

Didn't he set up the first 15 plays and then his OC took over unless he overrode the play called?

Yes but even the 15 scripted plays were a colaborative effort with the rest of his offensive staff.

[Ravage!!!]

THe other coaches will know the system before they are coaching it.

Plus... you don't need to know the 'specific system' to know how to read defenses. System is just knowing the terminology. Knowing the kinks to the routes. You don't need to be the 'maker of the system' to coach it, or the QB. Thats why HCs have QB coaches all over the NFL. I know people like to believe it, but McD's system isn't more complicated or difficult than everyone else's.

[Lancane]

Coaching and offensive gameplanning are two different spheres of the collective whole to success. No matter the position, but especially at the quarterback position. That is one reason I am sort of glad we have McCoy closer to the situation then Josh will be. He knows the more general favored offenses that are utilized in and around the league and will coach him as a quarterback, not just someone who will utilize the small advantages of the spread offense.

[claymore]

Why not, Shanny was HC, GM, Head honcho of all operations. :laugh:

It bit us all in the ass eventually. If we had a good offensive Coordinator it wouldnt bother me so much.

I have more faith in Martindale than I do any other coach on this team, and thats not saying much.

A HC has to be able to delegate responsibilities to the assistants. I just dont see where McD can do that.

[broncofaninfla]

It bit us all in the ass eventually. If we had a good offensive Coordinator it wouldnt bother me so much.

I have more faith in Martindale than I do any other coach on this team, and thats not saying much.

A HC has to be able to delegate responsibilities to the assistants. I just dont see where McD can do that.

I agree with you, I'm not impressed with Mcd as a play caller or his offensive game planning at all. Before the flamers start pulling lack of excecution out of thier huge book of excuses I'm talking purely about the play calling (dink and dunk, bubble screens, and the 3 running plays we run over and over and over.) I expected way more from Mcd because of his success at New New England but looks like Brady and Belichek were the primary reason for that. He seems to have a good work ethic though and I'm optimistic he'll do a better job of tayloring his game planning to the talent we have on our roster.

[Lonestar]

Iirc mike had the play sheet on the sidelines and called the play in after looking at it.

Now I have not seen everygame the past couple of years. But the games I have seen. He was the scheming on the sidelines.

Mike was a micro manager and had video feeds of every meeting going on into his office. So he could keep tabs on what was going on.

He was a brilliant offensive mind. But should hav e found a strong GM that he could work with. To be able to say I need the following positions go fetch them for me.

But he was afraid of getting someone that would be like aldavis.

Dread you mentioned him hiring Bates. I do not think he did so free and clear. I truly believe that Bates was pushed down his throat by Pat.

The reason I say that is bates more or less had a free hand on draft day. There is no time in mikes career that he spent 75% on a draft class on DL guys.

I beleieve Pat forced his hand after mike had named slowitt the DC. I futher believe he told Pat that it would fail but he would try it.

If you noticed very few of the players bought into the scheme knowing that slowitt was getting the job back if it did not workout.

By the by week it was over and bates was an after thought.


Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

[WARHORSE]

Josh McDaniels cant be the QB Coach, OC, and HC all at once. THere isnt enough time in the day.



He is the QB coach. Im sure he is drilling into brother Ben what Ben can do to help the QBs in areas that hes not dealing with.

Play calling? You gotta do SOMETHING on gameday besides walk the sidelines and call timeouts.

OC?

Thats gameplanning and attack.


Josh is actually a true head coach. He has his hands in everything and he wants things done his way. (See: Mike Nolan)


If my head is on the line.........its MY way or the HIGHWAY.

[claymore]

He is the QB coach. Im sure he is drilling into brother Ben what Ben can do to help the QBs in areas that hes not dealing with.

Play calling? You gotta do SOMETHING on gameday besides walk the sidelines and call timeouts.

OC?

Thats gameplanning and attack.


Josh is actually a true head coach. He has his hands in everything and he wants things done his way. (See: Mike Nolan)


If my head is on the line.........its MY way or the HIGHWAY.
Not enough hours in the week War. If he continues to do it this way he will fail.

He needs successfull assistants before this team is good.

I have zero hope for anyone but Martindale. I dont like McCoy, and Ben Mcdaniels is freaking laughable.

Not being negative. Just not overly optimistic for this staff. If we seem to have a good draft, it will be a step in the right direction.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

If you mean unilaterally no not by a long shot. Like EVERY headcoach his staff was involved in the game planning. And no he did always call the plays. His offensive co-ordinators did much of playing calling. However, he always reserved the right to override a play that his o.c. would call.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/02/26/kyle-shanahan-not-mike-will-call-redskins-plays

Posted Feb. 26, 2010 @ 4:58 p.m.
By Eric Edholm

INDIANAPOLIS — Although Mike Shanahan mostly spoke in generalities at the Combine about his team's specific plans next season, he did reveal one interesting nugget.

Kyle Shanahan, Mike's son who has been hired as offensive coordinator, will call plays.

"Kyle did a great job calling plays last year [for Houston]," Mike Shanahan said. "I'm heavily involved in offense and defense."

Mike Shanahan always called plays in Denver, despite other people holding the title of offensive coordinator. And though he's giving that part of his coaching responsibility up, keeping it in the family, he still will be heavily involved in the offensive game plan.

"I think one of the reasons why I've stayed in this profession is I love the game," Mike said. "I love the Xs and Os. I love the game, and I'll always be involved in both sides of the ball. I'll also delegate a lot of responsibility to people that have proven they can handle it."

[Lancane]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/02/26/kyle-shanahan-not-mike-will-call-redskins-plays

Posted Feb. 26, 2010 @ 4:58 p.m.
By Eric Edholm

INDIANAPOLIS — Although Mike Shanahan mostly spoke in generalities at the Combine about his team's specific plans next season, he did reveal one interesting nugget.

Kyle Shanahan, Mike's son who has been hired as offensive coordinator, will call plays.

"Kyle did a great job calling plays last year [for Houston]," Mike Shanahan said. "I'm heavily involved in offense and defense."

Mike Shanahan always called plays in Denver, despite other people holding the title of offensive coordinator. And though he's giving that part of his coaching responsibility up, keeping it in the family, he still will be heavily involved in the offensive game plan.

"I think one of the reasons why I've stayed in this profession is I love the game," Mike said. "I love the Xs and Os. I love the game, and I'll always be involved in both sides of the ball. I'll also delegate a lot of responsibility to people that have proven they can handle it."

Too bad he did not adopt that attitude earlier, he could have still been here!

:coffee:

[Ravage!!!]

Every great successful CEO of any major corporation will tell you the same. Its hiring great people under you. If you have to have your hands in everything... then you aren't doing your job as a delegator.

Look at successful coaching systems:Bill Walsh ---- Mike Holmgren, Jim Fassel, Paul Hacket, Sam Wyche, George Seifert, Dennis Green, Mike Shanahan, and Jon Gruden

Holgrem went on to have Andy Reid, Mike Sherman, Steve Mariucci, and Ray Rhodes.

Andy Reid---- Brad Childress, John Harbaugh

Bill Belicheck----Romeo Crennel, Al Groh, Eric Mangini, Nick Saban, Jim Schwartz, Josh McDaniels.

Good assistant coaches that the HC can then delegate jobs to, so he doesn't have to do it all. That only makes sense. If Nolan is the "example" of how this coaching regime is going to work, thats kinda scary. Thats not an example of good things, imo.

You MUST rely on the people under you to do their job.

[Ravage!!!]

Thats the word of the article writer from pro-football something. That doesn't make it a 100% fact, or a fact for 100% of the time. You telling me he was the only one calling plays with Kubiak was here?

I believe it to be more of a collaboration between mike and the OC.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Thats the word of the article writer from pro-football something. That doesn't make it a 100% fact, or a fact for 100% of the time. You telling me he was the only one calling plays with Kubiak was here?

I believe it to be more of a collaboration between mike and the OC.

You would need to ask the writer that question

[Lonestar]

You would need to ask the writer that question

It is easy to dispute it if you only want a negative answer.

it is time to move on as mike is no longer here. and will not be coming back.

I wish him well in WAS as he is going to need it.

[TXBRONC]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/02/26/kyle-shanahan-not-mike-will-call-redskins-plays

Posted Feb. 26, 2010 @ 4:58 p.m.
By Eric Edholm

INDIANAPOLIS — Although Mike Shanahan mostly spoke in generalities at the Combine about his team's specific plans next season, he did reveal one interesting nugget.

Kyle Shanahan, Mike's son who has been hired as offensive coordinator, will call plays.

"Kyle did a great job calling plays last year [for Houston]," Mike Shanahan said. "I'm heavily involved in offense and defense."

Mike Shanahan always called plays in Denver, despite other people holding the title of offensive coordinator. And though he's giving that part of his coaching responsibility up, keeping it in the family, he still will be heavily involved in the offensive game plan.

"I think one of the reasons why I've stayed in this profession is I love the game," Mike said. "I love the Xs and Os. I love the game, and I'll always be involved in both sides of the ball. I'll also delegate a lot of responsibility to people that have proven they can handle it."

Yep and that article is still wrong. Just because in an article does make it accurate.:coffee:

[HORSEPOWER 56]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/02/26/kyle-shanahan-not-mike-will-call-redskins-plays

Posted Feb. 26, 2010 @ 4:58 p.m.
By Eric Edholm

INDIANAPOLIS — Although Mike Shanahan mostly spoke in generalities at the Combine about his team's specific plans next season, he did reveal one interesting nugget.

Kyle Shanahan, Mike's son who has been hired as offensive coordinator, will call plays.

"Kyle did a great job calling plays last year [for Houston]," Mike Shanahan said. "I'm heavily involved in offense and defense."

Mike Shanahan always called plays in Denver, despite other people holding the title of offensive coordinator. And though he's giving that part of his coaching responsibility up, keeping it in the family, he still will be heavily involved in the offensive game plan.

"I think one of the reasons why I've stayed in this profession is I love the game," Mike said. "I love the Xs and Os. I love the game, and I'll always be involved in both sides of the ball. I'll also delegate a lot of responsibility to people that have proven they can handle it."

That's funny, I thought Jeremy Bates called all the plays last year. That's what Shanahan told the media, anyway.

[frauschieze]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/02/26/kyle-shanahan-not-mike-will-call-redskins-plays

Posted Feb. 26, 2010 @ 4:58 p.m.
By Eric Edholm

INDIANAPOLIS — Although Mike Shanahan mostly spoke in generalities at the Combine about his team's specific plans next season, he did reveal one interesting nugget.

Kyle Shanahan, Mike's son who has been hired as offensive coordinator, will call plays.

"Kyle did a great job calling plays last year [for Houston]," Mike Shanahan said. "I'm heavily involved in offense and defense."

Mike Shanahan always called plays in Denver, despite other people holding the title of offensive coordinator. And though he's giving that part of his coaching responsibility up, keeping it in the family, he still will be heavily involved in the offensive game plan.

"I think one of the reasons why I've stayed in this profession is I love the game," Mike said. "I love the Xs and Os. I love the game, and I'll always be involved in both sides of the ball. I'll also delegate a lot of responsibility to people that have proven they can handle it."

I swear after Shanahan was fired, he said in an interview that he hadn't called plays after his first year in Denver, that it was a common misconception. I'll try to find the article.

[Lonestar]

If he did not call plays in why did he have the play sheet all the time and cover the mic with it "about the time" the plays where being called to the QB.

When there was a time out who did the QB always go to.

Sorry but I know who was calling the shots on this team the past 15 years.


Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

[Ravage!!!]

Well. the OC was up in the booth. Hard for the QB to walk up to him. They all had headsets on, so the three of them (HC, OC, and QB) could converse on the sidelines.

Why did he have the play sheet in front of him? Simple... so he could be lookign at the same thing his OC was to confer and confirm with ideas and strategies..ideas. Just because you have a meeting of the minds doesn't mean he was over-riding anyone. Means he was involved. The same reason every HC has the headset on.

Thats why its a TEAM effort, TEAM ideas. The game plans were made up of the TEAM coaches coming together to formulate the best plan of attack. When plays were called, it was a TEAM of heads meeting together.

I know Kubiak carried a play card with him, but Shanahan (Kyle) was the one that called the plays for Houston last year.

I know Billick always carried a play card with him, but in his last season as HC, made the announcment that he was taking OVER the play calling. So even with the play card in his hand, conferencing with this OC, and getting his HC job due to the OC job he did in Minnesota, someone else was calling the plays.

I know who was calling the shot, but it would be foolish to think he was the only one calling all the plays.

[Northman]

If he did not call plays in why did he have the play sheet all the time and cover the mic with it "about the time" the plays where being called to the QB.

When there was a time out who did the QB always go to.

Sorry but I know who was calling the shots on this team the past 15 years.


Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel


HC's always have a play sheet in case they want to override the OC in certain situations. I dont believe Mike had the entire say so when calling plays as it would of been a entire waste to hire guys like Kubiak, etc.

[DenBronx]

I'm pretty excited to see what Brady can do here. I think McDaniels is going to take alot of time with him and Kyle will only be better with another year under his belt. Brady could still win the job though. Camp is going to be all about competition this year at QB.

[TXBRONC]

I'm pretty excited to see what Brady can do here. I think McDaniels is going to take alot of time with him and Kyle will only be better with another year under his belt. Brady could still win the job though. Camp is going to be all about competition this year at QB.

I'm not excited about Brady but I am curious to see what happens.

[Lonestar]

HC's always have a play sheet in case they want to override the OC in certain situations. I dont believe Mike had the entire say so when calling plays as it would of been a entire waste to hire guys like Kubiak, etc.

Hey I don't necessarily disagree with why hire Gary. But everyone since has been wasted money.

We all know mike was a micro manager and him and Gary were singing the same tune.

As for dinger. And who ever it was in 2008 not so much. I just know I saw mike covering his lips a lot making calls or I guess if some of you wish to believe "faking" out the other side.

Believe. What you wish but I'll bet that mike changed 50%+ of the plays "called" by the "OC".

And yes sometimes the OC was indeed in the press box level but I suspect it was mike that called most of the time outs from the sideline to fix issuses he saw.

Again believe mike was the end all of HC's and I'll believe he was a GREAT OC and not much more than that.


Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

[Slick]

Love your optimism War. I'm not quite there yet, but I do see it at the very least an upgrade over Simms. I do think Josh will let them battle, and that should be good for both QB's and the team in general.

From what I've read, it seems Brady is hungry for a chance to compete, to try to show that the naysayers are wrong about him. The fact that we didn't try to lock up Orton to any kind of moderate multi-year deal makes me believe that Josh wasn't completely satisfied with his play and has been looking to upgrade the position or at the very leat, push Kyle. It's about all you can ask at this point.

[Lancane]

Love your optimism War. I'm not quite there yet, but I do see it at the very least an upgrade over Simms. I do think Josh will let them battle, and that should be good for both QB's and the team in general.

From what I've read, it seems Brady is hungry for a chance to compete, to try to show that the naysayers are wrong about him. The fact that we didn't try to lock up Orton to any kind of moderate multi-year deal makes me believe that Josh wasn't completely satisfied with his play and has been looking to upgrade the position or at the very leat, push Kyle. It's about all you can ask at this point.

You nailed it on the head in my opinion... Everyone keeps going on about how well Orton did, and that the team wanted to keep him. But I do not buy that for a minute, why not sign him to a short-term deal if that was so, why waste a player and picks for a backup quarterback. Hillis and those picks could have netted the team an extra pick this year, at least I believe that to be true. We saw the tension and arguments between Orton and McDaniels all last season on the sidelines. According to certain media we also have a good inclination that Quinn was someone Josh wanted to get last year to run his offense.

I for one am not a big Orton supporter and hope that Quinn is the answer or even Brandstater; the thing is that I don't believe they would have traded for Quinn if they were all that high on Brandstater either, because then he should be the one to challenge this year. Too many questions and not enough answers, let alone we have to just get better offensively and that is the plain and simple truth.

[WARHORSE]

You nailed it on the head in my opinion... Everyone keeps going on about how well Orton did, and that the team wanted to keep him. But I do not buy that for a minute, why not sign him to a short-term deal if that was so, why waste a player and picks for a backup quarterback. Hillis and those picks could have netted the team an extra pick this year, at least I believe that to be true. We saw the tension and arguments between Orton and McDaniels all last season on the sidelines. According to certain media we also have a good inclination that Quinn was someone Josh wanted to get last year to run his offense.

I for one am not a big Orton supporter and hope that Quinn is the answer or even Brandstater; the thing is that I don't believe they would have traded for Quinn if they were all that high on Brandstater either, because then he should be the one to challenge this year. Too many questions and not enough answers, let alone we have to just get better offensively and that is the plain and simple truth.


I dont think this signing says anything about Brandstater, whether postive or negative when it comes to expectations.

It doesnt say that Brandstater is blowing away their expectations, thats about it.

But in the end, even if Josh thought Quinn has had plenty of coaching, the trade for Quinn just makes too much sense on every level.

He knows the system, which means he will not be starting from scratch which is huge.
He has the NFL arm.
He has better athletic ability than Orton BY FAR.

Brady Quinn Pro Day
Quinn did only passing drills and had a good workout, showing good velocity and good anticpaction. Notre Dame coach Charlie Weis ran the passing drills. Quinn threw to Irish tight end Marcus Freeman and receivers Rhema McKnight, Darius Walker and Matt Shelton, who finished at Notre Dame in 2005. On March 22, Quinn weighed in 233 pounds. He ran indoors on FieldTurf. He ran his 40s faster than expected (4.82 and 4.73). He also ran the short shuttle in 4.22 seconds and the three-cone drill in 6.79 (with tiny cones, not tall ones). In addition, he had a 36-inch vertical jump and a 9-foot-7 broad jump.

He has not had the talent around him on the field that is here in Denver.

He has a good amount of snaps under his belt in the NFL.

Hes still confident, and doesnt make excuses.

Compared to Simms, the entire Broncos org. breathed a sigh of relief with this trade. Simms was putrid.

He is MOBILE unlike Kyle, which opens up pages in the playbook Kyle cannot execute.

He has upside.

Mike Mayock on Quinn: "Brady Quinn has a tremendous skill set," Mayock says. "He can make every throw. He comes out of a Charlie Weis offense, understands pass protections and where to throw the football. Plus, he has unquestioned work ethic."

[TXBRONC]

You nailed it on the head in my opinion... Everyone keeps going on about how well Orton did, and that the team wanted to keep him. But I do not buy that for a minute, why not sign him to a short-term deal if that was so, why waste a player and picks for a backup quarterback. Hillis and those picks could have netted the team an extra pick this year, at least I believe that to be true. We saw the tension and arguments between Orton and McDaniels all last season on the sidelines. According to certain media we also have a good inclination that Quinn was someone Josh wanted to get last year to run his offense.

I for one am not a big Orton supporter and hope that Quinn is the answer or even Brandstater; the thing is that I don't believe they would have traded for Quinn if they were all that high on Brandstater either, because then he should be the one to challenge this year. Too many questions and not enough answers, let alone we have to just get better offensively and that is the plain and simple truth.

None of us can say for sure but it's not far fetched to think that McDaniels brought Quinn in to possibly compete with Orton considering the fact he has ran this offense before.

If McDaniels was absolutely sold on Orton as long term why not give him a new contract right now. I don't buy into the b.s. that says McDaniels hasn't given him one because there's no CBA in place. Sure McDaniels put a tender on him that includes a 1st and 3rd but that's not a contract it hedging your bets.

[TXBRONC]

Love your optimism War. I'm not quite there yet, but I do see it at the very least an upgrade over Simms. I do think Josh will let them battle, and that should be good for both QB's and the team in general.

From what I've read, it seems Brady is hungry for a chance to compete, to try to show that the naysayers are wrong about him. The fact that we didn't try to lock up Orton to any kind of moderate multi-year deal makes me believe that Josh wasn't completely satisfied with his play and has been looking to upgrade the position or at the very leat, push Kyle. It's about all you can ask at this point.

Some people say that McDaniels hasn't locked up Orton to any kind deal because there is no CBA. I don't believe that for a minute. If McDaniels was completely solid I don't think he would have hesitated to give Orton a new contract.

[Ravage!!!]

Either way.. I'm not excited at all about either QB. No fan 'brags' about having Orton or Brady as your QB. Its something you hide your face about.

[Lancane]

Either way.. I'm not excited at all about either QB. No fan 'brags' about having Orton or Brady as your QB. Its something you hide your face about.

Hide our faces, maybe... But we should still have some faith, even if only a little. Even though I should shut up, because I have little faith as is in McDaniels and far less in Orton. I'm hoping Quinn could be the answer, but you never know...personally I'm still pissed we did not move to draft Sanchez. Either or, does not matter...if McDaniels can not make more out of this team then simply destroying what was promising about it, then it will be time for a new head coach.

[Lonestar]

Un****ing believeable.


Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

[Lancane]

Un****ing believeable.


Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

Huh?... Not sure what your comment is in reference to Jr.:confused:

[WARHORSE]

Im sorry, but theres a lot of good game tape on Quinn.

And honestly, from some of the highlights Ive seen on all 7 of his INTs, they definitely werent all his fault.

Im not blowin smoke up Bradys butt, but I still see a QB who threw for 69 TDs vs 14 INTs at Notre Damn.

And if you dont think the offense or the talent around people doesnt make a difference, let me simply reference HOF QB Steve Young.

In two years at Tampa Bay, Young threw 11 TDs vs 21 INTs, and had a completion percentage of 53%.

Heres Bradys gamelogs for his career in Cleveland:

2007- DNP a single game

2008- 2 games healthy, one with a broken finger.

2009- 8 complete games, 11 passes in 2 other games.


I want you to know as well, that Mr. Anderson, who quarterbacked the other 8 games for Cleveland last year, was beyond dismal.

He threw 3 TDs vs 10 INTs.

And who did he have to throw to?



SO............Brady Quinn has started and played in a grand total of 10 games, and hes INEPT???

And his WRs were..........................WHO???


I just dont see how anyone can call this guy a bust, or say that he cant play.


BTW............was Cutlers stats affected at all by a change of personel at WR?

There were only 4 games last year in which Cutler didnt throw an INT.......twice against Detroit, once against St. Louis, and Pittsburg.



HMMMMmmmm.............

Just sayin.

slurp.:coffee:

[T.K.O.]

I dont think this signing says anything about Brandstater, whether postive or negative when it comes to expectations.

It doesnt say that Brandstater is blowing away their expectations, thats about it.

But in the end, even if Josh thought Quinn has had plenty of coaching, the trade for Quinn just makes too much sense on every level.

He knows the system, which means he will not be starting from scratch which is huge.
He has the NFL arm.
He has better athletic ability than Orton BY FAR.

Brady Quinn Pro Day
Quinn did only passing drills and had a good workout, showing good velocity and good anticpaction. Notre Dame coach Charlie Weis ran the passing drills. Quinn threw to Irish tight end Marcus Freeman and receivers Rhema McKnight, Darius Walker and Matt Shelton, who finished at Notre Dame in 2005. On March 22, Quinn weighed in 233 pounds. He ran indoors on FieldTurf. He ran his 40s faster than expected (4.82 and 4.73). He also ran the short shuttle in 4.22 seconds and the three-cone drill in 6.79 (with tiny cones, not tall ones). In addition, he had a 36-inch vertical jump and a 9-foot-7 broad jump.

He has not had the talent around him on the field that is here in Denver.

He has a good amount of snaps under his belt in the NFL.

Hes still confident, and doesnt make excuses.

Compared to Simms, the entire Broncos org. breathed a sigh of relief with this trade. Simms was putrid.

He is MOBILE unlike Kyle, which opens up pages in the playbook Kyle cannot execute.

He has upside.

Mike Mayock on Quinn: "Brady Quinn has a tremendous skill set," Mayock says. "He can make every throw. He comes out of a Charlie Weis offense, understands pass protections and where to throw the football. Plus, he has unquestioned work ethic."

you had me at "putrid":D

[sakic_avs]

We should trade for that dynamo in Chicago.

He's da bomb!

[SoCalImport]

We should trade for that dynamo in Chicago.

He's da bomb!

:banghead:

[WARHORSE]

you had me at "putrid":D


Mus be my cologne.

Its called "TRUTH".:D

[claymore]

Im sorry, but theres a lot of good game tape on Quinn.

And honestly, from some of the highlights Ive seen on all 7 of his INTs, they definitely werent all his fault.

Im not blowin smoke up Bradys butt, but I still see a QB who threw for 69 TDs vs 14 INTs at Notre Damn.

And if you dont think the offense or the talent around people doesnt make a difference, let me simply reference HOF QB Steve Young.

In two years at Tampa Bay, Young threw 11 TDs vs 21 INTs, and had a completion percentage of 53%.

Heres Bradys gamelogs for his career in Cleveland:

2007- DNP a single game

2008- 2 games healthy, one with a broken finger.

2009- 8 complete games, 11 passes in 2 other games.


I want you to know as well, that Mr. Anderson, who quarterbacked the other 8 games for Cleveland last year, was beyond dismal.

He threw 3 TDs vs 10 INTs.

And who did he have to throw to?



SO............Brady Quinn has started and played in a grand total of 10 games, and hes INEPT???

And his WRs were..........................WHO???


I just dont see how anyone can call this guy a bust, or say that he cant play.


BTW............was Cutlers stats affected at all by a change of personel at WR?

There were only 4 games last year in which Cutler didnt throw an INT.......twice against Detroit, once against St. Louis, and Pittsburg.



HMMMMmmmm.............

Just sayin.

slurp.:coffee:There was also a big difference in Coaching War. Young went to a team that had maybe the best coach ever. With one of the best staff's ever.

The difference in talent between the Broncos and Browns isnt that great IMO.

Hopefully the coaching is.

*** Also great thread. Im playing devils advocate. I appreciate your positive take. I need to hear it!

[WARHORSE]

There was also a big difference in Coaching War. Young went to a team that had maybe the best coach ever. With one of the best staff's ever.

The difference in talent between the Broncos and Browns isnt that great IMO.

Hopefully the coaching is.

*** Also great thread. Im playing devils advocate. I appreciate your positive take. I need to hear it!


I agree. Young walked up onto a time of league change and innovation that was engineered to the championship level by the late great Bill Walsh.

Young is a HOFer because of it, and he could of ended up a scrub.


Im not saying Quinn is going to do the same thing, but I am saying I cant see where he has been tried and found wanting.

I know this, Shanahan would have brought him to a higher level of play, of that I have no doubt.

Can Josh do it? I believe he can.

How high a ceiling?

That remains to be seen..............but at least its a spark to look forward to for the upcoming season.;)

[rcsodak]

THe other coaches will know the system before they are coaching it.

Plus... you don't need to know the 'specific system' to know how to read defenses. System is just knowing the terminology. Knowing the kinks to the routes. You don't need to be the 'maker of the system' to coach it, or the QB. Thats why HCs have QB coaches all over the NFL. I know people like to believe it, but McD's system isn't more complicated or difficult than everyone else's.

So you're saying McD's system is LESS complicated than Oak's?

Link?

[frauschieze]

So you're saying McD's system is LESS complicated than Oak's?

Link?

That is very clearly not what he said. :confused:

[rcsodak]

Not enough hours in the week War. If he continues to do it this way he will fail.

He needs successfull assistants before this team is good.

I have zero hope for anyone but Martindale. I dont like McCoy, and Ben Mcdaniels is freaking laughable.

Not being negative. Just not overly optimistic for this staff. If we seem to have a good draft, it will be a step in the right direction.

So you know Ben McDaniels? Maybe you should enlighten us, clay.

It's the HC's job to have ALL of his coaches going in the same direction. From there, he's not having to constantly stick his head in on meetings. He can rest assured his 'message' is getting out there.

To say he's being any more than he is, clay, is being your usual 'anti-mcd'.

Shame.

[rcsodak]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/02/26/kyle-shanahan-not-mike-will-call-redskins-plays

Posted Feb. 26, 2010 @ 4:58 p.m.
By Eric Edholm

INDIANAPOLIS — Although Mike Shanahan mostly spoke in generalities at the Combine about his team's specific plans next season, he did reveal one interesting nugget.

Kyle Shanahan, Mike's son who has been hired as offensive coordinator, will call plays.

"Kyle did a great job calling plays last year [for Houston]," Mike Shanahan said. "I'm heavily involved in offense and defense."

Mike Shanahan always called plays in Denver, despite other people holding the title of offensive coordinator. And though he's giving that part of his coaching responsibility up, keeping it in the family, he still will be heavily involved in the offensive game plan.

"I think one of the reasons why I've stayed in this profession is I love the game," Mike said. "I love the Xs and Os. I love the game, and I'll always be involved in both sides of the ball. I'll also delegate a lot of responsibility to people that have proven they can handle it."

One person's opine. Plain and simple. Unless, of course, I missed the quotations.

I remember a game back when Kubes was in denver, where Shanny admitted, in quotes, that they won the game only because of Kube's play-calling.

I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to see that in Kube's early years, with no OC experience, Shanny called the plays.
As Kube's gained that experience, and understood Shanny's way of thinking, he got more and more play-calling responsibilities. Shanny, iirc, even boasted on kube's behalf when Houston came calling, on his understanding of the game, play-calling, etc.
Again, when Dennison was given the reigns, I don't think it'd be too far fetched to deduce that Shanny would again be in charge, up until he thought the LB-turned-OLCoach could handle it.

[rcsodak]

Every great successful CEO of any major corporation will tell you the same. Its hiring great people under you. If you have to have your hands in everything... then you aren't doing your job as a delegator.

Look at successful coaching systems:Bill Walsh ---- Mike Holmgren, Jim Fassel, Paul Hacket, Sam Wyche, George Seifert, Dennis Green, Mike Shanahan, and Jon Gruden Notice how EVERY one of the above was fired.

Holgrem went on to have Andy Reid, Mike Sherman, Steve Mariucci, and Ray Rhodes. see above

Andy Reid---- Brad Childress, John Harbaugh

Bill Belicheck----Romeo Crennel, Al Groh, Eric Mangini, Nick Saban, Jim Schwartz, Josh McDaniels. What? No Charlie Weiss?

Good assistant coaches that the HC can then delegate jobs to, so he doesn't have to do it all. That only makes sense. If Nolan is the "example" of how this coaching regime is going to work, thats kinda scary. Thats not an example of good things, imo.

You MUST rely on the people under you to do their job.

I'm sure none of the above mentioned HC's EVER felt a change needed to be made with their Coordinators....

Oh, wait...... :lol:

[rcsodak]

Love your optimism War. I'm not quite there yet, but I do see it at the very least an upgrade over Simms. I do think Josh will let them battle, and that should be good for both QB's and the team in general.

From what I've read, it seems Brady is hungry for a chance to compete, to try to show that the naysayers are wrong about him. The fact that we didn't try to lock up Orton to any kind of moderate multi-year deal makes me believe that Josh wasn't completely satisfied with his play and has been looking to upgrade the position or at the very leat, push Kyle. It's about all you can ask at this point.

Well, from my point of view, and that of ex-FO guys/ex-players (Sirius NFL), BQ needs to just relax this year, digest the system, involve himself, get to know the offensive players, and NOT worry about starting.
Have him prepared to come off the bench in case of injury/blowout, and then compete for the starting job next year.
Sometimes a year off can do wonders for a player's psyche, let alone confidence, of which I don't think he has much of.

[rcsodak]

That is very clearly not what he said. :confused:


but McD's system isn't more complicated or difficult than everyone else's.

I beg to differ. :welcome:

[frauschieze]

Yeah, exactly rc. He said it "isn't more complicated or difficult", NOT that it is "less complicated than OAK's", which is what you implied he said and then asked for a link on.

[rcsodak]

Yeah, exactly rc. He said it "isn't more complicated or difficult", NOT that it is "less complicated than OAK's", which is what you implied he said and then asked for a link on.

Unless I'm mistaken, less is the opposite of more. He said "everyone else's". That includes Oak.


....next..... :coffee:

[frauschieze]

Unless I'm mistaken, less is the opposite of more. He said "everyone else's". That includes Oak.


....next..... :coffee:

I'm so sorry to inform you....you ARE mistaken in this context.

He said "not more complicated"; he did not say "less complicated". That difference in words means that the "not more" can mean "equal" or "comparable", or even "similar".

:hi: