How do the recent D-line signings improve the defense?

[rationalfan]

assuming bannon, williams and green will give the team a better-than-average dline, how does this improve/affect denver's linebacker and secondary?

[xzn]

Think of the first six games of '09 all season long... With a new and upgraded starting d-line last year's starters become very solid depth. That fact should go a long way towards preventing us from "wearing down".

Understand these signing put ALL the pressure on our LBs to be playmakers on the other side of the LOS because all the guys we signed are pluggers not guys who will really threaten the opposing QB. Elvis and Ayers will need to do the heavy lifting for us to get pressure. I'm loving Rolando Mc Clain right about now, how'd he look next to DJ for the next ten years? I think Martindale would like that!

Our secondary looks very solid and is demonstrably the strength of the team, although aging.

[rationalfan]

listening to mike klis on milehighsports radio right now. he believes green, bannan and williams will all start; with williams on the end.

he says that once the details of bannan's contract are released we'll see how highly the broncos valued him, and why it's been mentioned that he'll be the starting NT.

klis also says marshall will be gone before the season starts; then goes on a rant that people will assume denver will suck because marshall will be gone.

now klis says the broncos want two first round picks, because it would control the early portion of the draft.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

http://twitter.com/VicLombardi/statuses/10242633205

In less than a week, the Broncos have added 940 pounds of beef to their D-Line. Now they have to address this O-Line.

[dogfish]

i'm not at all assuming that those guys give us a batter-than-average D-line. . . i think that's really pushing it, unless jamal williams has enough left in the tank to play like he did five years ago. . .

still, even an average line is far better than what we've trotted out there in recent years, so we'll see. . . XZN is right that having solid depth should help to keep us from wearing down so badly. . .

i certainly don't think about these signings as "solving the problem," but they should buy us some time to work on it, anyway. . . we still need to draft and develop some real talent on the DL if we want to reach our long term goals for the defense. . . in the meantime, hopefully having a rotation of competent guys will help us to be competitive. . .

[rationalfan]

not topical to this thread, but continuing on previous post, klis says there's still a chance denver lands hadnot.

radio host also says if marshall is traded for a first round pick it won't make sense because denver does not want two first round picks. money?

[underrated29]

Itspretty solid. Not wowy, not great. Just above average... X is right that it puts the pressure on our LBs. I agree that they can/should handle it.

Romclain, graham, witherspoon, all look lovely right now.

So does Cody, Thomas and pierre paul.


I still think we we take cody somehow someway. But now T, can learn and maybe get his FATT ARSE-not a slam, but truth, in shape for our mile high air.

I think we certianly need to upgrade DE with an early pick. NT can wait imo for 2nd or 3rd day. LB, CB still need some touching up, but overrall these Line players did patch holes so we can draft needs elsewhere this year and then PLUG the DL holes next year.

[cuzz4169]

I'm loving Rolando Mc Clain right about now, how'd he look next to DJ for the next ten years? I think Martindale would like that!


IMO Id rather see him next to Davis....Davis was a run stuffer I dont think DJ is cut out to be a MLB in the 3-4. DJ just isnt the physical player....Think of the top LBS and how physical they are...DJ is a week side OLB in a 4-3. Dont get me wrong he doesnt suck but I think we can get a more physical player.

[xzn]

IMO Id rather see him next to Davis....Davis was a run stuffer I dont think DJ is cut out to be a MLB in the 3-4. DJ just isnt the physical player....Think of the top LBS and how physical they are...DJ is a week side OLB in a 4-3. Dont get me wrong he doesnt suck but I think we can get a more physical player.

Andra Davis, to me is a rotational and depth guy at this point in his career and Rolando Mc Clain is a bigger, younger version of Ray Lewis without the thug baggage.

Andra in his prime was a good fit for "Mack", or strongside inside LB in a 30 front. He's still servicable and is a good stop-gap starter. He is not a difference maker at this point although he does a good job of plugging against guards who are trying to reach him on the second level. That said, he's one of the guys who "wore down" last season.

DJ is a perfect fit for the "Jack", or weakside inside LB, with his athleticism and he has more than adequate bulk at a solid 242. Look for him to be more featured this year as teams scheme to protect more against Elvis.

[broncobryce]

IMO Id rather see him next to Davis....Davis was a run stuffer I dont think DJ is cut out to be a MLB in the 3-4. DJ just isnt the physical player....Think of the top LBS and how physical they are...DJ is a week side OLB in a 4-3. Dont get me wrong he doesnt suck but I think we can get a more physical player.

Davis is the weakspot. When he is on the field we have to fall all over ourselves to make sure he isn't in coverage, he is that bad.

[cuzz4169]

DJ is a perfect fit for the "Jack", or weakside inside LB, with his athleticism and he has more than adequate bulk at a solid 242. Look for him to be more featured this year as teams scheme to protect more against Elvis.

I understand what your saying but I dont think DJ is a physical player for a mlb in a 4-3 or a 3-4. We need physical players I just dont see it in him...compare him to Al Wilson and tell me what you think. I dont believe Davis wore down #1 hes a Florida Gator lol....#2 that guy did a great job as a run stuffer all year he was third on the team in tackles and was on the sideline in passing situations. He sheds blocks DJ struggles with that. You might think im crazy but i would trade DJ and play woodyard at the weak mlb...I dont see much of a difference plus hes a lot cheaper.

I was an OLB at a high level and It all starts with physical LBS those guys make your defense. I know you need d-line but physical lbs lead a defense. look at willis and what he has done to the 49ers defense.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

I think the guys we brought in (provided Williams and Green can stay healthy) will help out a lot vs the run but I don't think they'll make much difference vs the pass (maybe Williams can help collapse the pocket up the gut) so it's still Doom's one-man show.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Itspretty solid. Not wowy, not great. Just above average... X is right that it puts the pressure on our LBs. I agree that they can/should handle it.

Romclain, graham, witherspoon, all look lovely right now.

So does Cody, Thomas and pierre paul.


I still think we we take cody somehow someway. But now T, can learn and maybe get his FATT ARSE-not a slam, but truth, in shape for our mile high air.

I think we certianly need to upgrade DE with an early pick. NT can wait imo for 2nd or 3rd day. LB, CB still need some touching up, but overrall these Line players did patch holes so we can draft needs elsewhere this year and then PLUG the DL holes next year.

I don't think OLB is a need right now. Give Ayers a chance...and we have pretty solid depth there anyways.

[broncobryce]

I don't think OLB is a need right now. Give Ayers a chance...and we have pretty solid depth there anyways.

I agree. Ayers should be much better with a season under his belt.

[Ziggy]

I think the guys we brought in (provided Williams and Green can stay healthy) will help out a lot vs the run but I don't think they'll make much difference vs the pass (maybe Williams can help collapse the pocket up the gut) so it's still Doom's one-man show.

I disagree. I think that they will help out immensely against the pass. When you make a team one dimensional by taking away the run, it's a huge advantage for the secondary and LB'ers.

[Ziggy]

listening to mike klis on milehighsports radio right now. he believes green, bannan and williams will all start; with williams on the end.

Say what? Jamal Williams is a true NT. He doesn't have near the mobility that Bannan does. I'd be shocked to see Bannan inside while Williams is in the game unless we're playing a 4-3 formation.

[Davii]

I don't know what level they will play at as a unit. However, I think it will turn out to be an upgrade if for no other reason than depth. I think we have definitely upgraded our defense and I am excited to see how the rest of the offseason plays out.

[dogfish]

I think the guys we brought in (provided Williams and Green can stay healthy) will help out a lot vs the run but I don't think they'll make much difference vs the pass (maybe Williams can help collapse the pocket up the gut) so it's still Doom's one-man show.



I don't think OLB is a need right now. Give Ayers a chance...and we have pretty solid depth there anyways.

i mostly agree with this. . . you do have to be a little wary just because he was looked at as a bit of a project and he didn't produce much last year, but i thought ayers flashed plenty of physical skills-- hopefully he's learned and progressed enough mentally that he can go out this year and just let it loose a little bit. . . i do expect him to make more of an impact for us this year. . .

and i do like our depth there fairly well, but a lot of that depends on the health of reid's knee-- he was one of our most effective wave rushers early in the season, but if he's gimpy we don't have much else. . . haggan is solid, physical and versatile-- i like him a lot as a rotational/depth guy, and don't mind him as a nominal starter with limited snaps, buuut. . .

he really doesn't present much of an edge rushing threat. . . he can rack up a couple of sacks here and there if you let him blitz enough, but he's not a guy that's going to generate a lot of consistent pressure. . . he's a guy that i think fits probably about as well inside as outside in the 3-4, which added to his special teams play makes him an ideal end-of-the-roster type 'backer if ayers can win the starting job at some point. . . but if reid isn't healthy, we'd probably be smart to at least consider another legit edge rusher if one is available-- either in the draft, or in FA. . .

[dogfish]

Say what? Jamal Williams is a true NT. He doesn't have near the mobility that Bannan does. I'd be shocked to see Bannan inside while Williams is in the game unless we're playing a 4-3 formation.

i was kinda confused about that also. . . they keep saying bannan's going to start at nosetackle, and 310 sure seems light for a fulltime starting NT-- jay ratliff notwithstanding. . . i don't want to judge it until i've seen it, but it does make me wonder whether klis is just projecting that, or if he's actually been told that by someone in the organization. . .

and if he has. . . it's always possible that someone is using klis to spread disinformation-- because we're planning on spending one of our top picks on a NT like dan williams or cody, or. . . uhh. . . who knows. . .

i still find it a little strange that baltimore keeps kelly gregg at NT and plays ngata as an end in their base D. . . i guess it does make sense to utilize ngata's superior movement skills on the edge. . . gregg's certainly proven to be effective at the nose, but i'd want that 345 pound monster right at the heart of my defense, controlling everything inside. . .

enh well. . . in any case, it's early and there's plenty of time for that shit to resolve itself through OTAs and camp. . . even if we don't add any more bodies through the draft (and i'd like to think that we will, we should take advantage of what looks to be solid DL depth this year), i'm guessing that we'll see plenty of mixing and matching until they figure out what groupings they like, both base and sub-package. . . plenty of roles to fill, and i would expect to see plenty of rotation along the DL regardless of who wins the starting jobs. . .

off-topic, but i'm also curious to see whether martindale will incorporate any 40 front looks this year outside of the nickel and dime packages. . . i remember JMFMCD saying before the season that we were going to use multiple fronts and some hybrid looks, but it certainly seemed to me that the vast majority of our fronts featured three true down linemen. . .

with these additions plus whatever the draft may bring, we're starting to assemble most of the necessary parts to use a number of different looks-- especially with DJ and woodyard being strong 4-3 'backers, and doom proven effective as a 40 front pass-rushing end. . . i'd kinda like to see ayers get some more chances to play with his hand in the dirt, also. . .

should be interesting, anyway. . . i honestly still think we're a ways away from the talent level we need to really be a quality defense, but last year's progress made me hopeful. . . i don't know if better depth in the trenches will help us extend last year's strong early season play from the D later into the year, but i really hope so-- as of right now, i really think it's our best chance at being a competitive squad. . .

long term, i just hope we can finish re-working the front seven before the secondary all retires. . . especially given the time it can take to develop D-linemen. . .

of course, we did invest in some young talent there last year, but we're going to need more soon enough. . . we need to get the front right before that-- i still kinda hope we take at least one front seven defender in the top three rounds. . . ILB would logically seem to be the biggest and most immediate need, but i wouldn't complain about some linemen either. . . given the time it typically takes to groom those guys, starting now while we have some solid vets ahead of them would be a good idea. . . somebody like alex carrington, cam thomas or lamarr houston would be a smart investment. . .

[xzn]

Lamar Houston is getting a lot of hype. On Path to the Draft they were saying that he is up to a early second round grade and possibly a fringe first.

I would not complain about any defense front seven pick or any offensive line pick in the first three rounds.

[Rick]

Say what? Jamal Williams is a true NT. He doesn't have near the mobility that Bannan does. I'd be shocked to see Bannan inside while Williams is in the game unless we're playing a 4-3 formation.

Threw me for a loop as well.

Have to remember though...this is a writer saying this...not one of the coaches.

I will be very surprised to see bannan as NT and not end and Williams as end not NT.

[rcsodak]

i mostly agree with this. . . you do have to be a little wary just because he was looked at as a bit of a project and he didn't produce much last year, but i thought ayers flashed plenty of physical skills-- hopefully he's learned and progressed enough mentally that he can go out this year and just let it loose a little bit. . . i do expect him to make more of an impact for us this year. . .

and i do like our depth there fairly well, but a lot of that depends on the health of reid's knee-- he was one of our most effective wave rushers early in the season, but if he's gimpy we don't have much else. . . haggan is solid, physical and versatile-- i like him a lot as a rotational/depth guy, and don't mind him as a nominal starter with limited snaps, buuut. . .

he really doesn't present much of an edge rushing threat. . . he can rack up a couple of sacks here and there if you let him blitz enough, but he's not a guy that's going to generate a lot of consistent pressure. . . he's a guy that i think fits probably about as well inside as outside in the 3-4, which added to his special teams play makes him an ideal end-of-the-roster type 'backer if ayers can win the starting job at some point. . . but if reid isn't healthy, we'd probably be smart to at least consider another legit edge rusher if one is available-- either in the draft, or in FA. . .

I think we all need to sit back and see what *wink* has in order for the D. He's a disciple of the Ryans...having coached with them and a very close family friend.
I think the team will be more of an attacking D than last year's 2nd half showed.

I also think that since he's a LB guy, they'll be addressing that area quickly in the draft. McClain/Weatherspoon/Morgan. DJ is not cut out to be a MLB. He doesn't have the persona for it, imo.
He's a WOLB and needs to be kept there, or traded. An early 2nd round pick would be nice.

[cuzz4169]

I also think that since he's a LB guy, they'll be addressing that area quickly in the draft. McClain/Weatherspoon/Morgan. DJ is not cut out to be a MLB. He doesn't have the persona for it, imo.
He's a WOLB and needs to be kept there, or traded. An early 2nd round pick would be nice.

Woah someone agrees...Im not blind!!! :salute:

[xzn]

122 tackles sounds pretty physical to me.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?playerId=5542

DJ is a perfect fit for Jack backer and I'm pretty sure he's Martindale's favorite new toy along with Elvis.

WEAKSIDE

[dogfish]

I think we all need to sit back and see what *wink* has in order for the D. He's a disciple of the Ryans...having coached with them and a very close family friend.
I think the team will be more of an attacking D than last year's 2nd half showed.

i hope that this is true. . .



I also think that since he's a LB guy, they'll be addressing that area quickly in the draft. McClain/Weatherspoon/Morgan. DJ is not cut out to be a MLB. He doesn't have the persona for it, imo.
He's a WOLB and needs to be kept there, or traded. An early 2nd round pick would be nice.

i don't agree about DJ, but either way. . . if we're looking for help at ILB, i'd expect us to be looking at brandon spikes along with mcclain, not weatherspoon or morgan. . .

[Ziggy]

i hope that this is true. . .




i don't agree about DJ, but either way. . . if we're looking for help at ILB, i'd expect us to be looking at brandon spikes along with mcclain, not weatherspoon or morgan. . .

I love the idea of Brandon Spikes in orange and blue. Forget the 40 time at the combine and look at the tape. Great leader, passionate about the game, and a playmaker. Some team is going to get a steal at the end of the 1st, 2nd round range.

[dogfish]

I love the idea of Brandon Spikes in orange and blue. Forget the 40 time at the combine and look at the tape. Great leader, passionate about the game, and a playmaker. Some team is going to get a steal at the end of the 1st, 2nd round range.

i agree, and i'd be glad to take him-- they said that same shit about james L and mauauauauagagluga last year, and both of those guys came in and played well right off the bat. . . let somebody else draft a guy like JPP and his potential, and i'll take spikes and plug him into the SILB spot and forget about it for the next ten years or so if he stays healthy. . .

from 20-25 into around the 50's is going to be prime territory for us this year with guys like spikes, pouncey, iupati, kyle wilson, cody, odrick, maybe golden tate or lamarr houston, etc etc. . .

[JDL]

assuming bannon, williams and green will give the team a better-than-average dline, how does this improve/affect denver's linebacker and secondary?

How in the world do you get from worst in the league to better than average.

They are nice signings, but you are talking about two guys over 30 who are more part-time players (NOT starters) and a once great NT/DT whose had a myriad of injuries recently. Nothing about them makes us better than average.

What will hopefully happen is that they will be able to better hold up over the course of a season. We clearly had little depth last year and now we have a little bit, but make no mistake... we don't have 1 full-time DL starter on the team... and that absolutely means we are at best striving for average. Considering what was available on the open market, nice haul, but let's be realistic about what kind of upgrade you really get from UFA...particularly in the weakest UFA period ever due to so many top level UFAs being RFAs... not that UFA was recently anything more than a place for stop-gap players.

Nice job... we still need starters and that HAS to come through good drafting.

[Ziggy]

How in the world do you get from worst in the league to better than average.

They are nice signings, but you are talking about two guys over 30 who are more part-time players (NOT starters) and a once great NT/DT whose had a myriad of injuries recently. Nothing about them makes us better than average.

What will hopefully happen is that they will be able to better hold up over the course of a season. We clearly had little depth last year and now we have a little bit, but make no mistake... we don't have 1 full-time DL starter on the team... and that absolutely means we are at best striving for average. Considering what was available on the open market, nice haul, but let's be realistic about what kind of upgrade you really get from UFA...particularly in the weakest UFA period ever due to so many top level UFAs being RFAs... not that UFA was recently anything more than a place for stop-gap players.

Nice job... we still need starters and that HAS to come through good drafting.

While I disagree with you on just how much of an upgrade the 3 J's are, I do agree that we need to look to the future in the draft. In FA, McD is following the same pattern with the Dline that he did with the secondary last season. Bring in some older vets that can hold down the fort, and increase depth and talent at the position. I hope that we can all agree that he has done that with the Dline this season. McD then went into the draft and spent a future 1st, a 2nd, and a 4th on the secondary also. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Denver go the same route in this draft with the Dline.

Overall, it's a great way to build a team, as long as you draft well. We can all argue about the value of A. Smith, McBath, and Bruton, but the strategy of the overall plan is solid. Upgrade a position of weakness in FA, and draft depth, talent, speed, size, or whatever the position calls for. Hopefully the rookies can learn the system, and one day become an upgrade over the older players. Like I said, it requires good drafting to be successful in the long run, but strategy is solid.

In an ideal world, most of your base talent becomes home grown and you supplement less and less through FA. This way, your team has a great mix of experience and youth. The Pittsburgh Steelers, Baltimore Ravens, and New England Patriots all use this philosiphy with success, and it shows year in and year out.

[CoachChaz]

Well, I guess if we're going to sign so-called "has beens" and "havent been yets"...at least we're signing them from three teams that know a few things about the 3-4 defense and the players that fit it.

[Nomad]

Lamar Houston is getting a lot of hype. On Path to the Draft they were saying that he is up to a early second round grade and possibly a fringe first.

I would not complain about any defense front seven pick or any offensive line pick in the first three rounds.

I agree! It starts right here and if your lines are weak, your team will be weak and the BRONCOS should know this from experience!

[SOCALORADO.]

Well, I guess if we're going to sign so-called "has beens" and "havent been yets"...at least we're signing them from three teams that know a few things about the 3-4 defense and the players that fit it.

Yeah, i am not so sure these guys are gonna be game changers for DEN.
To me, these players are solid depth players. Its a long season, and injuries are a huge part of a teams success.
If DEN can get 9 good games of solid play from Williams, its a win.
Green is a depth guy and nothing more.
Bannan has been the most impressive signing so far, and he will start.
Mike Klis is lost.....again. I think hes just drank a few too many Minotaurs, and hes spouting crap again, about where these guys will play.
I still think DEN will go after a NT or a DE high in the draft. (Rounds 1-3)
But overall, these are solid signing's.

[broncofaninfla]

If anything we've improved with depth on the Dline. I really feel Bannon (DE) and Williams (NT) will start and Green will rotate in on passing downs. Should be a good battle between Fields and Baker for the back up NT postion.

[CoachChaz]

Yeah, i am not so sure these guys are gonna be game changers for DEN.
To me, these players are solid depth players. Its a long season, and injuries are a huge part of a teams success.
If DEN can get 9 good games of solid play from Williams, its a win.
Green is a depth guy and nothing more.
Bannan has been the most impressive signing so far, and he will start.
Mike Klis is lost.....again. I think hes just drank a few too many Minotaurs, and hes spouting crap again, about where these guys will play.
I still think DEN will go after a NT or a DE high in the draft. (Rounds 1-3)
But overall, these are solid signing's.

Agreed. Williams in a rotation with Fields OR Baker (really dont wasnt to see 3 NT's on the roster) will help the middle. I love Bannan's potential. Green can just rotate with Holliday. Nothing special, but very solid depth

[Tned]

Agreed. Williams in a rotation with Fields OR Baker (really dont wasnt to see 3 NT's on the roster) will help the middle. I love Bannan's potential. Green can just rotate with Holliday. Nothing special, but very solid depth

For a lot of the games we play, rotational DL players can be effective. However, as we saw last year, some teams will go to a no huddle (not necessarily hurry up) to try and prevent the Broncos from rotating our line.

Not every offense has the talent to pull that off, but some do and that's one of the problems with relying on a DL rotation.

[CoachChaz]

For a lot of the games we play, rotational DL players can be effective. However, as we saw last year, some teams will go to a no huddle (not necessarily hurry up) to try and prevent the Broncos from rotating our line.

Not every offense has the talent to pull that off, but some do and that's one of the problems with relying on a DL rotation.

The benefit there is that it's typically pass-oriented offenses that run no-huddle.

[broncofaninfla]

Is Holliday under contract with Denver this season? I was under the impression he is an unrestricted free agent?

[Tned]

Is Holliday under contract with Denver this season? I was under the impression he is an unrestricted free agent?

I believe he's a free agent and I haven't heard anything about whether the Broncos are trying to resign him.

[CoachChaz]

Is Holliday under contract with Denver this season? I was under the impression he is an unrestricted free agent?

Yeah...that's why we' were discussing our desire to re-sign him. I just dont know how many DL they want to have under contract to start camp

[Lancane]

Wow...I am real surprised by not just by the fans on here, but also by certain idiotic media member (((Cough))) Klis (((Cough)))...

Point is that Denver's defense vastly improved last year, and granted they did run out of steam come the mid-way point, but Bannan was not signed to play defensive end, he has been given starter-esque money to start at the Nose Tackle position, Fields will rotate with him as will Williams, no matter what that idiot Klis believes. And the Broncos have retained most of last years roster, when you measure the moves being made by Denver's Front Office, and seriously, then the answer seems apparent to me...

Think back to what Bowlen and company has stated since seasons' end, the talk of improvement on the offensive line, better quarterback play and the want of a top-notch quarterback, not too mention the issues with drives and scoring. Denver has invested much of the free agency period in defensive players; Williams, Bannan, Green, Jones and those are just the ones the team signed of those they either contacted or brought in. We know that they met with Pashos, so they are serious about improving the offensive line. Add in that the coaches have continually been high on the rookie defensive additions from last year; Smith, Bruton, McBath, Ayers and Baker, which does not include the veterans they inked...

To me this all points to the draft for Denver will be not so much a defensive draft, but more offensive. And I do not believe we will see them drafting the BPA, but more the best player who fits and immediate need or can make a quicker impact to where they want to improve. Several fans believe that Denver will either draft an offensive tackle or guard in the first, if not a wideout...receiver I am not so sure of, but the others may be spot on. Broncos would love to add Bradford or Clausen, but I do not see that happening...and Denver will take a quarterback fairly early, of that I am pretty sure. Within the first four rounds, I believe we will see one defensive player drafted if that and likely it will be a true 3-4 defensive end IMHO.

[SOCALORADO.]

I still think DEN will draft a DE or a NT by round 3.
Theres alot of quality depth at these positions, and passing on a
NT Cam Thomas or a DE Alex Carrington would be tough to me.
But by and large i do think these moves signal that there will be some
serious offensive picks taken right away. And a QB i think will be one of them.

[rationalfan]

How in the world do you get from worst in the league to better than average.



probably the same way the team upgraded the safety position last year - with veterans who know how to play.

[CoachChaz]

probably the same way the team upgraded the safety position last year - with veterans who know how to play.

and a few youngsters sprinkled in for depth and the future

[SOCALORADO.]

and a few youngsters sprinkled in for depth and the future

McBath barring the forearm injury, was the bright spot of last years draft.
The FS position in DEN is in good hands.
Now if DEN can just grab SS Barry Church to play next to him........;)

[Broncolingus]

How do the recent D-line signings improve the defense?

...ask me after Denver wins a playoff game in 2010 - or at least when Denver doesn't do a 'one-for-the-history-books' season ending collapse to miss the playoffs.

Not passing any judgment until game 16 is in the books...

[CoachChaz]

McBath barring the forearm injury, was the bright spot of last years draft.
The FS position in DEN is in good hands.
Now if DEN can just grab SS Barry Church to play next to him........;)

I'd love Barry Church. I just dont think it happens.


Please prove me wrong McD

[Ziggy]

Lamarr Houston in the 2nd. Let's bring in a big DE that can put pressure on the passer to rotate in with these guys. Alex Carrington, Jared Odrick, or Tyson Alualu would also be a nice addition.

[xzn]

Lamarr Houston in the 2nd. Let's bring in a big DE that can put pressure on the passer to rotate in with these guys. Alex Carrington, Jared Odrick, or Tyson Alualu would also be a nice addition.

Do you see Alualu as a five tech? Isn't he only 6'2? I'm interested in him from his triangle numbers but haven't found any scouting reports that are clear on wether he fits a 30 front.

[xzn]

Ziggy, do you have any scouting reports on any of these guys?

[dogfish]

Overview

Alualu was considered a top prospect as a prep and made an immediate impression upon arriving in the Pac-10. He stepped into the rotation as a true freshman, playing in every game, earning his first start and finishing with 16 tackles on the year.

He began a streak of 38 consecutive starts as a true sophomore, leading the Golden Bears with 52 tackles, 3.5 tackles for loss and 2.5 sacks. His career-high 62 tackles was the highest single-season total by a Cal defensive lineman since current Washington Redskin Andre Carter posted 60 in 2000. Despite facing constant double-teams, Alaalu matched Carter's 60 as a senior, picking up 10 tackles for loss and 7.5 sacks to finally earn first-team All-Pac-10 recognition.

Quick, strong and passionate, Alualu's production is even more impressive considering he played defensive end in the 3-4 alignment -- a position typically defined as a block-consuming, role-playing spot more than a stat-producing position. Scouts believe Alualu's numbers would be even more impressive if he were playing in a 4-3 defense. He appears better suited to be a "three technique" defensive tackle.

Had Alaalu played in the Big Ten or SEC, more would know his name. Considering the impressive career he had at California, don't expect scouts to forget to include him among the Top 50 selections come April.


2008 Season
Had a career-high 62 tackles on the year, most for a Cal lineman since Duane Clemons had 82 in 1995 … named second-team All-Pac-10 … started every game at a defensive end spot the last two seasons … had at least one tackle for loss in all but two games … recipient of Cal's Brick Muller Award as the team's most valuable defensive lineman … 11th in the Pac-10 with 6.0 sacks and tied for 16th in the league with 11.0 TFL … finished off the regular season with a career-best 10 tackles, including a sack and two for loss, plus forced fumble vs. Washington … played well at Maryland with eight total tackles, including one sack … had a pair of sacks for minus 17 yards, as well as two pass break-ups, in Cal's win over UCLA … registered a 10-yard sack at USC … finished with eight tackles plus a forced fumble in the Big Game vs. Stanford.

2007 Season
Started all 13 games at defensive end … paced the defensive line with 52 tackles, including 3.5 for a loss … his tackle total is the most by a Cal defensive lineman since current NFL-standout Andre Carter had 60 in 2000 … also had 2.5 sacks, an interception and a team-best four fumble recoveries … had 20 tackles and a pair of fumble recoveries in the last three regular season games … recorded a pair of sacks at Colorado State … recovered his first career fumble and took it into the end zone for a touchdown vs. Arizona after a Thomas DeCoud blitz on quarterback Willie Tuitama jarred the ball loose … snared a key interception at Oregon in the fourth quarter when the Ducks were driving and threatening to score on Cal's 17-yard line … also recovered a fumble against USC … earned the team's Brick Muller Award as the Most Valuable Defensive Lineman.

2006 Season
Stepped into the Golden Bear defensive line rotation immediately as a true freshman … saw action in all 13 games, including his first career start against Oregon State … registered 16 tackles, fourth on the defensive line … tallied a career-best six tackles (three solo) against UCLA and added five takedowns (two solo) in his collegiate debut at Tennessee.

Analysis
Pass rush: Has a good initial burst and hand placement to get into the pads of the offensive tackle and drive him into the pocket. Lacks sustained speed off the edge to rush the passer as a defensive end and likely will be moved inside to tackle in the NFL. Marginal technique as a pass rusher. Relies on a bull rush and strong hands to disengage and uses mostly effort to collapse the pocket. Shows a spin move, but it is slow to develop and generally ineffective.

Run defense: Good initial quickness off the snap. Good lateral agility and balance to slide down the line against the toss and make the tackle at or near the line of scrimmage. Uses his natural leverage advantage and overall strength to anchor at the point of attack. Good upper-body strength to stack and shed in the running game.

Explosion: Provides good initial pop when meeting the blocker. Shows explosiveness in his hands with his ability to shed blocks and gives high effort to close, but only marginal burst.

Strength: Looks lighter on film than his listed weight, but plays with good strength at the point of attack. Relies on his lower-body drive and natural leverage advantage to anchor. Doesn't give up much room and has the quick, strong hands to disengage to make plays at or near the line of scrimmage.

Tackling: Locates the ball quickly and flies to the action. Only marginal flexibility to break down in space, but he's a high-effort pursuit defender willing to launch his body into the air to knock down the ballcarrier. Good strength for the drag-down tackle.

Intangibles: High-intensity player who plays with reckless abandon. Seems to enjoy the physical aspect of the game and is willing to throw his body into the pile. Team captain. Given the team's Brick Muller Award as the defensive line MVP the past three years. Played in all 51 games of his career. Earned Joe Roth Award for best exemplifying courage, attitude and sportsmanship, as well as the Senior Lifter of the Year. Married with two children.

NFL Comparison: Chris Hovan, Buccaneers

[xzn]

Great find dog! Reading that report he sounds like he has "Jarvis Green" potential as a situational rusher as a base 34DE and/or an interior 43DT, particularly in extra DB situations. I doubt he has starter potential as either but should be a quality depth / rotation guy in the pros.

Mayock has him as his fifth DT behind Suh, Mc Coy, Williams and Odrick.

[gobroncsnv]

Keep working inside out... improve the front 3, then the next 4, and THEN look to start replacement (after a couple more seasons) of Dawk and Champ. Build a good foundation before you pick out curtains...

[dogfish]

Keep working inside out... improve the front 3, then the next 4, and THEN look to start replacement (after a couple more seasons) of Dawk and Champ. Build a good foundation before you pick out curtains...

dude. . . if steve atwater EVER heard you refer to the defensive backs as "curtains," i do believe he might hit you harder than he hit okoye. . . .


:lol::lol:

[gobroncsnv]

yeah, may have to rethink that one... nevertheless, I think you build upfront first... on O as well as D.
But Atwater WAS a hittin' mutha, wasn't he?

[dogfish]

Great find dog! Reading that report he sounds like he has "Jarvis Green" potential as a situational rusher as a base 34DE and/or an interior 43DT, particularly in extra DB situations. I doubt he has starter potential as either but should be a quality depth / rotation guy in the pros.

Mayock has him as his fifth DT behind Suh, Mc Coy, Williams and Odrick.

i can't say that i'm that familiar with him, but he does kinda sound like he projects at the next level as one of those lunchpail guys who works best in a rotation. . . i thought his scouting report sounded a lot like trevor laws until i saw that alualu only did 21 reps on the bench. . . i try not to get too hung up on numbers and measureables, but you do look for a baseline, and 21 reps is damn near dead bottom of that measurement for a guy that you want to play defensive line fulltime. . . lamarr houston has the same 33" arms, and he did 30 reps. . . i wouldn't pass on a guy who was productive on the field just because of a combine measurement, but as a fan who can't watch game tape, that number would make me a bit nervous in a year that looks to have pretty good DL depth. . .

i do agree that he does offer some versatility if he can be an interior rusher in the nickel and dime packages, as well as providing a bit of pass rush from the five-technique. . . we could use a guy like that, it's definitely something i've thought about before. . . but, in this year's draft, the site's i'm looking at are mostly projecting alualu as a 2nd round pick-- and with our fairly high second, some of the other guys that might be on the board could include jared odrick, terrance cody, brian price, lamarr houston and cory wooton. . .

of course we don't know who'll actually be there, but i'd probably take most of those guys over alualu-- particularly houston or cody, pending what we do in the first. . .

[dogfish]

more scouting reports. . .



Tyson Alualu, DT, California
Despite a highly successful career at Cal, Alualu finds himself buried deep among a talented class of defensive tackles. As a four year starter, the 6-foot-3 DT started 39 consecutive games for the Golden Bears. He made his first start against Oregon State in the fifth game of his college career and never looked back, recording 16 tackles that season. Alualu became a more consistent presence inside during his sophomore campaign in 2007 registering 52 tackles, 3.5 for loss, with 2.5 sacks. He then had a breakthrough junior season in 2008 recording 62 tackles, 11 for loss, while gaining 6 sacks. His performance earned him Second Team All PAC-10 honors. Then he had an even more productive 2009 with 65 tackles, 11.5 for loss, and 7.5 sacks.
Gets moving quickly at the snap, shooting the gap with energy. Tends to play with good leverage and stacks up blockers at the point; sheds them in time to make the tackle. Moves well into the backfield. Has quick footwork and hands. Is intelligent. Reads screens and draw passes well.

However, lacks explosiveness. Average speed limits his pursuit ability; could be a bit inconsistent. Must learn to attack every play. Lacks pure, pass rushing skills. Must add bulk. Will have some trouble holding up at the point of attack against big NFL offensive linemen.

A 3-4 end with good upside, Alualu does not make jaw-dropping plays, but is strong and productive. He is unlikely to be drafted as high as he will probably be rated, but in time will prove to be a better NFL player than many of the more highly touted defensive tackles who will be drafted ahead of him.

from NFL.com:


Tyson Alualu
Height:6'3"
Weight:295 lbs.
Arm Length:33 in.
Hand Size:10 in.
College:California
Conference:Pac 10

Alualu appears to be a bit of a tweener (combination of height and weight) for an NFL defensive lineman. He doesn’t have the great bulk as an interior lineman in a 4-3 front or the ideal height to play end in a 3-4 scheme. Alualu shows deceptive power for his size that can push the pocket as a pass rusher as well as penetrate the line of scrimmage as a run defender. He has quick hands to control and separate from blockers as well as solid instincts to feel pad pressure and maintain leverage in his gap responsibility. Alualu has enough tools and talent to contribute giving depth to an NFL defensive line.


Strengths: Productive talent who played at a high level throughout career earning all-conference recognition. Uses his power to hold up at the point of attack and to push the pocket. Displays the pass rush ability necessary to stay on the field on third down. Exhibits impressive hand use to gain leverage and shed blockers. Is a tough, relentless player.

Weaknesses: Only possesses average size. Lacks the ideal bulk to play inside and the height of a defensive end. Average change of direction in space and doesn’t always locate the football quickly. Only has average range in pursuit and won’t chase down plays from the backside.


lamarr houston


Latest News
03/01/2010 - Defensive linemen aren't typically known for their flamboyance, but Texas' Lamarr Houston appears to be the exception. While every other lineman from Group 7 wore the standard black shorts and some variation of black shoes when running their 40-yard dash Monday at the NFL Scouting Combine, Houston decided to channel his inner Terrell Owens. The 305-pound defensive tackle sported long white tights and wore yellow shoes so bright that they were practically blinding. If Houston wanted to make a statement of how well-conditioned he was, consider it a success. NFL.com analyst Bucky Brooks observed that Houston looked outstanding in his flashy outfit and that there was little, if any, fat evident on his large frame. Houston unofficially ran the 40 in 4.85 seconds, an exceptional number for a defensive tackle, and he also posted an unofficial 9-foot, 6-inch broad jump, a great distance for his position. - Jason Feller, NFL.com

02/25/2010 - 2010 NFL COMBINE POTENTIAL RISER: DT Lamarr Houston, Texas: It's surprising how he's flying under the radar a bit despite playing for a high-profile Longhorns squad, but if he runs in the 4.9 range at over 300 pounds and lifts well, teams looking for a penetrating three-technique tackle -- or 3-4 defensive end -- will leave Indianapolis intrigued. - Chad Reuter, The Sports Xchange, NFLDraftScout.com


Overview
The 2006 Colorado Gatorade High School Player of the Year as a defensive end and running back became an All-Big 12 defensive tackle. His strong senior season (68 tackles, 22 for loss, eight sacks) makes him one of the top risers in the 2010 senior class.

Houston began his UT career as a reserve end and special teams player in his true freshman season (14 tackles, two for loss, sack). The following season, Houston started 11 of 13 contests, racking up 12 tackles for loss and four sacks. A foot injury stunted his growth in 2008, but he still played 12 games (starting eight) at tackle, seven tackles for loss and 1.5 sacks.

Houston's compact build doesn't fit what all teams are looking for in interior lineman. However, his strength at the point of attack is undeniable, as is his motor and agility for his size. Depth at the tackle position could push him out of the top 50 picks, but Houston could prove to be a bargain in the third round.

Analysis
Pass rush: Extremely agile for a 300-pounder and works relentlessly to reach the quarterback. Gets under the shoulder of his man if lined up in the gap or slanting. Beats most cut blocks with quickness and strong hands and is able to recover from initial stalemate to get after the passer. Good backfield awareness. Gets his hands up to deflect passes, though his height and length leave something to be desired. Dangerous on twists inside. Short arms cause him to work harder to get off blocks against top-level guards. Must improve pass-rush moves.

Run defense: Excellent pursuit down the line. Upper body and hands are strong enough for him to pull down ballcarriers while engaged with blockers. Regularly lines up at the five-technique, standing his ground against larger linemen using a strong punch and leverage. Stays square to the line, able to move laterally while engaged. Lacks the bulk play inside on run downs at the next level.

Explosion: Has a good first step, but not elite first-step quickness. Lines up with two hands down so often he must prove to scouts he can get off quickly from the three-technique; his ability to penetrate on slants shows he's capable. Gets his hands into a blocker's jersey quickly and pushes them back using leverage and brute strength.

Strength: Massive upper body. Should wow teams pumping bench-press reps at the Combine. Plays strong and has a good punch with violent hands to disengage. Uses low center of gravity to keep leverage against the run. Holds up larger lineman and double teams but will be engulfed by larger NFL linemen, unable to disengage when head-up.

Tackling: Very strong tackler, comes with aggression and does not let go once in contact with the ballcarrier. Agile enough to get through trash inside. Good flexibility and strength to bring down backs coming through the hole. Good burst to the quarterback once through the line. Does not break down in space and lacks the change-of-direction skills to capture elusiveness quarterbacks and running backs, but will chase them down with hustle and good straight-line speed.

Intangibles: Very competitive. Has an above-average motor and is willing to play hurt. Generally quiet, but took over vocal defensive line leadership role as a senior. Suspended for one game in 2008 after DWI arrest. Parents are both ministers.

2008 Season
Suspended for one game after being arrested and charged with DWI in two-car accident (no injuries). Appeared in 12 games, making eight starts, at defensive tackle and on special teams despite battling a foot injury for much of the season … a second-team Academic All-Big 12 selection … helped UT rank first in the Big 12 in scoring defense (18.8 ppg/18th NCAA), total defense (342.9 ypg), rushing defense (83.5 ypg/third NCAA) and second in pass efficiency defense (124.2 rating) … tallied 22 tackles, 1.5 sacks, seven TFL, 11 pressures and five PBD … posted three tackles and two TFL in a season-opening victory against FAU … recorded four tackles, two TFL, a PBU and a pressure versus Rice … named the Most Productive Defensive Performer by the coaching staff for his game against the Owls … logged three pressures against Arkansas … tallied two tackles and a PBU in a victory at Colorado … compiled five tackles versus No. 1 Oklahoma … posted a tackle, a PBU and two pressures against No. 11 Missouri … added three tackles, two TFL, a sack and a pressure against No. 6 Oklahoma State … notched a tackle and two pressures at No. 7 Texas Tech … tallied a tackle, a PBU and two pressures at Kansas … recorded a half sack against Texas A&M … registered two tackles in the Fiesta Bowl against No. 10 Ohio State.

2007 Season
Appeared in all 13 games, starting 11, at defensive end … tabbed honorable mention All-Big 12 by The Associated Press … named one of UT's Outstanding Defensive Ends … helped UT give up just 93.4 rushing yards per game (sixth NCAA) … led the team with 12 TFL and 24 pressures to go along with 66 tackles, 4.5 sacks, four PBD and a forced fumble … posted a tackle and two pressures in a victory against Arkansas State … earned the first start of his career and notched six tackles, a sack and a PBD againt No. 19 TCU … added five tackles, a pressure and a PBD at UCF … posted five tackles, including four TFL and a sack, while adding four pressures versus Rice … posted six tackles, a TFL and three pressures against Kansas State … recorded five tackles and a TFL against No. 10 Oklahoma … posted four tackles, a sack and two pressures at Iowa State … tallied four tackles, a sack and three pressures at Baylor … recorded seven tackles and a pressure against Nebraska … notched eight tackles, a TFL, a PBD and two pressures in a victory at Oklahoma State … posted three tackles, a PBD and two pressures against Texas Tech … established a career high with nine tackles to go along with a half sack and a pressure at Texas A&M … added three tackles, a TFL and three pressures against Arizona State in the Holiday Bowl.

2006 Season
Appeared in 11 games … posted 14 tackles, two TFL, a sack and two pressures … opened with a tackle against North Texas … posted three tackles and a TFL at Rice … notched five tackles, a TFL, a PBD and a pressure versus Iowa State … added three tackles against Sam Houston State and a pressure versus Baylor … posted one tackle against Oklahoma State and Iowa (Alamo Bowl).

2010 NFL Draft Prospect Scouting Report:


Lamarr Houston, DT, Texas
Lamarr Houston came to Texas expecting to be the team's next great defensive end. He did earn 11 starts as a freshman and a sophomore at the end position, and even earned honorable mention All-Big 12 accolades during the 2007 season. Then in 2008 Houston switched to the defensive tackle spot. His season was slowed by injuries, but Houston still managed to make eight starts and do his part clogging the middle of the line.
Six games into the 2009 season and Houston is turning into a dominating defensive tackle. He continues to add more weight and is listed at 6-2 and 300 pounds, but the weight seems to keep going up and that is a good thing if he wants to play defensive tackle in the NFL. It is his production on the field that is getting the attention of NFL scouts. Through six games, Houston has 21 tackles, six tackles-for-loss and 17 quarterback hurries.

Houston's experience at defensive end and defensive tackle should make him a more valuable player in the draft. He can move around in any 4-3 defense and provide quality depth anywhere on the line. Houston will have to make some noise between now and the draft to be a first or second round selection, but he should not fall far past that point.

2/15 Update: Houston finished off his collegiate career by leading the Longhorns in tackles during the BCS National Championship game. He even tallied two tackles-for-loss and a sack. During workouts after the season he has proven to be a solid run stuffer who has the speed, strength and agility to chase down ball carriers. Right now he is likely a third round selection and all the talent emerging from the defensive line will not help his stock, but he could separate himself from some of the other defensive tackles with more quality workouts.

from NFL.com:


Lamarr Houston
Height:6'3"
Weight:305 lbs.
Arm Length:33 in.
Hand Size:10 in.
College:Texas
Conference:Big 12

Houston is a short, thick defender that has natural power at the point of attack. He can anchor the middle of the defense when playing with good pad level but can be inconsistent in this area. He has strong hands but again doesn’t always use them effectively to shed blockers. Houston feels pad pressure well and can restrict running lanes effectively. He shows good power to push the pocket as a bull rusher but needs to expand his moves and counters to contribute more as a pass rusher. He needs to be more disciplined and anticipate the snap count as he will jump offsides too often. Houston has the size and athleticism to be an effective interior defender at the next level and will likely fit best in a 4-3 scheme.


Houston has enough bulk and size to play inside in a 4-3 scheme. Is a smart player who can feel pressure. Tough performer. Is an instinctive guy who can find the football. Possesses good power. Has been productive in college.

Houston exhibits an inconsistent motor and doesn’t always finish plays. Gets called for too many flags when incorrectly guessing the snap count. Gets in trouble when he plays with inconsistent pad level. Must improve his pass rush package beyond the bull rush.

[getlynched47]

Here's how I believe the defensive line will shake out for 2010:


LDE- Justin Bannan, Marcus Thomas

NT- Jamal Williams, Ronald Fields, Chris Baker

RDE- Ryan McBean, Jarvis Green

I can easily see Marcus Thomas getting cut if he doesn't do well at defensive end. I still think it was a waste of his talent to make him the backup Nose Tackle for 2009, but we didn't have another option for Nose Tackle. I hope they make the correct decision and slide him over to Defensive End this offseason. If Marcus Thomas is removed, I would fully expect us to draft a rookie to replace him in the rotation, or re-sign Holliday.

Ryan McBean was a beast of a Defensive End in 2009 until he sprained his knee ligament vs. Baltimore. I have him starting over Jarvis Green only because Jarvis Green is horrible when he has to be relied on to start 16 games. The stats don't lie.
Jarvis Green has severely declined as he's been relied on more and more to be a starter. With Richard Seymour shipped out, it thrusted Green into a full-time role. He struggled big time. As a nickel rushing Defensive End here in Denver, he may regain his pass-rusher form that saw him tally up 7.5 and 6.5 sacks in 2006 and 2007 at the 3-4 defensive end position.

Another option I could see shaping up is if they move Ronald Fields to Defensive End. He started a few games for San Francisco as a 3-4 defensive end. He doesn't offer much, if any, pass rushing ability as an end, but he would solidify our rush defense as one of the strongest in the entire NFL.

Tell me what you think :salute:

[xzn]

I have those same second round guys ahead of him plus Cam Thomas, Vlad Ducasse, Rodger Saffold, Brandon Spikes and "yes" Colt Mc Coy (but only if Josh thinks he has "it").

I doubt that Odrick would last to our second but if he did I'd sprint to the podium to turn in a card with his name on it. Like we should have done with Cushing last year instead of Ayers.... but hopefully Mayock is right about him and he ends up better!

[xzn]

We are so totally on the same page. The only thing I would add is that what you describe is base defense but our new guys are "scheme versatile".

I think we'll see four man fronts at times in Nickle and Dime situations, as well as seeing 33 Stack and 32 Dime fronts.

Guys like Bannan can play NT at times and on obvious passing downs you could even put Green at nose. And NT Fields can play DE to give Bannan a rest.

I hope we find a use for Marcus but he may have to beat out a rookie five tech prospect or Baker at nose to make the team.


Here's how I believe the defensive line will shake out for 2010:


LDE- Justin Bannan, Marcus Thomas

NT- Jamal Williams, Ronald Fields, Chris Baker

RDE- Ryan McBean, Jarvis Green

I can easily see Marcus Thomas getting cut if he doesn't do well at defensive end. I still think it was a waste of his talent to make him the backup Nose Tackle for 2009, but we didn't have another option for Nose Tackle. I hope they make the correct decision and slide him over to Defensive End this offseason. If Marcus Thomas is removed, I would fully expect us to draft a rookie to replace him in the rotation, or re-sign Holliday.

Ryan McBean was a beast of a Defensive End in 2009 until he sprained his knee ligament vs. Baltimore. I have him starting over Jarvis Green only because Jarvis Green is horrible when he has to be relied on to start 16 games. The stats don't lie.
Jarvis Green has severely declined as he's been relied on more and more to be a starter. With Richard Seymour shipped out, it thrusted Green into a full-time role. He struggled big time. As a nickel rushing Defensive End here in Denver, he may regain his pass-rusher form that saw him tally up 7.5 and 6.5 sacks in 2006 and 2007 at the 3-4 defensive end position.

Another option I could see shaping up is if they move Ronald Fields to Defensive End. He started a few games for San Francisco as a 3-4 defensive end. He doesn't offer much, if any, pass rushing ability as an end, but he would solidify our rush defense as one of the strongest in the entire NFL.

Tell me what you think :salute:

[getlynched47]

We are so totally on the same page. The only thing I would add is that what you describe is base defense but our new guys are "scheme versatile".

I think we'll see four man fronts at times in Nickle and Dime situations, as well as seeing 33 Stack and 32 Dime fronts.

Guys like Bannan can play NT at times and on obvious passing downs you could even put Green at nose. And NT Fields can play DE to give Bannan a rest.

I hope we find a use for Marcus but he may have to beat out a rookie five tech prospect or Baker at nose to make the team.

Yeah I was talking about base 3-4 defense.

In the Nickel 3-3-5, I'd expect Fields or Bannan in at Nose Tackle with Green and McBean at end since there's more need for some pass rush in those situations.

In a dime 4-3, I'd expect Dumervil and Ayers at defensive end with Bannan and Jarvis Green/Marcus Thomas in the inside.

I really believe Justin Bannan is going to be used in EVERY package, unless his ass gets tired and he needs a break :lol:

Best part of our new players is the versatility they offer. With all those additions, we have a great rotation to go along with a solid core of run stuffers. Looking good! :salute:

EDIT: I was surprised to learn that Jarvis Green can play defensive tackle in a 4 down lineman alignment, but you're absolutely correct. According to rotoworld,
The Patriots used a 4-3 defense in Monday night's opener, with Tully Banta-Cain starting at right defensive end.
TBC had four tackles (three solo) and a game-high two sacks. Ty Warren was at left end, while Jarvis Green and Vince Wilfork started inside. Derrick Burgess rotated in heavily, finishing with three solo stops and a sack. The 4-3 allows the Pats to get upfield more, and involves less gap control.

[Cugel]

I agree. Ayers should be much better with a season under his belt.

Unfortunately, that's what everybody said about Jarvis Moss and look how that turned out! So far Ayers has been a disappointment. He's shown exactly nothing in his first year.

Will he blossom in his second year? Who knows? I can't predict. :coffee:

But, there's ZERO evidence supporting that theory at the moment. Faith has to be BASED on something and we haven't seen anything so far.

Conjecture is that he "might" see more action as offenses scheme to take away Elvis Dumervil next season (assuming they get him signed which they have to do).

[Cugel]

The real question is "how much does Jamal Williams have left in the tank?" Obviously he's not the player at 34 that he was 5 or even 3 seasons ago.

This move could wind up being like the Sam Adams deal. Adams was worse than useless and was cut in mid-season. Back in the day (2000 Ravens SB season) Adams teamed up with Tony Siragusa to give the Ravens a totally un-moveable DL. NOBODY could run on them and I think Denver got something like 66 yards on the ground in the playoff loss to them.

But, NT wears down anybody, no matter how good. And you suddenly can get old at that position. We saw that with Michael Dean Perry ("Refrigerator" Perry's younger brother) when Shanahan cut him in mid-season too in 1997.

You have to hope that he still has some juice left and can provide a bit of the pass rush from the DL that Denver has been lacking for the past 6 to 8 years.