Formula One Thread

[Retired_Member_001]

Monza this weekend!

What's this I see? ;)

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2007/9/6723.html


The McLaren-Ferrari ‘spy scandal’ took another twist at Monza on Friday when details emerged of a letter sent last week by FIA President Max Mosley to McLaren drivers Fernando Alonso, Pedro de la Rosa and Lewis Hamilton.

“The FIA has been made aware of an allegation that one or more McLaren drivers may be in possession, or that such drivers have recently been in possession, of written evidence relevant to this investigation,” said the letter, in which Mosley goes on to ask the drivers to produce details of any such documents.

It follows the FIA’s decision earlier this week to stage a fresh hearing into the circumstances surrounding McLaren’s possession of confidential Ferrari data after the emergence of new evidence. McLaren escaped sanction in the original hearing where the World Motor Sport Council decided there was no proof the team had made use of the data.

In his letter, Mosley specifically requests that the McLaren drivers forward details of any electronic communications that mention or involve Ferrari, or the Italian team’s former engineer Nigel Stepney, who has denied allegations that he was the source of the leaked information.

Mosley also stresses that in doing so, the drivers would not face any proceedings under the International Sporting Code or the Formula One regulations, but warns that witholding any information could result in serious consequences.

The nine Formula One teams not directly involved in the case are also understood to have received an official request from the FIA for any pertinent information.

The full FIA letter to the McLaren drivers:

31 August 2007

Dear Mr De La Rosa

As you will be aware, the FIA has recently investigated whether, how and to what extent McLaren was in possession of confidential Ferrari technical information. The FIA has subsequently been made aware of an allegation that one or more McLaren drivers may be in possession, or that such drivers have recently been in possession, of written evidence relevant to this investigation.

In the interests of the sport and the Championship it is important that the FIA as the regulator establishes unequivocally and rapidly whether or not this allegation has any basis in fact.

The FIA therefore formally requests that you produce copies of any relevant documents which may be in your possession or power of procurement and which may be relevant to this case. For these purposes “documents” includes all written materials such as emails, letters, electronic communications, text messages, notes, memoranda, drawings, diagrams, data,. or other material, stored in any physical, “hard copy” or electronic form. In particular (though without limiting the generality of this request), the FIA wishes to receive copies of any electronic communications (howsoever conveyed or stored) which may be relevant to this case and which make reference to Ferrari, Nigel Stepney or any technical or other information coming from or connected with either Ferrari or Mr Stepney. In the event that you are aware of the existence or previous existence of any document falling within the above description but are not in a position to produce it, please describe the content of the document in question, the circumstances under which it came to your knowledge and the reasons why you are unable to produce it. In the event that you are unsure as to whether any document falls within the above description, kindly submit it (or a description of it) and the FIA will assist in making a determination.

You will appreciate that there is a duty on all competitors and Super Licence holders to ensure the fairness and legitimacy of the Formula One World Championship. It is therefore imperative that if you do have any such information, you make it available to us without delay. I can confirm, given the importance of this issue, that any information you may make available in response to this letter will not result in any proceedings against you under the International Sporting Code or the Formula One regulations. However, in the event that it later comes to light that you have withheld any potentially relevant information, serious consequences could follow.

We are sending identical letters to Fernando Alonso and Lewis Hamilton. We look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience. Thank you very much for your co-operation.

Yours sincerely

Max Mosley

[Retired_Member_001]

McLaren have lost all constructers points.

Somehow I still think this isn't over.

[Tned]

McLaren have lost all constructers points.

Somehow I still think this isn't over.

I read yesterday Mclaren was fined $100 million (not a typo) and lost a specific number of constructer points.

[Den21vsBal19]

I read yesterday Mclaren was fined $100 million (not a typo) and lost a specific number of constructer points.

This one's going to end up in the courts................the last place any sport needs to be


$100 mil's got to be a record sporting fine :eek:

[Tned]

I saw another article where Mclaren has already said they were going to appeal the fine.


$100 million fine for McLaren in spy case
ASSOCIATED PRESS
Article Last Updated: 09/14/2007 02:35:43 AM PDT


Formula One team McLaren was fined $100 million and stripped of its points in the constructors' standings Thursday in the biggest scandal to hit auto racing's premier circuit.
McLaren, which had led drivers' and constructors' standings, was punished by the World Motor Sports Council for allegedly using leaked secret technical documents belonging to F1 rival Ferrari.

Team drivers Lewis Hamilton and Fernando Alonso, currently

1-2 in the championship standings, were not punished and can continue to compete for the season title.

[Retired_Member_001]

Lewis can win the championship on the next race.

:first:

[Retired_Member_001]

A world championship for Raikkonen was way over due but it's a real shame Lewis Hamilton couldn't make history.

Looks like it's been a rough weekend for English sport.

[Den21vsBal19]

A world championship for Raikkonen was way over due but it's a real shame Lewis Hamilton couldn't make history.

Looks like it's been a rough weekend for English sport.
Yeah, nerves got to him abit, but his poor start eventually had no bearing on events.................

Been a good championship though, some good racing on the track and more than a little intrigue off it...................which is continuing after the final race

[Retired_Member_001]

Yeah, nerves got to him abit, but his poor start eventually had no bearing on events.................

Been a good championship though, some good racing on the track and more than a little intrigue off it...................which is continuing after the final race

:laugh:

McLaren wont win the appeal, if anything BMW and Williams will get a small fine. I don't think it would be fair to take the championship away from Kimi now anyway.

[Den21vsBal19]

:laugh:

McLaren wont win the appeal, if anything BMW and Williams will get a small fine. I don't think it would be fair to take the championship away from Kimi now anyway.
Yeah, you're probably right..................but considering all the shenanigans, it's a pretty appropriate way of ending the year :laugh:

[y2cragie]

Howdy guys.
Very apt Mclaren won nothing this year. Shame for Lewis but as far as Mclaren are concerned they were lucky to even get to race the last few races.
Side note, Michael Schumacher is testing the car at Barcelona next week because niether current driver has experience with an F1 car without Traction control. Rumors have it if his performance is at the top of the time sheets, he may even consider a return.

[Den21vsBal19]

Interesting to hear on Radio 5Live last night that Renault have been asked to appear in front of the authorities for allegedly breaking the same rules as McLaren, ironically enough the engineer involved is an ex-McLaren man :laugh:

BBC~ Renault face McLaren spy charge (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7085098.stm)

[y2cragie]

And should suffer the same punishment.
Then next year Williams will be the third placed team, and as a historical thing, I hope they bring out the big red 5 again.

[Den21vsBal19]

And should suffer the same punishment.
Then next year Williams will be the third placed team, and as a historical thing, I hope they bring out the big red 5 again.
Would Williams race Red 5?

I always thought that was at Mansell's request?

[y2cragie]

I don't know if they would, I just think it would be cool to see it again.:D

Testing for the 2008 season began today, guess who was fastest. Yes sir, on M. Schumacher. A year away from racing, first real time in the car (4 slow laps at fiorano for the fiat guys) and he bangs in the fastest lap. I think Felipe needs to top that tomorrow or else he really could be in jeapordy.

[Den21vsBal19]

I don't know if they would, I just think it would be cool to see it again.:D

Testing for the 2008 season began today, guess who was fastest. Yes sir, on M. Schumacher. A year away from racing, first real time in the car (4 slow laps at fiorano for the fiat guys) and he bangs in the fastest lap. I think Felipe needs to top that tomorrow or else he really could be in jeapordy.
He's an annoyingly smug, arrogant, cheating bar-steward, but the SOB knows how to drive :mad:

[y2cragie]

lol.
Day two he was top again, almost half a second faster than Massa.
A comment I found interesting. He was asked if the offers were going to be coming in, he said probably not and even if they were, there are no seats free right now.
Could he seriously be thinking of a return in his own words and not speculation? I sure hope so.

[Retired_Member_001]

He's an annoyingly smug, arrogant, cheating bar-steward, but the SOB knows how to drive :mad:

That sounds like Alonso to me, all you have to do is add "whiny little biotch".

:laugh:

Am I the only one who heard Alonso wanted to join Red Bull? :laugh:

[frenchfan]

That sounds like Alonso to me, all you have to do is add "whiny little biotch".

:laugh:

Am I the only one who heard Alonso wanted to join Red Bull? :laugh:I agree Alonso should sometimes shut his big trap, but Lewis is not the angel many thought he was ;)
And honestly... it was harder to lose the championship than to win it in his situation... He really lost his temper during the last 2 races...

I'm dying to see what all the drivers will do without TC... I think there will have some surprises...

Seems like Alonso will join back Renault... It's just a question of time before annoncement... and IMO, it's also because of the new spy affair...

And if he comes back who will be the #2 driver for Renault ? Kovalainen or Picquet Jr? My prediction was Alonso-Picquet... But Heikki showed good things during the Barcelona test. May be Heikki with McLaren (though I don't think so... he is a Briatore's driver and Ron Denis HATES Flavio and won't pick another of his drivers soon IMO).

Can't wait for the next GP... Hopefully, there is football !!!! :defense:

[y2cragie]

Hi frenchie, there was some news today.
Firstly there will be an announcement on Alonso this week, Flavio says there is a 60% chance of him joining Renault, right now.
Secondly He said, Renault would have differant drivers next year, which suggests Heikki is gone.
Finally Renault said they would quit the sport if they are found guilty in their spying hearing. Thus next year we could in theory have, no red bull as they run renault engines, No Renault and No Mclaren (if the FIA find any ferrari ideas in their cars)
2002 all over again anyone? Even I as a Ferrari fan would hate to see that happen again.

[frenchfan]

Hi frenchie, there was some news today.
Firstly there will be an announcement on Alonso this week, Flavio says there is a 60% chance of him joining Renault, right now.
Secondly He said, Renault would have differant drivers next year, which suggests Heikki is gone.
Finally Renault said they would quit the sport if they are found guilty in their spying hearing. Thus next year we could in theory have, no red bull as they run renault engines, No Renault and No Mclaren (if the FIA find any ferrari ideas in their cars)
2002 all over again anyone? Even I as a Ferrari fan would hate to see that happen again.
Hi Y2 :beer:

I've said since a long time that Alonso would be back with Renault... Only 2 things stopped or slowed the process :
1/ the duration of the contract. Renault wanted at least 2 years, Alonso only 1.
2/ the spy affair.

I've bet with some friends several weeks ago that the team will be Alonso-Picquet... I hope I'm right :D

About the championship... IMO, if Renault, McLaren are out, I don't see any interest about F1 thus far... I think Ferrari likes challenges and wouldn't like this faked championship...
What I've heard about the new spy affair is that Renault have warned the FIA as soon as they found the McLaren files on their computers.. .Now, that's what they say... I'm waiting for the truth...

[y2cragie]

To be fair I am more inclined to believe Renault when they say they made sure the FIA and Mclaren were told right away. In Mclarens case, they say they told the FIA right away, then later the truth comes out that Alonso threatend to tell the FIA first as blackmail. More Ron dennis bullpoop.

[frenchfan]

To be fair I am more inclined to believe Renault when they say they made sure the FIA and Mclaren were told right away. In Mclarens case, they say they told the FIA right away, then later the truth comes out that Alonso threatend to tell the FIA first as blackmail. More Ron dennis bullpoop.I hope so... I'm not a big Ron Dennis fan (remember the Prost-Senna era :D)

Plus, the fact Renault said they'll be out of F1 if they are found guilty showed that they seem cleaner than McLaren was IMO...
Time will tell though...

:beer:

[Den21vsBal19]

I hope so... I'm not a big Ron Dennis fan (remember the Prost-Senna era :D)

Plus, the fact Renault said they'll be out of F1 if they are found guilty showed that they seem cleaner than McLaren was IMO...
Time will tell though...

:beer:
Well, they've been found guilty, but not been punished as no McLaren intellectual property had made its way onto the design. :confused:

So it's OK to know what & how the oppositition are trying to do, but not to copy them?

BBC ~ Renault escape spy row punishment (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7129049.stm)

[y2cragie]

two things, exactly what happend to Mclaren, it was only after the emails from the drivers that they were recalled to the FIA and punished. I'll bet my life savings on that veing the same situation, if more info comes to light, they'll be dragged back and punished.
secondly. There was never going to be a punishment with renault threatening to leave.

[frenchfan]

Well, they've been found guilty, but not been punished as no McLaren intellectual property had made its way onto the design. :confused:

So it's OK to know what & how the oppositition are trying to do, but not to copy them?

BBC ~ Renault escape spy row punishment (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7129049.stm)The fact is they are guilty to have found an employee who broke the rules.
Then they warned FIA they had some McLaren files! (about the McLaren affair, it was Ferrari that warned the FIA).
I don't think it's as bad as what McLaren did.
Just my opinion though... (and no national chauvinism here)... We'll never know all the story.

BTW, spying is an art in F1... All the teams do it...
Moreover, can you brainwash an engineer from another team when you hire him? Do you think Ross Brawn will forget all what he knows about Ferrari now that he's with Honda?

Last, I agree with Y2... If FIA really find a proof that Renault used this informations (like the drivers email), I'll bet they will be punished.
And FIA didn't take the risk to see a top team leaving... May be MCLaren should has done the same... :laugh:

And may be they wanted to save a seat for Alonso... :laugh:

:beer:

[Retired_Member_001]

Fernando Alonso will race for Renault next season alongside Nelson Piquet Jr, it was confirmed on Monday. The move marks Alonso’s return to the team with whom he won two world titles and follows a troubled 2007 season with McLaren.

Piquet’s promotion from test driver to race seat means Renault will field an all-new line-up for next season - and leaves current stars Giancarlo Fisichella and Heikki Kovalainen without confirmed drives for 2008.

“I am delighted to be returning to Renault,” said Alonso. “This is the team where I grew up as a driver in Formula One. Now it is time for us to begin a new chapter together. I am very excited about working with this great team once more, and confident that together we can move back to the front of the field. Renault had a difficult year in 2007, but I know that the team has real strength in depth. I am confident they can produce a fast and competitive car and be back at the top in 2008.”

“Fernando and Nelsinho will form one of the most exciting driver line-up of 2008,” commented Renault team principal Flavio Briatore. “We are delighted to be welcoming Fernando back home to the team where he enjoyed his greatest success. His abilities as a driver and a team leader are well known, and we look forward to forging another strong partnership. What’s more, he knows the team well and how we operate; he will feel comfortable straight away in this environment.

Alonso, 26, previously drove for Renault between 2003 and 2006, during which time he scored 15 Grand Prix victories and won two drivers’ championships, in 2005 and 2006.

Meanwhile, 22-year-old Brazilian Piquet spent 2007 as Renault’s test and reserve driver, after finishing runner-up in the 2006 GP2 series championship. The Brazilian will now make his Formula One debut at the 2008 Australian Grand Prix.

“First of all, I want to thank Flavio and Renault for putting their confidence in me for 2008,” said Piquet. “It is a fantastic opportunity to make my Formula One debut with one of the top teams on the grid, and alongside one of the very best drivers in the sport. This drive is something I have been working towards since the end of 2006, and I am proud that my performances as test driver have earned me this position. I am looking forward to teaming up with Fernando, and learning from him. As a rookie, there is no better way to start your career than to have a double world champion as your reference point.”

Briatore added: “Nelsinho is one of the most promising young talents in motorsport. After his success in GP2, he has spent a year learning the ropes as our test driver and getting to know the team; he is now ready to step up to the next level.”

Alonso and Piquet will be supported by Frenchman Romain Grosjean, reigning 2007 F3 Euroseries Champion and a product of Renault’s driver development scheme, in the role of test driver.

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2007/12/7167.html

[frenchfan]

I've won my bet...

Almost 2 months ago I've said that 2008 Renault team would be Alonso-Piquet.
I'm a bit sad for Heikki and I hope he will find a seat (may be McLaren?)... If not, he still could compete in WRC... He tested Loeb's Citroen C4 and was good... BTW, Loeb (4th time WRC champion), tested the Renault F1 and was really good too...

Wookie... Thanks for the post (so I don't have to do it by myself :D)

[y2cragie]

Race of champs was a great watch. Too bad Michael didn't win the final, I thought it a bit unfair they went back to the first race cars when it should have been the fiats, as those would have made it equal. Ekstrom clearly the faster driver in the big car, Michael the open wheel, it should have come down to the equal standing.
Oh well.

P.S. dont take this seriously. All in the fun of a great event.;):D

[Retired_Member_001]

I saw a Renault with all these Renault F1 team logo's on the car, it was outside my house.

Maybe Alonso has come to ask for advice on how to win back a World Championship? ;)

Not that I'm going to give it to him. :eviltongue:

[y2cragie]

that would be the new clio I believe. To big for alonso;)

[Retired_Member_001]

that would be the new clio I believe. To big for alonso;)

This wasn't a Clio, I'm pretty sure about that.

[y2cragie]

Maybe Heiki stole his F1 car as a screw you to them for releasing him. We'll see an oddly Renault looking Mclaren next year.
Ahem I've said too much, Ron and his Lawyers will be after me.:D

[Retired_Member_001]

The F1 seasons kicks off again with the Australian GP. The pole position went to Lewis Hamilton with Robert Kubica lining up behind him as well as Heikki Kovalainen. Other notable position rankings are Felippe Massa (4th), Fernando Alonso (12th) and Kimi Raikkonen (14th).

The race starts in 5 hours and 14 minutes from the post on.

[Den21vsBal19]

What's this I hear about a night race? :eek:

Sounds like it could be...................interesting ;)