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JONtheBRONCO
01-27-2010, 04:13 PM
Well, instead of starting a new thread everytime the Broncos or a Bronco player is mentioned on ESPN's insider, I'll just keep it in one thread. The fact ESPN makes you pay for an account is frustrating, so I'll share it for those of you without an account. Enjoy! Go Broncos!

JONtheBRONCO
01-27-2010, 04:14 PM
Franchise tag likely for Hampton?

Casey Hampton | Steelers | Interested: Cardinals?, Broncos?, Chiefs?, Dolphins?, Bills?

The Pittsburgh Steelers would be wise to hang on to Casey Hampton. Since his rookie campaign in 2001, the massive NT has anchored the team's oppressive 3-4 defense while the men around him changed a number of times. According to what sources have told the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, the Steelers will try to bring him back one way or another, be it a long-term deal or a franchise or transition tag.

But what if they don't lock him up, or they place the "non-exclusive" tag on him, meaning other teams can make offers? We'd expect Hampton to draw plenty of interest. The Dolphins, Chiefs, Cardinals and Broncos are all on the lookout for an upgrade at NT, and if the Bills indeed make the switch to a 3-4 this offseason, they'll need a NT, too.

JONtheBRONCO
01-27-2010, 04:16 PM
Wilfork ready for a fight

Vince Wilfork | Patriots | Interested: Broncos?, Chiefs?, Dolphins?, Bills?

A week ago, ESPN Boston's Mike Reiss wrote that the way it's shaping up, Vince Wilfork is "likely to be assigned the franchise tag" if a deal can't be consummated with the Patriots. Appearing on Boston radio station WEEI told the hosts that being tagged would be akin to "a slap in the face." He then added, "I want a long-term deal or I want to be free. Point blank."

As we're always reminded, this isn't always up to what the players want. The Patriots would be within the rules to franchise Wilfork, and unless he wanted to sit out the entire season, he's stuck.

In the unlikely event that Wilfork is not tagged or re-signed, he will be one of the top free agents on the market this offseason, especially given the prevalence of the 3-4 defense, and the need for a nose tackle in that scheme. Given that, the Broncos, Dolphins and Bills (who may be switching to a 3-4) might take a look, and it's also possible that the Chiefs -- a.k.a. Pats West -- will be interested.

JONtheBRONCO
01-27-2010, 04:18 PM
Elvis to leave the building?

Elvis Dumervil | Broncos | Interested: Cardinals?, Packers?, Patriots?, 49ers?, Dolphins?

Denver Broncos LB Elvis Dumervil was a revelation in 2009, laying waste to opposing QBs like his financial future depended on it. Mainly because it kinda did: he's expected to hit restricted free agency this offseason.

Being an RFA brings a limit to what can happen to Elvis this offseason, but it's possible the Broncos will look to sell high and trade him to the highest bidder. One team that could be particularly interested is the Miami Dolphins, the team that hired Denver's 2009 defensive coordinator Mike Nolan this past week. As NFL Insider Adam Schefter tweeted on Sunday morning, "look for [Dumervil] to be on Miami's radar."

Other 3-4 teams possibly in need of a pass-rushing dynamo like Dumervil include the Patriots, Packers (if Aaron Kampman is let go), 49ers (if they don't believe in Ahmad Brooks) and Cardinals.

The Football Scientist KC Joyner emailed in with his take on why Dumervil will be an especially hot commodity this offseason

KC Joyner
Versatile Dumervil can play in any scheme

"As impressive as Dumervil's pass rushing techniques are (he may be the best bull rusher in the league despite his lack of size), his best value may lie in that he has shown the ability to rush the passer from both the 4-3 and 3-4 alignments. Some 3-4 rush linebackers don't fare as well when playing with their hand on the ground at the snap but Dumervil does. That means he could help any team in need of a pass rusher and his value will increase accordingly."

Bill Williamson
Retaining Elvis a top priority

"Expect Denver to do everything it can to keep Dumervil. He is the centerpiece of the defense. With receiver Brandon Marshall and quarterback Kyle Orton also likely restricted free agents, it wouldn't be a surprise if Dumervil is the top priority. Denver will likely put a high tender on Dumervil that would make it difficult for him to leave. Still, this will be a very interesting situation to watch in the coming weeks."

CoachChaz
01-27-2010, 04:56 PM
Say NO to Hampton. Up there in years and just has "i'm going to kick back and enjoy cashing the paychecks on my last big contract" written all over him

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
01-27-2010, 06:40 PM
I WANT WINNERS! I want people that want to win!

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/TCIH/singletary.jpg

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
01-27-2010, 06:42 PM
Unrelated:

Is it just me or are kyle and coach gushing at each other? Curtsy?

http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm161/blueonions405/Denver%20Broncos%202009/captccc21ae25e6144448e474933a430707.jpg

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
01-28-2010, 12:42 AM
More insider stuff please! :D

pnbronco
01-28-2010, 01:18 AM
Thanks Jon.....:salute:

frenchfan
01-28-2010, 02:41 AM
Thanks Jon.....:salute:Yeah... Thank You Jon :salute: :beer:

Talking about Doom... I hope he is our #1 priority indeed...
My plan would be :
1/ Resigned Doom --> make the effort here
2/ Resigned Orton with a decent but not huge contrat (save the money and use it somewhere else to solve our issues)
3/ See what is best for us about BM... I like him but I wouldn't be mad if we make a good trade (good draft picks + a player may be?).

Dirk
01-28-2010, 06:23 AM
Chiefs -- a.k.a. Pats West

:lol:

I'm glad they got off our backs with that crap!

Dean
01-28-2010, 07:32 AM
Actually, KC would be Pats central and we are Pats west. Let's be geographically correct here.


:rolleyes:

Superchop 7
01-28-2010, 07:50 PM
Point Udall, Guam (Westermost point.....US territory)

Lebanon, Kansas (Centralmost point......US territory)

This would be as geographically corrrect per Dean.

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
01-28-2010, 07:54 PM
Hook us up john! When folks are arguing geographical correctness the boredom has reached an all time high! More insider speculation por favor! :D

JDL
01-28-2010, 10:04 PM
The Cardinals make an interesting trade partner.

The rumors are very hot and heavy the Cardinals are going to trade Boldin no matter what. The Cardinals have a desperate need for a 3-4 pass rusher and that is their top offseason priority. The radio guys in the know have already told fans not to expect a 1st (that it is ridiculous), but that at this point his true value may only be a 3rd due to his contract demands.

That tells me the Cardinals will take a 2nd - other teams likely will be wanting to give a 3rd. (The media guys are hopeful that the Pats with multiple 2nds would be interested in a deal) But, you could bridge that gap of trade value by combining Dumervil for Boldin.

Basically,

Denver gets - 1st rd pick (26), Anquan Boldin

Arizona gets - Elvis Dumervil, late rd pick (could be a 4th-6th)

Essentially, Denver can sell it as getting a 1st rd pick and a player worth a 2nd rd pick at a position of need (so they got more than the 1st and 3rd they'd have gotten otherwise.) This would mean that we could use BOTH our 1st rd picks on other positions and when we trade Marshall, if whatever we get from that deal wouldn't have to be spent on a WR either.

Boldin is expected to get a deal with around $10-12mil guaranteed. (just for comparison, Doom supposedly wants something like Ware money - well, Ware got a contract with 40mil guaranteed and 20mil just in signing bonus up front.)

Cardinals get what they want, a pass rusher and aren't giving up multiple picks.

I think this makes a lot of sense for both sides, Boldin has the size that Orton likes to throw to and we can look in later rounds or FA at bringing in a deep threat to fill out the WR corps. Boldin while having injury issues recently isn't nearly the risk that 1st rd WRs are (the position that busts more than any other in the 1st rd.)

For Marshall, I still think we should look at a deal with Chicago and attempt to land Brian Urlacher... I love Rolando McClain but it doesn't appear he will make it to our pick. Dawkins sounds like he'll stay and no doubt McD has to turn it around sooner than later, Urlacher and a pick would help (plus, there were rumors that Bowlen didn't want multiple 1st this year due to cost issues.) If that was true at all we may very well be looking at acquiring players (remember we asked the NY Jets for David Harris an ILB in a Marshall deal.) So, I would expect some creative deals to pop up.

titan
01-28-2010, 11:54 PM
The Cardinals make an interesting trade partner.
For Marshall, I still think we should look at a deal with Chicago and attempt to land Brian Urlacher...

I was thinking Chicago would be a good trade partner, too, as the Bears may overpay to make their boy Jay happy. But Marshall to the Bears for what? Urlacher sounds good on the surface but he'll be 32 this year and coming off a major injury. Given his hard hitting style of play Urlacher may not have much time left. The Bears don't have a #1 and #2 choice, so not much can be had there.

LRtagger
01-29-2010, 12:17 AM
Basically,

Denver gets - 1st rd pick (26), Anquan Boldin

Arizona gets - Elvis Dumervil, late rd pick (could be a 4th-6th)



Damn. Doom is a beast, but that would be a sweet deal. Then we could package Marshall for another player or multiple players rather than picks.

We could potentially have Boldin, plus two firsts and one or two established defensive players in exchange for Marshall and Doom. That is a lot to build upon especially since this team still needs to upgrade it's talent level and depth.

JDL
01-29-2010, 05:40 AM
Damn. Doom is a beast, but that would be a sweet deal. Then we could package Marshall for another player or multiple players rather than picks.

We could potentially have Boldin, plus two firsts and one or two established defensive players in exchange for Marshall and Doom. That is a lot to build upon especially since this team still needs to upgrade it's talent level and depth.

I think McDaniels realizes that he has a short window here, not sure he can afford to wait for this team to turn around. This came up a lot last year with possible player for player trades. It became pretty common around the league.

It may be that something we might be able to do something with New England to acquire Vince Wilfork. I expect a lot of player for player deals as teams aren't as likely to want to give up draft picks... I do think we could see a lot of swapping picks too. With the lockout looming, teams mostly don't want to give out brand new huge contracts so actually players under contract will be very hot commodities I think.

Didn't Seattle have an excess LB after taking Curry last year?

I'm not sure, but I do think creative will be the word of the day this offseason.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 08:36 AM
Basically,

Denver gets - 1st rd pick (26), Anquan Boldin

Arizona gets - Elvis Dumervil, late rd pick (could be a 4th-6th)





If I was a Cardinals fan I would kick my GM's ass if he made that deal.

claymore
01-29-2010, 08:46 AM
If I was a Cardinals fan I would kick my GM's ass if he made that deal.

I would kiss ours! That would makle up for alot of value I percieve as lost over the last year.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 09:24 AM
I would kiss ours! That would makle up for alot of value I percieve as lost over the last year.

What value do you perceive as lost? Cutler? A first round pick?

claymore
01-29-2010, 09:34 AM
What value do you perceive as lost? Cutler? A first round pick?

Yes, and yes, and the 3rd rounder used to move up and grab quinn.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 09:49 AM
Yes, and yes, and the 3rd rounder used to move up and grab quinn.

Cutler has proven nothing. I've yet to see how we lost out in that deal. When it happens, I'll concede, but until then...

The first round pick still hasnt had a chance to pan out, but aside from that...how do people sit here and complain about losing a first round pick, then turn around and say that the draft is a crapshoot and cant be relied upon. Pick one, please.

I just find it interesting that the entire organization is expected to be perfect in 10 months. Marshall, Doom, Cutler...all of the anti-McD favorites were okay when they didnt excel in their rookie season, but Quinn and Smith are suppose to be Pro-Bowlers immediately. Makes sense

Nomad
01-29-2010, 10:07 AM
Cutler has proven nothing. I've yet to see how we lost out in that deal. When it happens, I'll concede, but until then...

The first round pick still hasnt had a chance to pan out, but aside from that...how do people sit here and complain about losing a first round pick, then turn around and say that the draft is a crapshoot and cant be relied upon. Pick one, please.

I just find it interesting that the entire organization is expected to be perfect in 10 months. Marshall, Doom, Cutler...all of the anti-McD favorites were okay when they didnt excel in their rookie season, but Quinn and Smith are suppose to be Pro-Bowlers immediately. Makes sense

I figured it to be a loss if he had an immediate impact on his new team regardless of what he had to play with. He hasn't and if he wins a SB 10 yrs from now, it doesn't mean anything to me! One can say he needs the pieces to make it perfect, then what QB/team doesn't!!

gregbroncs
01-29-2010, 10:22 AM
I figured it to be a loss if he had an immediate impact on his new team regardless of what he had to play with. He hasn't and if he wins a SB 10 yrs from now, it doesn't mean anything to me! One can say he needs the pieces to make it perfect, then what QB/team doesn't!!I think he did have an immediate impact. They got worse.

claymore
01-29-2010, 10:32 AM
Cutler has proven nothing. I've yet to see how we lost out in that deal. When it happens, I'll concede, but until then...

The first round pick still hasnt had a chance to pan out, but aside from that...how do people sit here and complain about losing a first round pick, then turn around and say that the draft is a crapshoot and cant be relied upon. Pick one, please.

I just find it interesting that the entire organization is expected to be perfect in 10 months. Marshall, Doom, Cutler...all of the anti-McD favorites were okay when they didnt excel in their rookie season, but Quinn and Smith are suppose to be Pro-Bowlers immediately. Makes senseI think Cutler is the 2nd best QB this Org has had. And he was fun as hell to watch.

As for the first rd pick... They can complain about it because it didnt fit an immediate need, we took less value in the trade, and the trade decision was literally made in 2 minutes. McD had such a boner he didnt even get to pick which #1 he gave Seattle. Sounds like a 15 YO boy getting his first chance at a shot of poon.

As for the Org being perfect in 10 months,... I don't know anyone that expected that. What they did expect is noticeable deficiencies would be fixed and the strengths would be used to their maximum potential. Neither happened.

I feel like the Broncos got gutted. It wasn't a SB team, but it had all the expensive pieces were gutted and replaced with 50 YO safeties and no name QB's.

SR
01-29-2010, 10:42 AM
I think Cutler is the 2nd best QB this Org has had. And he was fun as hell to watch.

As for the first rd pick... They can complain about it because it didnt fit an immediate need, we took less value in the trade, and the trade decision was literally made in 2 minutes. McD had such a boner he didnt even get to pick which #1 he gave Seattle. Sounds like a 15 YO boy getting his first chance at a shot of poon.

As for the Org being perfect in 10 months,... I don't know anyone that expected that. What they did expect is noticeable deficiencies would be fixed and the strengths would be used to their maximum potential. Neither happened.

I feel like the Broncos got gutted. It wasn't a SB team, but it had all the expensive pieces were gutted and replaced with 50 YO safeties and no name QB's.

We got the better end of the Cutler deal in all aspects. McDaniels trading away OUR first round pick and keeping Chicago's worked out for OUR benefit. What our greatest strengths were in the '08 season were not our greatest strengths this season, thus rendering them unable to be used to their max potential THIS season. What were our weaknesses in '08? DEFENSE. Our defense finished 7th overall in the entire NFL this year. We fixed what EVERYONE said needed to be fixed, but our offense got worse. You're not seeing or examining the entire scenario. Period.

claymore
01-29-2010, 10:53 AM
We got the better end of the Cutler deal in all aspects. McDaniels trading away OUR first round pick and keeping Chicago's worked out for OUR benefit. What our greatest strengths were in the '08 season were not our greatest strengths this season, thus rendering them unable to be used to their max potential THIS season. What were our weaknesses in '08? DEFENSE. Our defense finished 7th overall in the entire NFL this year. We fixed what EVERYONE said needed to be fixed, but our offense got worse. You're not seeing or examining the entire scenario. Period.
Our defense was statistically better, and I give Nolan mad props for that. But we also lost 80% of our last 10 games. Which was the worst meltdown in Broncos history, and the 3rd of its kind in NFL history.

Our Defense folded down the stretch and I think we got raped on the Cutler trade, Smith Trade. We lucked out on which pick was sent for Smith. I would like to see decisions work out because of planning.

The Quinn trade was just stupid. Not much else to say there.

Our strengths are now our weakness, and our weakness isnt our strength. Seems like we went thru a whole lotta shit for nothing. Im not even going to get into the Nolan, Turner, Dennison thing.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 11:00 AM
Nolan gets the credit for the good start the defense had and McDaniels gets the blame for the bad finish. Really?

Our team was gutted and we have no talent left. We got draft choices for a mediocre (at best) QB who havent had much of a chance to fulfill their career destinies and somehow we got "raped"? Interesting


But let's assume for a minute that every conspiracy theory is true and every assumption made by fans full of unwarranted hatred are correct. How did we go through such HELL in a year and lose so much talent and become such a worse team and end up with the same finished product that the Mastermind gave us over the last few years?

claymore
01-29-2010, 11:13 AM
Nolan gets the credit for the good start the defense had and McDaniels gets the blame for the bad finish. Really?

Our team was gutted and we have no talent left. We got draft choices for a mediocre (at best) QB who havent had much of a chance to fulfill their career destinies and somehow we got "raped"? Interesting


But let's assume for a minute that every conspiracy theory is true and every assumption made by fans full of unwarranted hatred are correct. How did we go through such HELL in a year and lose so much talent and become such a worse team and end up with the same finished product that the Mastermind gave us over the last few years?He's a mediocre QB? I dont think so.

Nolan gets credit for the statistical turnaround of the defense. It is nothing short of amazing.

I credit luck to the fast start. I said it then, and I say it now, we were a paper tiger.

It wasnt the same product. There are no conspiracies, and its all out in the open. But you guys just dont accept to see it.

Our team is worse now than it was at the begining of the season. Let alone, last season.

broncofaninfla
01-29-2010, 11:28 AM
I actually do give Mcd some of blame for the defenses collapse. The offense going 3 and out contributed to the defense wearing down.

So far only McBath has panned out from the draft, the jusry is still out but early indications are we still need a RB, LB, CB, and TE as Moreno, Ayers, Smith and Quinn havent panned out to date.

Throw the records out, this team finished as the worst team in the AFC West in 2009. The 2008 team had a putrid defense and steller offense. The defense improved in 2009 but the offense is now putrid due to poor scheming, game planning and now lacks talent. There are a lot of holes to fill and the play calling has to improve or the decline will continue.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 11:51 AM
He's a mediocre QB? I dont think so.

Nolan gets credit for the statistical turnaround of the defense. It is nothing short of amazing.

I credit luck to the fast start. I said it then, and I say it now, we were a paper tiger.

It wasnt the same product. There are no conspiracies, and its all out in the open. But you guys just dont accept to see it.

Our team is worse now than it was at the begining of the season. Let alone, last season.

81 TD, 63 INT, 83.8 rating...yeah that speaks volumes of greatness.

By same product, I refer to the final record. Tell me again how it wasnt the same as what Shanny had been producing. Difference is, we were expected to win 11-12 games with Shanny in control and we went 8-8. We were expected to go 3-14 with McD in control and we went 8-8. Which one really got the better grade?

Anyone with a clue knew we werent ready for the playoffs and we still almost got there. How is that a disappointment?

claymore
01-29-2010, 11:56 AM
81 TD, 63 INT, 83.8 rating...yeah that speaks volumes of greatness.

By same product, I refer to the final record. Tell me again how it wasnt the same as what Shanny had been producing. Difference is, we were expected to win 11-12 games with Shanny in control and we went 8-8. We were expected to go 3-14 with McD in control and we went 8-8. Which one really got the better grade?

Anyone with a clue knew we werent ready for the playoffs and we still almost got there. How is that a disappointment?

I said we need to go 9-7 this year for it to be worth it. YOU scoffed at me.

I am hugely disapointed. I wish we could do a ctrl +alt +delete on this mess.

Compare Cutlers Numbers thru his first 4 years With some of the greats. He is better than alot of HOF'ers. So yeah, it speaks of greatness to me.

underrated29
01-29-2010, 11:58 AM
81 TD, 63 INT, 83.8 rating...yeah that speaks volumes of greatness.

By same product, I refer to the final record. Tell me again how it wasnt the same as what Shanny had been producing. Difference is, we were expected to win 11-12 games with Shanny in control and we went 8-8. We were expected to go 3-14 with McD in control and we went 8-8. Which one really got the better grade?

Anyone with a clue knew we werent ready for the playoffs and we still almost got there. How is that a disappointment?





I think what most of them are saying is that we already had the offense intact and defense was all that was needed. Had they kept the O, and let nolan do his thing with the D, we probably would have been in the playoffs.

I think thats what they are all pissed about. I do not blame them either. However, i do understand that the new coach wants to do things his way, which means a shake up, which means our good O will have bumps, and our horrible d, will have bumps although, as I thought our D was actually alright, it was just the schemes we had to work with.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 12:05 PM
I said we need to go 9-7 this year for it to be worth it. YOU scoffed at me.

I am hugely disapointed. I wish we could do a ctrl +alt +delete on this mess.

Compare Cutlers Numbers thru his first 4 years With some of the greats. He is better than alot of HOF'ers. So yeah, it speaks of greatness to me.

Understood, but IMO, I dont think you can compare the numbers of an HOFer to a youngster. Usually completely different offenses, skillsets, situation, etc. I believe what Cutler does over the next 4 years is more important. Not saying it wont happen, but unless he makes significant changes to his game...he'll be nowhere close to great.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 12:07 PM
I think what most of them are saying is that we already had the offense intact and defense was all that was needed. Had they kept the O, and let nolan do his thing with the D, we probably would have been in the playoffs.

I think thats what they are all pissed about. I do not blame them either. However, i do understand that the new coach wants to do things his way, which means a shake up, which means our good O will have bumps, and our horrible d, will have bumps although, as I thought our D was actually alright, it was just the schemes we had to work with.

That's the root of everything. Usually the people that think we'd be great had we kept the O are the ones that assume McDaniels had the complete intention of getting rid of Cutler and the O from the start.

yardog
01-29-2010, 12:17 PM
That's the root of everything. Usually the people that think we'd be great had we kept the O are the ones that assume McDaniels had the complete intention of getting rid of Cutler and the O from the start.

We have a winner! :cool:

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 12:37 PM
We have a winner! :cool:

Make sure that's the only part of my quote that get highlighted

yardog
01-29-2010, 12:41 PM
Make sure that's the only part of my quote that get highlighted

I was just agreeing with you thats how I feel. So I guess we agree on something.

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 12:41 PM
Cutler has proven nothing. I've yet to see how we lost out in that deal. When it happens, I'll concede, but until then...

how'd we lose out in th deal? really?..we give up a 25 yr old pro bowl qb..the basically carried the entire offense...while going through a staggering amount of rbs (7)...a constant shift in oline personel from 2006 -08, the loss of two great linemen,,nalen and lepsis..then in his final season here behind a group of two vets and three basicaly rookie linemen

and then still managed to have the offense at #2 overall...12th in scoreing..3rd in passing yards...and thats with a defense ranked 31st in turnovers..29th total and 30th in scoreing


FOR

kyle " im afraid to thow it deep" orton....and the chance to watch our offense crumble patheticaly with him under center

and robert " im just glad im made the team" ayers...

yeah we came out smelling like roses:rolleyes:

The first round pick still hasnt had a chance to pan out, but aside from that...how do people sit here and complain about losing a first round pick, then turn around and say that the draft is a crapshoot and cant be relied upon. Pick one, please.

the draft is a crap shoot....but you dont pass on orakpo for a RB we could have gotten later....you dont give up next years 14th overall pick...for a small cb projected to go in the 3rd round....and you dont package 2 3rds to move up and grab a te expected to go alot later then the last pick of the second round

I just find it interesting that the entire organization is expected to be perfect in 10 months. Marshall, Doom, Cutler...all of the anti-McD favorites were okay when they didnt excel in their rookie season, but Quinn and Smith are suppose to be Pro-Bowlers immediately. Makes sense

really??
cutler played his first games as a true rookie..he had a 59.1 com%..9 tds..200 ypg...and a 88.5qbr

marshall had 20 rec..309 yards...15.4 ypc..2tds...behind two probowl wrs in walker and smith...hows that not good

doom didnt even play a snap until week six..came in for pass rush duties and had 2 sacks...finished with 8.5 sacks ina part time role

now for alphonso smith...now with the confirmed value of the 14th pick in the first round...you would think the guy would have more then 14 tackles..3 pass def...he came here with the benefit of being a great punt return guy
eddie royal.............11.2 ypr
kenny Mckinnely......10.7 ypr
alphonso smith.........4.7 ypr

quinn....did he even suite up?...2 3rds for a guy that dont even suite up?..the 3rd rnd is the meat an potatoes round..where you get your solid role players and hopefull find a diamond in the ruff....we got a guy who cant even crack the lineup

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 12:49 PM
I've already announced my concession. It's been made clear to me that every OPINION you and TXBRONC and a few others have are God-spoken scripture. I'm well aware that there is NOTHING that can make any of you even consider a minimal possibility that different truths may exist and so I concede. No longer will I fight the good fight.

I'll just move on supporting my team while those with unbridled hatred continue to morph into miserable ******** that will find every reason and magnify every minimal statement into a reason to continue hating the team that they pronounce to love so much.

So maybe those of us that support the team no matter what and try to look for the positives will one day be rewarded and maybe we wont, but at least we'll have the ability to enjoy the good time. i feel sorry for the rest of you.

underrated29
01-29-2010, 12:57 PM
really??
cutler played his first games as a true rookie..he had a 59.1 com%..9 tds..200 ypg...and a 88.5qbr

marshall had 20 rec..309 yards...15.4 ypc..2tds...behind two probowl wrs in walker and smith...hows that not good

doom didnt even play a snap until week six..came in for pass rush duties and had 2 sacks...finished with 8.5 sacks ina part time role

now for alphonso smith...now with the confirmed value of the 14th pick in the first round...you would think the guy would have more then 14 tackles..3 pass def...he came here with the benefit of being a great punt return guy
eddie royal.............11.2 ypr
kenny Mckinnely......10.7 ypr
alphonso smith.........4.7 ypr

quinn....did he even suite up?...2 3rds for a guy that dont even suite up?..the 3rd rnd is the meat an potatoes round..where you get your solid role players and hopefull find a diamond in the ruff....we got a guy who cant even crack the lineup






ummm. You def take Knowshon over Orapko. And Knowshon would not have been available later. San Diego was chomping at the bit to take him. I think orak is slightly overrated- not saying he sucks or anything, but i think he is more a product of a great DL and defense then he is superior player. I also think Knowshon is vastly underrated by every bronco fan that thinks he is anything other than a great pick.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 12:59 PM
I'll never say Moreno had a great season by any means, but another year for everyone in the system and an improved OL can only mean good things. If he shows no improvement...then I'll question the pick.

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 01:08 PM
I've already announced my concession. It's been made clear to me that every OPINION you and TXBRONC and a few others have are God-spoken scripture. I'm well aware that there is NOTHING that can make any of you even consider a minimal possibility that different truths may exist and so I concede. No longer will I fight the good fight.

I'll just move on supporting my team while those with unbridled hatred continue to morph into miserable ******** that will find every reason and magnify every minimal statement into a reason to continue hating the team that they pronounce to love so much.

So maybe those of us that support the team no matter what and try to look for the positives will one day be rewarded and maybe we wont, but at least we'll have the ability to enjoy the good time. i feel sorry for the rest of you.


knew it was comeing...those that continue to support the bad coaching mistakes made ....will always throw out the ..."real fans support the team no matter what aurguement"...when confronted by facts they cannot spin

for the record ..because i dont agree with the happenings of this team....the direction...the willingness to bleed talent ....doesnt make me a miserable.........that hates the team...no in fact i love this team...have been a die hard and true fan for close to 40 years....and thats why it pisses me off so damm much to see us screw up so much over one rookie egotistical coach

is it a requirement that we have to be giddy little school girls happy over every little thing to be fans?

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 01:13 PM
ummm. You def take Knowshon over Orapko. And Knowshon would not have been available later. San Diego was chomping at the bit to take him. I think orak is slightly overrated- not saying he sucks or anything, but i think he is more a product of a great DL and defense then he is superior player. I also think Knowshon is vastly underrated by every bronco fan that thinks he is anything other than a great pick.


lets see our dline was the worst i have ever seen

our defense ranked 31st in sacks..31st turnovers..30th in scoreing.. and we fix it by passing on the player considered the best pure passer in the draft
to take a rb that may have been available at 18, when the rush offense was ranked 11th even with a slew of injured rb.....we could have drafted a donald brown at 18...or a shonne green with the smith pick..or the quinn pick!!!..or maybe used buck halter and hillis?

im not saying moreno wont someday be a star...but rushing offesne was by far the least of my concerns going into last years draft

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 01:23 PM
knew it was comeing...those that continue to support the bad coaching mistakes made ....will always throw out the ..."real fans support the team no matter what aurguement"...when confronted by facts they cannot spin

for the record ..because i dont agree with the happenings of this team....the direction...the willingness to bleed talent ....doesnt make me a miserable.........that hates the team...no in fact i love this team...have been a die hard and true fan for close to 40 years....and thats why it pisses me off so damm much to see us screw up so much over one rookie egotistical coach

is it a requirement that we have to be giddy little school girls happy over every little thing to be fans?

Being a giddy school girl and looking at positives are pretty different. In the same way that not agreeing with decisions and blasting every little thing are different.


But...I already conceded, so I really dont care either way

underrated29
01-29-2010, 01:25 PM
THE Thing with Orak is he is a 4-3 guy. There were/are major concerns about his ability to play 3-4 and drop back in coverage. Much like doom. As it seems doom made the transition well. Orak maybe could have done the same. however, we already have that player in Doom. And if I remember correctly Orak is not built size wise for DE in a 3-4.....So essentially we would have had overkill with doom and orak.

Now i wont argue about the DL, because its a MUST and HAs been that way for years now.

However, Knowshon is a talent that does not come across all to often. Ayers was drafted to be our 3-4 DE and OLB as well, mainly on the line, if I remember Joshs statements correctly. So we did address the need that you wanted, just with ayers instead of ORak. And ayers has a lot higher ceiling, he is just not polished yet.

As with any draft we have to wait a couple years to see the true effectiveness. however, I think in three years both our 1sts will be known as great players in the league.....Knowshon I am sure of, ayers- i will take the scouts and coaches word for that he is a coupleyear project.

Denver Native (Carol)
01-29-2010, 01:36 PM
knew it was comeing...those that continue to support the bad coaching mistakes made ....will always throw out the ..."real fans support the team no matter what aurguement"...when confronted by facts they cannot spin

The same real fans who support the team NOW are the SAME fans who have supported the Broncos in past years - and we all KNOW that in past years, there was as MANY BAD AS GOOD YEARS. I don't understand how someone can say they are a Bronco fan, but let everything slide in years past, and now, come down on everything with a negative attitude.
A real fan is a fan - FOR BETTER OR FOR WORSE, regardless who the coach is, regardless who the players are, etc., etc., etc.

T.K.O.
01-29-2010, 01:53 PM
im not saying moreno wont someday be a star...but rushing offesne was by far the least of my concerns going into last years draft

really ? we had a phone salesman starting by seasons end and havn'nt had a stud rb in years.and you thought we were "all set" at rb ?
you have been a fan for 40 years ,so you have watched hundreds of players come and go...yet you think the loss of one or 2 players is ruining the franchise ?
ive been a fan of the broncos since i moved to colorado when i was 14 (33 years ago) and i have seen good and bad times,but i dont recall another decade where i only got to see 1 playoff win.
so i felt that we needed to really shake things up,the team had gotten soft .
i would never say that everything the fo does is great and should not be questioned,but the status quo was mediocrity and i think mcD is letting the entire team know that anything less than 100% will not be tolerated.
and i applaud him for that.:salute:

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 01:56 PM
THE Thing with Orak is he is a 4-3 guy. There were/are major concerns about his ability to play 3-4 and drop back in coverage. Much like doom. As it seems doom made the transition well. Orak maybe could have done the same. however, we already have that player in Doom. And if I remember correctly Orak is not built size wise for DE in a 3-4.....So essentially we would have had overkill with doom and orak.

Now i wont argue about the DL, because its a MUST and HAs been that way for years now.

However, Knowshon is a talent that does not come across all to often. Ayers was drafted to be our 3-4 DE and OLB as well, mainly on the line, if I remember Joshs statements correctly. So we did address the need that you wanted, just with ayers instead of ORak. And ayers has a lot higher ceiling, he is just not polished yet.

As with any draft we have to wait a couple years to see the true effectiveness. however, I think in three years both our 1sts will be known as great players in the league.....Knowshon I am sure of, ayers- i will take the scouts and coaches word for that he is a coupleyear project.


orakpo..6'3 260...doom 5'11...250..james harrisen..6'0..248...claw matheews..6'3...250...shaun phillips 6'3 260...jason taylor..6'6.255

i think orakpo fits right in there with other 3-4 olbrs

like i said..had running back been a pressing issue...the moreno was an excellent choice...but rb wasnt a real dire need...you dont get better drafting players you dont need...you get better drafting players you need

T.K.O.
01-29-2010, 01:59 PM
when moreno gets used to the speed of the nfl and learns to stop thinking to much ( he hesitates at the los to often) he should be one of the most productive backs we've had in a long time.:salute:

BroncoAV06
01-29-2010, 02:06 PM
81 TD, 63 INT, 83.8 rating...yeah that speaks volumes of greatness.

By same product, I refer to the final record. Tell me again how it wasnt the same as what Shanny had been producing. Difference is, we were expected to win 11-12 games with Shanny in control and we went 8-8. We were expected to go 3-14 with McD in control and we went 8-8. Which one really got the better grade?

Anyone with a clue knew we werent ready for the playoffs and we still almost got there. How is that a disappointment?

Uhhh 2-8 to finsih the season. That's a disapointment. I like reading and listening to the "people" about the NFL but there picks mean jack. I have a clue. I expect an improvment in the NFL. Its not college, your paid to win now, get players to buy in, and bring an improvment which the off-season is for.

Denver had the offense, needed a defense. Nolan had it going early then they reverted back to last year, coaches on different pages and he split. Its not different then last year but it should have been.

Now we are in the same ole boat again, still trying to find d-line, now a WR to pair with Royal who was not able to be apart of the offense this year(just Denver's luck that their #1 offensive player had to clash with the HC), decide who will be throwing passes to said WR, and who will be blocking on the interior for said QB.

That's what so frustrating to me is the needs are the same if not more again this year.

underrated29
01-29-2010, 02:12 PM
orakpo..6'3 260...doom 5'11...250..james harrisen..6'0..248...claw matheews..6'3...250...shaun phillips 6'3 260...jason taylor..6'6.255

i think orakpo fits right in there with other 3-4 olbrs

like i said..had running back been a pressing issue...the moreno was an excellent choice...but rb wasnt a real dire need...you dont get better drafting players you dont need...you get better drafting players you need




But that is at OLB. Where as we already have doom at OLB, so he would need to be DL and i think thats not the size josh wants for his 3-4 DE.....And the fact that he has/had issues about dropping on coverage-which he does not do in WAS.

Not saying he cant do it, but those were the concerns. Not saying he isnt big enough for 3-4 DL, but thats what I remember hearing the FO say. THey want/need bigger DE than that.......Could be wrong. The only real way to tell is if ayers lives up to his potential/hype and we draft solid this year. Then the knowshon pick will be gravy.

claymore
01-29-2010, 02:16 PM
The same real fans who support the team NOW are the SAME fans who have supported the Broncos in past years - and we all KNOW that in past years, there was as MANY BAD AS GOOD YEARS. I don't understand how someone can say they are a Bronco fan, but let everything slide in years past, and now, come down on everything with a negative attitude.
A real fan is a fan - FOR BETTER OR FOR WORSE, regardless who the coach is, regardless who the players are, etc., etc., etc.

In those years there have been Broncos I didnt like. Darryl Gardner, Jake Plummer, Maurice Clarett, Travis Henry, Etc... There are guys i dont like now, McDaniels, ..... Um McDaniels,,,, Eh I cant think of anyone else.

I dont like those guys personally or professionaly. It doesnt mean I dont LOVE the Broncos.

T.K.O.
01-29-2010, 02:21 PM
as is the case with many peoples view of mcD....it takes more than a rookie season to decide wether or not a player was worth their draft spot.
hc is a very important position (maybe the most important to the team)as are many.
in the past it has been widely considered that the 3rd year is when you can expect to find out if a player will meet expectations.
some recent players such as adrian peterson,flacco and others have kind of given people short sightedness when it come to this.
but we have to remember these are exceptions to the rule,and rarely does a player display his full potential in the 1st or even 2nd season.

CoachChaz
01-29-2010, 02:57 PM
I guess I have an advantage when it comes to dealing with McDaniels.


I suffered though 5 years of Dennis Franchione at A&M. Nothing could be worse

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 03:49 PM
The same real fans who support the team NOW are the SAME fans who have supported the Broncos in past years - and we all KNOW that in past years, there was as MANY BAD AS GOOD YEARS. I don't understand how someone can say they are a Bronco fan, but let everything slide in years past, and now, come down on everything with a negative attitude.
A real fan is a fan - FOR BETTER OR FOR WORSE, regardless who the coach is, regardless who the players are, etc., etc., etc.


in the past we didnt have a mesage board ..we can thank al gore for inventing the internet so we have the opportunity

and follow what your saying..the same fans who followed the broncos thu thick and thin are still fans..they dont have to like every move..do they

i didnt like letting sharpe walk...i didnt agree with pryce moving on...i didnt like watching berry and heywood leave...i hated signing gardner...as well as kinneson...i didnt like watching atwater move on because we didnt wanna match

for the most part we had no where to bitch about it did we...nothings changed..we just have a place to vent

silkamilkamonico
01-29-2010, 03:51 PM
I guess I have an advantage when it comes to dealing with McDaniels.


I suffered though 5 years of Dennis Franchione at A&M. Nothing could be worse

I suffered through 10 years of Mike "the mastermind" Shanahan. That's worse than McDaniels right there.

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 03:53 PM
when moreno gets used to the speed of the nfl and learns to stop thinking to much ( he hesitates at the los to often) he should be one of the most productive backs we've had in a long time.:salute:


i thought it was blamed souly the oline just suddenly sucking :confused:

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 04:00 PM
I suffered through 10 years of Mike "the mastermind" Shanahan. That's worse than McDaniels right there.


would that include the first ten years when he built a b2b superbowl winning team? or after he lost players like, atwater, sharpe, zimmermon, elwaY, TD, schlereth, alfred williams, elam, Howard griffeth..ray crockett, neil smith, keith trayler, rod smith, ed mccaffery, nalen, lepsis

underrated29
01-29-2010, 04:03 PM
would that include the first ten years when he built a b2b superbowl winning team? or after he lost players like, atwater, sharpe, zimmermon, elwaY, TD, schlereth, alfred williams, elam, Howard griffeth..ray crockett, neil smith, keith trayler, rod smith, ed mccaffery, nalen, lepsis



Damn, after looking at that, I forgot just how good of a team we had. Look at that freaking lineup....Man those days were sexy.

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
01-29-2010, 04:10 PM
I loved shanahan as a coach, and I always found a way to ignore his porous GM skills.

arapaho2
01-29-2010, 04:13 PM
Damn, after looking at that, I forgot just how good of a team we had. Look at that freaking lineup....Man those days were sexy.


yeah people wanna bitch about shannys decline or lack of post season wins...but man look at all that talent and thats not includeing guys like mobely, trevor pryce, al wilson that was all lost in his last 8 years coaching...thats alot of talent to just snap your fingers and replace

Ziggy
01-29-2010, 06:32 PM
yeah people wanna bitch about shannys decline or lack of post season wins...but man look at all that talent and thats not includeing guys like mobely, trevor pryce, al wilson that was all lost in his last 8 years coaching...thats alot of talent to just snap your fingers and replace

It is a lot of talent to replace, but he had over a decade to do it. He didn't need to just snap his fingers. Some of the key players were already in place when Shanny got here. Guys like Elway, Atwater, Zimm, and others were here. Regardless, he was the best GM in the league his first 2 years here. After that, it went downhill fast. Shanny the coach was absolutely brilliant. Shanny the Gm, outside of the first 2 years was a complete failure. That sucks, because I'm a big Shanny fan, but it's true.

JDL
01-29-2010, 06:38 PM
If I was a Cardinals fan I would kick my GM's ass if he made that deal.

Actually, I live in Phoenix and most Cardinals fans would be ecstatic. With the emergence of their other WRs, they 1st) want New England's 2nd rd pick BUT if they cannot get that, they are pretty much ready after 3-4 years of this to part ways and the NUMBER 1 priority of every fan here is 2nd) Pass Rusher - Elvis is the best on the market and they want a proven commodity to solidify what is already a pretty stacked team. There might be a little bit of grumbling but only from the head in the cloud fans who think Boldin is worth a 1st (there are people here who think they could get a 2nd for Scheffler)... but everyone is already bracing for only getting a 3rd rd pick... that is a gut shot and they will look to a team who maybe doesn't value their 2nd rd pick highly and would trade it for Boldin (like Pats because they have 3), but remember how badly Green Bay struggled to find a suitor for Walker.. now imagine contract, injuries AND age... and that puts Boldin at best as a late 2nd so they could take a 3rd OR they could get a great player in return. Most fans remember signing Berry who was absolutely LOVED here and so there is a certain amount of goodwill towards poaching the Broncos again. Make no mistake, Boldin's value is really low right now.

rationalfan
01-29-2010, 07:08 PM
It is a lot of talent to replace, but he had over a decade to do it. He didn't need to just snap his fingers. Some of the key players were already in place when Shanny got here. Guys like Elway, Atwater, Zimm, and others were here. Regardless, he was the best GM in the league his first 2 years here. After that, it went downhill fast. Shanny the coach was absolutely brilliant. Shanny the Gm, outside of the first 2 years was a complete failure. That sucks, because I'm a big Shanny fan, but it's true.

it's easy to attract quality free agents when you're showing them a team with elway - and when you're "smart enough" to circumvent the salary cap rules.

EMB6903
01-29-2010, 07:09 PM
Damn, after looking at that, I forgot just how good of a team we had. Look at that freaking lineup....Man those days were sexy.

the crazy thing about that is 3/4th's of those players were FA pick ups.

sneakers
01-31-2010, 01:25 AM
I WANT WINNERS! I want people that want to win!

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/TCIH/singletary.jpg

I want players who take the money and don't care about anything else.

http://www.footballbabble.com/images/ryan-leaf.jpg

T.K.O.
01-31-2010, 02:41 PM
yeah people wanna bitch about shannys decline or lack of post season wins...but man look at all that talent and thats not includeing guys like mobely, trevor pryce, al wilson that was all lost in his last 8 years coaching...thats alot of talent to just snap your fingers and replace

and yet some people only gave mcD 1 season to build a championship team ?
and how did shanny piss off all those great players enough to make them leave ?
oh wait its proffessional sports and players jump from team to team all the time.....

JONtheBRONCO
01-31-2010, 05:13 PM
Marshall-for-Quinn in the works?

We're still in the preliminary -- mostly speculative -- stages of the Brandon Marshall sweepstakes. Here's what we know: he's all but done for in Denver, as we continue to read things like this from Mike Klis of the Denver Post: "Today most likely is goodbye to All Things Brandon Marshall."

OK, but where does he wind up? Any team could use a player as talented on the field as Marshall, but not every team wants to deal with the possibility of his off-the-field issues. We've speculated that the Pats and Cowboys would be two teams on the cusp of Super Bowl runs who might take a shot, and on Sunday, Klis added the Cleveland Browns to the mix. Even more intriguing, Klis thinks that the trade could kill two birds with one stone: Get rid of Marshall and get a QB back, as he thinks the Browns could be interested in swapping Brady Quinn.

Adam Schefter

Return package too much for Brandon

"Forget all the Rams-Bucs-Brandon Marshall trade talk. Barring the unforseen, it will not happen. The Broncos are going to put a high tender on Marshall -- probably a first- and third-round draft choice -- so any team that signs the Pro Bowl wide receiver will have to compensate Denver with the terms that the Broncos dictate. There's no chance the Rams are giving up the first pick in the draft for Brandon Marshall. There's no chance the Buccaneers are giving up the third pick in the draft for Marshall. Now if either of these teams can acquire another first-round pick later in the draft that it could trade to Denver, then maybe something could get done. But the chances of that happening are a long shot, at best. So when Marshall trade rumors continue to circulate -- and they should, Denver will look to trade him -- consider where the potential trade partner is drafting. If it's a high first-round pick, forget it; the trade is not happening."

Denver Native (Carol)
01-31-2010, 05:36 PM
This is not from ESPN, but it is another Marshall/Quinn rumor:

http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474978024029

A Pro Bowl Trade? Rumors of a Brandon Marshall for Brady Quinn Trade are Spreading

Denver Broncos Pro Bowl wide receiver Brandon Marshall and Cleveland Browns quarterback Brady Quinn are at the center of the Pro Bowl week trade rumors. It has been reported that the Denver Broncos and Cleveland Browns have been discussing a trade. The Browns have 2 quaterbacks (Quinn and Derek Anderson) and have a real need at receiver. The Broncos have Kyle Orten at QB, but could look to upgrade inthe near future. Also, Marshall and Broncos coach Josh McDaniels have had their disagreements and tensions are pretty high between the two of them. Although the deal is not finalized, expect this deal or some other deal involving Marshall to go down this off-season.

Denver Native (Carol)
01-31-2010, 05:41 PM
http://nflmocks.com/2010/01/31/could-the-broncos-trade-brandon-marshall-for-brady-quinn/

Rumors have been circulating that wide receiver Brandon Marshall will be playing his last game in a Denver Broncos helmet at this evening’s Pro Bowl. The team is expected to trade the disgruntled wide receiver this offseason.

One landing spot that has been speculated for Marshall is the Cleveland Browns. The rumor initially pointed to Browns playmaker Josh Cribbs and draft picks being involved in the deal but new reports link quarterback Brady Quinn to the discussion.

The trade would fill holes for both teams. Denver needs to rid themselves of Marshall, and picking up an explosive weapon like Cribbs would bring a new dynamic to their offense. Brady Quinn is also a solid back up and could possibly challenge Kyle Orton for the starting quarterback job.

Cleveland needs help, well, everywhere. Marshall is one of the most physically gifted wide outs in the sport and he would replace Braylon Edwards — who was traded to the New York Jets mid-season — as the team’s number one option.

Marshall for Quinn is purely speculation at this point.

Other teams that could be considered front-runners to acquire Marshall would include the Redskins, Seahawks, Ravens, Dolphins, and Cowboys.

Nomad
01-31-2010, 06:51 PM
:lol:Marshall for Quinn is the best joke I've heard in a while!!

broncohead
01-31-2010, 09:18 PM
We would get more then just Quinn out of a trade with the Browns.

claymore
01-31-2010, 09:19 PM
If the Marshall for Quinn trade happens, I will seriously start to believe I live in Hell, or... JMCD seriously hates me and is doing this shit on purpose.

atwater27
01-31-2010, 10:16 PM
Cool. Cleveland could replace that guy that dropped every other pass thrown to him with another guy who drops every other pass thrown to him.

arapaho2
01-31-2010, 11:54 PM
and yet some people only gave mcD 1 season to build a championship team ?
and how did shanny piss off all those great players enough to make them leave ?
oh wait its proffessional sports and players jump from team to team all the time.....


yeah shanny pissed off zimm. schreleth, a williams, elway, TD, mobely, lepsis, nalen, rod smith, eddmac, so bad they just all quit:confused:

arapaho2
02-01-2010, 12:00 AM
It is a lot of talent to replace, but he had over a decade to do it. He didn't need to just snap his fingers. Some of the key players were already in place when Shanny got here. Guys like Elway, Atwater, Zimm, and others were here. Regardless, he was the best GM in the league his first 2 years here. After that, it went downhill fast. Shanny the coach was absolutely brilliant. Shanny the Gm, outside of the first 2 years was a complete failure. That sucks, because I'm a big Shanny fan, but it's true.


i beleiev zimm came from the redskins brought by shanny..and i also dont believe shanny was in total control until after the b2b sb

shanny the power made some absalute horrible moves..gardner, kennisen..the drafts...but i also believe the drafts had more to do with sunquist then shanny....seems like imediatly after his departure we had some solid drafts...kuper, harris, clady, cutler, marshall, royal, hillis, d williams...dumervill....all after sunquist was canned

Lonestar
02-01-2010, 12:19 AM
yeah people wanna bitch about shannys decline or lack of post season wins...but man look at all that talent and thats not includeing guys like mobely, trevor pryce, al wilson that was all lost in his last 8 years coaching...thats alot of talent to just snap your fingers and replace


It was not like any of his day one choices made it big from 1999-2005 Excepting a couple of LB's

go back and look at how many day one choices resigned with DEN after their rookie contracts expired.

He was in charge of football operations which means he had the final say in who was drafted. the buck stopped at his desk, no one else to blame if the staff was screwing the pooch on draft day you fire them. you do not wait 3-6 years to do it.

And Please no lame assed remarks about Ted being in charge as GM. No one that is remotely logical, will buy that tired excuse.

arapaho2
02-01-2010, 12:27 AM
It was not like any of his day one choices made it big from 1999-2005 Excepting a couple of LB's

go back and look at how many day one choices resigned with DEN after their rookie contracts expired.

He was in charge of football operations which means he had the final say in who was drafted. the buck stopped at his desk, no one else to blame if the staff was screwing the pooch on draft day you fire them. you do not wait 3-6 years to do it.

And Please no lame assed remarks about Ted being in charge as GM. No one that is remotely logical, will buy that tired excuse.

not many pre 06 day one choces were wanted back to sign dude
but look at his drafts with sunquist...look again after...logic
i know you hate shanny for plummer....but there is very little that says suddenly in 06 shanny just drafted better..other then he canned sunquist

Lonestar
02-01-2010, 12:52 AM
not many pre 06 day one choces were wanted back to sign dude
but look at his drafts with sunquist...look again after...logic
i know you hate shanny for plummer....but there is very little that says suddenly in 06 shanny just drafted better..other then he canned sunquist


That is the whole point the stunk at drafting talent Hench my nickname for it DAFTING

Sundquist was the GM in name only. MIKE was in total charge of Football Operations and that meant Ted reported to HIM.

IF you do not have that one down then , you are not as smart as you think.

I do not hate mike never have just do not like his drafting or for that matter almost all of his personnel decisions.

HE made some good moves when he first came to town, but after all of them moved on he did almost nothing to replace that talent.

and on DAY one when you build your stars and in rounds 3-5 when you build the non stars but solid players he was lousy.

Not even discussing his lame asses FA Busts. to numerous to to even count.


ANd frankly I'm not all that sure after TED left in 2006 that he was all that great in finding LONG term talent for this team. That means someone worth resigning after their rookie contract expires.

We all know that 2007 was bust. 2008 I'll give you Clady but then it was very untypical for mike, Royale is a maybe should be more involved in the playbook after a dismal sophomore slump year.

Please do not use the jay, scheff or marshall as your poster kids for this, while they MAY turn into solid players. We all know that head cases are losers, may not today but certainly someone your not going to give 30 Mil to guaranteed.

Kuper may be worth keeping if the price is right, marshall perhaps IF he was not a head case but that has been discussed ad nausea.


but look at 1998-2005
05 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
2 56 Darrent Williams CB Oklahoma State
3 76 Karl Paymah DB Washington State
3 97 Domonique Foxworth CB Maryland
3 101 Maurice Clarett -- Ohio State

2004 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 17 D.J. Williams OLB Miami (Fla.)
2 41 Tatum Bell RB Oklahoma State
2 54 Darius Watts WR Marshall
3 85 Jeremy LeSueur CB Michigan


2003 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 20 George Foster T Georgia
2 51 Terry Pierce LB Kansas State

2002 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 19 Ashley Lelie WR Hawaii
2 51 Clinton Portis RB Miami (Fla.)
3 96 Dorsett Davis DT Mississippi State

2001 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 24 Willie Middlebrooks CB Minnesota
2 51 Paul Toviessi DE Marshall
3 87 Reggie Hayward DE Iowa State

2000 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 15 Deltha O'Neal CB California
2 40 Ian Gold LB Michigan
2 45 Kenoy Kennedy SAF Arkansas
3 70 Chris Cole WR Texas A&M

1999 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 31 Al Wilson MLB Tennessee
2 58 Montae Reagor DE Texas Tech
2 61 Lennie Friedman C Duke
3 67 Chris Watson CB Eastern Illinois
3 93 Travis McGriff WR Florida

1998 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 30 Marcus Nash WR Tennessee
2 61 Eric Brown SS Mississippi State
3 91 Brian Griese QB Michigan

Some real keepers here HUH?

Lonestar
02-01-2010, 01:04 AM
i beleiev zimm came from the redskins brought by shanny..and i also dont believe shanny was in total control until after the b2b sb

shanny the power made some absalute horrible moves..gardner, kennisen..the drafts...but i also believe the drafts had more to do with sunquist then shanny....seems like imediatly after his departure we had some solid drafts...kuper, harris, clady, cutler, marshall, royal, hillis, d williams...dumervill....all after sunquist was canned

MIght have been Stink out of WAS. IIRC ZIM came from MIN where he was a pro bowl players . But he was already here when mike was brought in.

arapaho2
02-01-2010, 01:15 AM
That is the whole point the stunk at drafting talent Hench my nickname for it DAFTING

Sundquist was the GM in name only. MIKE was in total charge of Football Operations and that meant Ted reported to HIM.

IF you do not have that one down then , you are not as smart as you think.

I do not hate mike never have just do not like his drafting or for that matter almost all of his personnel decisions.

HE made some good moves when he first came to town, but after all of them moved on he did almost nothing to replace that talent.

and on DAY one when you build your stars and in rounds 3-5 when you build the non stars but solid players he was lousy.

Not even discussing his lame asses FA Busts. to numerous to to even count.


ANd frankly I'm not all that sure after TED left in 2006 that he was all that great in finding LONG term talent for this team. That means someone worth resigning after their rookie contract expires.

We all know that 2007 was bust. 2008 I'll give you Clady but then it was very untypical for mike, Royale is a maybe should be more involved in the playbook after a dismal sophomore slump year.

Please do not use the jay, scheff or marshall as your poster kids for this, while they MAY turn into solid players. We all know that head cases are losers, may not today but certainly someone your not going to give 30 Mil to guaranteed.

Kuper may be worth keeping if the price is right, marshall perhaps IF he was not a head case but that has been discussed ad nausea.


but look at 1998-2005
05 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
2 56 Darrent Williams CB Oklahoma State
3 76 Karl Paymah DB Washington State
3 97 Domonique Foxworth CB Maryland
3 101 Maurice Clarett -- Ohio State

2004 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 17 D.J. Williams OLB Miami (Fla.)
2 41 Tatum Bell RB Oklahoma State
2 54 Darius Watts WR Marshall
3 85 Jeremy LeSueur CB Michigan


2003 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 20 George Foster T Georgia
2 51 Terry Pierce LB Kansas State

2002 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 19 Ashley Lelie WR Hawaii
2 51 Clinton Portis RB Miami (Fla.)
3 96 Dorsett Davis DT Mississippi State

2001 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 24 Willie Middlebrooks CB Minnesota
2 51 Paul Toviessi DE Marshall
3 87 Reggie Hayward DE Iowa State

2000 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 15 Deltha O'Neal CB California
2 40 Ian Gold LB Michigan
2 45 Kenoy Kennedy SAF Arkansas
3 70 Chris Cole WR Texas A&M

1999 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 31 Al Wilson MLB Tennessee
2 58 Montae Reagor DE Texas Tech
2 61 Lennie Friedman C Duke
3 67 Chris Watson CB Eastern Illinois
3 93 Travis McGriff WR Florida

1998 - Denver Broncos
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 30 Marcus Nash WR Tennessee
2 61 Eric Brown SS Mississippi State
3 91 Brian Griese QB Michigan

Some real keepers here HUH?

whatever your just backing my point

those drafts are all drafts with sunquist ....the 2006-08 drafts were without sunquist.....are you just saying shanny magicaly drafted better?
2007 brought our starting RT harris and Marcus Thomos our starting DT/DE so it wasnt a complete bust other then moss and crowder

and because you hate certain players dont make them trash, cutler will be better then plummer or orton could ever hope to be, marshall will be a star for years, hillis will go to another team soon and become a stud FB

and shanny had the same powers as josh has now...joshes draft was a complete failure...so does mcd get a pass?

gobroncsnv
02-01-2010, 07:54 AM
Cutler needs to have one good year before he starts being better than Plummer... Not even a sniff at the playoffs for his career so far.

claymore
02-01-2010, 07:56 AM
whatever your just backing my point

those drafts are all drafts with sunquist ....the 2006-08 drafts were without sunquist.....are you just saying shanny magicaly drafted better?
2007 brought our starting RT harris and Marcus Thomos our starting DT/DE so it wasnt a complete bust other then moss and crowder

and because you hate certain players dont make them trash, cutler will be better then plummer or orton could ever hope to be, marshall will be a star for years, hillis will go to another team soon and become a stud FB

and shanny had the same powers as josh has now...joshes draft was a complete failure...so does mcd get a pass?

There is a reason Sundquist was fired, and why drafts amazingly got better directly after.

Sundquist was good at trades, and bad at drafting.

claymore
02-01-2010, 08:13 AM
Cutler needs to have one good year before he starts being better than Plummer... Not even a sniff at the playoffs for his career so far.

Yeah Plummer was a real post season QB. :rolleyes:

topscribe
02-01-2010, 12:02 PM
Yeah Plummer was a real post season QB. :rolleyes:

Actually, he was. He didn't do well against Pittsburgh and their #1 passing
defense, true (although he still completed 60% of his passes, including two to
the Steelers). But that was in the conference championship game after
beating NE the previous week. So he did quarterback the Broncos that far.

And if you go back and search the archives, you will discover he did a pretty
good job against Indy. The difference in both of those years (2003 & 2004)
was Peyton Manning against Denver's weak defensive backfield.

It just goes back to the trite but true adage: defense wins championships.
You can have the greatest postseason QB in history, but if the defense can't
stop the other team, the odds of a successful postseason drop precipitously.

But the fact remains: The Broncos did get to the postseason with him at QB,
three years in a row. And the last time Denver was there was with him at QB.

-----

claymore
02-01-2010, 12:54 PM
Actually, he was. He didn't do well against Pittsburgh and their #1 passing
defense, true (although he still completed 60% of his passes, including two to
the Steelers). But that was in the conference championship game after
beating NE the previous week. So he did quarterback the Broncos that far.

And if you go back and search the archives, you will discover he did a pretty
good job against Indy. The difference in both of those years (2003 & 2004)
was Peyton Manning against Denver's weak defensive backfield.

It just goes back to the trite but true adage: defense wins championships.
You can have the greatest postseason QB in history, but if the defense can't
stop the other team, the odds of a successful postseason drop precipitously.

But the fact remains: The Broncos did get to the postseason with him at QB,
three years in a row. And the last time Denver was there was with him at QB.

-----

He won 2 playoff games in a 10 year career. I dont consider that good.

arapaho2
02-01-2010, 12:58 PM
MIght have been Stink out of WAS. IIRC ZIM came from MIN where he was a pro bowl players . But he was already here when mike was brought in.


thats right minnesota...i was thinking stink

arapaho2
02-01-2010, 01:23 PM
Actually, he was. He didn't do well against Pittsburgh and their #1 passing
defense, true (although he still completed 60% of his passes, including two to
the Steelers). But that was in the conference championship game after
beating NE the previous week. So he did quarterback the Broncos that far.

And if you go back and search the archives, you will discover he did a pretty
good job against Indy. The difference in both of those years (2003 & 2004)
was Peyton Manning against Denver's weak defensive backfield.

It just goes back to the trite but true adage: defense wins championships.
You can have the greatest postseason QB in history, but if the defense can't
stop the other team, the odds of a successful postseason drop precipitously.

But the fact remains: The Broncos did get to the postseason with him at QB,
three years in a row. And the last time Denver was there was with him at QB.

-----

bull, top..plummer sucked balls in the post...you wanna use the colts games as proof he played good....but those games are padded with alot of 3rd and 4th qrt stats against a soft defense because indy had a huge lead already...did he play well with the game on the line? no he sucked when it mattered

go ahead and call his attack on soft prevent d's playing well:laugh:

2003 the score was 31 -3 at half time..its not like plummer lit it up
2004 the score was 35 -3 at half..again it wasnt like jake was ripping it up

2005 against the pats i believe the fumble recovery and subsequent PI call that gave us the ball on the 1 ydl and then the bailey int which also gave us the ball on the 1yl..and the anderson two rushing tds from that were more of the reason then plummers 15 completions

as for him getting us there
plummer had some very good defenses and a great run game taking the pressure off him

i wouldnt call plummer a great qb...but still i would rather have him then orton

JONtheBRONCO
02-01-2010, 01:44 PM
Will Elvis be cruel to Denver?

Elvis Dumervil | Broncos | Interested: Cardinals?, Packers?, Patriots?, 49ers?, Dolphins?

Denver Broncos LB Elvis Dumervil was a revelation in 2009, laying waste to opposing QBs like his financial future depended on it. Mainly because it kinda did: he's expected to hit restricted free agency this offseason, and would be an unrestricted free agent if there is a new CBA in place by March 5.

Being an RFA brings a limit to what can happen to Elvis this offseason, but it's possible the Broncos will look to sell high and trade him to the highest bidder. One team that could be particularly interested is the Miami Dolphins, the team that hired Denver's 2009 defensive coordinator Mike Nolan this past week. As NFL Insider Adam Schefter tweeted on Sunday morning, "look for [Dumervil] to be on Miami's radar."

Other 3-4 teams possibly in need of a pass-rushing dynamo like Dumervil include the Patriots, Packers (if Aaron Kampman is let go), 49ers (if they don't believe in Ahmad Brooks) and Cardinals. Speaking with ESPN.com's AFC East blogger Tim Graham, Dumervil allowed that it's "a possibility" he could end up with the Dolphins, and when asked if other Pro Bowlers were lobbying him to join their team, he said, "That would be tampering. I can't snitch on nobody." In other words, yes.

JONtheBRONCO
02-10-2010, 06:11 PM
Broncos could target Franklin
3:21
PM ET
Aubrayo Franklin | 49ers | Interested: Broncos? Top Email

It can be tough for casual football viewers to see the impact that a good DT can have on a game, and unless they're picking up lots of sacks, it's hard to pick them apart using the stats sheet.

But teammates tend to know what's going on, and San Francisco 49ers linebacker Patrick Willis is adamant that Aubrayo Franklin is "the best nose in the game," according to what he told the San Francisco Chronicle back in January. Willis states that he could not put up the gaudy tackle numbers he does without Franklin on the line, and he's hopeful the team can re-sign him.

In November, Matt Maiocco of the Santa Rosa Press Democrat foresaw the problem of retaining the UFA, and wrote that the team "will take whatever steps necessary to keep him around in 2010." The first option is a contract extension, but barring that, they could use the franchise tag. In 2010, a tag for a DT will run a team $7.003 million. That's a nice increase from the two mil Franklin's being paid this season.

Here's Bill Barnwell of Football Outsiders on one team that could take a look if Franklin is somehow not retained:



Football Outsiders

Upgrade at NT necessary in Denver
"If you're in the camp that chalks up the second-half decline to a worn-down defensive line, the Broncos would be wise to add more big bodies up front that fit their 3-4 scheme. One spot in particular would be at nose tackle, where Ronald Fields is a situational player stretched as a starter. If the Broncos target one player in free agency, it should be 49ers nose tackle Aubrayo Franklin, who would be the perfect fit for their needs and scheme." - Bill Barnwell