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BRONCOSFREAK765
02-29-2008, 09:38 AM
Probably Our Most Consistent Player For The Past Couple Years. Once Again This Doesnt Suprise Me

MHCBill
02-29-2008, 09:43 AM
Can somebody put a freeze on this clown starting a new thread every two minutes?

claymore
02-29-2008, 09:45 AM
Probably Our Most Consistent Player For The Past Couple Years. Once Again This Doesnt Suprise Me
There was a rumor that the Broncos want a certain kicker in the draft. I dont remember which one....... But I agree the Elam thing is pretty harsh. I hope they at least tell him thanks ect........

DallasChief
02-29-2008, 09:46 AM
Can somebody put a freeze on this clown starting a new thread every two minutes?

He's started two threads in a month.

BRONCOSFREAK765
02-29-2008, 09:47 AM
as unhappy as u sound, one would think you are a raiders fan. lol. and this i s the first thread i posted since zach thomas and you said he was washed up, kinda funny the patriots were quick to make him an offer....come to think about it so was dallas. go watch more espn, quit talkin out ur you know what.

HolyDiver
02-29-2008, 09:47 AM
He's started two threads in a month.

I think it's a carry-over from the Freak...............these two are NOT best friends.

Rex
02-29-2008, 09:47 AM
They are planning signing Justin Medlock.

DallasChief
02-29-2008, 09:48 AM
They are planning signing Justin Medlock.

Too late, he signed with the Rams earlier this month.

MHCBill
02-29-2008, 09:49 AM
That's true... since two teams offered a player a contract shortly after he had been released there's no possible way they made a mistake.

That NEVER happens.

Zak Thomas is finished and I'm very happy he got a deal elsewhere so we didn't make a mistake signing him.

BRONCOSFREAK765
02-29-2008, 09:55 AM
I think it's a carry-over from the Freak...............these two are NOT best friends.

no its not that. we are just very passionate about our broncos, and have different opinions sometimes...................ah who am i kidding, all the time.lol. and place bets now, when we win our next superbowl we will probably disagree about who should hold the trophy first and what jersey they should wear and so on.

mclark
02-29-2008, 11:22 AM
Too late, he signed with the Rams earlier this month.

Is that true? He was unsigned all year. Justin Medlock would have been a nice signing for us.

MOtorboat
02-29-2008, 11:24 AM
Is that true? He was unsigned all year. Justin Medlock would have been a nice signing for us.

:confused:

He couldn't hit the broad side of a barn from 10 feet away.

mclark
02-29-2008, 11:26 AM
:confused:

He couldn't hit the broad side of a barn from 10 feet away.

He didn't have a good preseason with KC. But he had a great college career. I'd sign him and work with him. He had a new holder in KC. Something was wrong there.

shank
02-29-2008, 11:27 AM
Is that true? He was unsigned all year. Justin Medlock would have been a nice signing for us.

i agree. i was a fan of medlock's...

i hate how we are handling stuff like this lately. it seems as if elam doesn't even know if the team wants him, and they are probably low-balling the hell out of him.

i love rod smith and the loyalty that the team shows him, but how in the hell hasn't elam earned this same loyalty? he embodies the denver broncos...

NightTrainLayne
02-29-2008, 11:33 AM
i agree. i was a fan of medlock's...

i hate how we are handling stuff like this lately. it seems as if elam doesn't even know if the team wants him, and they are probably low-balling the hell out of him.

i love rod smith and the loyalty that the team shows him, but how in the hell hasn't elam earned this same loyalty? he embodies the denver broncos...

No-one knows how much Elam was asking for. I'd love to have him back, but he's past the point where he can just name his own price. With Shanny's relationship with Elam factoring in, I have to assume that Elam wanted more than we were willing to pay. There's two sides to the transaction.

MHCBill
02-29-2008, 11:37 AM
ummmmm... wouldn't it be nice to have a kicker that not only kicks field goals, but can also boot the ball out of the end zone in Denver?

Two roster spots for one position has finally caught up to the great Jason Elam.

Don't get me wrong... Elam is a Denver Broncos God, but it's time to change the guard.

Draft a new young stud from college and let him kickoff and make field goals over 50 yards.

I'll miss Jason, but it's time to gain back a roster slot.

shank
02-29-2008, 11:39 AM
No-one knows how much Elam was asking for. I'd love to have him back, but he's past the point where he can just name his own price. With Shanny's relationship with Elam factoring in, I have to assume that Elam wanted more than we were willing to pay. There's two sides to the transaction.

elam has been vocal about wanting to retire a bronco. he loves it here. i don't see him as the type to demand a big contract, especially when he's humble enough to know that he doesn't have the leg that he used to.

what makes me mad is that he and his agent imply that they don't know what the team wants because they've had limited contact.

with a person who has been as important to your organization as jason elam, you don't leave them hanging like that. if you want to go another direction then you sit down with him and tell him.

his agent said that he's giving the broncos 2 weeks to sign him! i don't think money is what elam is after...

shank
02-29-2008, 11:41 AM
I'll miss Jason, but it's time to gain back a roster slot.

so that we can carry an extra "fullback?"

maybe another "punt/kick returner?"

or do you want the room for another "tight end"


a roster spot on the denver broncos isn't as precious as it should be...

MHCBill
02-29-2008, 11:42 AM
agents always tell the truth...

CoachChaz
02-29-2008, 11:43 AM
Is it really distressing to lose a middle of the pack kicker? Yes, he's a Denver legend, but his skills are fading.

MHCBill
02-29-2008, 11:43 AM
so that we can carry an extra "fullback?"

maybe another "punt/kick returner?"

or do you want the room for another "tight end"


a roster spot on the denver broncos isn't as precious as it should be...an extra spot for someone that can help the team...

How many teams keep three kickers?

That's a pretty lame argument imo.

shank
02-29-2008, 11:55 AM
help the team like mike bell, chad mustard, brian clark, and nate jackson did this season?

yeah, we need another guy like them so that we can get rid of elam.


until the team says something about the situation all i have to go on is what elam, his agent, and reports that say the broncos have been very minimal in their contact to go on. what he's done for the organization makes him deserving of better, whether he's going to be on the team next year or not.

i'm not even saying 'we better resign him, or it's betrayal' i'm just saying that he's been too good to the broncos to have them yank him around.

Astrass
02-29-2008, 01:26 PM
Who knows what's really going on. Maybe he's thinking about retiring or something. Maybe Denver doesn't want to risk a multi year deal on him because of his age and his skills fading.

Or

Maybe Shanny wants a PK who can run and pass when needed! haha


Or

Maybe we're bringing Saurbrun back and he's going to PK / Punt / Run point on the wedge.

Brand
02-29-2008, 02:26 PM
All of these changes are symptomatic of major efforts to upgrade to a younger, less expensive, team. May also represent a change in philosophy in approaching the games. I am actually excited to see an evolution of the Broncos to something else. We shall see......

dogfish
02-29-2008, 03:40 PM
All of these changes are symptomatic of major efforts to upgrade to a younger, less expensive, team. May also represent a change in philosophy in approaching the games. I am actually excited to see an evolution of the Broncos to something else. We shall see......

which explains re-signing engelberger and nate jackson, and wanting zach thomas. . . .


trust me, i WISH i could agree with what you posted here, because it's absolutely the smart way to go. . . but i have a hard time believing that that's actually what's happening. . . . i think you're giving shenanigans too much credit for actually having a plan in place. . . .

aberdien
02-29-2008, 05:16 PM
Kind of a pointless release, but whatever.

Stargazer
02-29-2008, 05:27 PM
Use one of the 5th or 7th rounders on a kicker. The new kicker will come cheap. And eliminate the need to carry 3 kickers.

MOtorboat
02-29-2008, 05:36 PM
Use one of the 5th or 7th rounders on a kicker. The new kicker will come cheap. And eliminate the need to carry 3 kickers.

Don't need to draft a kicker...that's just wasting a pick. I know, I know, Elam worked out, but it's not a resoundingly good idea to pick a kicker, when you can probably get one as an undrafted free agent.

SmilinAssasSin27
02-29-2008, 05:43 PM
elam isn't the future. If we are truly rebuilding, let's blow the whole thing up. That includes Kickers.

Slick
02-29-2008, 07:16 PM
ummmmm... wouldn't it be nice to have a kicker that not only kicks field goals, but can also boot the ball out of the end zone in Denver?

Two roster spots for one position has finally caught up to the great Jason Elam.

Don't get me wrong... Elam is a Denver Broncos God, but it's time to change the guard.

Draft a new young stud from college and let him kickoff and make field goals over 50 yards.

I'll miss Jason, but it's time to gain back a roster slot.
I wholeheartedly agree.

I'll miss him too, but I miss a lot of former Broncos.

How long has it been since we've had at least mediocre special teams play?

A kicker who can force touchbacks would be a weapon compared to our coverage teams.

Hoshdude7
02-29-2008, 08:37 PM
If we treat him like this, I don't think I will ever have respect for Shanny again.

champbronc2
02-29-2008, 08:46 PM
Probably Our Most Consistent Player For The Past Couple Years. Once Again This Doesnt Suprise Me

I wonder too.:tsk:

I loved Elam.

Superchop 7
02-29-2008, 08:52 PM
Jason is asking for the moon.

He needs to come to his senses.

Furthermore, if he goes to another team....his mind won't be right, he won't be around long.

Stargazer
02-29-2008, 08:54 PM
If we treat him like this, I don't think I will ever have respect for Shanny again.

He's a 38 year old kicker who occupies 2 roster spots. His contract is up and Denver did not re-sign him.

Hoshdude7
02-29-2008, 08:58 PM
He's a 38 year old kicker who occupies 2 roster spots. His contract is up and Denver did not re-sign him.

It's just that I wanted to see him retire as a Bronco.
Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go cry.

Stargazer
02-29-2008, 09:01 PM
It's just that I wanted to see him retire as a Bronco.


There is still a chance he will be back. And if Denver doesn't bring him back, he might just retire.

#1bmarshfan
03-01-2008, 02:21 AM
sad he won 3 of are 7 games for us probably are mvp besides bmarsh

Simple Jaded
03-01-2008, 02:27 AM
This teams talent level is a joke! I'm not losing any sleep over a kicker that can't run the the sideline without pulling a hammy.

The fact is, Elam is slipping, it's better to get out too early than too late.

He's just a kicker......

Superchop 7
03-01-2008, 02:38 AM
Elam is male spelled backwards.

Can you make it ??? (Shanny asks)

Think so. (Elam says)

You have 4 seconds (Shanny says)

We have all day, I do this in my sleep... (Elam)

Denver Native (Carol)
03-18-2008, 08:03 PM
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/mar/18/bowlen-could-intervene-help-keep-elam/


Owner may intervene in Elam talks


It's rare that Broncos owner Pat Bowlen gets personally involved in negotiations. That's why he hires personnel people.

But, in rare cases, he does step forward.

Safety John Lynch, a team captain, was one notable example last month. Bowlen personally intervened and helped talk Lynch out of leaving despite having to take a paycut.

So with free-agent kicker Jason Elam scheduled to visit the Atlanta Falcons today and Thursday, the owner was asked whether he might get involved again, particularly if the scenario appeared likely he'd be losing a player who has been splitting uprights with regularity for the franchise for the past 15 years.

"I've watched it. I haven't said anything to anybody," Bowlen said about the state of negotiations and Elam's pending trip "... I'm sure our football people are watching that closely. But I can't really give you a really good answer to that question."

However, the owner did admit the Lynch case is an apt comparison: "I think there are some parallel scenarios there."

It might take some outside involvement to maintain the status quo since the direction of Elam's negotiations appears to be heading more toward an exit than a return.

Negotiations are at a standstill with Denver. The Falcons are serious about upgrading their kicking game, having lacked stability there. And the Falcons wouldn't be courting the kicker if they felt they were being used as pawn in contract talks.

Elam made $2.2 million in base salary in the final year of his deal in 2007, when he converted 27 of 31 field-goal attempts, including four game-winners.

There's a growing feeling that, while loyalty should be a consideration, there's a business element that's just as important and might ultimately win out.

JETS DB INTRIGUES: The Broncos are mainly focusing on the draft but remain intrigued by the potential acquisition of New York Jets defensive tackle Dewayne Robertson, though no deal appears imminent.

The situation is complicated by Robertson's knee issues, which necessitated a recent visit to Denver for a full check-up, and by trade compensation levels and financial outlay. Robinson is due a $3 million roster bonus in June and has two years worth $18.8 million left on his contract.

BOSSHOGG30
03-18-2008, 08:06 PM
Hey Pat, let Elam walk. We might need 50+ yard field goals you know.

BroncoJoe
03-18-2008, 08:07 PM
I don't want to see Elam kicking for another team, but his salary demands are a bit high considering all he does is kick field goals (he doesn't kickoff anymore), and his range has greatly diminished.

I want him back, but not at a steep price. Good luck, Pat.

Lonestar
03-18-2008, 08:18 PM
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/mar/18/bowlen-could-intervene-help-keep-elam/


JETS DB INTRIGUES: The Broncos are mainly focusing on the draft but remain intrigued by the potential acquisition of New York Jets defensive tackle Dewayne Robertson, though no deal appears imminent.

The situation is complicated by Robertson's knee issues, which necessitated a recent visit to Denver for a full check-up, and by trade compensation levels and financial outlay. Robinson is due a $3 million roster bonus in June and has two years worth $18.8 million left on his contract.

Am I missing something here?

nevcraw
03-18-2008, 08:21 PM
If they paid him the same as last year i would be fine w/ that. The guy is still clutch, his leg may not be as strong but with the game on the line he still will come through.. Cannot be said for the majority of the kickers out there.

They should still draft one to be the heir apparent and the KO specialist.. or - for a couple of mil less we can all worry every time the new guy lines up. no thanks...

The broncos willl need all ther help they can get to get back to winning, a kicker should not be the reason if they lose.

UnderArmour
03-18-2008, 08:22 PM
Hey Pat, let Elam walk. We might need 50+ yard field goals you know.

Careful. Clutch kickers are not something that can be taken for granted. Just ask San Diego about Kaeding. Elam just doesn't miss many game-winners/go ahead field goals. I definitely want him back.

MOtorboat
03-18-2008, 08:25 PM
Careful. Clutch kickers are not something that can be taken for granted. Just ask San Diego about Kaeding. Elam just doesn't miss many game-winners/go ahead field goals. I definitely want him back.

No arguing that Elam is clutch, but he no longer has the range to be clutch enough to nail the 55-yarder to win a game. That forces Cutler to have to push the offense deeper into enemy territory before the kick is attempted...unfortunately, that's not a good thing.

BANJOPICKER1
03-18-2008, 08:47 PM
No arguing that Elam is clutch, but he no longer has the range to be clutch enough to nail the 55-yarder to win a game. That forces Cutler to have to push the offense deeper into enemy territory before the kick is attempted...unfortunately, that's not a good thing.
Why not?If this is your point,Cutler can get it closer if Elam says he needs another 2 yards..Elam = Superbowl days...:D

MOtorboat
03-18-2008, 08:50 PM
Why not?If this is your point,Cutler can get it closer if Elam says he needs another 2 yards..Elam = Superbowl days...:D

What you're forgetting is that Elam could bail Elway out because he could hit the clutch kick from 55 instead of having to get a 45 yard field goal. (Oh, I know, Elway was God and GOAT and never had to be bailed out :rolleyes:)

I know people want Elam back because of what he means to the franchise and his link to the Super Bowl years...but people forget how good he really was. He is no longer that. Sad to see, because I love Elam, but it's true. We missed the boat last year with Mason Crosby. We can't miss the boat again. I would even advocate drafting Alexis Serna with one of our fourth or fifth round picks...

broncosfanscott
03-18-2008, 08:59 PM
Elam is a clutch kicker and it would suck to see him kicking for some other team. I hope we are able to keep him as well as pick up one in the draft that can be mentored by Elam for whenenver he is done.

MOtorboat
03-18-2008, 09:04 PM
Elam is a clutch kicker and it would suck to see him kicking for some other team. I hope we are able to keep him as well as pick up one in the draft that can be mentored by Elam for whenenver he is done.

Again...we missed the boat last year...instead we traded picks to get a druggie.

Lonestar
03-18-2008, 09:05 PM
If they paid him the same as last year i would be fine w/ that. The guy is still clutch, his leg may not be as strong but with the game on the line he still will come through.. Cannot be said for the majority of the kickers out there.

They should still draft one to be the heir apparent and the KO specialist.. or - for a couple of mil less we can all worry every time the new guy lines up. no thanks...

The broncos willl need all ther help they can get to get back to winning, a kicker should not be the reason if they lose.

But it also should not be the only reason they win either 4 of those games last year would have been losses without Elam, masking just how bad this team really was last year..

Yes I know it is good to have a Great FG guy but paying him 2.5 per year to haul mikeys asses out of the fire every week is spraying cologne on a rotting corpse..

Fix the real issues and all you have to do for the kicker is have them kick PATs, not 40 yard FGs cause you suck in the red zone..

Lonestar
03-18-2008, 09:09 PM
No arguing that Elam is clutch, but he no longer has the range to be clutch enough to nail the 55-yarder to win a game. That forces Cutler to have to push the offense deeper into enemy territory before the kick is attempted...unfortunately, that's not a good thing.


WHY?

Are you admitting defeat up front that our Offense sucks so bad we had to settle for 55 yarders?

It is time to fix the real problem on this team and that IMO is not having toe rely on a 55 yard FG to win or tie a a game in desperation time..

If mikey does not have the horses to get it done, get him some more horses.. If it is mikey get a new HC..

MOtorboat
03-18-2008, 09:32 PM
WHY?

Are you admitting defeat up front that our Offense sucks so bad we had to settle for 55 yarders?

It is time to fix the real problem on this team and that IMO is not having toe rely on a 55 yard FG to win or tie a a game in desperation time..

If mikey does not have the horses to get it done, get him some more horses.. If it is mikey get a new HC..

Every team in the league needs an Elam...an Elam from 10 years ago. I am not admitting defeat. I am facing reality, which apparently is lacking from most Broncos fans. Elam CANNOT connect on the long kick anymore. Go ahead, drink the Kool-Aid...think Elway could do no wrong. There's a reason he had to hit a 63-yarder...DAMMIT people, Elam is done. We need a kicker. There are going to be times Cutler can't get those 10 yards and we have to kick the 55-yarder. Elam can't hit any more. WAKE UP!

Like I said, I love Elam. He's a Broncos great, but it's time for him to go, and for us to move on. Realize that.

MOtorboat
03-18-2008, 09:34 PM
WHY?

Are you admitting defeat up front that our Offense sucks so bad we had to settle for 55 yarders?

It is time to fix the real problem on this team and that IMO is not having toe rely on a 55 yard FG to win or tie a a game in desperation time..

If mikey does not have the horses to get it done, get him some more horses.. If it is mikey get a new HC..

BTW, Elam's age is not Shanahan's fault. I know you don't know who zam is, but you're starting to sound like him. Weak argument.

Players make plays. Elam can no longer make that play. Time to move on.

NameUsedBefore
03-18-2008, 10:02 PM
50+ yard field goals are pretty rare. You guys are putting way too much value on them. Accuracy and being clutch > power, IMO.

Krugan
03-18-2008, 10:03 PM
Every team in the league needs an Elam...an Elam from 10 years ago. I am not admitting defeat. I am facing reality, which apparently is lacking from most Broncos fans. Elam CANNOT connect on the long kick anymore. Go ahead, drink the Kool-Aid...think Elway could do no wrong. There's a reason he had to hit a 63-yarder...DAMMIT people, Elam is done. We need a kicker. There are going to be times Cutler can't get those 10 yards and we have to kick the 55-yarder. Elam can't hit any more. WAKE UP!

Like I said, I love Elam. He's a Broncos great, but it's time for him to go, and for us to move on. Realize that.

Elam didnt have to kick a 63 yarder. It was the end of the first half and it just happened to be thats where we ended up. Shanny asked him if he could make it from there, with teh wind at his back, and he said he thought he coudl.

It was by no means a "have to" kick.

BTW im not arguing his leg strength, but you missed the pipes with the have to comment.

Lonestar
03-18-2008, 10:03 PM
Every team in the league needs an Elam...an Elam from 10 years ago. I am not admitting defeat. I am facing reality, which apparently is lacking from most Broncos fans. Elam CANNOT connect on the long kick anymore. Go ahead, drink the Kool-Aid...think Elway could do no wrong. There's a reason he had to hit a 63-yarder...DAMMIT people, Elam is done. We need a kicker. There are going to be times Cutler can't get those 10 yards and we have to kick the 55-yarder. Elam can't hit any more. WAKE UP!

Like I said, I love Elam. He's a Broncos great, but it's time for him to go, and for us to move on. Realize that.


I'm sorry that my post did not come across correctly I agree completely Elam was a great and while it is nice to kick an OCCASIONAL Long FG have to win more than 50% of your games that way tells most folks something it wrong with either the talent, the players intensity or the game planing..

If you HAVE TO WIN 4 of you 7 games on last second heroic FG's we should face the fact that this team should probably be drafting in the top 5 instead of at 12..

Elam exit stage left.. retire as a Bronco..

MOtorboat
03-18-2008, 10:05 PM
I'm sorry that my post did not come across correctly I agree completely Elam was a great and while it is nice to kick an OCCASIONAL Long FG have to win more than 50% of your games that way tells most folks something it wrong with either the talent, the players intensity or the game planing..

If you HAVE TO WIN 4 of you 7 games on last second heroic FG's we should face the fact that this team should probably be drafting in the top 5 instead of at 12..

Elam exit stage left.. retire as a Bronco..

We have a lot of late-round picks. May need to spend it on a kicker.

Lonestar
03-18-2008, 10:15 PM
We have a lot of late-round picks. May need to spend it on a kicker.

Yep actually TWO punter and FG/KO or one that can do it all..

I would not be opposed to spending 4th on a quality kicker..

dogfish
03-18-2008, 10:30 PM
No arguing that Elam is clutch, but he no longer has the range to be clutch enough to nail the 55-yarder to win a game.


you act as though it's some easy thing to go out and find a guy who IS clutch from 50+, while in reality they're not exactly just standing around waiting to be signed. . . only 7 kickers hit over 50% of their kicks from 50+ last year, let alone 55. . .

tubby
03-18-2008, 10:50 PM
Elam stays. No one is better inside 40 yards. Have the kickoff guy drop the bombs.

Npba900
03-18-2008, 10:54 PM
Ummmmm.......Elam had 4 clutch wins for the Broncos last year. Those clutch wins gave the Fans so much hope and redemption. Now suddenly, some of the same fans want to kick Elam to the curb! Imagine all the furor had Elam missed those 4 kicks last season......we the fans would have endured a 5-11 season!

Yeah I know at 5-11 we would be drafting alot higher, and Denver would have probably cut Elam for missing 4 last second FG's/Extra points.

I say pay Elam! Hell, I'll absolutely go beserk if we let Elam go and a divison rival picks him up, and Elam beats us twice next season.

Lonestar
03-18-2008, 10:57 PM
Ummmmm.......Elam had 4 clutch wins for the Broncos last year. Those clutch wins gave the Fans so much hope and redemption. Now suddenly, some of the same fans want to kick Elam to the curb! Imagine all the furor had Elam missed those 4 kicks last season......we the fans would have endured a 5-11 season!

Yeah I know at 5-11 we would be drafting alot higher, and Denver would have probably cut Elam for missing 4 last second FG's/Extra points.

I say pay Elam! Hell, I'll absolutely go beserk if we let Elam go and a divison rival picks him up, and Elam beats us twice next season.


Lets see if I do the math it means a 3-13 season 4-7 equals 3 at least when I was in school..


that IMO is where this team really was.. We sucked in the RED zone and if you can't socore down there why bother..

Superchop 7
03-19-2008, 07:04 AM
Hopefully we can replace him with someone that loses games and takes time out of his busy life to embarrass the organization.

Hobe
03-19-2008, 08:35 AM
Careful. Clutch kickers are not something that can be taken for granted. Just ask San Diego about Kaeding. Elam just doesn't miss many game-winners/go ahead field goals. I definitely want him back.

Not many kicker made the game winners in the first two games last year. I still think he is a keeper.

Rex
03-19-2008, 08:38 AM
Ask KC how much they would like to have a kicker like Elam.

Mike
03-19-2008, 09:05 AM
I am interested in knowing how much money Elam wants and where that places him in regards to what other kickers are making.

I love Elam, but I don't see how you can justify a big contract to a guy who is in the twilight of his career.

LRtagger
03-19-2008, 09:15 AM
Its not a matter of whether we want to keep him or not...obviously we want him on the team. The conflict is in the fact that he doesnt kick off, and he cant get the ball to the goalposts on anything greater than 50 yards, but he still wants his $2-3mil a year.

This means that we not only have to pay Elam his monstrous salary, but we also have to keep another kicker on the roster just for kickoffs and the ocassional 50+ yard field goal (maybe 5 in a season?).

If we can find a punter who can place kick (kickoff), then we might be OK...but Elam is just not worth what he wants to get paid. We shouldnt have to settle for a punter just because he can kickoff (we saw what happened last year). Our offense and defense should be much better this year, and I just dont forsee us needing 4 game-winners again. Elam can't expect to make $2-3mil a year just to kick 20-25 field goals.

BOSSHOGG30
03-19-2008, 09:19 AM
50+ yard field goals are pretty rare. You guys are putting way too much value on them. Accuracy and being clutch > power, IMO.

nope but just about any NFL caliber kicker better be accurate from 40 yards in. You want to give Elam credit for his accuracy then stop looking at his field goal percentage compared to other kickers who actually attempt kicks beyond 45 yards. It would be interesting to see how accurate most kickers are if you only take into account kicks from 40 yards and in.

Rex
03-19-2008, 09:25 AM
nope but just about any NFL caliber kicker better be accurate from 40 yards in. You want to give Elam credit for his accuracy then stop looking at his field goal percentage compared to other kickers who actually attempt kicks beyond 45 yards. It would be interesting to see how accurate most kickers are if you only take into account kicks from 40 yards and in.

He was 10/14 from 40+ last year including 1/2 from 50+., 9/12 from 40+. 17/17 from 39 and under.

Vinatieri: 0/3 from 40+ last year. 23/29 from 39 and under.

Quit bitching. KC had 3 kickers.

silkamilkamonico
03-19-2008, 09:42 AM
Let him go Pat.

He's an ageless kicker that wants to go out with a bang and that's ok.

We'll just move on.

BOSSHOGG30
03-19-2008, 09:45 AM
He was 10/14 from 40+ last year including 1/2 from 50+., 9/12 from 40+. 17/17 from 39 and under.

Vinatieri: 0/3 from 40+ last year. 23/29 from 39 and under.

Quit bitching. KC had 3 kickers.

You SOB! ;)

NightTrainLayne
03-19-2008, 09:55 AM
Every team in the league needs an Elam...an Elam from 10 years ago. I am not admitting defeat. I am facing reality, which apparently is lacking from most Broncos fans. Elam CANNOT connect on the long kick anymore. Go ahead, drink the Kool-Aid...think Elway could do no wrong. There's a reason he had to hit a 63-yarder...DAMMIT people, Elam is done. We need a kicker. There are going to be times Cutler can't get those 10 yards and we have to kick the 55-yarder. Elam can't hit any more. WAKE UP!

Like I said, I love Elam. He's a Broncos great, but it's time for him to go, and for us to move on. Realize that.

In fairness the 63-yarder was before the half with the clock practically at zero. It was kind of a unique situation that day. The 63-yarder wasn't a game-winner at the end of a game.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-19-2008, 10:03 AM
If it is correct for me to assume that Elam wants as much money as he can get this late in his career, that totally surprises me. Many players, including Elway took a pay cut late in their career to help the team. I definitely thought Elam would be willing to do the same. Am I missing something here?

BroncoJoe
03-19-2008, 10:09 AM
If it is correct for me to assume that Elam wants as much money as he can get this late in his career, that totally surprises me. Many players, including Elway took a pay cut late in their career to help the team. I definitely thought Elam would be willing to do the same. Am I missing something here?

Yes. A 50+ yarder.

:heh:

topscribe
03-19-2008, 12:55 PM
But it also should not be the only reason they win either 4 of those games last year would have been losses without Elam, masking just how bad this team really was last year..

Yes I know it is good to have a Great FG guy but paying him 2.5 per year to haul mikeys asses out of the fire every week is spraying cologne on a rotting corpse..

Fix the real issues and all you have to do for the kicker is have them kick PATs, not 40 yard FGs cause you suck in the red zone..

Would you be getting a bit dramatic about this, JR? Remember the Raiders
of the early 70's, and the countless times they won off the leg of George
Blanda? That would include their Super Bowl year of 1976, right? Would they
be counted as a bad team because they won so many times by a field goal?

Fact is, parity today is so great in the league that a team MUST have a
reliable kicker. They will have to rely on the kicker to win some games, if
their name isn't "Patriots."

-----

nevcraw
03-19-2008, 01:24 PM
I would love to see the total percentage of kicks last year over 50 yds vs. 20 - 49 yds. I will go out on limb and say much less.
The big leg is a luxury only. a strong KO guy who also can kick the high % (20-49 yds) would also be a luxury. A kicker who can walk on the field an hit the majority of kicks including the pressured riddled kick, is not a luxury but a must have!!!!!
who needs 7th CB just to sit the bench when they can have a guy who's only job is to kick touchbacks while another guy has one job that's make the field goal and that guy is Elam.

BroncoJoe
03-19-2008, 01:34 PM
My point about Elam is we've offered him a three year deal. THREE YEARS! Dude is 38 years old, has made his fair share of money and it's not good enough for him?

That's my beef right now. I'd like him back, but if he's looking for a big last payday, have fun losing in Atlanta.

BOSSHOGG30
03-19-2008, 01:44 PM
My point about Elam is we've offered him a three year deal. THREE YEARS! Dude is 38 years old, has made his fair share of money and it's not good enough for him?

That's my beef right now. I'd like him back, but if he's looking for a big last payday, have fun losing in Atlanta.

Exactly! Right on Brother!

Rex
03-19-2008, 01:47 PM
My point about Elam is we've offered him a three year deal. THREE YEARS! Dude is 38 years old, has made his fair share of money and it's not good enough for him?

That's my beef right now. I'd like him back, but if he's looking for a big last payday, have fun losing in Atlanta.

Why do you blame a guy who has been one of the best in the league looking for one last payday? They all do. If they honestly think he is not worth it, they will let him walk. I will tell you though, if he is gone, at some point next year the team will seriously regret it.

BroncoJoe
03-19-2008, 01:49 PM
Why do you blame a guy who has been one of the best in the league looking for one last payday? They all do. If they honestly think he is not worth it, they will let him walk. I will tell you though, if he is gone, at some point next year the team will seriously regret it.

Guess I'm a loyalist. I'd take a bit less money (any offer couldn't be THAT much more than we're offering) for a chance to be on a winning team. Especially after being in the league that long, with a fat bank account.

That's just me.

Rex
03-19-2008, 01:52 PM
Guess I'm a loyalist. I'd take a bit less money (any offer couldn't be THAT much more than we're offering) for a chance to be on a winning team. Especially after being in the league that long, with a fat bank account.

That's just me.

He is from Atlanta. I am sure he has an emotional attachment to the city.

I never thought Roy Williams would leave Kansas, but I guess emotion plays a role in some things.

Requiem / The Dagda
03-19-2008, 01:53 PM
Gimme Mehlhaff.

nevcraw
03-19-2008, 01:54 PM
My point about Elam is we've offered him a three year deal. THREE YEARS! Dude is 38 years old, has made his fair share of money and it's not good enough for him?

That's my beef right now. I'd like him back, but if he's looking for a big last payday, have fun losing in Atlanta.

what does the lenth of the contract have to do with it? The sticking point is not the length i would imagine but the the girth (guarranteed money). A clutch kicker is worth 2-3 mil a year when he is directly responsible for a games outcome..

BOSSHOGG30
03-19-2008, 02:13 PM
Clutch kicking is good for teams that are playoff caliber teams or teams that actually have super bowl expectations. Maybe it is just me, but I think Denver has a couple years to go in order to reach that level. We have too many holes and questions to be worried about clutch kicking bringing us the hardwear. We would be better off grooming a young guy from the draft so when these young guys click and we fill in a few more peices of that puzzle we will have a guy we can rely on. By the time we get to that point Elam will be over 40.

Lonestar
03-19-2008, 02:21 PM
Clutch kicking is good for teams that are playoff caliber teams or teams that actually have super bowl expectations. Maybe it is just me, but I think Denver has a couple years to go in order to reach that level. We have too many holes and questions to be worried about clutch kicking bringing us the hardwear. We would be better off grooming a young guy from the draft so when these young guys click and we fill in a few more peices of that puzzle we will have a guy we can rely on. By the time we get to that point Elam will be over 40.

I think your correct here and then 2 years from now we are starting a rookie kicker in playoff drive. Makes sense to me..

WWTHD ;)


















What Would Ted Have Done.

dogfish
03-19-2008, 02:24 PM
Would you be getting a bit dramatic about this, JR? Remember the Raiders
of the early 70's, and the countless times they won off the leg of George
Blanda? That would include their Super Bowl year of 1976, right? Would they
be counted as a bad team because they won so many times by a field goal?

Fact is, parity today is so great in the league that a team MUST have a
reliable kicker. They will have to rely on the kicker to win some games, if
their name isn't "Patriots."

-----



actually, the need for a clutch kicker is even greater if your name is pansies. . . they've won three super bowls in the past decade-- all three of them were by a margin of three points. . . . ;)



it was only this past year, with the addition of randy moss, that they became an offensive machine. . . .

dogfish
03-19-2008, 02:25 PM
Clutch kicking is good for teams that are playoff caliber teams or teams that actually have super bowl expectations. Maybe it is just me, but I think Denver has a couple years to go in order to reach that level. We have too many holes and questions to be worried about clutch kicking bringing us the hardwear. We would be better off grooming a young guy from the draft so when these young guys click and we fill in a few more peices of that puzzle we will have a guy we can rely on. By the time we get to that point Elam will be over 40.

only GOOD argument i've seen so far for letting him go. . . .

topscribe
03-19-2008, 02:29 PM
Clutch kicking is good for teams that are playoff caliber teams or teams that actually have super bowl expectations. Maybe it is just me, but I think Denver has a couple years to go in order to reach that level. We have too many holes and questions to be worried about clutch kicking bringing us the hardwear. We would be better off grooming a young guy from the draft so when these young guys click and we fill in a few more peices of that puzzle we will have a guy we can rely on. By the time we get to that point Elam will be over 40.

You may be right.

However, didn't most people last year regard the Giants as a year or two
away? I mean, you go into games to win them now, not two or three years
away. And you can never be entirely sure as to what you have until your
team takes the field.

It is very easy to discount the value of a kicker with ice water in his veins.
Until someone else lets it fly wide-right on the last play of the game . . .

-----

Requiem / The Dagda
03-19-2008, 02:29 PM
Mason Crosby was pretty damn clutch for Green Bay.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 02:33 PM
actually, the need for a clutch kicker is even greater if your name is pansies. . . they've won three super bowls in the past decade-- all three of them were by a margin of three points. . . . ;)



it was only this past year, with the addition of randy moss, that they became an offensive machine. . . .

Good point. Of course, it was last year's team I was thinking of.

Regarding past years, how many Super Bowls would the Pats have won
without good field goal kicking?

-----

BOSSHOGG30
03-19-2008, 02:33 PM
You may be right.

However, didn't most people last year regard the Giants as a year or two
away? I mean, you go into games to win them now, not two or three years
away. And you can never be entirely sure as to what you have until your
team takes the field.

It is very easy to discount the value of a kicker with ice water in his veins.
Until someone else lets it fly wide-right on the last play of the game . . .

-----

Last time I checked Lawrence Tynes didn't put the Giants over the top regardless of what people thought about them before the season started.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 02:35 PM
Mason Crosby was pretty damn clutch for Green Bay.

A few weeks ago, the Sports Guru had a draft expert on his radio program (I'm
sure you know whom I'm talking about), who said three or four good kickers
would probably be available in the later rounds.

I wonder if that is where the Broncos are going with this . . .

-----

BroncoJoe
03-19-2008, 02:35 PM
Mason Crosby was pretty damn clutch for Green Bay.

I REALLY wanted him in last year's draft.

Lonestar
03-19-2008, 02:36 PM
You may be right.

However, didn't most people last year regard the Giants as a year or two
away? I mean, you go into games to win them now, not two or three years
away. And you can never be entirely sure as to what you have until your
team takes the field.

It is very easy to discount the value of a kicker with ice water in his veins.
Until someone else lets it fly wide-right on the last play of the game . . .

-----

Me thinks that the defense won more for that team than did the FG guy did..

Frankly NO ONE thought of that team as a Super team last year.. Till they beat Dallas in the playoffs..

Rex
03-19-2008, 02:39 PM
Last time I checked Lawrence Tynes didn't put the Giants over the top regardless of what people thought about them before the season started.

Nope. If he wouldnt have nailed the last kick, he would have been cut.

dogfish
03-19-2008, 02:42 PM
Last time I checked Lawrence Tynes didn't put the Giants over the top regardless of what people thought about them before the season started.

no, but he almost LOST them the chance at the super bowl when he missed that kick against green bay. . . :heh:

BOSSHOGG30
03-19-2008, 02:44 PM
Denver already came out and said they like Taylor Mehlaff from Wisconsin. I think they will draft him and he will be the future regardless of what we do with Elam.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 02:45 PM
Last time I checked Lawrence Tynes didn't put the Giants over the top regardless of what people thought about them before the season started.

You apparently missed the point. You said the Broncos were not a serious
playoff contender in the next year or two, and therefore should not be so
concerned about keeping Elam's good kicking, in lieu of a prospect in a
different position.

I responded you can't be too sure about those things. From all the talk of
"holes" in the squad, one would think the Broncos are taking on the
appearance of a few tons of swiss cheese. Personally, I don't see all those
holes . . . a couple or so, yes, but not all over the place.

From some of the squeakers the Broncos played last year, they could have
been 11-5, as well as 4-12. The kicker made sure the Broncos were not
4-12, and in the right circumstances Elam could have made them 11-5.

I'm glad Bowlen is intervening. That means that Elam's contract offer will
probably increase. If Pat wants him badly enough, he will get him. Elam
doesn't really want to go anywhere, I'm sure.

-----

Denver Native (Carol)
03-19-2008, 02:55 PM
Why do you blame a guy who has been one of the best in the league looking for one last payday? They all do. If they honestly think he is not worth it, they will let him walk. I will tell you though, if he is gone, at some point next year the team will seriously regret it.

I have to believe that the Broncos have, money wise, been very good to Jason. Up until now, he never had a problem resigning with the Broncos when his contract was up.

Lonestar
03-19-2008, 03:03 PM
I have to believe that the Broncos have, money wise, been very good to Jason. Up until now, he never had a problem resigning with the Broncos when his contract was up.


mostly because in many folks opinion he was more than well compensated from the number I have heard he wants more money fro less capability.. Than he had before..

BTW what is the big difference in making 2.5 and 3.2 an year.. About what he would have to spend on moving..

topscribe
03-19-2008, 03:12 PM
mostly because in many folks opinion he was more than well compensated from the number I have heard he wants more money fro less capability.. Than he had before..

BTW what is the big difference in making 2.5 and 3.2 an year.. About what he would have to spend on moving..

Actually, I was just trying to present both sides . . . kind of a "devil's
advocate" thing, I guess. But you're right about more money for less
capability.

That is why Lynch took the cut. Neither he nor the FO expect quite as high
level of play this year that he produced in previous years, it would seem.
They may be looking at Elam's contract in much the same way.

-----

Lonestar
03-19-2008, 03:58 PM
Actually, I was just trying to present both sides . . . kind of a "devil's
advocate" thing, I guess. But you're right about more money for less
capability.

That is why Lynch took the cut. Neither he nor the FO expect quite as high
level of play this year that he produced in previous years, it would seem.
They may be looking at Elam's contract in much the same way.

-----

Makes sense and if Jason can fool someone into 3.5 or more per year more power to him.. He still has a ROF slot unless he knocks us out a Superbowl bid in years to come.. Maybe even a HOF slot as a bronco ..

Requiem / The Dagda
03-19-2008, 04:21 PM
Denver already came out and said they like Taylor Mehlaff from Wisconsin. I think they will draft him and he will be the future regardless of what we do with Elam.

Actually, Denver doesn't come out and say they like anyone; that's just what Draft Daddy reported. Which I assume is true, but it's not like they came out and announced it.

TXBRONC
03-19-2008, 05:05 PM
I am interested in knowing how much money Elam wants and where that places him in regards to what other kickers are making.

I love Elam, but I don't see how you can justify a big contract to a guy who is in the twilight of his career.


Same here. I am very appreciative all the clutch kicking Elam did for us over the years but he is obviously on the backside of his career so huge contract is noit justifiable.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 07:22 PM
Same here. I am very appreciative all the clutch kicking Elam did for us over the years but he is obviously on the backside of his career so huge contract is justifiable.

Huge contract is or is not justifiable, TX?

I think you meant is not, didn't you?

-----

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 07:27 PM
I just don't think paying him a large amount is worth it. If he still had it from 55-60, sure, but he doesn't. We need to let go of him. He's just not the kicker he was. I hate to harp on it, but we missed our chance with Mason Crosby last year. We need to try and get a young, big-leg kicker in here...Alexis Serna is another stud. Now, that doesn't mean pull a Carl Peterson and draft him in the fourth, but if he's still there with our second pick in the fifth, I wouldn't have one problem taking him.

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 07:28 PM
I will say it once again.

.

Missed on Crosby...should look into Serna...my opinion.

str8jacket
03-19-2008, 07:31 PM
Missed on Crosby...should look into Serna...my opinion.

Agreed. How could you justify paying Elam that much money for less than 40 yard field goals.

People called me stupid for wanting Crosby as bad as I did last year knowing Elam was coming to a close with his career.

"Elam has 5 years left"

"Elam is clutch"

"Elam is reliable"

"Elam deserves more time"

And yet look at us now

Lonestar
03-19-2008, 07:33 PM
Agreed. How could you justify paying Elam that much money for less than 40 yard field goals.

People called me stupid for wanting Crosby as bad as I did last year knowing Elam was coming to a close with his career.

"Elam has 5 years left"

"Elam is clutch"

"Elam is reliable"

"Elam deserves more time"

And yet look at us now

all of those were true at the time and probably still apply what is the issue is the 3.5 mil he wants..


Do we need another kicker in the near future sure we do.. But last year we were mortally bleeding at DL..

str8jacket
03-19-2008, 07:36 PM
all of those were true at the time and probably still apply what is the issue is the 3.5 mil he wants..


Do we need another kicker in the near future sure we do.. But last year we were mortally bleeding at DL..

And yet we still are mortally bleeding even after that draft, I think we could have done without Thomas personally.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 07:37 PM
all of those were true at the time and probably still apply what is the issue is the 3.5 mil he wants..


Do we need another kicker in the near future sure we do.. But last year we were mortally bleeding at DL..

Well, that's my concern. DL is the only posiition where the Broncos continue
to bleed to that degree, IMO. I believe at this point that the Broncos should
develop myopia: they should not be able to see anything but what they're
looking at, and they should be looking at nothing but DL until it is fixed.

Sign the guy (Elam) and get him out of the way, IMO.

-----

Lonestar
03-19-2008, 07:39 PM
And yet we still are mortally bleeding even after that draft, I think we could have done without Thomas personally.

And who would we have at DT this year, larry, curly and moe?

Broncoschic7
03-19-2008, 07:40 PM
Personally, I'd like to see him stay. He may be getting "old", but there are more times than not that will be valuable to the Broncos (experience wise). If he were a running back or someone constantly taking hits I wouldn't be so gunghoe with the age thing. However, at this point with a somewhat younger team for a big part, I'd take Elam, especially going into this year. We know what he can do, he's pretty much consistent and still has it in him to win some of those "oh my gosh, I think I'm going to puke" down to the wire games for us,,,,lol. JMO:D

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 07:40 PM
Well, that's my concern. DL is the only posiition where the Broncos continue
to bleed to that degree, IMO. I believe at this point that the Broncos should
develop myopia: they should not be able to see anything they're looking at,
and they should be looking at nothing but DL until it is fixed.

Sign the guy (Elam) and get him out of the way, IMO.

-----

The problem is there's no depth in the draft at d-line at all. So we might as well pick up what we can, because the talent at d-line isn't very good. Don't sign Elam and you've got a little extra money.

str8jacket
03-19-2008, 07:41 PM
And who would we have at DT this year, larry, curly and moe?

Sounds alot like what we have now, minus Moe.

Requiem / The Dagda
03-19-2008, 07:42 PM
The problem is there's no depth in the draft at d-line at all. So we might as well pick up what we can, because the talent at d-line isn't very good. Don't sign Elam and you've got a little extra money.

At defensive tackle or end? :/

TXBRONC
03-19-2008, 07:44 PM
Huge contract is or is not justifiable, TX?

I think you meant is not, didn't you?

-----


Yes I meant not justifiable. Oh and I fixed it.

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 07:44 PM
At defensive tackle or end? :/

I don't see a terrible amount of talent past the top 2 at DT...

Requiem / The Dagda
03-19-2008, 07:45 PM
I don't see a terrible amount of talent past the top 2 at DT...

Two elite guys; and a bunch of 2-4 round guys. There's depth there and a butt load at DE.

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 07:46 PM
Two elite guys; and a bunch of 2-4 round guys. There's depth there and a butt load at DE.

We don't need DE. I think it's a reach to grab most DT at our spot in the 2nd, and I don't think they will last to our pick in the fourth. I think we're in a really tough spot to draft DT talent this year.

Requiem / The Dagda
03-19-2008, 07:48 PM
We don't need DE. I think it's a reach to grab most DT at our spot in the 2nd, and I don't think they will last to our pick in the fourth. I think we're in a really tough spot to draft DT talent this year.

We could use another LDE; but not early. There will be defensive tackles available that are worth #42. I'm assuming we'll pick up a third. We'll be fine.

The talent's there. I'd take a WR at #42, and I'm confident we will.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 07:50 PM
The problem is there's no depth in the draft at d-line at all. So we might as well pick up what we can, because the talent at d-line isn't very good. Don't sign Elam and you've got a little extra money.

What? The little bit they pay a kicker?

And they will have to sign another kicker . . . and pay him . . . won't they? :noidea:

-----

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 07:53 PM
We could use another LDE; but not early. There will be defensive tackles available that are worth #42. I'm assuming we'll pick up a third. We'll be fine.

The talent's there. I'd take a WR at #42, and I'm confident we will.

I don't have a problem with WR at 42, and if we pick up a third, yes, DT is the prime position. I would hate to see us mortgage the entire draft to get into the third to get a DT though...as we did with Thomas last year in the 4th. That's not worth it.

We need a kicker....we shouldn't pay Elam what he wants...it's too bad, but its reality. We should draft a kicker in the later rounds.

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 07:54 PM
What? The little bit they pay a kicker?

And they will have to sign another kicker . . . and pay him . . . won't they? :noidea:

-----

So with Elam we have to pay two kickers. With a rookie, you only have to pay one the minimum....what's your point?

Requiem / The Dagda
03-19-2008, 07:56 PM
Yeah, Elam can kiss it. 3 million a year if not more? Eat that. Draft Serna, Melhaff, Coutu and pay them the league low and spend that 3 million on getting a guy worth somethin'.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 08:07 PM
So with Elam we have to pay two kickers. With a rookie, you only have to pay one the minimum....what's your point?

That's a kicker and a punter, isn't it? Didn't the punter do the kickoffs?

-----

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 08:09 PM
That's a kicker and a punter, isn't it? Didn't the punter do the kickoffs?

-----

Not very well.

topscribe
03-19-2008, 08:11 PM
Not very well.

Well, so the guy kicked off all the way from the 30 to the 50. So what? :lol:

-----

MOtorboat
03-19-2008, 08:13 PM
Well, so the guy kicked off all the way from the 30 to the 50. So what? :lol:

-----

:coffee:

topscribe
03-19-2008, 08:49 PM
Yeah, Elam can kiss it. 3 million a year if not more? Eat that. Draft Serna, Melhaff, Coutu and pay them the league low and spend that 3 million on getting a guy worth somethin'.

Well, you may be right in that.

I'm just saying that, whatever they do, do quickly and get their minds back on the DL.

-----

nevcraw
03-19-2008, 09:55 PM
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/mar/19/broncos-wiegmann-both-interested-no-deal-yet/

GEORGIA ON HIS MIND: Kicker Jason Elam arrived in Atlanta for his free-agent visit, with the substantive part of the trip with the Falcons set to take place Thursday. The second day will likely include a meeting with team owner Arthur Blank, known as a solid closer in contract negotiations.

Denver has put forth a standing three-year offer to Elam that includes an average per year ranging somewhere between $2.4 million and $2.6 million. That annual haul would place the 15-year veteran behind only St. Louis’ Josh Brown ($2.8 million per season) and in the neighborhood of Indianapolis’ Adam Vinatieri ($2.4 million).
But, as with many NFL deals, there’s contract money and real cash the player’s likely to see. The hang-up in Elam’s case appears to be guaranteed payout and contract structure, which could relegate the agreement to essentially a one-year arrangement.

At age 38, Elam seemingly wants to squeeze all he can out of his final big payday.

The Falcons may be poised to go that extra mile, or million.

pilfin
03-20-2008, 09:07 AM
you know, Rob Bironas was a stud last year. He has one of the strongest legs in the game, and has been extremely clutch. He is an RFA, 2nd round tender. I'm wondering if it would be worth a 2nd round pick to get a kicker that will be a stud for the next 10 years.

Mike
03-20-2008, 09:09 AM
you know, Rob Bironas was a stud last year. He has one of the strongest legs in the game, and has been extremely clutch. He is an RFA, 2nd round tender. I'm wondering if it would be worth a 2nd round pick to get a kicker that will be a stud for the next 10 years.

No kicker is worth a 2nd round pick. Especially with Denver's needs.

MOtorboat
03-20-2008, 09:10 AM
No kicker is worth a 2nd round pick. Especially with Denver's needs.

Not to mention, the top-rated kicker probably won't go until at least the fourth round...

WARHORSE
04-11-2008, 04:49 AM
Q: What were the Broncos thinking when they did not take advantage of Jason Elam giving them the last chance to beat Atlanta's offer? Yes, he cannot do kickoffs and yes, he doesn't have the leg that he used to, but what other option did they have? None of the kickers left in free agency are better then Elam and none of the kickers in the draft are remotely impressive. In my opinion kickers usually win a team about three games a year, on an average. Since the Broncos have put themselves in a pickle, you can go ahead and mark them down for a least three extra losses this year. I'm scratching my head on this one. Don't you think they made a bad move by not resigning him?
A: There are certainly in a spot where it will be immensely difficult – and likely not possible -- for them to find a way to feel as comfortable in their kicking game as they were last year when Elam kicked game-winners in four of their seven victories.
But the Broncos were working under a now-or-next year assumption about Elam's future and their kicking needs after talking to Elam's representatives in the negotiations.
In short, they wanted, because of a salary cap ramifications as far as potential future dead money against the cap, Elam to sign multi-year deal with the intention he would play two or three more years.
And by the contract Elam signed, compared to the one the Broncos quietly say he turned away, it appears Elam's intention is to play just one more season. The total amount of the deal was roughly the same between the two teams, but the Falcons deal had $900,000 more of that money in the first year.
So, Elam signed in Atlanta. And because of that the Broncos took that as an indication he intends to only play one more season – his 16th – in the league. The Broncos also believe that means they would have had to deal with replacing him next year, so that they might as well do it now and try to maintain the fiscal approach they have elected to take this year.
However, that said, I think they also believed they were going to get Olindo Mare in that scenario, especially after a two-day visit, but he then elected to sign in Seattle instead.
So that leaves the Broncos with Matt Prater, a strong-legged prospect who is just 1-of-4 in field-goal attempts in his career. Shanahan has said Prater will get to compete for the job with a still-unsigned kicker who will join the fray at some point.
John Carney is still available with his value rising some as a handful of teams want another kicker to bring to camp. And there will be some younger players out there as well the Broncos can grab later on.
Can they secure a player with the kind of resume Elam has? No. But they wanted him to play more than '08 and believed they offered him a contract to do that.
They probably won't have to wait long to find out if sticking to their guns – something they've taken some heat for not doing from time to time in the past – was a mistake.

Ziggy
04-11-2008, 10:25 AM
I think it's a big loss also. The only thing I can think of is that Shanahan is possibly tired of using an extra roster spot for a guy that can kickoff. Maybe he thinks he can find a kicker that kicks off and does foeld goals just as well. If that kicker is out there in free agency right now, I haven't heard of him.

BroncoJoe
04-11-2008, 10:29 AM
And by the contract Elam signed, compared to the one the Broncos quietly say he turned away, it appears Elam's intention is to play just one more season. The total amount of the deal was roughly the same between the two teams, but the Falcons deal had $900,000 more of that money in the first year.


That speaks volumes to me. Now I'm more pissed at Elam than the Broncos.

DenBronx
04-11-2008, 11:59 AM
That speaks volumes to me. Now I'm more pissed at Elam than the Broncos.

same here...after all the big contracts we gave that dude and all the loyalty he jumped ship for 900k. i hope he tweaks his hammy.

so be it then....bring on the rook that can handle kickoffs and field goals. :salute:

r8rh8r
04-11-2008, 12:12 PM
Denver didn't have an opportunity to match Atlanta's offer. He stated from the beginning that he'd give Atlanta a fair shot to outbid Denver. Elam didn't think it would be ethical to let Atlanta set the market price and then simply let Denver match. Here's the proof:

The Unfolding Elam Melodrama (http://www.rockymountainfever.net/2008/03/unfolding-elam-melodrama.html)

That said, Elam is a huge loss. His asking price was, however, way too high. Time to move on. I actually think Prater shows some promise (http://www.rockymountainfever.net/2008/03/filling-elams-shoes.html). I think he deserves some cautious optimism.

Denver Native (Carol)
05-11-2008, 07:59 PM
Jason talks about leaving:

http://www.cbs4denver.com/video/?id=...nc.dayport.com)

Sassy
05-11-2008, 08:00 PM
Tear jerking interview...Jason is ALL CLASS! He'll be missed.
(I like how he commented that it would be "weird" to be in red and black and that he'll have to try not to go out on the field when the Broncos are kicking fg's against the Falcons!)

Hobe
05-11-2008, 09:12 PM
To me this is one of the places where the “business” gets in the way of the game. Warhorse gave nothing but business reasons for Elam’s departure. It was all cash flow. The kicking game has been a concern since Elam left. It is all question marks. :noidea: