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View Full Version : McDaniels faces familiar decision: youth or veterans



Denver Native (Carol)
01-15-2010, 10:33 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos/ci_14195168

Talk to the old salts around the league about free agency and the draft, and the term "muddy the waters" will often come up.

Basically, that's the choice of signing a veteran player in free agency for a specific role rather than developing — and playing — a younger player in the same spot.

Because a veteran player takes practice snaps through the week and playing time on game day from a younger guy, the thought is it may take longer to develop a team's draft picks or second- and third-year players if there isn't a concerted effort to play them.

Hence you "muddy" the developmental waters with older players who may not be more talented or in the team's long-term plans, but they simply make fewer mistakes in the short term.

In his time with the Broncos, Mike Shanahan often muddied the waters when it came to young players. Shanahan, who took plenty of criticism for his work in the draft, also let quality young players go at times after giving them little chance to prove themselves because he preferred to work with more experienced players who didn't have the growing pains.

Domenik Hixon, who has made a nice career for himself since the Broncos tossed him aside, will always be a rather tidy example of this.

But it is exactly the spot the Broncos find themselves in right now. They have some young players, like guard Seth Olsen, safety Darcel McBath, outside linebacker Robert Ayers, defensive lineman Chris Baker and perhaps even wide receiver Kenny McKinley when he recovers from his knee surgery, who are in that all-important second offseason with the team.

They are also in position to at least compete for larger roles.

Broncos coach Josh McDaniels has shown himself to be a coach who prefers age and experience at times. Like most coaches, he detests mistakes, and veteran players will always make fewer of them.

McDaniels surrendered a draft pick for veteran defensive linemen Le Kevin Smith in training camp after looking at his guys. McDaniels signed cornerback Ty Law during the season because he preferred Law coming in off the street over his second-round pick — Alphonso Smith — or rookie Tony Carter in the slot.

McDaniels continually used LaMont Jordan as a third running back over a player such as second-year back Peyton Hillis, and in team meetings often lauded Jordan for making the right choices in the running game despite the fact Jordan carried the ball just five total times in the Broncos' last 11 games.

But after another 8-8 finish, the organization's fourth consecutive year on the outside looking in at the playoff bracket, the Broncos are now in a position to choose their direction.

They can be a team committed to the draft and then working with and playing those younger players. Or they can be a team that plays the draft picks who excel immediately and fills in the rest with an ever-changing cast of veteran free agents.

Like their running game this season, the Broncos were kind of stuck in the middle in 2009. They were kind of committed to young players and kind of reliant on late veteran additions such as Law, Le Kevin Smith, Vonnie Holliday and Russ Hochstein.

Former Colts coach Tony Dungy, who won at least 12 games in each of his last six seasons on the sideline and won at least 10 games in 10 seasons overall, always expressed the need and desire to play young players in the era of free agency.

And the Colts have rarely participated in the whirlwind of huge contracts to players they didn't draft.

"We're not afraid to play young guys," Dungy always said.

And for Dungy and the Colts, that meant a commitment to those young guys in practice, in games. They consistently made good choices in April and pushed them along to be ready to play in September.

In the uncertain labor landscape of the league, in which teams can't say for sure whether a salary cap will exist again down the road or what it will look like if it does, a team committed to its own players, its own draft picks, will more easily be able to adjust to any future labor deal.

McDaniels has already talked about the importance of this April's draft for his program. And as he prepares to enter the second year on his four-year deal, he'll be facing the choice of moving forward with youth, or, in the words of several personnel executives, "muddying the waters" and then simply trying to see what he can catch.

roomemp
01-15-2010, 10:36 AM
I am curious to see what direction he goes in this year. Lat year we loaded up on both rookies and vets. I can picture McD giving the youngsters every opportunity to make it as a starter but if they are not ready or can't cut it, a vet will be waiting in the wings. See Alfonso Smith.

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
01-15-2010, 01:30 PM
Prospects or Pros, a tough decision for any coach.

HORSEPOWER 56
01-15-2010, 01:34 PM
You fix this years problems with vets. You build future teams with youth. The likelyhood that any guys drafted this year will make a significant impact is wishful thinking. You never try to use the draft to fix current problems.

KyleOrtonArmySoldier#128
01-15-2010, 02:28 PM
You fix this years problems with vets. You build future teams with youth. The likelyhood that any guys drafted this year will make a significant impact is wishful thinking. You never try to use the draft to fix current problems.

I agree wholeheartedly. Immediate impact from veterans, future is good if you draft well.

But I think the question raised in the article is whether or not you hurt your prospects by giving them less playing time and practice.

WARHORSE
01-15-2010, 02:36 PM
One thing I liked when Alphonso Smith was on the field.........he played hard.

He made some mistakes, but his effort as a DB when he was on the field was very good. I liked him.

Scheme wise, Im sure he was mixed up. But once again, he was playing in the slot almost the entire time he was on the field. He didnt play there in college much at all, and I dont doubt thats why he had trouble adjusting.

Brandon Merriweather didnt play his first year or so with the Pats.

Bill doesnt like mistakes on the field.


He plays now though doesnt he?

SOCALORADO.
01-15-2010, 03:02 PM
One thing I liked when Alphonso Smith was on the field.........he played hard.

He made some mistakes, but his effort as a DB when he was on the field was very good. I liked him.

Scheme wise, Im sure he was mixed up. But once again, he was playing in the slot almost the entire time he was on the field. He didnt play there in college much at all, and I dont doubt thats why he had trouble adjusting.

Brandon Merriweather didnt play his first year or so with the Pats.

Bill doesnt like mistakes on the field.


He plays now though doesnt he?


And heres the point some are making. Although Alphie sucked for most of the year, he tried hard, and is willing to learn and get better. Hopefully he does.
So with 2 absolute awsome CBs playing now, but getting up there in years, and Alphie looking to improve, theres no reason to draft a CB high in this years draft. Its a fairly deep draft at CB, so a guy like Cox or Verner in the 3rd would be ideal for the Broncos situation.
I think these issues depend on specific positions, and FA options, which are not really good at CB this year.

Lonestar
01-15-2010, 05:06 PM
Depending on the spot/position I'm more of a play them as much as you can type.

if they suck it up and are just not quite ready get the VET back in there while the rook watches and learns.

Northman
01-15-2010, 05:11 PM
I agree wholeheartedly. Immediate impact from veterans, future is good if you draft well.

But I think the question raised in the article is whether or not you hurt your prospects by giving them less playing time and practice.

The problem is McD has a very small window to make it work. So, HP has a valid point that you just cant rely on young talent to instantly fix the holes on this team. McD has some things he needs to work on including his scheme. And if Marshall is gone he is going to have to make up for it by getting someone who is just as productive. But, drafting a wideout is a huge crapshoot compared to some other positions. Once again, he is going into a season where schemes are changing do to personnel changes, etc. He's going to be a lot more prepared this year than he was last year so lets hope he gets it right.

Lonestar
01-15-2010, 05:13 PM
The problem is McD has a very small window to make it work. So, HP has a valid point that you just cant rely on young talent to instantly fix the holes on this team. McD has some things he needs to work on including his scheme. And if Marshall is gone he is going to have to make up for it by getting someone who is just as productive. But, drafting a wideout is a huge crapshoot compared to some other positions. Once again, he is going into a season where schemes are changing do to personnel changes, etc. He's going to be a lot more prepared this year than he was last year so lets hope he gets it right.

While you make good points marshals production can easily be made up with other WR much like TO departure from DAL was. Providing the QB is allowed more than a micro second to scan the field.

Northman
01-15-2010, 05:22 PM
While you make good points marshals production can easily be made up with other WR much like TO departure from DAL was. Providing the QB is allowed more than a micro second to scan the field.

Very true. But again i wouldnt quite put Orton on Romo's level in terms of quick release and scanning the field with consistency. Now, with some assistants leaving it just means the boys in the trenches will have to once again learn a new scheme which only adds to the chemistry problems we faced this year. If we go into next season and are unable to get a receiver to produce like Brandon did than it could get real ugly. And thats if you didnt think it was ugly already. :lol:

Lonestar
01-15-2010, 05:32 PM
Very true. But again i wouldnt quite put Orton on Romo's level in terms of quick release and scanning the field with consistency. Now, with some assistants leaving it just means the boys in the trenches will have to once again learn a new scheme which only adds to the chemistry problems we faced this year. If we go into next season and are unable to get a receiver to produce like Brandon did than it could get real ugly. And thats if you didnt think it was ugly already. :lol:

Again Orton may not be room but then romo was not romo till last year either. being brand new to a scheme tends to make you think more that just play.

given time to throw and offseason and TC to get timing down I suspect he will have a fine year next year..

remember orton did not have marshall in TC, that he really did not have his throwing hand till the bye and then the ankle injury coupled with hamiltons and caseys lack of beef made for lots of quicker than I'd like to have pocket presence.

I know I've hammered this a lot but really being comfortable in a scheme and having a few months in it, are pigs of a different color.

rcsodak
01-15-2010, 07:27 PM
I say let Hillis go....trade him to Shanny.

And grab Gerhart, from Stanford.

He's not a bull, he's a frickin' Water Buffalo!

He's got great strength, agility, drive, power and speed for being such a big guy.

Hell, trade Moreno as well.

GERHART!!!!!!!

Northman
01-15-2010, 07:28 PM
I say let Hillis go....trade him to Shanny.

And grab Gerhart, from Stanford.

He's not a bull, he's a frickin' Water Buffalo!

He's got great strength, agility, drive, power and speed for being such a big guy.

Hell, trade Moreno as well.

GERHART!!!!!!!

Yea, Gerhart is a ******* beast. OMG. He alone beat USC this year. Fricking ridiculous.

rcsodak
01-15-2010, 07:30 PM
Very true. But again i wouldnt quite put Orton on Romo's level in terms of quick release and scanning the field with consistency. Now, with some assistants leaving it just means the boys in the trenches will have to once again learn a new scheme which only adds to the chemistry problems we faced this year. If we go into next season and are unable to get a receiver to produce like Brandon did than it could get real ugly. And thats if you didnt think it was ugly already. :lol:

Maybe you missed the last game, without BM?

Seems Gaffney can do quite well, when afforded the opportunity.

Not that I think 1 receiver should be getting the ball thrown to him that much, but McD pretty much proved that they'll survive without the whiney baby.

Lonestar
01-15-2010, 08:20 PM
I say let Hillis go....trade him to Shanny.

And grab Gerhart, from Stanford.

He's not a bull, he's a frickin' Water Buffalo!

He's got great strength, agility, drive, power and speed for being such a big guy.

Hell, trade Moreno as well.

GERHART!!!!!!!
this kid will be a top ten pick and while it would be nice to have we have much higher priorities this year. NT/DE/OG/C just for rounds 1-4

Northman
01-16-2010, 09:50 AM
Maybe you missed the last game, without BM?

Seems Gaffney can do quite well, when afforded the opportunity.

Not that I think 1 receiver should be getting the ball thrown to him that much, but McD pretty much proved that they'll survive without the whiney baby.

:lol:

Thats just one game my friend, against a very poor KC defense. When Gaffney can do that game in and game out then we can talk. So no, i didnt miss anything.