PDA

View Full Version : Bowlen supportive of McDaniels; coach backs his QB



Denver Native (Carol)
01-04-2010, 02:03 PM
http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos/ci_14119470

Pat Bowlen wasn't smiling Sunday evening. No reason for that after his Broncos just topped off a 6-0 start with a devastating 2-8 finish.

But Bowlen walked away from his 26th season as the Broncos' owner with his usual quiet dignity. Bowlen knew his young coach, Josh McDan- iels, made a difficult decision when he decided to bench two of his best offensive players, Brandon Marshall and Tony Scheffler, with the playoffs potentially at stake.

"Unfortunately, we lost this game, but I have no problems with the coach," Bowlen said as he left the home locker room at Invesco Field. "He's my coach."

McDaniels finished his first season as the Broncos' head coach with an 8-8 record. Kyle Orton finished his first season as the Broncos' quarterback with career highs of 3,802 yards passing and 21 touchdowns — but also three interceptions in the final game.

As he walked to his car Sunday night, Bowlen stopped long enough to endorse McDaniels as his coach for the foreseeable future.

McDaniels said he can improve on his first-year work.

"I certainly can do a better job of what I do, and I'm not going to go into detail about this, that and the other," McDaniels said. "I'm looking forward to getting better in the offseason at what I do. And trying to improve our team in every way that I can."

One way, McDaniels said, is to help Orton become a better quarterback.

"This was his first season and he'll get better," McDaniels said. "Part of my job is to help him get better by coaching him up."

Although Orton's contract has now expired, expect the Broncos to sign him to a new deal within the next two months.

"I think something's going to be worked out," Orton said.

At the very least, Orton can be brought back on a one-year, $3.043 million contract as a restricted free agent. Most likely, though, the Broncos and Orton will try to reach accord on a multiyear contract that approaches the deals of other established QBs.

"I was proud to have the opportunity to coach him this year and look forward to moving forward with him," McDaniels said.

jrelway
01-04-2010, 02:11 PM
multi year deal for orton. keeps getting worse. ortons a smart dude but he doesnt have the physical tools to lead this team. noodle arm, immobile, and he trips over a blade of grass when the pressures on. hes a backup at best.

dogfish
01-04-2010, 02:13 PM
At the very least, Orton can be brought back on a one-year, $3.043 million contract as a restricted free agent. Most likely, though, the Broncos and Orton will try to reach accord on a multiyear contract that approaches the deals of other established QBs.

oy! that part scares the hell out of me. . . i've said elsewhere that bringing orton back for at least the next year or two is probably the right thing to do given the circumstances, but i may gouge my eye out with a stapler if we give the guy ten million a year. . . we can find somebody considerably cheaper who can complete bubble screens and throw the ball away when the pass rush breaks the pocket!

:doh:

Thnikkaman
01-04-2010, 02:21 PM
Iff we can find a better QB than Orton, I would love to see him as our back-up. Maybe I'm drunk but I can't see anything but positives going into next season. With or without Marshal and Scheffler. I'm trying this new thing called not having a knee jerk reaction to everything. Its really helping my stress levels.

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 02:27 PM
http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos/ci_14119470

Pat Bowlen wasn't smiling Sunday evening. No reason for that after his Broncos just topped off a 6-0 start with a devastating 2-8 finish.

But Bowlen walked away from his 26th season as the Broncos' owner with his usual quiet dignity. Bowlen knew his young coach, Josh McDan- iels, made a difficult decision when he decided to bench two of his best offensive players, Brandon Marshall and Tony Scheffler, with the playoffs potentially at stake.

"Unfortunately, we lost this game, but I have no problems with the coach," Bowlen said as he left the home locker room at Invesco Field. "He's my coach."

McDaniels finished his first season as the Broncos' head coach with an 8-8 record. Kyle Orton finished his first season as the Broncos' quarterback with career highs of 3,802 yards passing and 21 touchdowns — but also three interceptions in the final game.

As he walked to his car Sunday night, Bowlen stopped long enough to endorse McDaniels as his coach for the foreseeable future.

McDaniels said he can improve on his first-year work.

"I certainly can do a better job of what I do, and I'm not going to go into detail about this, that and the other," McDaniels said. "I'm looking forward to getting better in the offseason at what I do. And trying to improve our team in every way that I can."

One way, McDaniels said, is to help Orton become a better quarterback.

"This was his first season and he'll get better," McDaniels said. "Part of my job is to help him get better by coaching him up."

Although Orton's contract has now expired, expect the Broncos to sign him to a new deal within the next two months.

"I think something's going to be worked out," Orton said.

At the very least, Orton can be brought back on a one-year, $3.043 million contract as a restricted free agent. Most likely, though, the Broncos and Orton will try to reach accord on a multiyear contract that approaches the deals of other established QBs.

"I was proud to have the opportunity to coach him this year and look forward to moving forward with him," McDaniels said.

Good. I hope so.

The LAST thing this team needs is change in continuity.

Orton has never had a coach to help him grow, in the NFL.

He does now, and I can't wait to see what McD gets out of him.

claymore
01-04-2010, 02:30 PM
Iff we can find a better QB than Orton, I would love to see him as our back-up. Maybe I'm drunk but I can't see anything but positives going into next season. With or without Marshal and Scheffler. I'm trying this new thing called not having a knee jerk reaction to everything. Its really helping my stress levels.

Im just trying to remain steady in my dislike for the direction of the team.

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 02:31 PM
multi year deal for orton. keeps getting worse. ortons a smart dude but he doesnt have the physical tools to lead this team. noodle arm, immobile, and he trips over a blade of grass when the pressures on. hes a backup at best.

Too bad you missed yesterday's game. :rolleyes:

Other than a couple good defensive plays, I'd say he deserves a raise.

jrelway
01-04-2010, 02:32 PM
im sure orton had someone to help him grow while in chicago. we need to stop making excuses for orton. hes been in the league a few years now. orton = jason campbell.

jrelway
01-04-2010, 02:33 PM
Too bad you missed yesterday's game. :rolleyes:

Other than a couple good defensive plays, I'd say he deserves a raise.

i watched yesterdays game. those 3 picks were awesome. hey, at least not all of em went for touchdowns!!

missingnumber7
01-04-2010, 02:42 PM
multi year deal for orton. keeps getting worse. ortons a smart dude but he doesnt have the physical tools to lead this team. noodle arm, immobile, and he trips over a blade of grass when the pressures on. hes a backup at best.

Did you watch the game yesterday...I agree with the attributes about his throwing ability, but he showed the ability to move in the pocket and get himself free.

Denver Native (Carol)
01-04-2010, 02:44 PM
im sure orton had someone to help him grow while in chicago. we need to stop making excuses for orton. hes been in the league a few years now. orton = jason campbell.

Orton = first year in a totally new system

BroncoHusker
01-04-2010, 02:47 PM
Orton is good enough for now and re-signing him is the right thing to do. I'd like to see what McDaniels can do with him with a second year.

This offseason we need to focus on getting our lines in better shape. We have no run game making our offense 1-dimensional and we can't stop the run either.

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 02:54 PM
im sure orton had someone to help him grow while in chicago. we need to stop making excuses for orton. hes been in the league a few years now. orton = jason campbell.

Seriously?

1. If orton = jcampbell, he'd not be called a 'noodle arm', or 'immobile'.
2. Campbell has had how many OC's/HC's while in Was? Highly unfair to compare him to anybody.


But I do like the cutler=JGeorge one. :elefant:

PS> You DO realize cutler has played more games, right? Just checking. *wink*

jrelway
01-04-2010, 02:55 PM
Orton = first year in a totally new system

orton isnt a rookie. orton also played the whole season. im not saying ortons an awful qb. IMO, he just doesnt have the physical tools to lead us very far. I miss having a qb that can roll out when the pocket collapses to make a play.

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 02:56 PM
i watched yesterdays game. those 3 picks were awesome. hey, at least not all of em went for touchdowns!!


Other than a couple good defensive plays,

In case you missed this little sentence.

jrelway
01-04-2010, 02:57 PM
You're serious, right?

1. If orton = jcampbell, he'd not be called a 'noodle arm', or 'immobile'.
2. Campbell has had how many OC's/HC's while in Was? Highly unfair to compare him to anybody.


But I do like the cutler=JGeorge one. :elefant:

PS> You DO realize cutler has played more games, right? Just checking. *wink*

no one brought cutler up. do you realize that right?

topscribe
01-04-2010, 02:59 PM
multi year deal for orton. keeps getting worse. ortons a smart dude but he doesnt have the physical tools to lead this team. noodle arm, immobile, and he trips over a blade of grass when the pressures on. hes a backup at best.

Here, NTL. This is the kind of drivel to which you should respond . . .

-----

topscribe
01-04-2010, 03:02 PM
Seriously?

1. If orton = jcampbell, he'd not be called a 'noodle arm', or 'immobile'.
2. Campbell has had how many OC's/HC's while in Was? Highly unfair to compare him to anybody.


But I do like the cutler=JGeorge one. :elefant:

PS> You DO realize cutler has played more games, right? Just checking. *wink*

Anybody who has observed Orton with any amount of cognitive ability would
not come away calling him "noodle arm" or immobile . . .

-----

GEM
01-04-2010, 03:02 PM
im sure orton had someone to help him grow while in chicago. we need to stop making excuses for orton. hes been in the league a few years now. orton = jason campbell.

I know!!

It's just about as bad as the excuses made for that other Qb...

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 03:13 PM
orton isnt a rookie. orton also played the whole season. im not saying ortons an awful qb. IMO, he just doesnt have the physical tools to lead us very far. I miss having a qb that can roll out when the pocket collapses to make a play.

You mean like Plummer did? And was faulted for not being able to stay in the pocket?

You mean like Big Ben? Who seems to always be in the lead for sacks/fumbles?

You mean like Cutler? Who seems to think ANY place on the field is as good as another for throwing int's.

How much rolling out does PManning do? How dirty does his uni get?

topscribe
01-04-2010, 03:16 PM
im sure orton had someone to help him grow while in chicago.

And how are you so sure? Quick: what was the name of Orton's QB coach?



I miss having a qb that can roll out when the pocket collapses to make a play.

I guess you didn't see yesterday's game, after all.

Either that, or you slept through it?

-----

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 03:19 PM
no one brought cutler up. do you realize that right?


Originally Posted by jrelway View Post
im sure orton had someone to help him grow while in chicago. we need to stop making excuses for orton. hes been in the league a few years now. orton = jason campbell.

LMAO

You opened the door.

Learned that watching Boston Legal. :coffee:

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 03:21 PM
Anybody who has observed Orton with any amount of cognitive ability would
not come away calling him "noodle arm" or immobile . . .

-----

Watch the big words, top. You'll cornfuse 'em. :D

HORSEPOWER 56
01-04-2010, 03:21 PM
Anybody who has observed Orton with any amount of cognitive ability would
not come away calling him "noodle arm" or immobile . . .

-----

Brother, I've observed him for 10 weeks. Maybe, "inaccurate over 10 yards and scrambling challenged" are better ways to word it?

I'm not hating, I'm just calling it like I see it.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 03:26 PM
Brother, I've observed him for 10 weeks. Maybe, "inaccurate over 10 yards and scrambling challenged" are better ways to word it?

I'm not hating, I'm just calling it like I see it.

Yesterday, I saw Orton roll out of the pocket. I saw him scramble left. I saw
him scramble right. I saw him spin out of a defender's grasp and then spin out
again on the same play. And he still has a high ankle sprain.

I saw Orton throwing the ball on the money 30 yards down the field. I saw him
miss deep, and I saw him hit deep . . . as do all QBs. (And yes, I saw that
miserably underthrown INT that he admitted he'd like to have back.)

I don't know what game you were watching.

-----

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 03:26 PM
Brother, I've observed him for 10 weeks. Maybe, "inaccurate over 10 yards and scrambling challenged" are better ways to word it?

I'm not hating, I'm just calling it like I see it.

:tsk:

jrelway
01-04-2010, 03:32 PM
Yesterday, I saw Orton roll out of the pocket. I saw him scramble left. I saw
him scramble right. I saw him spin out of a defender's grasp and then spin out
again on the same play. And he still has a high ankle sprain.

I saw Orton throwing the ball on the money 30 yards down the field. I saw him
miss deep, and I saw him hit deep . . . as do all QBs. (And yes, I saw that
miserably underthrown INT that he admitted he'd like to have back.)

I don't know what game you were watching.

-----

obviously your ass is basing ortons career off one game. scramble to the left, scramble to the right? and yes, i saw that poorly underthrown ball. actually i seen many underthrown balls this season. orton does have a rocket arm though. especially to WRs that are 5 -10 yrds away.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 03:41 PM
obviously your ass is basing ortons career off one game. scramble to the left, scramble to the right? and yes, i saw that poorly underthrown ball. actually i seen many underthrown balls this season. orton does have a rocket arm though. especially to WRs that are 5 -10 yrds away.

Obviously my basing Orton's career is not off one game. I guess you have
missed it, but I have studied several entire games of Orton as a Chicago Bear,
and 64 different video clips of his play. And I have read everything there is to
read about him, here an in Chicago, that I could find. So, starting out with a
negative impression of Orton, this thorough research over several years has
cultivated in me a positive one.

BTW, my ass is not what is basing anything about Orton. :coffee:

-----

Superchop 7
01-04-2010, 03:42 PM
I wish you guys were "actually" at the game. (TV does not show you much)

Rolled out of the pocket......... and threw at the guys feet.

He does not see the field very well.

Yesterday, I pin the loss on the defense........no doubt about it.

But if you think "this" guy is special ?

You are out of your mind

(sidenote)

Naked bootleg was open all day.

Just sayin

broncofaninfla
01-04-2010, 03:42 PM
Too bad you missed yesterday's game. :rolleyes:

Other than a couple good defensive plays, I'd say he deserves a raise.

LMAO!!! I DID watch the game, I watched the highlights and even caught the post game news conferences. Orton threw is directly at the LB's on both occasions!!!! Orton played a HUGE role in costing us the game yesterday. But he's a team player right, and we need a bunch of team players since the team players we fielded yetserday did so well. I love how the pro Mcd fans lock onto the catch phrases Mcd feeds through the media to sway public opinion. "accountibility" and "team player" are the recent favorites.

jrelway
01-04-2010, 03:49 PM
LMAO!!! I DID watch the game, I watched the highlights and even caught the post game news conferences. Orton threw is directly at the LB's on both occasions!!!! Orton played a HUGE role in costing us the game yesterday. But he's a team player right, and we need a bunch of team players since the team players we fielded yetserday did so well. I love how the pro Mcd fans lock onto the catch phrases Mcd feeds through the media to sway public opinion. "accountibility" and "team player" are the recent favorites.

its ok. this guy thinks Orton did no wrong. the KC linebacker just made 2 nice plays to pick off ortons perfectly thrown passes.

arapaho2
01-04-2010, 03:52 PM
Good. I hope so.

The LAST thing this team needs is change in continuity.

Orton has never had a coach to help him grow, in the NFL.

He does now, and I can't wait to see what McD gets out of him.

i know hopefully 25 5 yard passes per game instead of only 20:D

topscribe
01-04-2010, 03:54 PM
LMAO!!! I DID watch the game, I watched the highlights and even caught the post game news conferences. Orton threw is directly at the LB's on both occasions!!!! Orton played a HUGE role in costing us the game yesterday. But he's a team player right, and we need a bunch of team players since the team players we fielded yetserday did so well. I love how the pro Mcd fans lock onto the catch phrases Mcd feeds through the media to sway public opinion. "accountibility" and "team player" are the recent favorites.

You are lacking here in your evaluation. The first INT was alllllllll Orton. No doubt.
The second, though, happens to all QBs. Just a tremendous defensive play, as
attested to by both Fouts and Griese when it happened--both former QBs. The
linebacker acted as if he were blitzing and came up and hid behind the DL. Then,
as Orton threw, the LB suddenly dropped back in front of Graham, Orton's
intended target. Brilliant.

I don't know whether you ever played football above the HS level, but I have,
and things even at the college level happens awfully quickly . . . and college
players going to the pros are overwhelmed with the speed at that level.

What I am saying is that these things happen, even to the "elite" QBs.
Defenders are paid, too.

-----

HORSEPOWER 56
01-04-2010, 03:56 PM
Yesterday, I saw Orton roll out of the pocket. I saw him scramble left. I saw
him scramble right. I saw him spin out of a defender's grasp and then spin out
again on the same play. And he still has a high ankle sprain.

I saw Orton throwing the ball on the money 30 yards down the field. I saw him
miss deep, and I saw him hit deep . . . as do all QBs. (And yes, I saw that
miserably underthrown INT that he admitted he'd like to have back.)

I don't know what game you were watching.

-----

I saw the same play, top. The question was, did he make a play at the end of it or just throw the ball away? I saw him roll out to avoid pressure several times just to throw the ball into the dirt. It really doesn't help. It's not a pick, but on third down it's a give up and just as bad as a sack.

Top, how many of his 30 yard downfield throws were one the money to a moving target where the receiver got to continue his route and the pass put the reciever in position to gain extra yardage after the catch? None of them. How many of them were to stationary receivers or guys coming back to the ball on a comeback route? How many times did the receiver have to slow down, reach back, break off his route and come back, or lay out to make the catch? All of them, top, all of them. His best throw of the day was the bullet he threw to Gaffney when he threaded the needle between 4 defenders, but Gaffney wasn't moving, was he? Even the 5 yd TD Pass to Stokely he had to lay out for and make what looked like a great catch. Stokely was in perfect position and had 2 steps on the defender but Orton overcompensated and threw it low and away and made Stokes dive for it. Why didn't he just hit him in the numbers?

That's what I'm talking about. It's the same every time. If he goes deeper than 10 yards it's usually underthrown and either a high lob, or low around the knees and the receiver has to adjust to it. These aren't "positional throws" where Orton's trying to throw a back-shoulder fade, these are just "Chuck and Prays". Get it close to the WR and hope he makes a play on it. Why is it that everyone sees it except 3 or 4 of you? Even the guys that are very supportive of Orton have criticized this very thing.

Either I'm completely off the mark, I'm blind, or I'm right. The big thing is, I have NO REASON TO DISLIKE ORTON other than his play on the field. He's a great guy and he's our starting QB. I WANT HIM TO BE SUCCESSFUL! If you're thinking I'm just saying this because I'm butt-hurt about losing Cutler, you're dead wrong. Cutler's gone, I can accept this. Do you just think it's a personal thing with Orton? Because it's not. I don't care if Captain Kangaroo is the QB right now, I would just like to see a little precision and football awareness out of my starting QB. Is that too much to ask?

Orton doesn't throw "to" his receivers, he throws "at" them. There's a big difference. Just becaue the ball is "catchable" doesn't make it a good throw. Especially when you consider that "catchable" is completely relative to the WR who is targeted. If I'm coming out of a break and i have to constantly adjust my body because the ball is a foot over my head or at my knees to "snatch it" because it's off target or poorly positioned, Im gonna drop a few. Anyone would.

You take this as if I'm attacking Orton personally. I'm not. i'm criticizing his play, as I've witnessed it, for the last 10 weeks.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 03:57 PM
its ok. this guy thinks Orton did no wrong. the KC linebacker just made 2 nice plays to pick off ortons perfectly thrown passes.

And you obviously think Orton did no right. :noidea:

-----

topscribe
01-04-2010, 04:00 PM
You take this as if I'm attacking Orton personally.

WTF? Why am I so in the damned wrong for taking my damned position in this board?

Damn. :tsk:


I probably know Orton better than anybody else on this board, unless his mother
is posting here, and I am the one who is out of line. :tsk:

-----

jrelway
01-04-2010, 04:06 PM
And you obviously think Orton did no right. :noidea:

-----

never said he did no right. but its wrong to spot the other team 14 points no?

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:06 PM
no one brought cutler up. do you realize that right?

Yes they did...:lol:

After the game yesterday and looking back on the game at Arrowhead...The Broncos and the Chiefs looked like 2 totally different teams in both games.I have read on here that alot of people say that Cassel isn't any good.With better pass protection like he got yesterday he can play like he is capable of playing.I don't think he was sacked once yesterday.

I also don't think he is any better or any worse than Orton at this point.If KC can get a OL like they had with Trent Green I think the Chiefs could improve.

The Chiefs D looked good yesterday and hopefully the team will improve and be more consistent next season...looking forward to the changes that will take place...I was even impressed with Haley's playcalling yesterday.

jrelway
01-04-2010, 04:07 PM
WTF? Why am I so in the damned wrong for taking my damned position in this board?

Damn. :tsk:


I probably know Orton better than anybody else on this board, unless his mother
is posting here, and I am the one who is out of line. :tsk:

-----

because you saw his highlights in chicago on youtube?

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:10 PM
its ok. this guy thinks Orton did no wrong. the KC linebacker just made 2 nice plays to pick off ortons perfectly thrown passes.

That was awesome...2 picks for TDs by the same guy...:lol:

broncofaninfla
01-04-2010, 04:12 PM
That was awesome...2 picks for TDs by the same guy...:lol:

He must be a superhuman LB I'm sure you've seen him do it all season long because it's not like it was Orton's fault or anything......

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 04:14 PM
never said he did no right. but its wrong to spot the other team 14 points no?

Ask cutler. He's done it plenty of times.

As has brady....

...pmanning......

...rivers.....

...emanning...

....jelway.....

...etc

Hopefully you get the point.

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:15 PM
He must be a superhuman LB I'm sure you've seen him do it all season long because it's not like it was Orton's fault or anything......

No actually I haven't...he didn't play at the start of the season...he was just lying in wait yesterday...:lol:

claymore
01-04-2010, 04:16 PM
You are lacking here in your evaluation. The first INT was alllllllll Orton. No doubt.
The second, though, happens to all QBs. Just a tremendous defensive play, as
attested to by both Fouts and Griese when it happened--both former QBs. The
linebacker acted as if he were blitzing and came up and hid behind the DL. Then,
as Orton threw, the LB suddenly dropped back in front of Graham, Orton's
intended target. Brilliant.

I don't know whether you ever played football above the HS level, but I have,
and things even at the college level happens awfully quickly . . . and college
players going to the pros are overwhelmed with the speed at that level.

What I am saying is that these things happen, even to the "elite" QBs.
Defenders are paid, too.

-----

http://blog.kir.com/archives/images/footballStar.jpg

rcsodak
01-04-2010, 04:16 PM
because you saw his highlights in chicago on youtube?

Still think 10yr olds should be banned. :coffee:

claymore
01-04-2010, 04:18 PM
Still think 10yr olds should be banned. :coffee:

Your Orton is showing.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 04:18 PM
because you saw his highlights in chicago on youtube?

Go see if you can find complete games and 64 different clips on Orton on Youtube.

Since you are insistent in being such a smartass, tell me what you have seen of him.



Thank you, Clay, for high-fiving that smart-ass remark. :2thumbs:

-----

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:19 PM
hi claymore :wave:

jrelway
01-04-2010, 04:19 PM
Ask cutler. He's done it plenty of times.

As has brady....

...pmanning......

...rivers.....

...emanning...

....jelway.....

...etc

Hopefully you get the point.

yea i get the point. orton did no wrong. all hail captain checkdown..:salute:

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:19 PM
Your Orton is showing.

LMAO...:lol:

HORSEPOWER 56
01-04-2010, 04:21 PM
WTF? Why am I so in the damned wrong for taking my damned position in this board?

Damn. :tsk:


I probably know Orton better than anybody else on this board, unless his mother
is posting here, and I am the one who is out of line. :tsk:

-----

I'm not saying you're out of line and I'm not attacking you, top. I'm saying that I'm just not seeing what you do in him. Geez, do I wish he was that guy! What a coup for us! Unfortunately, it's just not what I've seen. A lot of people give him credit for being a good game manager, but defenses just don't seem to respect him and I just haven't seen any "wow" plays from him. I haven't seen him make any defenses pay for blitzing him, or look off a Safety and drop one in the basket over the top on a deep route to a receiver because he made the play. Typically, you see at least one a game from pretty much every QB. I've never seen it from Orton.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 04:22 PM
yea i get the point. orton did no wrong. all hail captain checkdown..:salute:

Yeah, I get the point. Orton did no right. :salute:

-----

jrelway
01-04-2010, 04:22 PM
Go see if you can find complete games and 64 different clips on Orton on Youtube.

Since you are insistent in being such a smartass, tell me what you have seen of him.



Thank you, Clay, for high-fiving that smart-ass remark. :2thumbs:

-----

i dont have time do dig through stuff like that like you do topscribe. i commend you for sifting through 64 different clips of orton. btw, im sure theres videos of orton sitting on the bench behind griese and grossman.

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:23 PM
yea i get the point. orton did no wrong. all hail captain checkdown..:salute:

that loss doesn't just fall on Orton's shoulders...your D didn't look like the same D that played at KC...I don't think they got much pressure on Cassel.

Mike
01-04-2010, 04:23 PM
It's going to be a long off-season.

claymore
01-04-2010, 04:23 PM
Go see if you can find complete games and 64 different clips on Orton on Youtube.

Since you are insistent in being such a smartass, tell me what you have seen of him.



Thank you, Clay, for high-fiving that smart-ass remark. :2thumbs:

-----

It made me LOL. I couldnt help it.

claymore
01-04-2010, 04:24 PM
hi claymore :wave:

Hey KC! Thanks for not setting a new single season rushing record on all of our Team first nice guys. !

Mike
01-04-2010, 04:25 PM
that loss doesn't just fall on Orton's shoulders...your D didn't look like the same D that played at KC...I don't think they got much pressure on Cassel.

Horsepoop. Orton should have stopped Charles, sacked Cassel 6-7 times, should have blocked the d-line, made holes for the running game. Freaking no talent hack.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 04:26 PM
I'm not saying you're out of line and I'm not attacking you, top. I'm saying that I'm just not seeing what you do in him. Geez, do I wish he was that guy! What a coup for us! Unfortunately, it's just not what I've seen. A lot of people give him credit for being a good game manager, but defenses just don't seem to respect him and I just haven't seen any "wow" plays from him. I haven't seen him make any defenses pay for blitzing him, or look off a Safety and drop one in the basket over the top on a deep route to a receiver because he made the play. Typically, you see at least one a game from pretty much every QB. I've never seen it from Orton.

Well, I'm hoping that Orton can stay healthy this year, behind a line that can
protect him and produce some semblance of a running game, in a system in
which he is now more familiar, so we can see what he really can do.

McDaniels is in a presser right now. I don't know whether it was this one or
one he held yesterday (I'm doing several things at once), but he talked about
how this system is dramatically different than the one Orton knew in Chicago,
and that he looks forward to working with Orton, that he believes he can
"coach up" Orton to make him "even" a better player.

-----

Northman
01-04-2010, 04:26 PM
All i know is if Anubis the punter was there we would of been undefeated. I blame Griese.

jrelway
01-04-2010, 04:27 PM
that loss doesn't just fall on Orton's shoulders...your D didn't look like the same D that played at KC...I don't think they got much pressure on Cassel.

of course the loss isnt entirely ortons fault. defense muffed it up as well. never said it was all orton.

HORSEPOWER 56
01-04-2010, 04:27 PM
Go see if you can find complete games and 64 different clips on Orton on Youtube.

Since you are insistent in being such a smartass, tell me what you have seen of him.



Thank you, Clay, for high-fiving that smart-ass remark. :2thumbs:

-----

You gotta admit, top. It was funny.

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:27 PM
Hey KC! Thanks for not setting a new single season rushing record on all of our Team first nice guys. !

Isn't Jamal Charles awesome? over 1000 yds rushing on the season in only 8 games...piss on Larry Johnson,I cannot stand that maggot.

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:30 PM
of course the loss isnt entirely ortons fault. defense muffed it up as well. never said it was all orton.

I know...I am just stating facts

topscribe
01-04-2010, 04:31 PM
i dont have time do dig through stuff like that like you do topscribe. i commend you for sifting through 64 different clips of orton. btw, im sure theres videos of orton sitting on the bench behind griese and grossman.

It is time . . . a lot of time . . . I would like to have back, I'll admit.

But your allusion to 2006 is really old and nauseating. Orton has had two years
now as a starter. Any allusion to 2006 only adds to your nonsensical remarks.

But you seem to know all about me. Where I got my information. How much time
I have. You probably know how many times I go to the bathroom every day.
Why don't you do a biography of me?

But I'm sure you do have time to simply take a look at what I've found without
going to the trouble of demeaning me.

-----

Northman
01-04-2010, 04:31 PM
I picked up Charles on my fantasy team about 6 weeks ago. Both he and Jackson helped me win the Championship in my football league. However, that game was played 2 weeks ago and Charles was supposed to go back to being nothing. Did i mention i really hate the chiefs?

KCL
01-04-2010, 04:33 PM
I picked up Charles on my fantasy team about 6 weeks ago. Both he and Jackson helped me win the Championship in my football league. However, that game was played 2 weeks ago and Charles was supposed to go back to being nothing. Did i mention i really hate the chiefs?

You hate the Chiefs? :tsk:

:lol:

I do too at times

jrelway
01-04-2010, 04:34 PM
Isn't Jamal Charles awesome? over 1000 yds rushing on the season in only 8 games...piss on Larry Johnson,I cannot stand that maggot.

i lost my fantasy superbowl cause of that *******. but yea, hes ok.

HORSEPOWER 56
01-04-2010, 04:37 PM
All i know is if Anubis the punter was there we would of been undefeated. I blame Griese.

I'm blame Griese, too. That clown was guest commentating on 850 KOA! Boo! :mad: ;)

Mike
01-04-2010, 04:39 PM
I'm blame Griese, too. That clown was guest commentating on 850 KOA! Boo! :mad: ;)

He has actually been doing a good job at it.

Much better to listen to him than Dan Fouts and Dick Emblam (or whatever his name is).

weazel
01-04-2010, 04:59 PM
while I don't mind them signing him for a couple years, the thought of "Most likely, the Broncos and Orton will try to reach accord on a multiyear contract that approaches the deals of other established QBs." scares the hell out of me!

One way, McDaniels said, is to help Orton become a better quarterback.

"This was his first season and he'll get better," McDaniels said. "Part of my job is to help him get better by coaching him up."

I found it odd that McDaiels said it was Orton's first year... I'm sure he has played for Chicago before, no???

Ravage!!!
01-04-2010, 05:45 PM
Watching 64 games and knowing what you are seeing are two different things. They are fine to claim for forming an opinion, but they don't make that opinion any more valid than those that have watched him sporadically as a Bear, and all 16 games as a Bronco. You can't simply blame the lack of talent on "learning a new system." The system may help mask the deficiency, but can't simply make it go away. The lack always shines in the end, though.

Northman
01-04-2010, 05:50 PM
while I don't mind them signing him for a couple years, the thought of "Most likely, the Broncos and Orton will try to reach accord on a multiyear contract that approaches the deals of other established QBs." scares the hell out of me!

One way, McDaniels said, is to help Orton become a better quarterback.

"This was his first season and he'll get better," McDaniels said. "Part of my job is to help him get better by coaching him up."

I found it odd that McDaiels said it was Orton's first year... I'm sure he has played for Chicago before, no???

He was talking in response to Orton in the current system. In his presser yesterday he talked about how Orton did pretty well this year considering he was still getting used to the current system.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 05:50 PM
while I don't mind them signing him for a couple years, the thought of "Most likely, the Broncos and Orton will try to reach accord on a multiyear contract that approaches the deals of other established QBs." scares the hell out of me!

One way, McDaniels said, is to help Orton become a better quarterback.

"This was his first season and he'll get better," McDaniels said. "Part of my job is to help him get better by coaching him up."

I found it odd that McDaiels said it was Orton's first year... I'm sure he has played for Chicago before, no???

Shanahan said that for a QB to go to a new system is just like entering his rookie year.

Sounds as if McDaniels concurs . . .

-----

arapaho2
01-04-2010, 05:57 PM
Shanahan said that for a QB to go to a new system is just like entering his rookie year.

Sounds as if McDaniels concurs . . .

-----


yet you guys dont give that benefit to cutler ?:coffee:

Northman
01-04-2010, 05:59 PM
yet you guys dont give that benefit to cutler ?:coffee:

Thats because he sucks.

Ravage!!!
01-04-2010, 05:59 PM
yet you guys dont give that benefit to cutler ?:coffee:

:cool: :lol:

Ravage!!!
01-04-2010, 05:59 PM
Thats because he sucks.

still TEN times better than what we have in Denver right now.

topscribe
01-04-2010, 06:01 PM
still TEN times better than what we have in Denver right now.

Certainly ten times as generous . . . :D

-----

Northman
01-04-2010, 06:01 PM
still TEN times better than what we have in Denver right now.

Yea, 26 Int times. :lol:

topscribe
01-04-2010, 06:03 PM
yet you guys dont give that benefit to cutler ?:coffee:

Who are "you guys"?

I have been a Cutler apologist all along.

Despite the crack I just made . . . :D

-----

HORSEPOWER 56
01-04-2010, 06:04 PM
He was talking in response to Orton in the current system. In his presser yesterday he talked about how Orton did pretty well this year considering he was still getting used to the current system.

I see you and the coach's point, North but Orton takes every snap on Sunday, every snap with the first team in practice, and gets all the personalized attention from the QB coach he can handle. What's left to "get used to?"

Orton's not a rookie, he's a 4 year vet. He's seen a pro-playbook before. He's stared down real defenses, in real games, in both conferences, and two different divisions. I just don't think it's a matter of "getting it". He held a clip board for a year in Chicago his first year (like they say all good rookies should do) and started what was it 8 games his second due to Grossman injuries? Then he started for 16 games in Chicago and 16 games in Denver.

It sounds like McD is deflecting the criticism at himself, which he should do as the coach and leader, but the whole "getting better in the system" thing has now worn out its effectiveness. If he doesn't "get it" by now, he won't. I'm not saying he can't be coached to play better, but using the "system" as an excuse just can't be used anymore. Would your boss keep you around if you were still learning your job after 4 years? McDaniels is deflecting criticism and using this as an excuse.

Nomad
01-04-2010, 06:09 PM
Orton is good enough for now and re-signing him is the right thing to do. I'd like to see what McDaniels can do with him with a second year.

This offseason we need to focus on getting our lines in better shape. We have no run game making our offense 1-dimensional and we can't stop the run either.

Main focus of the offseason! I'm willing to give Orton a chance but after those ankles heal please take some speed training in the offseason!! But I guess if the line gets shored up, he wouldn't have to run much. That's where I'd like to see him improve..:)

Actually it's a long shot but I'd like to see Orton work with Rivers and how to step up in the pocket to avoid the pressure!! I think Rivers is one of the better ones in the game today!!

Northman
01-04-2010, 06:11 PM
I see you and the coach's point, North but Orton takes every snap on Sunday, every snap with the first team in practice, and gets all the personalized attention from the QB coach he can handle. What's left to "get used to?"

Orton's not a rookie, he's a 4 year vet. He's seen a pro-playbook before. He's stared down real defenses, in real games, in both conferences, and two different divisions. I just don't think it's a matter of "getting it". He held a clip board for a year in Chicago his first year (like they say all good rookies should do) and started what was it 8 games his second due to Grossman injuries? Then he started for 16 games in Chicago and 16 games in Denver.

It sounds like McD is deflecting the criticism at himself, which he should do as the coach and leader, but the whole "getting better in the system" thing has now worn out its effectiveness. If he doesn't "get it" by now, he won't. I'm not saying he can't be coached to play better, but using the "system" as an excuse just can't be used anymore. Would your boss keep you around if you were still learning your job after 4 years? McDaniels is deflecting criticism and using this as an excuse.

Well, although i agree with what you say if you see it from the standpoint that Brady himself has said it takes at least 3 years to get comfortable in the system. Take that for what its worth. At the end of the day ive never seen Kyle as the ultimate answer at QB. I never saw Plummer as that either. And with Cutler's issues i dont see it in him either. But right now Orton will have to suffice until we can find that guy for the long haul. As for whether or not my boss would keep me for 4 years while still learning that answer would be no. However, Ravage never fails to remind me that the NFL and regular worker are nowhere the same kind of thing. lol

topscribe
01-04-2010, 06:13 PM
I see you and the coach's point, North but Orton takes every snap on Sunday, every snap with the first team in practice, and gets all the personalized attention from the QB coach he can handle. What's left to "get used to?"

Orton's not a rookie, he's a 4 year vet. He's seen a pro-playbook before. He's stared down real defenses, in real games, in both conferences, and two different divisions. I just don't think it's a matter of "getting it". He held a clip board for a year in Chicago his first year (like they say all good rookies should do) and started what was it 8 games his second due to Grossman injuries? Then he started for 16 games in Chicago and 16 games in Denver.

It sounds like McD is deflecting the criticism at himself, which he should do as the coach and leader, but the whole "getting better in the system" thing has now worn out its effectiveness. If he doesn't "get it" by now, he won't. I'm not saying he can't be coached to play better, but using the "system" as an excuse just can't be used anymore. Would your boss keep you around if you were still learning your job after 4 years? McDaniels is deflecting criticism and using this as an excuse.

Guess I have to repeat myself: Shanny himself said a QB coming to a
completely new system can be likened to a rookie coming into the NFL. Then,
Shanny continued, it takes up to three (3) years for a QB to gain top
efficiency in that system.

And when Orton came here, he had only two (2) seasons actually on the field.
So he had not completed even that third year in one system when he suddenly
found himself in a dramatically different one.

I believe that, having to deal with that along with his injuries and a new team
that not only he had to get used to but had to get used to him and each
other, Orton did a fine job. And I believe that's why McDaniels thinks so, too.

-----

arapaho2
01-04-2010, 06:15 PM
Yea, 26 Int times. :lol:


geee cutler ...27 ints...bears 6 rushing tds...20.4 points per game
orton 12 ints....9 rushing tds...20.4 points per game

topscribe
01-04-2010, 06:20 PM
Main focus of the offseason! I'm willing to give Orton a chance but after those ankles heal please take some speed training in the offseason!! But I guess if the line gets shored up, he wouldn't have to run much. That's where I'd like to see him improve..:)

Actually it's a long shot but I'd like to see Orton work with Rivers and how to step up in the pocket to avoid the pressure!! I think Rivers is one of the better ones in the game today!!

First, there has to be a pocket to step up into. That has been part of the
problem: the D-line collapsing the pocket. Not even Chicago had that bad of a
problem when Orton was there, and that was one of the things I noticed about
him there: how well he stepped up into the pocket.

-----

arapaho2
01-04-2010, 06:37 PM
First, there has to be a pocket to step up into. That has been part of the
problem: the D-line collapsing the pocket. Not even Chicago had that bad of a
problem when Orton was there, and that was one of the things I noticed about
him there: how well he stepped up into the pocket.

-----

always the excuse top..always an excuse

weird how one of the top pass blocking olines..#2 i believe from 08...suddenly got worse and dropped from 11 sacks to 34

not that im implying orton isnt good in the pocket or anything:rolleyes:

topscribe
01-04-2010, 06:39 PM
always the excuse top..always an excuse

weird how one of the top pass blocking olines..#2 i believe from 08...suddenly got worse and dropped from 11 sacks to 34

not that im implying orton isnt good in the pocket or anything:rolleyes:

I don't know about excuses, but if it isn't there, it isn't there. Simple.

I don't care about 2008. I'm basing that on what I saw. In 2009.

At times, I thought the DTs were going to take the snap from center . . .

-----

Nomad
01-04-2010, 06:40 PM
First, there has to be a pocket to step up into. That has been part of the
problem: the D-line collapsing the pocket. Not even Chicago had that bad of a
problem when Orton was there, and that was one of the things I noticed about
him there: how well he stepped up into the pocket.

-----

I'll take your word for it and yes the main focus of McDaniels should be the lines....anything else would be disappointing!!

arapaho2
01-04-2010, 06:47 PM
I don't know about excuses, but if it isn't there, it isn't there. Simple.

I don't care about 2008. I'm basing that on what I saw. In 2009.

At times, I thought the DTs were going to take the snap from center . . .

-----


and yet kuper, hamilton and weigman clady and harris gave up a total of 11 sacks last year

what you saw was a immobile statue falling down if someone came close..that or throwing a lateral into the dirt

topscribe
01-04-2010, 06:53 PM
and yet kuper, hamilton and weigman clady and harris gave up a total of 11 sacks last year

what you saw was a immobile statue falling down if someone came close..that or throwing a lateral into the dirt

Rap, who gives a damn about last year? This is this year. And I saw the center
of that O-line repeatedly cave in, collapse, from the pass rush. All too often,
there was no pocket. Fact. Bottom line.

And I guess you never saw yesterday's game. Orton scrambled left. He scrambled
right. He spun out of defender's grasps, more than once. He ran and dived for
a first down on third and long.

Did you have your TV on the wrong channel? Did you see the wrong game? :confused:

-----

Shazam!
01-04-2010, 07:29 PM
Clay was flaccid after reading this.

Broncolingus
01-04-2010, 08:43 PM
Bowlen supportive of McDaniels; coach backs his QB

...as he should (has to) be.